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if Brick is off the board at 4...


bitonti

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Mario Williams - obviously a physical freak - there simply are no other athletes in the draft like him and represented definate top 5 value at the position. There is a downside to this player he's not a "gamechanger" in the sense of just taking over a game - he can get sacks in spurts but it's often against shoddy competition, don't forget he played with literally 3 other pro prospects on that NC State DL, also he played the LDE position which traditionally goes against the RT, the weaker OT. Manny Lawson played RDE and is a more natural pass rusher - definately a faster player as well. Also there are other DE in the draft - not necessarily other Mario Williams freaks but alot of great pass rushers and 3-4 DE in the middle to late rounds.

Haloti Ngata - this is a player I really like - ALOT - a better prospect than DROB coming out, the only player in the last 35 years to make all-american from Oregon. his mother just passed away now he has an entire family (huge numbers) to support and his focus will be on reaching his vast potential. the guy is the focal point of every opposing offensive lineman blocking scheme and he is often doubled and tripled. Put him with DROB it's the best DT combo this side of Henderson/Stroud - maybe even better than that. Only slight on his bio is a torn ACL his frashman year that occured on punt coverage so far from the action the coaches don't even have video tape of it. The guy is a stud just waiting to be drafted and I think Mangini is considering him in secret for the 4 spot. Tony P heard a scout at Mobile say if Ngata was in amazing shape this year (he really wasn't as was fighting through nick injuries rather than practicing with the team) he has the skillset to be worth the #1 overall selection. history has proven that top 10 DTs are usually always at least of starter quality. That sounds like not a big deal but with other positions like QB (and DE) a bust is worthless player who's not even worth having on the roster. Drob for example may never live up to draft status or salary level but he's already proven he's a great starter.

Jay Cutler - what I like best about this player is his attitude - he's got this smirk on that's like "hey i know something you don't know" or "i just made a deal with the devil" - he's tough as nails, got literally his @ss kicked every week at Vandy and not only survived but thrived. The dude put up 1 less rep on the bench press than AJ Hawk, that's unprecidented. Everyone knows about his arm strength but it's not just strength without reason, he's a smart player who makes throws most of the current NFL Qb's either can't make or don't try. Even if Chad comes back he's 30 and we need a long term solution. You can never have enough talent at QB and right now the Jets have very little. Also what I like about Cutler is that the jets are sort of like the Vanderbilt of the NFL. A guy like Leinart yeah he's great but he might show up to NYJ a team that stays in hotels even before home games and think to himself i wish i was back at USC - With Cutler he's guarunteed to look at the Jets as a great opportunity and a step up from where he's coming from. The guy is fearless and we need fearless.

If Brick is on the board I would probably take him over all of these options - but if he isn't it becomes a 3 horse race for me - Williams, Ngata, Cutler. make me choose I gotta take Cutler. (and this is coming from a guy if you told me in March 2005 Ngata would be on the board when the jets picked in 2006 i'd be incredibly happy). I dunno something about Cutler screams star to me. he's probably the most risky pick of the three but also could be the best... by far.

Let's be real it's not like the piece of sh\t Jets have anything to lose. :Nuts:

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If Brick is on the board I would probably take him over all of these options - but if he isn't it becomes a 3 horse race for me - Williams, Ngata, Cutler. make me choose I gotta take Cutler.

That would be disaster for the Jets and set them back 5 years.

If D'Brick is not there, the Jets have to go with Williams.

No way in hell Mangini will make the mistake of drafting Cutler with the #4 pick.

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Bit, I agree that Mario a freak (have seen all his games),,But I fear he is a clone to Abe in many respects,,not the best vs run and does definitly take the outside rush even on running plays,,,

and u r right, he played with 3 guys who are NFLers,,I think Lawson will be a better pro than mario eventually,,

i actually see lawson as a shaun Ellis to Marios Abe over time,,maybe not as media hype, but Ellis is a more solid every play producer,,,

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how would drafting Cutler at 4 set the jets back 5 years!

Thats rediculous..

You need great QB play to excell in the Nfl...

tHE JETS HAVE zERO QBS!

I GUARANTEE the jets take a QB with the first pick.

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That would be disaster for the Jets and set them back 5 years.

If D'Brick is not there, the Jets have to go with Williams.

No way in hell Mangini will make the mistake of drafting Cutler with the #4 pick.

VERY NICE POST TX

I've been arguing with Bitoni for some time now over at JI about Cutler. He's done nothing to warrant a Top 5 pick. The guy was considered a late 1st/early 2nd round pick before the Senior Bowl and now that he's had some good workouts we're supposed to take him at #4? It's rediculous.

If we want a QB we should trade up and take Leinart.

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I don't think we are going Cutler at 4 if Brick is gone.... I don't think we can afford to. He has alot of talent, but he also could be the second coming of Ryan Leaf. Don't get me wrong, I like Cutler.... but I think it will be Super Mario or Hawk. Then Maroney, DeAngelo, or LenDale at 29... Mangold at 35. At least, thats how I want it to play out.

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I love all these draft guys that are creaming over Lawson, and have probably never seen him play

Whil Mario was getting double and triple teamed....Lawson was free to wander

cmon JonE i was at Mobile and I saw lawson with my own eyes - more than that I watched at least half of NC State's games you can't double and triple team a guy when the other guys on the line are McCargo, Lawson and the other tackle. The guy saw more single blockers than any premium DE in the country... and most of the time they were right tackles.

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1) Cutler

2) Mario

It all starts with the QB. On a team like the Jets who lack a real starting caliber QB and has an anemic offense it would make a very large immediate impact. The O line can be addressed down the line with the other picks.

No, it doesn't.

It ALWAYS starts with the lines. Control the line of scrimmage and you will control the game.

If D'Brick is gone at 4, I'd take Ngata. You have to be able to stop the run in the NFL, and this guy could almost do it by himself. He's that strong and that good.

If D'Brick is there at 4, then it's a really tough choice. The people I don't want are Hawk or any of the QBs. Start with the lines and build out.

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1) trade with the Broncos for 15 and 22

2) trade with the Vikes for thier #1 and 2 #2's

3) Super mario

4) dbrick

5) V Davis

6) Cutler

THe more arguments we have about players the more I wanna trade down and get more picks.

I'd modify this some...

1) Trade with Broncos

2) Trade with Vikes

3) Ferguson

4) Try to find some other trade partner

5) Skip the pick like Tice did a couple years ago and wait

6) Just do not draft a soul

7) Quit the NFL

8) Draft Cutler

If Cutler is drafted in the top 10, there is something terribly wrong.

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you do not control the game by having a good O line..It's a team sport..

You need WEAPONS too...

But you need SMART talented play at QB..I dont care how good your line is..

a QB like Elway will always be a winner while someone like Vinny will always find a way to break your heart..

You cant win in the NFL w/O great QB play.

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you do not control the game by having a good O line..It's a team sport..

You need WEAPONS too...

But you need SMART talented play at QB..I dont care how good your line is..

a QB like Elway will always be a winner while someone like Vinny will always find a way to break your heart..

You cant win in the NFL w/O great QB play.

Dude, that post is so wrong it's not even funny.

You can win in the NFL with mediocre play from the QB.

There is no way in hell you can win consistently in the NFL if you don't control the LOS.

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No, it doesn't.

It ALWAYS starts with the lines. Control the line of scrimmage and you will control the game.

If D'Brick is gone at 4, I'd take Ngata. You have to be able to stop the run in the NFL, and this guy could almost do it by himself. He's that strong and that good.

If D'Brick is there at 4, then it's a really tough choice. The people I don't want are Hawk or any of the QBs. Start with the lines and build out.

I would agree the offensive line as a whole is the most important unit on the offensive side. Part of the equation though is teamwork; it isn

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1) trade with the Broncos for 15 and 22

2) trade with the Vikes for thier #1 and 2 #2's

3) Super mario

4) dbrick

5) V Davis

6) Cutler

THe more arguments we have about players the more I wanna trade down and get more picks.

The best option is the second one...what are we doing in this draft??? Getting quality picks and rebuilding many positions. If we aren't sure about our pick at #4 (which based on the hundreds of threads we've had, we're not), then trade down to the vikings at 17. I like that slightly better than the 2 #1's by the broncos only because of the depth within this draft class. We could pick up White at 17, Mangold at 29, and then still have 3 second round picks to grab another oliner a cb and and olb or qb. That gives us a little more flexibility. Although my pick would be brick...if he's not there, trade for quality and quantity of picks with the vikings at 17.

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Originally Posted by bman

you do not control the game by having a good O line..It's a team sport..

You need WEAPONS too...

But you need SMART talented play at QB..I dont care how good your line is..

a QB like Elway will always be a winner while someone like Vinny will always find a way to break your heart..

You cant win in the NFL w/O great QB play.

Dude, that post is so wrong it's not even funny.

You can win in the NFL with mediocre play from the QB.

There is no way in hell you can win consistently in the NFL if you don't control the LOS....

You may be able to win...But you CANT win championships with average QBS..

Sure there are always exceptions ..85 bears, 2001 ravens..

whatever...

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Look at the recent superbowl teams...

They all had great QB play during the playoffs..and the regular season..

Big Ben

Hassellbeck

Brady

McNabb

Warner

McNair...

Teams are not getting to the superbowl with average QBs..

PRIME EX...

The 04 Jets had a HOT defense the entire second 1/2 of the year..But Pennington, with his inablity to beat a good defense, scored 3 points against the steelers!

Jets need to go after Leinert or Cutler..

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Look at the recent superbowl teams...

They all had great QB play during the playoffs..and the regular season..

Big Ben

Hassellbeck

Brady

McNabb

Warner

McNair...

Teams are not getting to the superbowl with average QBs..

PRIME EX...

The 04 Jets had a HOT defense the entire second 1/2 of the year..But Pennington, with his inablity to beat a good defense, scored 3 points against the steelers!

Jets need to go after Leinert or Cutler..

The QB can't be great if he's laying on his back after 3 steps.

The QB won't be great if there is no running game.

The QB probably won't win the game if the defense can't stop the other team's running game.

You have to have good lines on both sides of the ball to win championships.

None of these guys are sure-fire HOFers... in fact the entire draft is really a crapshoot. I'd just rather build around line play first. Reggie Bush is a great talent, but he may be too beat up to do anything when Houston does get a line.

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Dude, that post is so wrong it's not even funny.

You can win in the NFL with mediocre play from the QB.

There is no way in hell you can win consistently in the NFL if you don't control the LOS.

You don't win without a QB either. As long as you have an average line and a great QB, you will make more gains than a great line and an average QB. You won't gain anything without having anything at all for either though. Without an O-line, a QB won't have any time to be great, that's true. But even with a great O-line, if the QB can't win a game, he won't win a game. Remember, an O-line can make 5 mistakes in a game (and even the best do) but if a QB makes 5 mistakes, you just lost.

The Patriots have had so much success the past few years because of Tom Brady. Sure, other components were in place, but he is what elevated them into Super Bowl winners.

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The Patriots have had so much success the past few years because of Tom Brady. Sure, other components were in place, but he is what elevated them into Super Bowl winners.

Whoa, I thought Jets fans were adamant that AV was the reason why they won 3 Super Bowls.:eek:

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04 jets had the leagues #1 rusher..

They had a very very good Defense that carried them the entire 2nd 1/2 of the year..

they failed b/c they lacked a QB who could make plays when needed...

Jets Need a QB..maybe Ramsey can be the guy..who knows...

but penny aint the guy...

I dont care how good his o line is..he cant win a game in pittsburg b/c he has a weak arm.

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If Brick isn't there, first, I would try to trade down. If nothing really blew me away, then I would take Cutler. I like Ngata a lot, much more than I like Williams, but the Jets are in desperate need of offense. The drafts in the Edwards/Bradway era were ridiculously lopsided. That's why the offense went to ****. While they stockpiled secondary and wasted first rounders on backup defensive ends, they ignored the offensive line and brought in only Brooks "Handoff" Bollinger as insurance for serial pussy Chad Pennington.

The offense needs an overhaul. Mangini and Tannenbaum are not stupid. The offense will get what it needs.

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Look at the recent superbowl teams...

They all had great QB play during the playoffs..and the regular season..

Big Ben

Hassellbeck

Brady

McNabb

Warner

McNair...

Teams are not getting to the superbowl with average QBs..

PRIME EX...

The 04 Jets had a HOT defense the entire second 1/2 of the year..But Pennington, with his inablity to beat a good defense, scored 3 points against the steelers!

Jets need to go after Leinert or Cutler..

Most of what you say is true. However, as the Ravens, Bucs and Panthers have shown if you have a strong defense and an excellent running game you don't need a superstar QB to get to the Super Bowl.

I would like Young or Cutler but I think an even better approach would be to trade down and get Patrick Ramsey some weapons. Ramsey can be like a Dilfer or Delhomme.

Trade down. Get a big-time RB (Lendale White, Joseph Addai) and a big-time TE (Davis, Pope, Fasano). Use Rounds 2-5 to add some new O-line guys.

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If Jets get Tregue and either Riley, Clement, or McIntosh as cheap stopgap at C and RT by the draft time then Jets are pressed in gathering talents instead of needs.

Just dont be bitching around if Jets take Young if Williams is not available.. Yes, I mean Young over Leinart if there is no trading partner.

Leinart had surgery on his throwing shoulder but since then he had been throwing well. He has been wearing the knee brace and still do. I am wondering how long will he last... Young is 100 percent healthy and has better chance that he can last more than 6 years playing with Jets...

Hell, I want Hawk for any reasons.

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