Theory as to why Green Bay is playing hard ball

[EM31]

All of this is why Derek Carr was the cleaner option,  By far.  Carr would have given us 3-4 years for "just" dollars and we could actively work on Carr's replacement during that time.

In any event, the well has been completely poisoned between the Packers and Rogers and there is no way the have him anywhere near their facility next year (or even credibly threaten to do so).  Green Bay needs to move him or cut him outright and the Jets are the ONLY move him option.

On the other hand there is the Woody Johnson wild card where we are at a major risk of a James Dolan/Carmelo Anthony scenario where the owner steps in and forces an expensive deal on the GM for a player who we could have obtained for next to nothing by simply being patient. Right now my money on on Woody to cave and force the deal now because he is not patient and he does not want the Jets to look bad for missing out on other (better) options.

[jgb]

45 minutes ago, Dunnie said:

I agree ... though not sure its a slam dunk ... Id say it sits at a comfortable 90% right now.

Yeah… 90% probably right and that’s in “basically a slam dunk” territory to me

[nyjets1969]

1 hour ago, Biggs said:

Speaking of balls.  Tannebaum got Favre for a draft pick the following year.  Conditional 4.  3rd at 50% of the snaps, 2nd at 70% and 1st if they got to the SB.

Lets see if JD pulls off a similiar deal.  

If the Jets make a deal late and we get off to a bad start and miss the playoffs by a game I think JD is a horses ass.  If he doesn't get a Tannebaum like deal he's a horses ass.  

JD had big balls when he drafted Zach and hired a defensive coach and a 1st time play caller.   This mess is clearly JD's making.  

I like him.  He seems to be doing a good job and doesn't tip his hand.  I think he completely sh*t the bed by drafting Zach with a defensive HC and 1st time play caller and expecting him to start day 1.  It was mismanagement.  That's why we are were we are.

Balls aside.  This is a huge year for JD.  By huge I mean the Jets are expected to compete for the playoffs and do something in the playoffs.  

I don't believe JD would be involved in this deal at all if he hadn't screwed up.  I don't believe for a minute he would have gone after a 1 year SB run at this point.  He's already lost control to Woody.   This move has panic and Woody all over it.

Not saying it won't be fun but JD screwed the pouch.  

Think this is Woody all over it. Think eventually Woody will get anxious and force JD to get fleeced the Packer know this and will take it all the way to Sept if they have to don't think they are as sold on Love as people think and want multiple first to move up and get a QB. If JD was running ship Carr would be the QB JD doesn't trade high draft picks on 39 year old players that are a year rental. The Carr deal would have been a 5 year plan to immediately compete and wait for a suitable replacement to fall to them in the draft.

[ptisme]

23 hours ago, FactsOnly said:

You Packer Backers fail to realize Rodgers has to WANT to play for the team he’s being traded to

his favorite OC EVER is here

they had joint practices last year

he already came out of his epiphany retreat and said JETS

you goofs think he’s gonna embarrass himself and go back on his word after building up this retreat as his shining moment? ??

smarten up

Yes he does have to want to play for the new team.    But would he turn down 60 million and just retire?

[sciond]

1 hour ago, EM31 said:

All of this is why Derek Carr was the cleaner option,  By far.  Carr would have given us 3-4 years for "just" dollars and we could actively work on Carr's replacement during that time.

In any event, the well has been completely poisoned between the Packers and Rogers and there is no way the have him anywhere near their facility next year (or even credibly threaten to do so).  Green Bay needs to move him or cut him outright and the Jets are the ONLY move him option.

On the other hand there is the Woody Johnson wild card where we are at a major risk of a James Dolan/Carmelo Anthony scenario where the owner steps in and forces an expensive deal on the GM for a player who we could have obtained for next to nothing by simply being patient. Right now my money on on Woody to cave and force the deal now because he is not patient and he does not want the Jets to look bad for missing out on other (better) options.

Woodhole Johnson is always the problem

Let's not forget GB has to pick up the 5th year option on Love. If they have him and AR at the same time they are really screwed. Love will ask for a trade is my guess.GB is a paper tiger in this process.

[ptisme]

19 hours ago, Augustiniak said:

The problem GB has now is that by trading rodgers and watching love suck, it exposes the gm and this regime for coasting on rodgers, seeing devante go and having no real talent left to contend, while watching the division overtake them.  To not suck they need to keep rodgers but long term it’s worse if they do.

Lots of assumptions and a falsehood.   Why do you assume Love will suck?  No one knows the answer to that.  If he sucks they’ll likely have a high pick next year to take a swing at another QB.  Also management didn’t let Adams go.   Adams took less money to go to the Raiders to play with his best friend 

[Charlie Brown]

19 hours ago, slats said:

This is you not being a “cap guy.” They’re already on the hook with Rodgers for $67M in dead money. They cannot afford another $110M on top of that over the next two years. Especially as they’re trying to move onto a QB on his fifth year option. 

This was my hidden point in my rant the other day.

[ptisme]

19 hours ago, JTJet said:

Whut?

Because the Jets have a much younger team overall than the Packers do, most of which are currently playing on cheaper contracts. 

You realize the two teams cap situations are WILDLY different if AR is on either team right? 

Hmm.  In 2022 the average age of the Jets was 26.1.   The average age of the Packers was  25.9.  That was with kicker Mason Crosby 38.  As well as Aaron Rodgers (39) and Mercedes Lewis (38) and Randall Cobb (32) all of whom won’t be back. 
https://www.phillyvoice.com/ranking-nfl-teams-age-after-53-man-cutdowns-2022-edition/

[FactsOnly]

32 minutes ago, ptisme said:

Yes he does have to want to play for the new team.    But would he turn down 60 million and just retire?

No team is giving up anything of value for a QB a who won’t play there?

[ptisme]

2 hours ago, Biggs said:

Speaking of balls.  Tannebaum got Favre for a draft pick the following year.  Conditional 4.  3rd at 50% of the snaps, 2nd at 70% and 1st if they got to the SB.

Lets see if JD pulls off a similiar deal.  

If the Jets make a deal late and we get off to a bad start and miss the playoffs by a game I think JD is a horses ass.  If he doesn't get a Tannebaum like deal he's a horses ass.  

JD had big balls when he drafted Zach and hired a defensive coach and a 1st time play caller.   This mess is clearly JD's making.  

I like him.  He seems to be doing a good job and doesn't tip his hand.  I think he completely sh*t the bed by drafting Zach with a defensive HC and 1st time play caller and expecting him to start day 1.  It was mismanagement.  That's why we are were we are.

Balls aside.  This is a huge year for JD.  By huge I mean the Jets are expected to compete for the playoffs and do something in the playoffs.  

I don't believe JD would be involved in this deal at all if he hadn't screwed up.  I don't believe for a minute he would have gone after a 1 year SB run at this point.  He's already lost control to Woody.   This move has panic and Woody all over it.

Not saying it won't be fun but JD screwed the pouch.  

The Favre trade isn’t apples for apples.   Favre only had one year left on his contract and made it known he wanted to go to the Bears or Vikings after that so he could stick it to the Packers.  He was a true one year rental.   Also the Packers had zero leverage on that one.   Favre showed up in GB on the eve of training camp wanting back in.   He was doing interviews bashing management on Greta Vansustren.   It was a PR debacle and the Packers wanted him out of town ASAP

[ptisme]

3 minutes ago, FactsOnly said:

No team is giving up anything of value for a QB a who won’t play there?

True.   So his choice is Jets or retire

[Biggs]

10 minutes ago, ptisme said:

The Favre trade isn’t apples for apples.   Favre only had one year left on his contract and made it known he wanted to go to the Bears or Vikings after that so he could stick it to the Packers.  He was a true one year rental.   Also the Packers had zero leverage on that one.   Favre showed up in GB on the eve of training camp wanting back in.   He was doing interviews bashing management on Greta Vansustren.   It was a PR debacle and the Packers wanted him out of town ASAP

Rodgers deal makes it worse not better.

[FactsOnly]

7 minutes ago, ptisme said:

True.   So his choice is Jets or retire

Which would be disgraceful on the Packers part to not grant an all-time QB a trade when they no longer want him

[bonkertons]

On 3/17/2023 at 10:19 AM, PFSIKH said:

All the leverage?  The Jets have a solid team everywhere, but the QB.  The Packers leverage is the Jets are looking at trotting out Zach Wilson, an as yet to be named drafted rookie QB in an admittedly poor QB draft class or the likes of Wentz, Bridgewater or Matt Ryan.

 

All the leverage?

Jets have options.  Packers don't.  Jets can bring in anyone, or just decide "you know what, we'll continue building for another year and then look to compete for a SB in '24".  We could trade for Lamar, Tannehill.  We could move up in the draft for a new QB and sign a lower level vet.  There are many options.  Obviously Rodgers would be the preference, but there are options.

 

What are the Packers' options?  Trade Rodgers to the Jets, or keep him.  That's it.  Keep in mind he's already said his intention is to play for the Jets next year...not exactly something you can come back from.  He has to go, and GB knows it.  They can play hardball, I would have been surprised if they didn't, but literally all JD needs to do is wait them out.  The only way this deal doesn't get done is if GB says "I'd rather burn down my own organization than sell him for that low of a price", which seems.....like maybe NOT the way to run a franchise.  

 

One way or another I expect one of these teams to fold before the draft.  It'll most likely be GB, since I'd imagine their preference is to get picks immediately for Rodgers - assets they can use to help Love succeed.  A 2nd this year and one of a 2nd/3rd/4th next year is my expectation when all is said and done.  

[ptisme]

17 minutes ago, FactsOnly said:

Which would be disgraceful on the Packers part to not grant an all-time QB a trade when they no longer want him

They don’t owe him anything.    They made him the highest paid qb in the league for two decades.   It ain’t show friends it’s show business.  

[MykePM]

2 hours ago, Biggs said:

Speaking of balls.  Tannebaum got Favre for a draft pick the following year.  Conditional 4.  3rd at 50% of the snaps, 2nd at 70% and 1st if they got to the SB.

Lets see if JD pulls off a similiar deal.  

If the Jets make a deal late and we get off to a bad start and miss the playoffs by a game I think JD is a horses ass.  If he doesn't get a Tannebaum like deal he's a horses ass.  

JD had big balls when he drafted Zach and hired a defensive coach and a 1st time play caller.   This mess is clearly JD's making.  

I like him.  He seems to be doing a good job and doesn't tip his hand.  I think he completely sh*t the bed by drafting Zach with a defensive HC and 1st time play caller and expecting him to start day 1.  It was mismanagement.  That's why we are were we are.

Balls aside.  This is a huge year for JD.  By huge I mean the Jets are expected to compete for the playoffs and do something in the playoffs.  

I don't believe JD would be involved in this deal at all if he hadn't screwed up.  I don't believe for a minute he would have gone after a 1 year SB run at this point.  He's already lost control to Woody.   This move has panic and Woody all over it.

Not saying it won't be fun but JD screwed the pouch.  

You use the Favre trade as an example of great GMing, then say Douglas will be a “horse’s ass” if he makes a deal too late.  The Favre trade was made in August.   Can we give JD at least until April, or even June, to pressure GB into an acceptable deal until we start getting on him?

[ptisme]

21 minutes ago, Biggs said:

Rodgers deal makes it worse not better.

15 million cap hit next year.   Just terrible for you.    Void years will be added to lower the cap in future years.   Rodgers admitted this

[Biggs]

6 minutes ago, MykePM said:

You use the Favre trade as an example of great GMing, then say Douglas will be a “horse’s ass” if he makes a deal too late.  The Favre trade was made in August.   Can we give JD at least until April, or even June, to pressure GB into an acceptable deal until we start getting on him?

No

[MykePM]

28 minutes ago, bonkertons said:

Jets have options.  Packers don't.  Jets can bring in anyone, or just decide "you know what, we'll continue building for another year and then look to compete for a SB in '24".  We could trade for Lamar, Tannehill.  We could move up in the draft for a new QB and sign a lower level vet.  There are many options.  Obviously Rodgers would be the preference, but there are options.

 

What are the Packers' options?  Trade Rodgers to the Jets, or keep him.  That's it.  Keep in mind he's already said his intention is to play for the Jets next year...not exactly something you can come back from.  He has to go, and GB knows it.  They can play hardball, I would have been surprised if they didn't, but literally all JD needs to do is wait them out.  The only way this deal doesn't get done is if GB says "I'd rather burn down my own organization than sell him for that low of a price", which seems.....like maybe NOT the way to run a franchise.  

 

One way or another I expect one of these teams to fold before the draft.  It'll most likely be GB, since I'd imagine their preference is to get picks immediately for Rodgers - assets they can use to help Love succeed.  A 2nd this year and one of a 2nd/3rd/4th next year is my expectation when all is said and done.  

Great post.  The “GB has all the leverage” narrative is basically based on the premise that if GB is willing to destroy themselves (by blowing up their cap), the Jets are screwed.  The best way to describe this standoff would be “mutually assured destruction”, which is why the deal will eventually get done.  Hopefully, sooner rather than later.

[Biggs]

6 minutes ago, ptisme said:

15 million cap hit next year.   Just terrible for you.    Void years will be added to lower the cap in future years.   Rodgers admitted this

Rodgers is a lying sniveling dog.   He puts on a Jets uniform I root for him.  

[ptisme]

In the end the best resolution will be both sides walking away feeling they gave in too much

 

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10069273-aaron-rodgers-rumors-teams-skeptical-packers-can-get-1st-rounder-more-in-jets-trade

[Ex-Rex]

On 3/17/2023 at 7:34 AM, Viermoo said:

 

It’s rumored that GB is insistent on this years 1st round pick from the Jets as a part of the deal. My theory is that they don’t believe in Jordan Love and want to combine the Jets #13, their #15 and next years 1st round pick to move up into the top three picks this year.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

 

I doubt the Packers are doubting Jordan Love on such a small sample size. They want to delay this until June when they can knock 15M off their salary cap books.  If the 13 pick was all GB wanted I would give it to them. There is plenty of o-line talent in the 2nd and 3rd rounds. Hopefully Mitchell will come back healthy along with Becton and Vera-Tucker. Grab a center in 2nd round and a backup guard in the 3rd and the Jets are well on their way. 

[ptisme]

6 minutes ago, Ex-Rex said:

I doubt the Packers are doubting Jordan Love on such a small sample size. They want to delay this until June when they can knock 15M off their salary cap books.  If the 13 pick was all GB wanted I would give it to them. There is plenty of o-line talent in the 2nd and 3rd rounds. Hopefully Mitchell will come back healthy along with Becton and Vera-Tucker. Grab a center in 2nd round and a backup guard in the 3rd and the Jets are well on their way. 

You and I have a deal.   13 for Rodgers and that’s it.  Maybe throw in Mims if you’re going to release him anyways.    Easy

[Alka]

3 hours ago, ptisme said:

True.   So his choice is Jets or retire

That is not his only choices.  He can go back to Green Bay and tell them to pay him the money.

Do you really think that Aaron Rodgers will let Green Bay off that easily?  Not a chance!!!

If Green Bay tries to stonewall Rodgers, do you really think he will say, "Oh well, I guess I will just retire and not collect the $60 Million Dollars that is coming to me?

If you believe that, then I got a bridge I want to sell you in Brooklyn!

[nycdan]

Breer's article on si.com:

https://www.si.com/nfl/2023/03/17/aaron-rodgers-jets-packers-trade-compensation

Dan, I’d just say that if the 13th pick was on the table, with maybe a little sweetener, I think the deal would probably be done already. And in calling around, asking teams that are uninvolved what they’d give up, just about everyone said it should be a Day 2 pick this year, fronting a package with a conditional pick or two on the back end. That, to me, is where I think you could get creative.

To me, a fair price would be the Jets’ second-round pick (No. 43) and a conditional pick this year or next or both. One idea could be to have one pick be, at baseline, a third in 2024 that becomes a second if Rodgers makes the Pro Bowl on the original ballot and a first if the Jets get to the Super Bowl (meaning the pick would be, at most, No. 31). Or you could a ’25 pick that rides, in part, on whether he plays in ’24. Or, again, both.

While some journalists are out there dropping their own opinions like stone tablets from the mountaintop, this is at least one piece of writing that attempts to be objective.  I haven't seen anything that contradicts this.  GB will start to feel the squeeze in the week leading up to the draft.  We may not see anything happen until then.  It would shock me if the #13 pick is involved.

[32EBoozer]

27 minutes ago, nycdan said:

Breer's article on si.com:

https://www.si.com/nfl/2023/03/17/aaron-rodgers-jets-packers-trade-compensation

Dan, I’d just say that if the 13th pick was on the table, with maybe a little sweetener, I think the deal would probably be done already. And in calling around, asking teams that are uninvolved what they’d give up, just about everyone said it should be a Day 2 pick this year, fronting a package with a conditional pick or two on the back end. That, to me, is where I think you could get creative.

To me, a fair price would be the Jets’ second-round pick (No. 43) and a conditional pick this year or next or both. One idea could be to have one pick be, at baseline, a third in 2024 that becomes a second if Rodgers makes the Pro Bowl on the original ballot and a first if the Jets get to the Super Bowl (meaning the pick would be, at most, No. 31). Or you could a ’25 pick that rides, in part, on whether he plays in ’24. Or, again, both.

While some journalists are out there dropping their own opinions like stone tablets from the mountaintop, this is at least one piece of writing that attempts to be objective.  I haven't seen anything that contradicts this.  GB will start to feel the squeeze in the week leading up to the draft.  We may not see anything happen until then.  It would shock me if the #13 pick is involved.

From AJ (@VonKlef): Any team not named the Jets that could trade for Rodgers at the 11th hour?

AJ, no. The ship’s sailed on that. The Raiders are one team that investigated everything, but obviously now they’ve gone with Jimmy Garoppolo. I supposed you could get creative and look at ideas like the Commanders or Titans. I’m just not sure, based on where those teams are in building their rosters, that they would want to make that splash, or that Rodgers would necessarily go there. So I think it’s Rodgers or bust …

[Biggs]

19 hours ago, Alka said:

That is not his only choices.  He can go back to Green Bay and tell them to pay him the money.

Do you really think that Aaron Rodgers will let Green Bay off that easily?  Not a chance!!!

If Green Bay tries to stonewall Rodgers, do you really think he will say, "Oh well, I guess I will just retire and not collect the $60 Million Dollars that is coming to me?

If you believe that, then I got a bridge I want to sell you in Brooklyn!

Of course he won't let them off easy.  He's been dicking around the Packers for 3 straight years.  The Packers gave him everything he wants.  In spite of it he publicly rags on them and is trying to screw them on the way out.  It's good for the Jets but make no mistake we are getting a great QB who's a complete a-hole.   He's likely to screw the Jets around if he makes it through the season in 2023.   He's appearance on McAfee show was so transparentally about a personal vendaetta against the Packers it should make Jets fans squirm.  He's going to be doing this to the Jets next off season.   It's a one year run and Aaron Rodgers dicking the Jets around in the offseason. 

Douglas can redeem himself by making a solid offer to Lamar and moving on from drama king.  

[Greensleeves]

On 3/17/2023 at 10:32 AM, PFSIKH said:

That is true.  The Packers do want draft picks.  And as I said, the pressure is far greater on the Packers come summer and the closer it gets to the season.  The suspense to pick-up the bonus is then.

What that guy did not elaborate on is the pressure for the Jets.  What do they lose from holding onto that 1st?  As I said, now is fine and manageable.  OTAs?  Not killing, but not without pain.  Training Camp?  With Lazzard and Hacket, it is not as painful as it could be, but the Rodgers and the Jets are losing snaps together.  What else? The Jets are held prisoner to a degree.  If their intent is to get Rodgers, they need to have cap space.  Is JD going to call the Packers bluff and sign Ryan?  Good luck with that.

As someone on the forum had suggested, why don't we try and trade back, recoup another pick and trade a later first round pick to Green Bay? Of course we need a trade partner, but I wonder if this is being considered.

[slats]

2 hours ago, Biggs said:

Of course he won't let them off easy.  He's been dicking around the Packers for 3 straight years.  The Packers gave him everything he wants.  In spite of it he publicly rags on them and is trying to screw them on the way out.  It's good for the Jets but make no mistake we are getting a great QB who's a complete a-hole.   He's likely to screw the Jets around if he makes it through the season in 2023.   He's appearance on McAfee show was so transparentally about a personal vendaetta against the Packers it should make Jets fans squirm.  He's going to be doing this to the Jets next off season.   It's a one year run and Aaron Rodgers dicking the Jets around in the offseason. 

Douglas can redeem himself by making a solid offer to Lamar and moving on from drama king.  

This is a fun take, but when did Lamar Jackson become the unselfish, team first guy? Seems to be a lot of drama going on in Baltimore right about now, most of it Jackson’s making. 

[thebuzzardman]

JD just mailed this to the Packers FO, regarding their latest ask:

 

 

 

[CanadaSteve]

IF true:

1) Trade us Jordan Love instead for a VERY low pick.

2) Too F***ing bad.  You can take a 3 this year or a conditional 3 next year which could be a 1 if we win the Super Bowl.  

 

[Biggs]

4 hours ago, slats said:

This is a fun take, but when did Lamar Jackson become the unselfish, team first guy? Seems to be a lot of drama going on in Baltimore right about now, most of it Jackson’s making. 

Not sure what you mean?   Based on the guaranteed money they offered him it’s a clear lowball based on the average of the top 5 contracts.  You can’t honestly believe that Jackson deserves 133 guaranteed when Murray is at 189.5 million guaranteed.  
 

 

[Dunnie]

Not sure what you mean?   Based on the guaranteed money they offered him it’s a clear lowball based on the average of the top 5 contracts.  You can’t honestly believe that Jackson deserves 133 guaranteed when Murray is at 189.5 million guaranteed.  
 
 

Kyler is a better passer.

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[Biggs]

5 minutes ago, Dunnie said:

Kyler is a better passer.

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Kyler sucks.   He got everyone fired rightfully so.  

[Dunnie]

Kyler sucks.   He got everyone fired rightfully so.  

I agree ... Which tells you how I feel about Lanar

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