jgb Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 5 hours ago, slats said: I don’t recall this. I do remember never liking Mahomes’ contract, believing he was foolish and a little too team friendly to sign such a long term deal in the first place. Despite the big numbers being thrown around, it was always not going to look nearly as good a couple years down the road. All good, when he signed his new deal, I said he was still underpaid per impact and in any case his deal would look like a bargain very soon. Too lazy to look, wasn’t calling you out, just remember having a good repartee about it with you. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 15 hours ago, Cyberjet said: How the Jets boxed themselves into this PR mess is beyond me. The Jets hold ALL the cards This has become a "PR mess"? Is QW holding out, demanding a trade or something and I missed it? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyberjet Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 I think you are missing my point. It’s really not a big deal. The Jets have him under contract. - he is kind of holding out/acting out with not showing up to OTAs and removing his Jet logo though he is still under contract - the Jets have options: Let him play out his 5th year is a legitimate option. Having that as an option while trying to negotiate a new contract is an ace they hold HOWEVER, Saleh took that off the table stating a new contract will get done immediately reducing the Jets leverage and empowering QW agent imo What if it doesn’t get done and the negotiations fail falling back on the 5th year option. Not a good look for the Jets. I don’t know why Saleh said it will get done whereas other times he says ‘that’s a Joe question’ i guess I should have stated it’s a potential PR mess 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 3 minutes ago, Cyberjet said: I think you are missing my point. It’s really not a big deal. The Jets have him under contract. - he is kind of holding out/acting out with not showing up to OTAs and removing his Jet logo though he is still under contract - the Jets have options: Let him play out his 5th year is a legitimate option. Having that as an option while trying to negotiate a new contract is an ace they hold HOWEVER, Saleh took that off the table stating a new contract will get done immediately reducing the Jets leverage and empowering QW agent imo What if it doesn’t get done and the negotiations fail falling back on the 5th year option. Not a good look for the Jets. I don’t know why Saleh said it will get done whereas other times he says ‘that’s a Joe question’ i guess I should have stated it’s a potential PR mess It's June. The time to even begin to panic about this is if we're getting close to September and QW starts talking holdouts or trades. Until that happens I don't give two f**ks. Like you said, he's under contract, AND it sounds like they're working on the extension behind the scenes. All this other fluff you're talking about is just standard negotiation tactic stuff that nearly every star player and team goes through when working on a new deal. R-E-L-A-X 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyberjet Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 I’m relaxed. Just having a discussion. I’m not even going to get my HR up if he holds out. I think the Jets D line is in good shape - better than last year. It’s not the end of the world if they don’t sign him to a new contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Thornburgh Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 55 minutes ago, Cyberjet said: I’m relaxed. Just having a discussion. I’m not even going to get my HR up if he holds out. I think the Jets D line is in good shape - better than last year. It’s not the end of the world if they don’t sign him to a new contract. Agree. Think we will be fine either way. I don’t want an Abe 2.0 scenario but QW is a good kid I can’t see him going AWOL come playoff time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 16 minutes ago, Rich Thornburgh said: Agree. Think we will be fine either way. I don’t want an Abe 2.0 scenario but QW is a good kid I can’t see him going AWOL come playoff time I understand once bitten twice shy but at some point you gotta pay your studs 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyberjet Posted June 8, 2023 Share Posted June 8, 2023 39 minutes ago, Rich Thornburgh said: Agree. Think we will be fine either way. I don’t want an Abe 2.0 scenario but QW is a good kid I can’t see him going AWOL come playoff time He does appear to be a good character kid. I just find the Jets approach in negotiations interesting. They do not take a hard ass approach. You can see that even in the Rodgers negotiations- JD negotiates with respect and appreciation. Many feel he got his head handed to him in that deal because many felt the Jets had the upper hand. With QW negotiations I get the sense that the Jets expect or hope for a reasonable respectful response from QW and his agent. These are just my opinions. Hell some GMs would say no negotiation/ play out your 5th year contract/ trade him next year for a 1st rounder or more. That’s not the JD approach which is fine as long as he can keep the ship together 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Sperm Edwards Posted July 14, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted July 14, 2023 On 6/3/2023 at 6:29 PM, Facts said: The best thing about this is... we will all find out who is right eventually. All we need is TIME. In a couple years, may of you will be saying "Facts was right". And the rest of you will be pretending like you never argued with me about it. lmao Ah the repeated insistence in this thread that we just had to factor in either $27.5MM (or a purported $30MM demand) because it was halfway between a presumed $25MM/year negotiating starting point and this alleged $30MM demand. And then he inks for lower than the alleged minimum negotiating starting point team offer. Screaming to the high heavens that QW is going to be over 10% of the salary cap annually. Including this year's $10MM, his 5-year average through the 2027 season is ~$21MM/year. That's not even 10% of the cap today, let alone over time with the massive cap increases that will happen over the course of this extension. 9 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted July 14, 2023 Share Posted July 14, 2023 On 6/4/2023 at 10:37 AM, Facts said: My math is perfectly fine. Your wording was off. You never said from the starting point. You just added that now. Your entire post is built around refuting a premise that you made up because you didn't describe what you were meaning, accurately. Again, you're just making up percentages. Let's look at historical figures, shall we? 2013-2023: Went from $124M to $225M ($101M increase increase in a decade) 2003 to 2013: Went from $75M to $124M ($49M increase in a decade) 1994 (first year) to 2003: Went from $34M to $75M ($41M increase in a decade) Now, how about percentages over the last two decade? 2013-2023: 81.5% increase in a decade (8.1% per year over a 10 year basis - not compounded) 2003 to 2013: 65.3% increase in a decade (6.5% per year over a 10 year basis - not compounded) The salary cap has gone up an average of 7.3% per year, on a 10 year basis, over the past two decades. So when I said it goes up about 10% per year, I was OVERESTIMATING. It's actually LOWER than that. But, Facts, what about compounding? The NFL Salary cap doesnt compound on a fixed rate. It doesnt work that way, which is why you use decade averages to get a good estimate. If you want to look at compounding for the fun of it, you will see a much lower percentage. For example, over the last 15 years, the NFL salary has compounded at only 4.5% per season. Applying these standards to the current cap: The average increase over the last two decades, per year, was 7.3%. Which means, in 5 years from now (just guessing on length of Q's contract), the cap will be at $307.1M. 7.3% x 5 years = 36.5% 36.5% increase over $225M is $307.1M. Applying this to the contract Q is reported to want. Q wants $25-30M per season. If we take the middle of those two numbers, we have $27.5M per season. To get to the 8% you and I talked about with Jones contract, the salary cap has to be ABOVE $343M. $27,500,0000 / 0.08 = $343,750,000 We would never reach that, as explained to you before. In fact, he would only get under 10% in the FINAL YEAR of his contract. The entirety of the contract would be 10% or MORE. A four year contract makes it even worse. 7.3% average increase x 4 = 29.2% 29.2% increase over $225M is $291M Which, again, means ONLY IN THE FINAL YEAR of his contract, will he get below 10%. The entire value of the contract would be 10% or more and there is zero chance he ever gets to Jones 8% number. Any time you have to conflate new money with current contract, you know the math is being purposefully manipulated. We are talking new contract here. You want to tack on the rookie contract final year to spread the monstrosity of a stupid contract over another year with a cheap base. Sorry, but no. We get Q this year at his cheap rate whether we sign him or not. In fact, as mentioned multiple times by yours truly in another thread, what we SHOULD do is: 2023: Let him play out his rookie deal at $9.5M (see if he can even duplicate what he did in 2022) 2024: If he has another great year, non-exclusive franchise tag him at $20.8M 2025: If he has another great, tag him again at $24.9M With this method, we have him until he is almost 30, at a cost of only $55.2M That is only 7.5% of the cap. A perfect number to be at for IDL. And don't run the risk of a Haynesworth situation. This is not correct. Supposition upon supposition, with a key element being that you were off on his contract by 15% from the outset, and then building arguments on top of that (using further incorrect math). The metaphor "House of Cards" in full effect. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted July 14, 2023 Share Posted July 14, 2023 2 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said: Supposition upon supposition, with a key element being that you were off on his contract by 15% from the outset, and then building arguments on top of that (using further incorrect math). The metaphor "House of Cards" in full effect. You know what you get when you put sh*t in a sausage maker? Sh*t sausages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Long Island Leprechaun Posted July 14, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted July 14, 2023 4 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said: Supposition upon supposition, with a key element being that you were off on his contract by 15% from the outset, and then building arguments on top of that (using further incorrect math). The metaphor "House of Cards" in full effect. I'm triggered that you waste your time arguing with a dunce. 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Sperm Edwards Posted July 14, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted July 14, 2023 2 minutes ago, Long Island Leprechaun said: I'm triggered that you waste your time arguing with a dunce. No one takes away my dunce cap. You can fight me for it, but you have to beat the man to be the man. 1 1 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creepy Lurker Posted July 14, 2023 Share Posted July 14, 2023 7 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said: No one takes away my dunce cap. You can fight me for it, but you have to beat the man to be the man. WOOOOOOH!!!!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunnie Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 I understand once bitten twice shy but at some point you gotta pay your studsI agree... The risk is necessary. Now if it backfires ... Fool me once ....Sent from my Pixel 7 using Tapatalk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slimjasi Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 Lol at this thread 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 On 6/8/2023 at 9:30 AM, Cyberjet said: I think you are missing my point. It’s really not a big deal. The Jets have him under contract. - he is kind of holding out/acting out with not showing up to OTAs and removing his Jet logo though he is still under contract - the Jets have options: Let him play out his 5th year is a legitimate option. Having that as an option while trying to negotiate a new contract is an ace they hold HOWEVER, Saleh took that off the table stating a new contract will get done immediately reducing the Jets leverage and empowering QW agent imo What if it doesn’t get done and the negotiations fail falling back on the 5th year option. Not a good look for the Jets. I don’t know why Saleh said it will get done whereas other times he says ‘that’s a Joe question’ i guess I should have stated it’s a potential PR mess Got it done!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post CanadaSteve Posted July 15, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted July 15, 2023 13 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said: 5 hours ago, Creepy Lurker said: WOOOOOOH!!!!! You can fight me for it, but you have to beat the man to be the man. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggs Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 On 6/3/2023 at 7:06 PM, Facts said: I never said 4%. Historically, it takes a decade for NFL cap to increase 100M. That's 10% per year. Which is what it would it take for Q's desired contract to reach 8%. Sure I have. Literally multiple times. AAV yearly numbers. For example, Chris Jones is $20M per year. The math is super simple. Q is said to want $25-$30M per season average. Let's use $27.5M for a middle ground. To be at 10%, the cap would have to rise to $275M. That's $27.5M / 0.1 = 275M The cap is currently at $225M, so that would be a $50M increase. Historically, it takes 6 seasons for the cap to go up $50M. Therefore, if Q signed a 6 year contract (for example), then at the END of his 6 year contract, the final year, (MAYBE) we would reach 10%. So, we would have Q for ONE season at 10%, and the average of the contract would be likely 12 or 13%. To be at 8% (where Jones is), the cap would have to go up $118 million. That would take over a decade. Inflation is currently running higher than it has since the 1980’s. Because of live streaming there is more competition for NFL TV rights than at any time in NFL history. Legalized gambling is a game changer for NFL revenue. Salaries are worth less on an inflation adjusted basis and inflation running hot along with more competition for NFL viewing rights is likely to lead to a decade of well above historical growth in the cap. Historically drug companies, alcohol brands and your local bookie weren’t allowed to advertise and there were 3 networks with the income to compete for the right to broadcast games. Historically Saudi Arabia wouldn’t have been allowed to own the PGA. Historically there weren’t 10 billionaires who were looking to own NFL teams. Now they’re are many minted weekly and there’s a global market for ownership. The reason a transparently borderline criminal is the Commissioner of the NFL is because he has consistently delivered more revenue to the NFL mob bosses and kept them from going to war with each other. Q was one of a handful of high value game changing players on the Jets. The League isn’t looking to create dynasties it’s looking to increase revenue and ownership value. There are multiple ways to build a highly competitive team capable of winning a SB. Right now Joe Douglas and Robert Saleh are trusted with that job. If they fail they will be canned, rinse repeat. What they spend or don’t spend on Q is a judgement call without a right answer. His value will either show up on the field or it won’t. Money ball in football has a ridiculous amount of moving parts. It’s a good idea to attach value to positions but in football there are outliers who’s value defies a money ball approach. Q looks like one of those players. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crusher Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 21 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said: Supposition upon supposition, with a key element being that you were off on his contract by 15% from the outset, and then building arguments on top of that (using further incorrect math). The metaphor "House of Cards" in full effect. What does any of this have to do with administering medication by way of the rectum? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 1 hour ago, The Crusher said: What does any of this have to do with administering medication by way of the rectum? Both are sloppy? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crusher Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 18 minutes ago, Jet Nut said: Both are sloppy? Nice! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggs Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 1 hour ago, Jet Nut said: Both are sloppy? Don't discount the hot nurse who happens to be anal retentive. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 3 hours ago, Biggs said: What they spend or don’t spend on Q is a judgement call without a right answer. His value will either show up on the field or it won’t. Money ball in football has a ridiculous amount of moving parts. It’s a good idea to attach value to positions but in football there are outliers who’s value defies a money ball approach. Q looks like one of those players. if we're talking economics the Jets don't really make much more money winning than losing in fact, as this offseason is proving, winning (or trying to win) is expensive they split the TV 32 ways all the Jets really have to do is keep the light on 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 2 hours ago, The Crusher said: What does any of this have to do with administering medication by way of the rectum? Took me a second, lol 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crusher Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 21 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said: Took me a second, lol Take your time, I'll wait. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 4 hours ago, The Crusher said: What does any of this have to do with administering medication by way of the rectum? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 1 hour ago, The Crusher said: Take your time, I'll wait. A gentle lover. I dig that. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bonkertons Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 Facts was wrong? Get out of town. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 Interesting that there are now more IDL making over $20 million a year than edge rushers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetstream23 Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 On 7/14/2023 at 7:44 AM, Sperm Edwards said: No one takes away my dunce cap. You can fight me for it, but you have to beat the man to be the man. That should be a half-time show on the field at MetLife. Fight Sperm for his Dunce Cap! Better than the frisbee chasing dogs... not quite as good as the Gate D spiral (#RIP) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetstream23 Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 4 hours ago, The Crusher said: Take your time, I'll wait. 2 hours ago, jgb said: A gentle lover. I dig that. To be fair, @The Crusher speaks to his baby back ribs the same way when they're in the smoker. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Jetsfan80 Posted July 15, 2023 Popular Post Share Posted July 15, 2023 6 hours ago, bitonti said: if we're talking economics the Jets don't really make much more money winning than losing in fact, as this offseason is proving, winning (or trying to win) is expensive they split the TV 32 ways all the Jets really have to do is keep the light on You used to complain that the Jets didn't spend enough. Now you complain that they spend too much. 3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BornJetsFan1983 Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 On 6/3/2023 at 2:31 PM, Facts said: And yeah, Q is much better than their guy but the point is SMART teams don't pay an interior d-linemen over 10% of the cap. This is what JD should be telling Q right now: This again? We literally do great and this guy thinks it's bad cause we don't employ scrub Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted July 15, 2023 Share Posted July 15, 2023 2 hours ago, jetstream23 said: To be fair, @The Crusher speaks to his baby back ribs the same way when they're in the smoker. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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