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Guess some of you need to hear this: Zach Wilson (and his $23 mil 5th yr option) has no Future in NY


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6 minutes ago, Embrace the Suck said:

No, the point is that if the Jets had a functional organization in place that players whether that be Geno, Sam, or whomever could have possibly developed into something. Instead time after time the players the jets draft, at qb in particular, bust out at a rate that seems to be higher than others, and you have to wonder why. I have no doubt that some of that is the players fault such as Geno getting his jaw broken or ZW saying he didn't feel he let the team down after negative yards in a half.

Such a thing is largely unknowable however, what we do know is that:

1. Turnarounds from Bust to FQB (or even serviceable starter) are rare; and

2. As of yet, no one has shown a propensity to predict with accuracy who the lucky winners of the turnaround lottery will be; and

3. None has never happened for the team that originally drafted the bust in the first place.

It is a much better strategy to move on and try again once you have an adequate sample size to determine a guy is a likely bust. In fact, if you want to chase turnarounds, it's smarter (see #3 above) to grab other teams' castoffs than to sit on yours for way too long hoping that he becomes one.

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48 minutes ago, Embrace the Suck said:

Not surprised that you'd tell yourself that to stroke your ego. Sorry to burst your bubble, but I don't get 'triggered' by the opinion of random online people who don't matter to me whatsoever with regard to a child's game, whereas maybe you do.  I simply point out things and those who relate to what I say one way or the other respond. You should probably go look in the mirror and be honest with yourself at this point. 

I’d have perhaps given your angry screed a more honest, less trolly reply, if you hadn’t replied in-line like that. Makes it much harder (for me) to parse and retort, especially on a phone.

Look, you want to be angry because some folks think they can predict Zach’s future, go for it. Debating this kind of homer emo is exhausting honestly, it’s all feels, no reals, IMO. You certainly weren’t this worked up wihen the opinions were overly positive but equally definitive and equally dismissive of disagreement.  Typical stuff really, you’re angry people hold negative analytical viewpoints. Ok, great.

I think you’re being a twat here, and clearly you think the same of me. So….impasse. Happy to leave it there. We dont all have to be best friends here all the time. Even if we’re all Jets fans. 

 

 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, football guy said:

The Jets and Zach’s team have made it abundantly clear both publically and privately- your the one being naive, choosing to resist the facts because it doesn’t jibe with what you personally believe should happen.

I’m not saying anyone should agree or disagree with the Jets play here; they are a unique brain trust who don’t look at past precedent, they don’t believe in groupthink. They don’t care if it hasn’t happened before, nor do they care if the “accepted way” is to send the player somewhere else so they can get a “fresh start”. They think he can have a fresh start inside their own locker room and are committed to it 

Guess we’ll see how it plays out.

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8 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Football Guy was saying year 2 Zach was a "night and day difference" from year 1 because he watched tape with some QB Coach or something.  He also once accused @JiF of banging his dog and sent him some nasty PM's in truly unhinged fashion.

Dude takes a thing one person with "connections" says and reiterates it as gospel.  If he's truly an insider he's an easily duped one and also thinks he's super knowledgeable about football purely by proxy.  

I'm team @Mogglez for life.

 

 

Touch some grass dude lol

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4 minutes ago, football guy said:

And for all we know it can crash and burn. No clue. Just stating the obvious

Oh I’m sure if it ends up exactly like jgb, 80 and others and I think it will, you’ll still tell us we were wrong. Or to stop beating the dead horse. Nothing ever changes really.

TBH this entire debate is dumb as long as AR is healthy.

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3 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Oh I’m sure if it ends up exactly like jgb, 80 and others and I think it will, you’ll still tell us we were wrong. Or to stop beating the dead horse. Nothing ever changes really.

TBH this entire debate is dumb as long as AR is healthy.

Yes you are wrong to think that this isn’t the Jets strategy. Whether or not it will be successful is up for debate

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1 hour ago, Warfish said:

I’d have perhaps given your angry screed a more honest, less trolly reply, if you hadn’t replied in-line like that. Makes it much harder (for me) to parse and retort, especially on a phone.

Look, you want to be angry because some folks think they can predict Zach’s future, go for it. Debating this kind of homer emo is exhausting honestly, it’s all feels, no reals, IMO. You certainly weren’t this worked up wihen the opinions were overly positive but equally definitive and equally dismissive of disagreement.  Typical stuff really, you’re angry people hold negative analytical viewpoints. Ok, great.

I think you’re being a twat here, and clearly you think the same of me. So….impasse. Happy to leave it there. We dont all have to be best friends here all the time. Even if we’re all Jets fans.

Actually I enjoy disagreement and varying opinions. I enjoy information that conflicts because that's how you make progress as opposed to blindly following along. I'm not angry at all. I've in fact stated that ZW has screwed up numerous times, and that he didn't capitalize on his opportunity regardless of poor coaching. I've stated that chances are he's done here. Neither of which seems to fit homer'ish, but people often base comments on what they want to believe. As you said all feels, no reals... Having said that: “There is no such thing as an external enemy, no matter what that voice in your head is telling you. All perception of an enemy is a projection of the ego as the enemy.”-Dr. Deepak Chopra M.D. and yes we are all Jets fans aside from the occasional masshole or raiders freak.

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40 minutes ago, football guy said:

I’ll make it a little easier to comprehend: 

Zach wants to be here and believes in the plan. He believes he can succeed Rodgers the way Steve Young succeeded Montana. He’s not going to chase for another situation unless it’s absolutely perfect. 

The Jets believe Zach can realize his potential because he’s a uniquely talented kid with the right work ethic, and they want him to succeed Rodgers. They won’t force it, but he’ll be given every opportunity to do so. 

You just keep adding new nested layers of uncertainty upon your thesis

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1 hour ago, Embrace the Suck said:

No, the point is that if the Jets had a functional organization in place that players whether that be Geno, Sam, or whomever could have possibly developed into something. Instead time after time the players the jets draft, at qb in particular, bust out at a rate that seems to be higher than others, and you have to wonder why. I have no doubt that some of that is the players fault such as Geno getting his jaw broken or ZW saying he didn't feel he let the team down after negative yards in a half.

I think you make an excellent point here and unfortunately the Jets are the prime example of how always "playing from behind" can hold a franchise back.  

There is no doubt that if a QB can sit for a year or 2 they have a greater chance of succeeding.  Now do I think Mahomes would suck if he was on the Jets, no, but do I think it helped him to sit for a year, absolutely.

These top pick QBs come right from college (usually playing in a simplified system) and have absolutely no time to decompress going from a Bowl game, to combine prep, to the draft (where they become celebrities), to OTAs and then in the case of the Jets starting day 1.  Its too much for a position that demands so much cerebral understanding and leadership.   

In other cases, where you have guys like Dak or russel wilson those guys are picked by teams that have an actual roster around them and in many cases a stable coaching situation.  Can you imagine if Russ had Adam Gase and thats jets roster as a rookie?  

I think that JD brings an actual football infrastructure here and while he has had to plug a LOT of holes due to the mismanagement of the roster before he got here, we are on the right track if we keep his team in place.

 

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7 hours ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Made no financial sense to cut Wilson and his bloated # 2 pick contract.  

Trying to squeeze what they can out of him and maybe find a trade partner was the better solution.  

If they believed there was “something there” they wouldn’t have handed over multiple high picks and taken on the massive contract of a 39-year old QB. 

Massive contract?  It’s less than Daniel Jones 

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42 minutes ago, football guy said:

He’s been extremely open about it, as has the rest of his inner circle. I have even gotten the chance to meet him in Red Bank this summer. He has no desires to leave

Why would he not say this now?

get what he can out of rodgers.  Then decide in 2 years what to do. 

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Just now, batman10023 said:

Why would he not say this now?

get what he can out of rodgers.  Then decide in 2 years what to do. 

I think the point is that Zach isn’t ultra motivated by money. He’s set and is smart with his money. He loves NJ and his ultimate desire is for this administration to stick together with him eventually succeeding Rodgers. Whether that comes in the form of a cheap extension, 5th year option, or franchise tag we’ll see. Point is the chances are he will be here to get his shot post-Rodgers

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45 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Guess we’ll see how it plays out.

image.jpeg.75a5ff69c4d68bf0d1c373eb9d642945.jpeg

Step 1: Decide what you want to happen

Step 2: Attack the source of any evidence (rather than its substance) that reduces the likelihood of what you want to happen to happen

Step 3: Conflate what others predict will happen with what they want to happen

Step 4: Accuse those who disagree of "having an agenda" and living in their mom's basement

BONUS STEP: After you are proven wrong never raise the topic again and if someone else does, accuse them of beating a dead horse and being a big meanie for taking a victory lap on the internet.

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3 minutes ago, jgb said:

image.jpeg.75a5ff69c4d68bf0d1c373eb9d642945.jpeg

Step 1: Decide what you want to happen

Step 2: Attack the source of any evidence (rather than its substance) that reduces the likelihood of what you want to happen to happen

Step 3: Conflate what others predict will happen with what they want to happen

Step 4: Accuse those who disagree of "having an agenda" and call them mean names

The Jets and Aaron Rodgers have outright come out and said it several times lol… some of you on here really just can’t comprehend what goes on outside the jetnation message board lol

again, touch some grass. It’s good for the brain, the soul

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2 minutes ago, football guy said:

The Jets and Aaron Rodgers have outright come out and said it several times lol… some of you on here really just can’t comprehend what goes on outside the jetnation message board lol

again, touch some grass. It’s good for the brain, the soul

So what? It's not probative as I have said many times with many cited examples. In summary, they have no motive to say otherwise (and indeed a motive to say these things in every conceivable scenario) so therefore it doesn't tend to support either side of this debate

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4 minutes ago, football guy said:

I think the point is that Zach isn’t ultra motivated by money. He’s set and is smart with his money. He loves NJ and his ultimate desire is for this administration to stick together with him eventually succeeding Rodgers. Whether that comes in the form of a cheap extension, 5th year option, or franchise tag we’ll see. Point is the chances are he will be here to get his shot post-Rodgers

I'd be good with this.  I want to see ZW on a redemption tour in a couple of years.  No idea if it works out but I'm rooting for the guy because he legitimately seems to have a good attitude this offseason, when it would've been easy for him to sulk.  It also couldn't have been easy to be vociferously booed by the hometown fans.

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6 minutes ago, football guy said:

I think the point is that Zach isn’t ultra motivated by money. He’s set and is smart with his money. He loves NJ and his ultimate desire is for this administration to stick together with him eventually succeeding Rodgers. Whether that comes in the form of a cheap extension, 5th year option, or franchise tag we’ll see. Point is the chances are he will be here to get his shot post-Rodgers

This is what I was saying the other day. The 5th year option seems like a tough pill to swallow. So an extension for years 5 and 6 seems to be the best way to protect both parties.

I know people don't believe that the Jets still believe in this kid.  Saleh wants to be here for the long haul. This is all new to us because it has been fire the staff and repeat. Yet the same people that built the roster that is the talk of the league are in favor of this plan with Zach. I support them.

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2 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

I'd be good with this.  I want to see ZW on a redemption tour in a couple of years.  No idea if it works out but I'm rooting for the guy because he legitimately seems to have a good attitude this offseason, when it would've been easy for him to sulk.  It also couldn't have been easy to be vociferously booed by the hometown fans.

He has handled things as good as he could have. He messed up with the I didn't let the defense down interview. Other than that he is trying to do and say all the right things.

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Just now, Maxman said:

He has handled things as good as he could have. He messed up with the I didn't let the defense down interview. Other than that he is trying to do and say all the right things.

He definitely did but I'm willing to write it off to him being a young QB who maybe was trying to defend his teammates on offense.  I don't think he's "entitled" or a jerk or anything like that.  And I agree that he's absolutely handled things the right way ever since.

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On 8/14/2023 at 11:29 AM, Jetsfan80 said:

Zach Wilson is indeed improving.  It's also true that it isn't nearly enough and he has no future here. 

Because all it takes is a couple of months of practices and a couple of preseason games to make that determination.  
 

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On 8/14/2023 at 12:14 PM, UntouchableCrew said:

I'm honestly shocked anyone watched that Panthers game and thought "he's developing, he's improving" and walked away encouraged.

Pretty much what everyone in every media outlet is saying.  Right or wrong

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