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Guess some of you need to hear this: Zach Wilson (and his $23 mil 5th yr option) has no Future in NY


Paradis

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21 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

Yeah, he does trust the team.  And he may or may not have to sit 3 years, no one knows what AR8 will do.  

Pedersons a good HC because he’s good, a good play caller, not from being innovative.  Point was TL went 1.5 years and turned around.  ZW missed time with injuries and was replaced by MW and he’s got a similar amount of experience.  Besides, if you’re blaming the Jets OC and Meyer, if a different coach turned TL around, you’re agreeing

I do not see it.  

The team that blew smoke up his ass when he struggled went out and traded for his replacement at great cost.  

I do not think you are giving Pederson enough credit, but it is what it is.  He provided Lawrence competent support.  Maybe Hackett can do this for Zach.  Or at the very least point his career in the right direction.

Again, the financials do not work.  The Jets need A-A-Ron to play three years.  He can retire/be cut after two and the Jets will save 2,5 million in cap space.  However, they would have ~20% of their cap ($49M) tied up in dead cap space.

If Zach looks competent through this season, his trade value will never be higher next offseason.  The Jets can trade him like a lot of teams do when they do not want to pick up that 5th year option and free up cap space.  Cap space they are going toneed.  

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1 hour ago, PFSIKH said:

I do not see it.  

The team that blew smoke up his ass when he struggled went out and traded for his replacement at great cost.  

I do not think you are giving Pederson enough credit, but it is what it is.  He provided Lawrence competent support.  Maybe Hackett can do this for Zach.  Or at the very least point his career in the right direction.

Again, the financials do not work.  The Jets need A-A-Ron to play three years.  He can retire/be cut after two and the Jets will save 2,5 million in cap space.  However, they would have ~20% of their cap ($49M) tied up in dead cap space.

If Zach looks competent through this season, his trade value will never be higher next offseason.  The Jets can trade him like a lot of teams do when they do not want to pick up that 5th year option and free up cap space.  Cap space they are going toneed.  

What kind of smoke did they blow up his ass?  He played like garbage vs the Pats, a team they were clearly better than and replaced him.  As they should have, as he should have and did realize why it was happening.  They brought in Rodgers because he immediately put the jets in the SB mix.  Zach’s not an idiot he knew it was coming and why.  Along with Rodgers provides Zach the best chance of salvaging his career.  Which ZW seems on board with.
I give Pederson credit just as I lay a lot of the blame on MLF. 
if Zach plays and looks competent, looks anything like the QB they invested in with the 2nd overall pick, why would they throw him away?  Whatever they get back is going to bring back a competent QB? 

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1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

why would they throw him away

why would he want to come back here? 

do you remember that he got booed in his 1st ever home game in week 3. it was the game after his 3 or 4 pick Denver game. in his 1st year i was a supporter of Zach and had quite few arguments with the STH over that. how do you boo the kid in his 3rd game and 1st ever home game? of course they said it's there right and if he can't take it, he shouldn't be here. all that kind of stuff.

how many times did his mother have to deal with fans like in Cleveland or online saying bad things about her son?

you really think he would want to come back here? or go somewhere else and play well and stick it to all the fans here who booed him.? i would. 

how both times Zach came back from injury, they planned it on a road game cause they didn't want him to get booed if he didn't play well.

and we know those boos bother him. they must have cause we found out that he didnt like MILF because he didnt coddle him and was a tough love kind of guy. anyone who cant handle that from one-person cant handle it from 40-50 million Jet fans.

he is better off anywhere but NY where he could throw 10 picks and not get booed. 

and we are better off cause unless he is really good he will be booed and he cant handle that.

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Zach had a good practice today. That’s a good thing. 
 

I love seeing him straight up copy Rodgers hard counts, ball fakes, naked boots, but he needs to put the no look pass in the cabinet for now. Keep mastering the basics young fella 

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17 minutes ago, doitny said:

why would he want to come back here? 

do you remember that he got booed in his 1st ever home game in week 3. it was the game after his 3 or 4 pick Denver game. in his 1st year i was a supporter of Zach and had quite few arguments with the STH over that. how do you boo the kid in his 3rd game and 1st ever home game? of course they said it's there right and if he can't take it, he shouldn't be here. all that kind of stuff.

how many times did his mother have to deal with fans like in Cleveland or online saying bad things about her son?

you really think he would want to come back here? or go somewhere else and play well and stick it to all the fans here who booed him.? i would. 

how both times Zach came back from injury, they planned it on a road game cause they didn't want him to get booed if he didn't play well.

and we know those boos bother him. they must have cause we found out that he didnt like MILF because he didnt coddle him and was a tough love kind of guy. anyone who cant handle that from one-person cant handle it from 40-50 million Jet fans.

he is better off anywhere but NY where he could throw 10 picks and not get booed. 

and we are better off cause unless he is really good he will be booed and he cant handle that.

Zach got booed in the NE Pats game. That was his 1st home game. 

Denver was the following week. Fans went nuts for him in the Titans game.

 

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16 minutes ago, Larz said:

Zach had a good practice today. That’s a good thing. 
 

I love seeing him straight up copy Rodgers hard counts, ball fakes, naked boots, but he needs to put the no look pass in the cabinet for now. Keep mastering the basics young fella 

Isn't that something you would hope for. Mimicking Aaron. 

I have a feeling that Hackett is a good teacher and uses Aaron as an example. If Zach resurrects his career whether here or not, he will be the poster child for teams having a veteran offensive staff  and bringing in a veteran QB and let them learn. Whether its a HOF player like Aaron or a solid QB like Alex Smith. Zach has a long way to go, but Teams bringing rookies QB and watching them fail over & over is getting frustrating. Taking time with these young QBs isn't a bad thing.

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7 minutes ago, Claymation said:

Isn't that something you would hope for. Mimicking Aaron. 

I have a feeling that Hackett is a good teacher and uses Aaron as an example. If Zach resurrects his career whether here or not, he will be the poster child for teams having a veteran offensive staff  and bringing in a veteran QB and let them learn. Whether its a HOF player like Aaron or a solid QB like Alex Smith. Zach has a long way to go, but Teams bringing rookies QB and watching them fail over & over is getting frustrating. Taking time with these young QBs isn't a bad thing.

Yes but the no look is risky.  You can look off the defense and move them and  then look at your target.  

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5 hours ago, doitny said:

why would he want to come back here? 

do you remember that he got booed in his 1st ever home game in week 3. it was the game after his 3 or 4 pick Denver game. in his 1st year i was a supporter of Zach and had quite few arguments with the STH over that. how do you boo the kid in his 3rd game and 1st ever home game? of course they said it's there right and if he can't take it, he shouldn't be here. all that kind of stuff.

how many times did his mother have to deal with fans like in Cleveland or online saying bad things about her son?

you really think he would want to come back here? or go somewhere else and play well and stick it to all the fans here who booed him.? i would. 

how both times Zach came back from injury, they planned it on a road game cause they didn't want him to get booed if he didn't play well.

and we know those boos bother him. they must have cause we found out that he didnt like MILF because he didnt coddle him and was a tough love kind of guy. anyone who cant handle that from one-person cant handle it from 40-50 million Jet fans.

he is better off anywhere but NY where he could throw 10 picks and not get booed. 

and we are better off cause unless he is really good he will be booed and he cant handle that.

Joe Namath was booed here.  I don’t remember Zach getting booed in the Steeler game, have no idea why he would have, he played well.  And if they did it didn’t bother him, he brought the team back and won

He doesn’t want to play for the Jets because some drunk may have given his mom a hard time in Cleveland?  So, it would be different if he was playing for whoever and playing in Cleveland?   What does Cleveland have to do with NY?

You’re stretching far and wide to find reasons for him to want out.  He’s not leaving his girl, this team and a chance to start and “stick it to those who booed him” just to go somewhere else.

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On 8/15/2023 at 2:16 PM, doitny said:

funny thing is these guys came out of there hole after a PRESEASON game. 

yeah he put up good numbers but they all came on dump offs. i think the ball traveled an avg of 3 yds?? 

ohh i see a little improvement, he didnt move backwards.... yeah cause the starting defense wasnt out there blitzing the sh*t out of him. 

I think it was the fact that he wasn't out of control.  Not circling randomly.  Many of those short passes were missed last year.  His pocket presence and footwork look better.  Taking what the defense gave him is not a bad thing.  I do agree that hitting the open short passes does not make a franchise QB.  It is still progress.  Some of those passes didn't travel far but were quick and on target, allowing YAC.  That was progress too.  

Baby steps but it's early.  

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1 hour ago, doitny said:

why would he want to come back here? 

do you remember that he got booed in his 1st ever home game in week 3. it was the game after his 3 or 4 pick Denver game. in his 1st year i was a supporter of Zach and had quite few arguments with the STH over that. how do you boo the kid in his 3rd game and 1st ever home game? of course they said it's there right and if he can't take it, he shouldn't be here. all that kind of stuff.

how many times did his mother have to deal with fans like in Cleveland or online saying bad things about her son?

you really think he would want to come back here? or go somewhere else and play well and stick it to all the fans here who booed him.? i would. 

how both times Zach came back from injury, they planned it on a road game cause they didn't want him to get booed if he didn't play well.

and we know those boos bother him. they must have cause we found out that he didnt like MILF because he didnt coddle him and was a tough love kind of guy. anyone who cant handle that from one-person cant handle it from 40-50 million Jet fans.

he is better off anywhere but NY where he could throw 10 picks and not get booed. 

and we are better off cause unless he is really good he will be booed and he cant handle that.

I can't think of any examples where a first-round bust QB signed a second contract with the team that drafted him. And in the very rare cases where a bust became a good or even decent QB in the future, 0.0 times it happened with the team that drafted him.

The bust wants a fresh start and some other team will believe they can salvage him and thus value him higher than the team that knows first hand that he just sucks.

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3 hours ago, PFSIKH said:

I do not see it.  

The team that blew smoke up his ass when he struggled went out and traded for his replacement at great cost.  

I do not think you are giving Pederson enough credit, but it is what it is.  He provided Lawrence competent support.  Maybe Hackett can do this for Zach.  Or at the very least point his career in the right direction.

Again, the financials do not work.  The Jets need A-A-Ron to play three years.  He can retire/be cut after two and the Jets will save 2,5 million in cap space.  However, they would have ~20% of their cap ($49M) tied up in dead cap space.

If Zach looks competent through this season, his trade value will never be higher next offseason.  The Jets can trade him like a lot of teams do when they do not want to pick up that 5th year option and free up cap space.  Cap space they are going toneed.  

You are correct. If the Pats brought in Aaron Rodgers this off season, not a Jets fan on Earth would think, "Oh, crap, that Mac Jones is going to be a force after Rodgers retires."

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On 8/16/2023 at 10:56 AM, jgb said:

Let's hope if Zach is pressed into action this season that Hackett deems him worthy of calling "teh good plays."

Look Zach stunk but he had no help.  The OC was stubborn and Zach often had no targets.  He ignored the fact that the line was horrible and allowed constant pressure.  

Again Zach stunk but all QB's stink under pressure.  There were free runners several times a game.  How many times on third and long was Zach crushed in less than 3 seconds by multiple defensive lineman?  I saw Peyton Manning lose to the Jets by over 30 points in a home playoff game because the hit him early and often.   He missed several open receivers in that game. The giants won a Super Bowl against Kelly because they harassed him.  Then they beat Brady the same way.  

Point is all QB's, even the great ones stink when they are hit hard and often.  It's easy when you have time for the receiver to come all the way across the field and your jersey is spotless when the game is over.  With few exceptions, a great OC, a stellar line and great skill players all around you are all there with the great ones.  Not saying Zach will be great, but at least he won't fear for his life on every single play.

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53 minutes ago, jgb said:

I can't think of any examples where a first-round bust QB signed a second contract with the team that drafted him. And in the very rare cases where a bust became a good or even decent QB in the future, 0.0 times it happened with the team that drafted him.

The bust wants a fresh start and some other team will believe they can salvage him and thus value him higher than the team that knows first hand that he just sucks.

There would have to be a lot of very specific conditions for that to happen.  On the other hand, we've seen a number of cases where QBs start their career with one or two bad seasons and then a light goes on.  QBs with less natural talent than Zach.

Exhibit A: Drew Brees. Sat his first season.  Was average, at best in season 2.  Worse in season 3 before getting hurt.  Then comes back and begins a run of play that eventually led him to the HoF career.  The interesting point is he played two really good seasons for SD before they gave up on him and traded him to NO where he really took off.  

Exhibit B: Steve Young.  Pretty awful his first two seasons in TB.  Went to SF and sat for a number of years behind Joe.  When he took over, he was very, very good.

Every QB's path is different.  I don't think it's rational to assign any certainty to Zach Wilson's path at this point.  He's going to learn behind one of the very best to ever play the game.  He has all of the physical talent to become great.  It's really just a matter of whether he puts it together now but I believe there is a very real chance he does.  

Now as to whether he remains a Jet after this season, or next season, I have no idea.  That's between him and Joe Douglas.  But I don't believe his mother's social media outbursts are a factor for whoever cited that nugget.  I think it will come down to what things look like, probably in the offseason after the 2024 season.  All of the debate, and in some cases, pearl-clutching now is just a meaningless way to pass the time before the season starts. 

 

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26 minutes ago, nycdan said:

There would have to be a lot of very specific conditions for that to happen.  On the other hand, we've seen a number of cases where QBs start their career with one or two bad seasons and then a light goes on.  QBs with less natural talent than Zach.

Exhibit A: Drew Brees. Sat his first season.  Was average, at best in season 2.  Worse in season 3 before getting hurt.  Then comes back and begins a run of play that eventually led him to the HoF career.  The interesting point is he played two really good seasons for SD before they gave up on him and traded him to NO where he really took off.  

Your memory regarding Brees is wrong starting with the fact that SD didn't trade him, he rejected their offer and left in FA after being franchise-tagged the year before:

He wasn’t a castoff. He beat out Rivers in consecutive years to start. Then even after a bad shoulder injury, Chargers offered him top QB money to stay. But it had a heavy incentive component to protect the team in case the shoulder wasn’t right. Brees rejected it for a more traditional contract from a desperate NO team, and because he didn’t want to deal with Rivers breathing down his neck. Obviously in hindsight this appears to have been a very wise choice.

Brees and Payton were obviously symbiotic and benefitted greatly from each other but Brees wasn’t some work-a-day schlub that Payton plucked off the trash heap, shined up, and presto a FQB from garbage.

 

 

26 minutes ago, nycdan said:

Exhibit B: Steve Young.  Pretty awful his first two seasons in TB.  Went to SF and sat for a number of years behind Joe.  When he took over, he was very, very good.

Like I said, a highly-drafted (I've been careful to define it as 1st rounder) bust has never experienced a turnaround on the team that drafted him. The bust wants a fresh start and some other team will likely believe he was mismanaged and is salvageable and value him higher than the team who knows first-hand that he stinks.

26 minutes ago, nycdan said:

Every QB's path is different.  I don't think it's rational to assign any certainty to Zach Wilson's path at this point.  He's going to learn behind one of the very best to ever play the game.  He has all of the physical talent to become great.  It's really just a matter of whether he puts it together now but I believe there is a very real chance he does.  

It's not certainty. I have explicitly stated far too many times to count that it is probabilistic.

26 minutes ago, nycdan said:

Now as to whether he remains a Jet after this season, or next season, I have no idea.  That's between him and Joe Douglas.  But I don't believe his mother's social media outbursts are a factor for whoever cited that nugget.  I think it will come down to what things look like, probably in the offseason after the 2024 season.  All of the debate, and in some cases, pearl-clutching now is just a meaningless way to pass the time before the season starts. 

 

You are selling yourself short when you say you have "no idea" whether Zach will be a Jet or not after this season. You are working with the same information as the rest of us and can apply reason to that information to estimate the likelihood of the different scenarios.

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1 hour ago, Jet Nut said:

Joe Namath was booed here.  I don’t remember him getting booed in the Steeler game, have no idea why he would have, he played well.  And if they did it didn’t bother, him he brought the team back and won

He doesn’t want to play for the Jets because some drunk may have given his mom a hard time in Cleveland?  So, it would be different if he was playing for whoever and playing in Cleveland?   

You’re stretching far and wide to find reasons for him to want out.  He’s not leaving his girl, this team and a chance to start and “stick it to those who booed him” just to go somewhere else.

i got my teams wrong. he go booed bad in his 1st home game vs NE where he threw 4 INTs his rookie season. that Steeler game was this year and was on the road. they always bring him back from injury on the road. there always afraid he will start slow and get booed. NY does not have good fans. we boo everybody. thats why they say not everybody can play here.

is it really one drunk giving his mom a hard time? i am always seeing her defend her son online over bad comments.

what does his girl have to do with it? i know she is related to you and probably a big reason you defend Zach so hard but if he got trade tomorrow does that mean he has to break up with her? of course not. if he loves her so much he doesnt want to leave NY she should love him enough to move with him if he has too. 

if he went to the CFL his girl would be going with him. thats love.

team? lol nobody cares about that. everybody leaves for the highest money. no one gives discounts especially a young guy who hasnt made any real money yet. well for NFL players.

you seem to be the one stretching far and wide for reason for him to want to stay. 

 

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2 hours ago, Claymation said:

Zach got booed in the NE Pats game. That was his 1st home game. 

Denver was the following week. Fans went nuts for him in the Titans game.

 

your right.

but he has been booed alot of times here. 

if he ever plays again and plays bad you know this fan base will boo him bad. us fans have seen enough bad play out of him we have no stomach to sit through another one whether its this year or 3 years from now.

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8 minutes ago, doitny said:

your right.

but he has been booed alot of times here. 

if he ever plays again and plays bad you know this fan base will boo him bad. us fans have seen enough bad play out of him we have no stomach to sit through another one whether its this year or 3 years from now.

True, but yesterday people were screaming for Becton to play with the 1st team, and everyone on this forum knows his backstory. What can I say, Jets fans are a fickle bunch.

They cheered for Strev on that rainy Thursday night last December. And he is awful. 

Much like Becton, Zach's story isn't finished. He might stink in the future, but he might turn it around. Only time will tell.

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36 minutes ago, Claymation said:

Much like Becton, Zach's story isn't finished. He might stink in the future, but he might turn it around. Only time will tell.

FTR: this has nothing to do with the OP/topic. I mean it does of course, but it doesn't. 

Roughly 70.08%-73.1% of this thread has been "YOU don't know how Zach will develop"...  No sh*t. But contractually speaking he's along for the ride for 2 more years at most. #2 overall QB on a 4 yr rookie contract who bombed for two years and then got replaced for his last two - is not going to be here passed FA in 2025, Doesn't matter how well/horrible he plays. Aaron would have to blow an ACL and Zach take the team deep in the playoffs for that to change. 

Go ahead and hold your breath for that one.

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5 minutes ago, Paradis said:

FTR: this has nothing to do with the OP/topic. I mean it does of course, but it doesn't. 

Roughly 70.08%-73.1% of this thread has been "YOU don't know how Zach will develop"...  No sh*t. But contractually speaking he's along for the ride for 2 more years at most. #2 overall QB on a 4 yr rookie contract who bombed for two years and then got replaced for his last two - is not going to be here passed that FA in 2025, Doesn't matter how well/horrible he plays. Aaron would have to blow an ACL and Zach take the team deep in the playoffs for that to change. 

Go ahead and hold your breath for that one.

He may not be here at that time, and JD may move on from him.

But JD/FO/CS may like what he sees in Zach, and offer him a 1 year prove it deal if Aaron walks away. No one on this forum knows what is going to happen. It might be your opinion that he isn't resigned, but not guaranteed.

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12 minutes ago, Claymation said:

He may not be here at that time, and JD may move on from him.

But JD/FO/CS may like what he sees in Zach, and offer him a 1 year prove it deal if Aaron walks away. No one on this forum knows what is going to happen. It might be your opinion that he isn't resigned, but not guaranteed.

And Zach will never sign that - his reps/agent need to be shot, fired into the sun and then nuked if they supported that option. At this point, it's almost assured that whatever the jets can (or will) reasonably offer is NOT going to best Zach could get, or conversely in his best interest. 2 years sitting behind Aaron? He's going to have options.

You can say things like "we don't know what will happen"...ok lol. I can do that too "Silver will be worth more than Gold in 2025"... You can't guarantee it won't. 

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1 hour ago, Claymation said:

Much like Becton, Zach's story isn't finished. He might stink in the future, but he might turn it around. Only time will tell.

Only time will tell if there’s a black widow spider in the knot of a tree. Would you stick your pecker in to find out?

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17 hours ago, Paradis said:

And Zach will never sign that - his reps/agent need to be shot, fired into the sun and then nuked if they supported that option. At this point, it's almost assured that whatever the jets can (or will) reasonably offer is NOT going to best Zach could get, or conversely in his best interest. 2 years sitting behind Aaron? He's going to have options.

You can say things like "we don't know what will happen"...ok lol. I can do that too "Silver will be worth more than Gold in 2025"... You can't guarantee it won't. 

History tells us that Gold won't be more than Silver. History also tells us that when a high draft pick QB struggles, his options will be limited and his 2nd contract will be a prove it contract, for example Sam Darnold & Baker Mayfield. Now whether that is with the Jets or another team that remains to be seen.

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On 8/17/2023 at 9:25 AM, Jet Nut said:

What kind of smoke did they blow up his ass?  He played like garbage vs the Pats, a team they were clearly better than and replaced him.  As they should have, as he should have and did realize why it was happening.  They brought in Rodgers because he immediately put the jets in the SB mix.  Zach’s not an idiot he knew it was coming and why.  Along with Rodgers provides Zach the best chance of salvaging his career.  Which ZW seems on board with.
I give Pederson credit just as I lay a lot of the blame on MLF. 
if Zach plays and looks competent, looks anything like the QB they invested in with the 2nd overall pick, why would they throw him away?  Whatever they get back is going to bring back a competent QB? 

Dude...I totally agree with what the Jets' did.  The team was too good to hope Zach gets his sh!t together.  

It was reported that the Patriots kicked the tires on A-A-Ron.  If A-A-Ron was amiable to it, I would understand the move from the Patriots perspective.

The Jets would not throw him away.  That is why they will trade him next year.  Hell, if they are comfortable enough, move him this year.  Again, if he looks competent, you cannot afford to keep him at the 5th year option.  Jordan Love and his 83 career passes pulled in 12M/yr after the Packers declined his 5th year.  Do you keep Zach for 12 million or another player that will see the field?

Every team that lines up with a QB1 not named Mahomes, Burrow, Herbert or Allen should be using a draft pick on a QB.  I am not saying a first rounder, but a pick on someone that might be the next Purdy or Hurts.

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21 hours ago, Jet Nut said:

Joe Namath was booed here.  I don’t remember Zach getting booed in the Steeler game, have no idea why he would have, he played well.  And if they did it didn’t bother him, he brought the team back and won

He doesn’t want to play for the Jets because some drunk may have given his mom a hard time in Cleveland?  So, it would be different if he was playing for whoever and playing in Cleveland?   What does Cleveland have to do with NY?

You’re stretching far and wide to find reasons for him to want out.  He’s not leaving his girl, this team and a chance to start and “stick it to those who booed him” just to go somewhere else.

Joe Namath was among the most beloved sports figures in NY history.  He was booed but not in NY.  He was booed in LA when he was playing for the Rams at the end of his career.  

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35 minutes ago, PFSIKH said:

It was reported that the Patriots kicked the tires on A-A-Ron.  If A-A-Ron was amiable to it, I would understand the move from the Patriots perspective.

 

AR8 never spoke to anyone other than the Jets, didn’t want to go to anyone other than the Jets after playing them in 2022.  The Pats talk was generated because Mac Jones sucks and AR8 would be a huge step up.  I get why the Pats would be interested but as he’s said, it was the Jets or retire, he wasn’t interested in anyone else.  

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The practices and preseason show real detailed focus for Zach.   2nd game was hitting the back foot and throwing.   
 

Zach’s play actions the 1st 2 seasons were dreadful.  now he looks just like AR.   
 

He’s a good athlete and coachable.   It’s easy to see he wasn’t being coached by the last staff.   They were overwhelmed. 

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It’s ironic how ZW’s interceptions are so catchable — like placing the ball on a velvet cushion, to borrow a soccer analogy — but so many of his throws within the vicinity of his WRs are like trying to catch a radioactive ☢️ scud missile

He just needs to do the opposite like George Costanza 

He has no feel for timing, rhythm, touch and pace, when to lead WRs, when to throttle them down, when it’s ok or not ok to miss high or low

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41 minutes ago, JoeNamathsFurCoat said:

It’s ironic how ZW’s interceptions are so catchable — like placing the ball on a velvet cushion, to borrow a soccer analogy — but so many of his throws within the vicinity of his WRs are like trying to catch a radioactive ☢️ scud missile

He just needs to do the opposite like George Costanza 

He has no feel for timing, rhythm, touch and pace, when to lead WRs, when to throttle them down, when it’s ok or not ok to miss high or low

Yes. He has no innate feel for the NFL game. Before the Nauvoo Legion mobilizes against me, I guess it's possible he develops this, but **** me is that unlikely.

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4 hours ago, Claymation said:

History tells us that Gold won't be more than Silver. History also tells us that when a high draft pick QB struggles, his options will be limited and his 2nd contract will be a prove it contract, for example Sam Darnold & Baker Mayfield. Now whether that is with the Jets or another team that remains to be seen.

hyperbole aside, history tells us that opportunity will not be back with the Jets. It's not like a "maybe" situation, not when the guy was a top 5 pick and wound up sitting for 2 years after losing his job. To speculate otherwise is an exercise in fantasy.  

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