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2 years ago one of the weakest rosters - Now this!


LockeJET

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4 minutes ago, Warfish said:

There is no question the roster is better, materially, today than it was the day JD took the job as Jets GM.

He's gone full Dan Snyder in 2023, and has purchased a team that should (on paper) compete for the playoffs, if not a deep playoff run, this year.

And he has some long-term pieces too, Sauce, Hall, Wilson, the two D-Ends perhaps, and a few others amongst them.

But the O-line is as raggedly shambolic today as it was then, and the QB position remains completely unanswered sans the short-term Aaron Rodgers rental.

I'd expect we do win pretty good this year (make playoffs, win a playoff game).  Too much talent not to, it'd be a historic debacle if we didn't tbqh.

And that much winning likely buys JD (and Saleh) their extensions.

But eventually, JD needs to answer the O-line and QB problems he's as-yet been unable to fix via the draft.

LOL, you left out Woody. He's the star of the offseason.

Now extend JD and RS to take the pressure off, neither one needs it to function at their best and do not want to lose either of them.

Oh, and go get Mike Evans for the cherry on top!

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37 minutes ago, Warfish said:

There is no question the roster is better, materially, today than it was the day JD took the job as Jets GM.

He's gone full Dan Snyder in 2023, and has purchased a team that should (on paper) compete for the playoffs, if not a deep playoff run, this year.

And he has some long-term pieces too, Sauce, Hall, Wilson, the two D-Ends perhaps, and a few others amongst them.

But the O-line is as raggedly shambolic today as it was then, and the QB position remains completely unanswered sans the short-term Aaron Rodgers rental.

I'd expect we do win pretty good this year (make playoffs, win a playoff game).  Too much talent not to, it'd be a historic debacle if we didn't tbqh.

And that much winning likely buys JD (and Saleh) their extensions.

But eventually, JD needs to answer the O-line and QB problems he's as-yet been unable to fix via the draft.

Not to rain on hard on the parade but those loaded Snyder teams didn’t crack 8-8.  Same thing from one of those loade rams team of the early 80’s.  I’m not sure Rodgers is ranked so low. Just where and who are the QBs ranked ahead?

 As for the oline, I think their biggest problem over the past few seasons is not staying healthy. Becton aside, they’ve had more than their fair share of injuries. Plus Rodgers should make them look much better by getting rid of the ball sooner.

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25 minutes ago, rangerous said:

Not to rain on hard on the parade but those loaded Snyder teams didn’t crack 8-8.

Oh, be assured, I am well aware. :)  But I do think how Dan tried it, and how JD has tried it, are different, with a higher odds of success here and now, than they had back then, even if the methodology is much the same.

25 minutes ago, rangerous said:

As for the oline, I think their biggest problem over the past few seasons is not staying healthy. Becton aside, they’ve had more than their fair share of injuries. Plus Rodgers should make them look much better by getting rid of the ball sooner.

Health has been our organizations achilleas heel for some time, no doubt about that.

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1 hour ago, Warfish said:

He's gone full Dan Snyder in 2023, and has purchased a team that should (on paper) compete for the playoffs, if not a deep playoff run, this year.

I'm gonna disagree about going full Snyder. He hasn't signed a bunch of big name retreads to big contracts. Rodgers and Cook to this point. Cobb was signed for AR not because he's a shiny toy. AL is a #2 WR. Most of the players on the team are young and will be here for a while as opposed to next years cap purge that would be inevitable had he bought a team of has been retreads.  

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1 hour ago, Warfish said:

There is no question the roster is better, materially, today than it was the day JD took the job as Jets GM.

He's gone full Dan Snyder in 2023, and has purchased a team that should (on paper) compete for the playoffs, if not a deep playoff run, this year.

And he has some long-term pieces too, Sauce, Hall, Wilson, the two D-Ends perhaps, and a few others amongst them.

But the O-line is as raggedly shambolic today as it was then, and the QB position remains completely unanswered sans the short-term Aaron Rodgers rental.

I'd expect we do win pretty good this year (make playoffs, win a playoff game).  Too much talent not to, it'd be a historic debacle if we didn't tbqh.

And that much winning likely buys JD (and Saleh) their extensions.

But eventually, JD needs to answer the O-line and QB problems he's as-yet been unable to fix via the draft.

The OL is just as shambolic?  C'mon you know that's some hyperbole.  Not to say it's good or even average right now(time will tell), but it's miles ahead of where it was back then.  Again I'm not sure if he should be praised for that, since it was so bad that improving it should have been the easiest thing in the world.  AVT alone puts us miles ahead of where we were, and Tippmann looks like a foundation piece as well.  Becton though is the one who will determine just how good this line can be.  Would be pretty satisfying to see the dude pointed at as JD's biggest draft mistake come in and have a PB year, holding down LT for a team that goes on a deep run.  

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1 minute ago, bonkertons said:

The OL is just as shambolic?  C'mon you know that's some hyperbole.  Not to say it's good or even average right now(time will tell), but it's miles ahead of where it was back then.  Again I'm not sure if he should be praised for that, since it was so bad that improving it should have been the easiest thing in the world.  AVT alone puts us miles ahead of where we were, and Tippmann looks like a foundation piece as well.  Becton though is the one who will determine just how good this line can be.  Would be pretty satisfying to see the dude pointed at as JD's biggest draft mistake come in and have a PB year, holding down LT for a team that goes on a deep run.  

AVT needs to stay healthy, he couldn't last year.  Tippmann needs to win the job, then play well, then stay healthy, to be win.  Becton needs to actually play a game, and (wait for it) stay healthy, and not get attitude more than he already has (and get resigned if he is good).  None of these guys are sure things yet, in 2023 or beyond, not remotely.  And the rest of these bodies are plug in's, fill in's, JAG's and castoffs.

JD has tried, but so far the results just aren't there.  This O-line has alot more potential than perhaps the one he inherited, but it needs to live up to that potential before we start patting JD on the back.

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1 hour ago, Augustiniak said:

The first round busts get highlighted but besides wilson/becton the picks have been pretty good, and have improved the past 2 drafts.  You can tell already that Izzy and McDonald are ready, and tippman should be solid as well.  

The 2020 draft was fairly average to bad all around......  

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1 minute ago, Warfish said:

AVT needs to stay healthy, he couldn't last year.  Tippmann needs to win the job, then play well, then stay healthy, to be win.  Becton needs to actually play a game, and (wait for it) stay healthy, and not get attitude more than he already has (and get resigned if he is good).  None of these guys are sure things yet, in 2023 or beyond, not remotely.  And the rest of these bodies are plug in's, fill in's, JAG's and castoffs.

JD has tried, but so far the results just aren't there.  This O-line has alot more potential than perhaps the one he inherited, but it needs to live up to that potential before we start patting JD on the back.

I think the point is that there is actual talent here.  Back then, there wasn't.  Obviously these guys need to stay healthy.  I think it's reasonable to expect that AVT will.  I don't think it's reasonable to assume Becton will, but IF he does, that's just another high end piece.  Luckily we also have Brown as insurance.

 

Don't disagree about the rest being JAGs, but these 3 guys alone are levels beyond anything we had back then.  Just a reminder of the Jets starting OL back in 2019:

 

LT: Beachum

LG: Alex Lewis

C : Harrison

RG: Winters

RT: Brandon Shell

 

We'll potentially only have 1 or 2(depending on how things go at C) starters at this level in 2023.  Even if Mitchell plays, at least he has some upside.  There was literally nothing to be excited about with that 2019 OL.  The present and future of that line was.....blegh.  

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I think a lot of good points but maybe to the point of nit picking. Of course the oline has be mostly injury free.  And the skill players Douglas has brought in need to contribute.  But unlike Snyder effort I think the jets brought in higher character guys even if some are on the back end of their careers.  And Rodgers seems to be the on field and lockeroom leader they’ve been looking for a very long time.  It’s still up to this team to put it all together on the field. Saleh has his work cut out for himself.

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2 hours ago, Warfish said:

There is no question the roster is better, materially, today than it was the day JD took the job as Jets GM.

He's gone full Dan Snyder in 2023, and has purchased a team that should (on paper) compete for the playoffs, if not a deep playoff run, this year.

And he has some long-term pieces too, Sauce, Hall, Wilson, the two D-Ends perhaps, and a few others amongst them.

But the O-line is as raggedly shambolic today as it was then, and the QB position remains completely unanswered sans the short-term Aaron Rodgers rental.

I'd expect we do win pretty good this year (make playoffs, win a playoff game).  Too much talent not to, it'd be a historic debacle if we didn't tbqh.

And that much winning likely buys JD (and Saleh) their extensions.

But eventually, JD needs to answer the O-line and QB problems he's as-yet been unable to fix via the draft.

The QB one is easy - no? It’s not like the Jets have been trying to address that for like- what, 50 years or anything like that. Or have they? 😉🤣🤣

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2 hours ago, Warfish said:

Oh, be assured, I am well aware. :)  But I do think how Dan tried it, and how JD has tried it, are different, with a higher odds of success here and now, than they had back then, even if the methodology is much the same.

Health has been our organizations achilleas heel for some time, no doubt about that.

I disagree that what JD has done this offseason is the same thing that Snyder did.  The core of this team, aside from Rodgers are all young players, with the exception of Q, all were drafted, traded for or signed by JD. He's not gone crazy in FA and mortgaged the future.

Jets fans have been screaming for a winning team and to make the playoffs. It figures that JD makes some moves to help insure that happens this year, and Jets fans complain about that.  I swear, the Jets have driven us all crazy.  We need to be in therapy.

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2 hours ago, bonkertons said:

The OL is just as shambolic?  C'mon you know that's some hyperbole.  Not to say it's good or even average right now(time will tell), but it's miles ahead of where it was back then.  Again I'm not sure if he should be praised for that, since it was so bad that improving it should have been the easiest thing in the world.  AVT alone puts us miles ahead of where we were, and Tippmann looks like a foundation piece as well.  Becton though is the one who will determine just how good this line can be.  Would be pretty satisfying to see the dude pointed at as JD's biggest draft mistake come in and have a PB year, holding down LT for a team that goes on a deep run.  

Good post, and I agree.  If Becton is starting either at LT or RT and with either Brown or AVT at the other OT spot, I think this OL could even be very good.  I think the interior will be pretty solid even with Tomlinson, McGovern and AVT (or Schweitzer if AVT is playing RT), but it will be even better if Tippman is at C. I could live with a few rookie mistakes from Tippman, but not McGovern's mistakes due to the fact that he just isn't that good.

Becton is the key.  That's why Saleh needs to have him practicing with the 1st fiull time either at LT or RT beginning with the next practice.

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2 hours ago, Warfish said:

AVT needs to stay healthy, he couldn't last year.  Tippmann needs to win the job, then play well, then stay healthy, to be win.  Becton needs to actually play a game, and (wait for it) stay healthy, and not get attitude more than he already has (and get resigned if he is good).  None of these guys are sure things yet, in 2023 or beyond, not remotely.  And the rest of these bodies are plug in's, fill in's, JAG's and castoffs.

JD has tried, but so far the results just aren't there.  This O-line has alot more potential than perhaps the one he inherited, but it needs to live up to that potential before we start patting JD on the back.

All JD can do is bring players in.  It's up to the CS and players themselves at what level they play.  The CS has to hold players accountable, and of course, they have to stay healthy and on the field.  That's mostly been the problem for the last 2 seasons.

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10 minutes ago, JKlecko said:

I disagree that what JD has done this offseason is the same thing that Snyder did.

Skins fans thought the same thing at the time.

10 minutes ago, JKlecko said:

The core of this team, aside from Rodgers are all young players, with the exception of Q, all were drafted, traded for or signed by JD. He's not gone crazy in FA and mortgaged the future.

With the exception of the most important guy (QB), his most important supporting asset (Cook at RB), his #2 WR (Davis), his #3 WR/KR (Hardman) and his #4 WR (Cobb), and one of his most vital O-line protectors (Brown).

Tell me, if you remove those guys, how does this Jets team look to fare in 2023?

10 minutes ago, JKlecko said:

Jets fans have been screaming for a winning team and to make the playoffs. It figures that JD makes some moves to help insure that happens this year, and Jets fans complain about that.

Where are you seeing a complaint?  Facts are facts.  JD failed to address the QB position, so in his make-or-break contract year, he bought a QB for a one (or more) year rental at exceptional cost to win now.  If he does, he's likely to get extended, if he doesn't, he isn't.

Spending greatly in FA is what the Skins did, and it's what we've done now.  Stating such isn't complaining about it, I've generally been in support of all of these moves so far.

10 minutes ago, JKlecko said:

  I swear, the Jets have driven us all crazy.  We need to be in therapy.

I think some of you love-everything-they-do homers just like to over-react to any perceived criticism. 

Be assured, when I'm being critical, there won't be any mistaking it for anything but criticism, lol.

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5 hours ago, LockeJET said:

#jets currently have 6 players on the roster who made the nfl top 100 players of 2023. That’s third most in the entire NFL. Ahmad “sauce” Gardner #23 Quinnen Williams # 40 CJ Mosley #46 Aaron Rodgers #51 Garrett Wilson #74 Dalvin Cook #91

But JD is not good remember as some want you to believe 

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2 hours ago, Warfish said:

Skins fans thought the same thing at the time.

With the exception of the most important guy (QB), his most important supporting asset (Cook at RB), his #2 WR (Davis), his #3 WR/KR (Hardman) and his #4 WR (Cobb), and one of his most vital O-line protectors (Brown).

Tell me, if you remove those guys, how does this Jets team look to fare in 2023?

Where are you seeing a complaint?  Facts are facts.  JD failed to address the QB position, so in his make-or-break contract year, he bought a QB for a one (or more) year rental at exceptional cost to win now.  If he does, he's likely to get extended, if he doesn't, he isn't.

Spending greatly in FA is what the Skins did, and it's what we've done now.  Stating such isn't complaining about it, I've generally been in support of all of these moves so far.

I think some of you love-everything-they-do homers just like to over-react to any perceived criticism. 

Be assured, when I'm being critical, there won't be any mistaking it for anything but criticism, lol.

The point is that he didn't bring all those guys in this season to go "all in."  Every team in the NFL except maybe GB signs FAs.  It's very difficult to build a team from just the draft alone.  Cobb probably is WR #5 not #4.

I disagree with your comment that if JD doesn't win now he won't be extended.  He may not be extended this year, but he would be next year.  He's not going anywhere, nor should he.

If you can't see the difference between what Snyder did and what JD has done then I can't help you, because you have an agenda and don't want to see.  There is none so blind as those who refuse to see.

I am FAR from a homer or liking everything they do.  I didn't like the Saleh hire.  I thought it was a horrible decision by JD.  You shouldn't draft a rookie QB with the intent of playing him day one when you've just hired a rookie HC who was a defensive coach and who has no experience with QBs, who in turn hired a rookie OC and a rookie QB coach, and don't have a solid vet QB on your roster.  Then they compounded their incompetence by expecting Zach to change his fundamentals, his mental approach to playing QB 180 degrees, and learn the complex WCO offense while starting day one, and then MLF made it a total cluster **** by trying to exploit weaknesses in opponent's secondaries early in games early in Zach career rather than trying to get him in a groove/rhythm and build confidence.

I won't kill JD for that because rookie GMs have to learn on the job just as rookie HCs and OCs do.  He has done a very good otherwise with trades, handling the cap, and the draft.  The D has certainly played well under Saleh, and the team shows up prepared and doesn't quit, but the jury is still out on him. 

Brian Daboll should have been the hire.  He is known for developing QBs, and I'm certain that he would have chosen an offensive scheme that fit what Zach did well coming out of BYU and wouldn't have expected him to change so much while he was playing.  Look at what he's done with Danile Jones.  IMO Zach would be playing at a really high level by now if Daboll had been his HC.  I don't think that Greg Knapp would have made much of a difference as he had no power over MLF or Saleh.  Saleh, MLF and JD totally mishandled Zach and about ruined him with their rookie mistakes. It's a credit to Zach, his love for the game, his work ethic, his attitude and his resilience that it didn't.

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2 hours ago, Warfish said:

With the exception of the most important guy (QB), his most important supporting asset (Cook at RB), his #2 WR (Davis), his #3 WR/KR (Hardman) and his #4 WR (Cobb), and one of his most vital O-line protectors (Brown).

Tell me, if you remove those guys, how does this Jets team look to fare in 2023?

This is just wrong.  Yes, Rodgers and Brown are old and acquired in free agency.  The rest is a false.  The most vital skill player and best skill player is Wilson. Hall comes next.  Cook is not the most important supporting asset. He is RB insurance and many thought the team would be fine without him and with the current RB room. Davis is not old and is not clearly the #2.  We will see if Lazard (who you have as the #5 receiver?) fits that role.  Cobb is the #5 receiver, not #4 and is there as a security blanket for Rodgers.  Besides Rodgers and Brown, I don't view any of the players you list as keys to the season. There are 10 -15 players that are more important.  Good try though. 

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10 hours ago, OtherwiseHappyinLife said:

What’s amazing is that Breece and AVT might also be on that list if they didn’t get injured last year.  That’s how impactful both were.

Its nice to have nice things.  Praying for some good health and a little bit of luck this season.  

Ooooo, that’s actually good dude, very well could be. Good catch! 

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11 hours ago, LockeJET said:

#jets currently have 6 players on the roster who made the nfl top 100 players of 2023. That’s third most in the entire NFL. Ahmad “sauce” Gardner #23 Quinnen Williams # 40 CJ Mosley #46 Aaron Rodgers #51 Garrett Wilson #74 Dalvin Cook #91

To the ones saying he bought the roster, he signed Rodgers and Cook on this list. JD has done an amazing job at building a roster in the draft, UDFAs and every other avenue. It’s called doing his job. Give credit where credit is due. We were basically a QB away last year. We are contenders my dudes. 

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11 hours ago, Warfish said:

There is no question the roster is better, materially, today than it was the day JD took the job as Jets GM.

He's gone full Dan Snyder in 2023, and has purchased a team that should (on paper) compete for the playoffs, if not a deep playoff run, this year.

And he has some long-term pieces too, Sauce, Hall, Wilson, the two D-Ends perhaps, and a few others amongst them.

But the O-line is as raggedly shambolic today as it was then, and the QB position remains completely unanswered sans the short-term Aaron Rodgers rental.

I'd expect we do win pretty good this year (make playoffs, win a playoff game).  Too much talent not to, it'd be a historic debacle if we didn't tbqh.

And that much winning likely buys JD (and Saleh) their extensions.

But eventually, JD needs to answer the O-line and QB problems he's as-yet been unable to fix via the draft.

It hasn’t been as a result of lack of effort. McCagnan was egregious in his lack of investment in oline. Highest pick I believe was 5th round Brandon Shell or something crazy like that. 
 

Douglas had spent 2 firsts and a high second now on Oline+spent big on Laken Tomlinson in free agency. 
 

his big screw up was the Becton over Wirfs decision.  Imagine having the best right tackle in football instead of Max Mitchell and Billy Turner right now? 
 

In his defense you saw in Becton rookie year and even in some of these pre season games why the Jets took him. He’s got a ton of talent, but given his size and “knock knees” it was pretty clear he wasn’t going to hold up physically. 

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