Organizational Responsibility

[BCJet]

Injuries happen and backups have to play - every player in the NFL understands that but what is happening here is completely different.

We have an elite defense, 2 young offensive stars in Breece and GW and some talented young players in AVT, Ruckert and Tippman and to put Zach Wilson on the field for any more games is doing them all a disservice.

We are not getting poor play at the QB position, we are playing someone who cannot execute even minimal NFL level plays and he has been given 3 years to improve to even a level of being below average.  Colt McCoy would likely have won with this team yesterday - let alone someone like Gardner Minshew who just beat the Ravens.  

I cannot see how JD and Saleh are able to look a single player in the eye today and tell them zach wilson will be the starter on sunday.  Why would any of these guys put their body on the line when they know there is ZERO chance for them to win.  Think about this from Jeremy Ruckert's standpoint - the hand picked OC wont play me over CJ Uzomah who is clearly useless, I am in the middle of another season where Ill have no catches because our QB cant execute simple plays, and I have virtually no chance to put up enough stats to get a good second contract.  That lack of any hope is going to be felt across the locker room and it should - you are literally taking away the opportunity for 52 players to have any sort of success for yet another season.

Its week 3 and we had 3 "altercations" on the sideline - why would that not continue?  

I really cannot believe that the organization can be this inept to continue to trot zach out there.  Forget winning games in 2023, the Jets leadership has to ensure that they do not ruin the young group of players that we have here and if they keep this absolute waste of a player in his role, they are doing just that.

[OtherwiseHappyinLife]

I’ll also add that Ruckert played 1 snap.  

[heymangold]

^^ I don't think Hardman played any.

 

it's a dereliction of duty as a HC to continue to roll zach wilson out there.  saleh has seen him for 3 years.  he can't honestly think that zach can turn it around.

someone in that organization, from woody to JD, HAS to see that they're losing because of him.

[derp]

If you’re the owner, do you let the general manager that put this team together burn more future assets to acquire a quarterback that’ll help keep the team together but not be good enough to compete for a Super Bowl this season?

Or do you just let this play out while already having an eye on GM and HC candidates?

It’s not fun to watch as a fan, but Douglas has made his bed. I feel a little bad for Saleh who I think is less to blame, but in an offense first league he just hasn’t shown he can head a team with a good offense. It’s kind of a shame for him MLF got scapegoated. I think the original coaching staff with a veteran QB might have shown some things.

This might be the most young talent the Jets have had, to the point that they might attract good candidates. And they should have a very high draft pick in what’s a strong draft class at the top as the wheels come off.

[Adoni Beast]

15 minutes ago, derp said:

If you’re the owner, do you let the general manager that put this team together burn more future assets to acquire a quarterback that’ll help keep the team together but not be good enough to compete for a Super Bowl this season?

Or do you just let this play out while already having an eye on GM and HC candidates?

It’s not fun to watch as a fan, but Douglas has made his bed. I feel a little bad for Saleh who I think is less to blame, but in an offense first league he just hasn’t shown he can head a team with a good offense. It’s kind of a shame for him MLF got scapegoated. I think the original coaching staff with a veteran QB might have shown some things.

This might be the most young talent the Jets have had, to the point that they might attract good candidates. And they should have a very high draft pick in what’s a strong draft class at the top as the wheels come off.

I honestly think that this is Aaron Rodgers' team now, including decisions on GM and HC. Woody will ask Rodgers what he wants and he will most likely want Douglas and Saleh + Hackett back to run it back for another year or two.

We can forget any illusions about drafting a QB within the top 100 picks next draft as well. 

If by some miracle Rodgers wants Saleh and/or Douglas gone, they will be shown the door but I seriously doubt that will happen. Saleh has the good vibes mantra and defensive acumen that Rodgers has been seeking, leaving Rodgers to control the offense via proxy Hackett.

That is the kind of autonomy Rodgers will want to finish out his career with. Our best bet and hope is that Rodgers comes back 100% next year and is able to stay healthy and play another 2 seasons. 

[Pac]

From the highest of highs to lowest of lows in the span of 2 weeks.  A Jet record.

If they don't sign a QB this week and Zap has another Zap performance in front of the country on Sunday night this locker room will implode. 

The thought of Taylor Swift celebrating a Chiefs romp from a box at met life must be a kick to the nuts for ARod. 

This is going to be ugly. 

[Smashmouth]

2 minutes ago, Pac said:

From the highest of highs to lowest of lows in the span of 2 weeks.  A Jet record.

If they don't sign a QB this week and Zap has another Zap performance in front of the country on Sunday night this locker room will implode. 

The thought of Taylor Swift celebrating a Chiefs romp from a box at met life must be a kick to the nuts for ARod. 

This is going to be ugly. 

Why would it even matter if Zippy even has what's considered a good performance ?

[heymangold]

2 minutes ago, Pac said:

From the highest of highs to lowest of lows in the span of 2 weeks.  A Jet record.

If they don't sign a QB this week and Zap has another Zap performance in front of the country on Sunday night this locker room will implode. 

The thought of Taylor Swift celebrating a Chiefs romp from a box at met life must be a kick to the nuts for ARod. 

This is going to be ugly. 

i'm so glad i never changed my avatar when i actually got excited with AR as the QB.

[jamesr]

31 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

Why would it even matter if Zippy even has what's considered a good performance ?

If he does then it'll extend the "best chance to win" mantra. 

Same reason why if Cobb had caught that Hail Mary yesterday there'd be zero chance that Zach gets benched.

[derp]

1 hour ago, Adoni Beast said:

I honestly think that this is Aaron Rodgers' team now, including decisions on GM and HC. Woody will ask Rodgers what he wants and he will most likely want Douglas and Saleh + Hackett back to run it back for another year or two.

We can forget any illusions about drafting a QB within the top 100 picks next draft as well. 

If by some miracle Rodgers wants Saleh and/or Douglas gone, they will be shown the door but I seriously doubt that will happen. Saleh has the good vibes mantra and defensive acumen that Rodgers has been seeking, leaving Rodgers to control the offense via proxy Hackett.

That is the kind of autonomy Rodgers will want to finish out his career with. Our best bet and hope is that Rodgers comes back 100% next year and is able to stay healthy and play another 2 seasons. 

Rodgers definitely complicates things and it would be very Jets-y to move forward a year late.

I do think he’s been very involved in decision making and the season may get so bad it forces Woody’s hand. I can’t see more than 6 total wins and think being back in the top 3-5 picks is firmly on the table, especially if they make no move at QB.

[Adoni Beast]

55 minutes ago, derp said:

Rodgers definitely complicates things and it would be very Jets-y to move forward a year late.

I do think he’s been very involved in decision making and the season may get so bad it forces Woody’s hand. I can’t see more than 6 total wins and think being back in the top 3-5 picks is firmly on the table, especially if they make no move at QB.

The most Jetsiest of scenarios:

• We will most likely have a Top 10 pick
• In a seemingly talented QB draft
• But will pass on drafting one because we will be going all in with Rodgers

I do think that the biggest priority for this team is stabilizing the team and locker room, beyond performing rah-rah speeches in practice. Not ideal, but I think we have to trade a 4th or a 5th round pick for a QB before the deadline.

What a lot of people lose sight of is the fact that it isn't just passing yards and points that matter, but the QB play has to be serviceable to be able to develop and grade the OL and O skill positions players properly...and keeping the Garrett Wilsons and Breece Halls happy (avoiding trade demands) enough, because the worse their stats look, the worst their next contract looks.

[Augustiniak]

1 hour ago, Adoni Beast said:

The most Jetsiest of scenarios:

• We will most likely have a Top 10 pick
• In a seemingly talented QB draft
• But will pass on drafting one because we will be going all in with Rodgers

I do think that the biggest priority for this team is stabilizing the team and locker room, beyond performing rah-rah speeches in practice. Not ideal, but I think we have to trade a 4th or a 5th round pick for a QB before the deadline.

What a lot of people lose sight of is the fact that it isn't just passing yards and points that matter, but the QB play has to be serviceable to be able to develop and grade the OL and O skill positions players properly...and keeping the Garrett Wilsons and Breece Halls happy (avoiding trade demands) enough, because the worse their stats look, the worst their next contract looks.

You can see this scenario unfolding already.  

The problem with trading for a qb is, the jets aren’t the only team with qb issues.  And if the jets overpay for cousins, it’s only b/c douglas and saleh got together and said look, we’re getting canned if we don’t get some wins here so we need to bring in this guy to prove it’s all b/c of zach.

if i had to guess right now, I’d say that they’re finishing with 5 or 6 wins, and woody will demand changes.  Douglas will be forced to fire saleh and the new coaching staff will wrankle rodgers.  Then there will be rumored raging debates about whether the jets will go qb in round 1.

my predictions:  saleh and all the coaches are gone, douglas survives b/c he seems to have drafted well besides qb, the jets have a top 12 pick in the first round, take a LT, and then draft a lesser qb prospect in the 3rd round.  This appeases rodgers, helps the offense and puts the jets in the same position they’re in now, all in on rodgers.  And obviously wilson is gone. 

[sciond]

This defense does not look elite....

[Augustiniak]

Just now, sciond said:

This defense does not look elite....

No but it’s pretty good, it will keep the jets in most games. 

[bitonti]

4 hours ago, derp said:

Or do you just let this play out while already having an eye on GM and HC candidates?

both JD and Saleh are on the 2nd to last year of their deal 

they can't get rid of Aaron Rodgers for another year at least 

the easiest (and most likely) outcome is JD and Saleh play their lame duck years out and Woody decides what to do after 2024 season

 

[The Crusher]

4 hours ago, Smashmouth said:

Why would it even matter if Zippy even has what's considered a good performance ?

According to Bobby, he did. 

[Zachtomims47]

1 minute ago, sciond said:

This defense does not look elite....

 

Think about this for a second...it's just absurd. 

 

[Augustiniak]

Just now, bitonti said:

both JD and Saleh are on the 2nd to last year of their deal 

they can't get rid of Aaron Rodgers for another year at least 

the easiest (and most likely) outcome is JD and Saleh play their lame duck years out and Woody decides what to do after 2024 season

 

If they finish with 4-6 wins out of 17 games i think saleh and his staff get canned. 

[BCJet]

4 hours ago, derp said:

If you’re the owner, do you let the general manager that put this team together burn more future assets to acquire a quarterback that’ll help keep the team together but not be good enough to compete for a Super Bowl this season?

Or do you just let this play out while already having an eye on GM and HC candidates?

It’s not fun to watch as a fan, but Douglas has made his bed. I feel a little bad for Saleh who I think is less to blame, but in an offense first league he just hasn’t shown he can head a team with a good offense. It’s kind of a shame for him MLF got scapegoated. I think the original coaching staff with a veteran QB might have shown some things.

This might be the most young talent the Jets have had, to the point that they might attract good candidates. And they should have a very high draft pick in what’s a strong draft class at the top as the wheels come off.

This is where having such an incompetent owner really hurts us.

In this scenario, its very possible that JD is too close to the whole thing, Zach was "his pick", Rogers was "his choice", there is a ton of money tied to both of them and the reality is that he has no one to really counsel him here other then Saleh, who is also really close to this whole thing.  

I get that we will likely be staring at a good OT when we pick and that likely will continue to be a huge need for us, but if there is a legitimate QB also available I just dont see how you can pass.  That being said, its going to take a bit of a leap from JD to do that - but wouldnt the best possible case for this team be having a first rounder ACTUALLY develop for a season behind rogers and also be ready to step in should he get injured?  We could wind up with the best of both worlds were Rogers plays one good season in 2024 and we get a legit long term starter who has a year to learn.  

[Barkus]

Zach Wilson has regressed to non-functional again. He is not an NFL qb, he is worse than hackenberg. Enough is enough!!!!

[Trotter]

1 minute ago, sciond said:

This defense does not look elite....

have restrained from posting this but since you opened it here goes.

Defense thru 3 games is average to a bit above average.

Far from elite and hysterical when you think the even remotely mentioned the 85 bears.

As far as the Jets - damn couldn't even make Columbus day  - a new record.  

[Matt39]

3 minutes ago, BCJet said:

This is where having such an incompetent owner really hurts us.

In this scenario, its very possible that JD is too close to the whole thing, Zach was "his pick", Rogers was "his choice", there is a ton of money tied to both of them and the reality is that he has no one to really counsel him here other then Saleh, who is also really close to this whole thing.  

I get that we will likely be staring at a good OT when we pick and that likely will continue to be a huge need for us, but if there is a legitimate QB also available I just dont see how you can pass.  That being said, its going to take a bit of a leap from JD to do that - but wouldnt the best possible case for this team be having a first rounder ACTUALLY develop for a season behind rogers and also be ready to step in should he get injured?  We could wind up with the best of both worlds were Rogers plays one good season in 2024 and we get a legit long term starter who has a year to learn.  

Everything about the current scenario the Jets are in begins and ends with the owner. Douglas has not been a good GM, but everything QB related right now is on ownership and no one else. They still haven’t brought in another QB and Monday is almost over. The depth this rot goes is worse than we realize.

[bitonti]

3 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

If they finish with 4-6 wins out of 17 games i think saleh and his staff get canned. 

lets walk this dog

the next coach would have to agree to coach Aaron and also have Joe Douglas for a boss for 1 year maybe less 

there's too much uncertainty 

they need to either fire everyone or give everyone raises and extensions 

there's probably not going to be a half measure where they fire Saleh but keep Joe 

 

[Zachtomims47]

3 hours ago, derp said:

Rodgers definitely complicates things and it would be very Jets-y to move forward a year late.

I do think he’s been very involved in decision making and the season may get so bad it forces Woody’s hand. I can’t see more than 6 total wins and think being back in the top 3-5 picks is firmly on the table, especially if they make no move at QB.

Rodgers getting hurt creates such a mess for next year. But I would want to take a QB regardless. You can't pass up an opportunity to appease Rodgers for one year. Draft a QB to be QB3, sign a good veteran backup and Let it be Rodgers, Vet, Rookie in 2024. The way it should be if you're trying to compete. 

The crappy part is, I like JD but I'm over Saleh and Hackett shouldn't be here either BUT how's Woody gonna tell Rodgers, "hey, we love ya but we're losing everyone".

[Bronx]

I think this is going to be redundant. The bottom line is that we currently have two defensive coordinators and a overrated OC running this team. I can't wait until Coach Rodgers shows up!

[Augustiniak]

2 minutes ago, bitonti said:

lets walk this dog

the next coach would have to agree to coach Aaron and also have Joe Douglas for a boss for 1 year maybe less 

there's too much uncertainty 

they need to either fire everyone or give everyone raises and extensions 

there's probably not going to be a half measure where they fire Saleh but keep Joe 

 

i hear you but i think the players are on the verge of revolting and truth i think rodgers may not last through the entire season next year.  

also, with rodgers' injury and age, that jets pick in the first round could be major qb territory.  if the jets go all in on rodgers again and bypass a qb and then rodgers gets hurt or decides to retire (something that simply cannot be dismissed), then everyone is gone.

[Green Truth]

JD has to bring in the best of the worst crappy QB's on the open market. Zach can not allow this team to implode from within and Saleh has to talk to JD and say,  "Hey Joe, We are about to lose the whole room, if I keep trotting this guy out there".

[Augustiniak]

2 minutes ago, Zachtomims47 said:

Rodgers getting hurt creates such a mess for next year. But I would want to take a QB regardless. You can't pass up an opportunity to appease Rodgers for one year. Draft a QB to be QB3, sign a good veteran backup and Let it be Rodgers, Vet, Rookie in 2024. The way it should be if you're trying to compete. 

The crappy part is, I like JD but I'm over Saleh and Hackett shouldn't be here either BUT how's Woody gonna tell Rodgers, "hey, we love ya but we're losing everyone".

have to take a qb.  does not need to be in the first round.  

[RutgersJetFan]

The fact that they wouldn't even take a call from Wentz or Ryan is peak ******* Jets.

[BCJet]

10 minutes ago, Trotter said:

have restrained from posting this but since you opened it here goes.

Defense thru 3 games is average to a bit above average.

Far from elite and hysterical when you think the even remotely mentioned the 85 bears.

As far as the Jets - damn couldn't even make Columbus day  - a new record.  

What about the defense was average yesterday?

I think one thing that gets lost is how much of a team game this is.  Because of zach's ineptitude the defense had to start at midfield a ton of times.  On top of that, when do they ever get to play with a lead?  These patriots games are masterclasses in how it doesnt matter how good a defense is, the Pats take very few risks - so no turnovers, get the ball out quick and never push the ball downfield.  

I saw a tweet today that said if the Jets scored the league average of 23 points per game for their last 18 games, they would be 15-3.  That leads me to believe the defense is pretty damn good.

[Matt39]

3 minutes ago, Green Truth said:

JD has to bring in the best of the worst crappy QB's on the open market. Zach can not allow this team to implode from within and Saleh has to talk to JD and say,  "Hey Joe, We are about to lose the whole room, if I keep trotting this guy out there".

It appears the Jets have been turning down calls from Wentz and Ryan, who compared to Wilson are Dan Marino and Peyton Manning.

[Augustiniak]

5 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

It appears the Jets have been turning down calls from Wentz and Ryan, who compared to Wilson are Dan Marino and Peyton Manning.

b/c if they bring in another qb and that experienced qb fails then the blame can no longer be placed on zach wilson, then it's the coaches. 

[Trotter]

5 minutes ago, BCJet said:

What about the defense was average yesterday?

I think one thing that gets lost is how much of a team game this is.  Because of zach's ineptitude the defense had to start at midfield a ton of times.  On top of that, when do they ever get to play with a lead?  These patriots games are masterclasses in how it doesnt matter how good a defense is, the Pats take very few risks - so no turnovers, get the ball out quick and never push the ball downfield.  

I saw a tweet today that said if the Jets scored the league average of 23 points per game for their last 18 games, they would be 15-3.  That leads me to believe the defense is pretty damn good.

For me 157 yards rushing, no sacks and very little pressure and several 3rd down completions where you are 3-5 yards off is average at best.

to be fair given that with average qb play jets win that game

[bitonti]

9 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

i hear you but i think the players are on the verge of revolting and truth i think rodgers may not last through the entire season next year.  

also, with rodgers' injury and age, that jets pick in the first round could be major qb territory.  if the jets go all in on rodgers again and bypass a qb and then rodgers gets hurt or decides to retire (something that simply cannot be dismissed), then everyone is gone.

Rodgers didn't even last this season but the Rodgers contract means he's next year's starter no matter what (or he retires, leaving a big ole cap hit)

even if/when they draft a QB  - that player would sit behind the player they are paying 40 mil per  

still they can't find a new coach if the GM is on a lame duck deal. It's either time for raises or time to fire everyone - but it all happens after 2024 and after the worst of the Rodgers contract passes 

I suspect Woody will do the easy thing, which is nothing, and run it all back in 2024 with Rodgers and Zach again. 

side note I wonder if the Rodgers contract was insured in case of injury. It has to be right? They don't get the cap space back but somewhere Lloyds of London is going to pay Woody 50 mil for Rodgers getting hurt

nice work if you can get it 

[Matt39]

1 minute ago, Augustiniak said:

b/c if they bring in another qb and that experienced qb fails then the blame can no longer be placed on zach wilson, then it's the coaches. 

The issue is they’d have to admit that this whole Wilson has improved line of BS they were feeding us all off-season and summer was a total farce and that he’s actually on the team as a high level influence favor.