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Another Reason Why This Team Is So Screwed Up


SoFlaJets

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We all know that Joe Beningo and Rob Saleh are buddy buddy and they exchange text messages. it's really an insight into the inner workings of this team that we've never had before. Sure Manish had his inside info from one of the coaches which ended up with them both getting fired. But yesterday on The Fan Beningo revealed something that I never heard of before when he said that Saleh had told him "If I could only coach with a "real" quarterback". My jaw dropped, since when and where ELSE has a General Manager ever held that much power over a head coaching decision? When Tannenbaum was the GM his job was to "buy the groceries" for Mangini and Rex and they would use the goods he got them the best way that THEY saw fit.

Jerry Jones has had a lot to say about players playing or not but he's the owner, the owner HAS that option, never the GM-nowhere that I have ever heard of anyway. So it's either Douglas was given too much power ....or....maybe it's really like a lot of us suspected all along: maybe it IS Woody who made Saleh play a player that he didn't want to play.

 

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I found that statement to be eye opening too...something Joe probably should not have said, especially if he has the trust of Saleh...because now I can't trust him.  But it is telling that Saleh feels railroaded in a sense when it comes to having the groceries to make the dinner.

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Just now, usanyj said:

I found that statement to be eye opening too...something Joe probably should not have said, especially if he has the trust of Saleh...because now I can't trust him.  But it is telling that Saleh feels railroaded in a sense when it comes to having the groceries to make the dinner.

Saleh has this relationship with Carton and Beningo as a trap door. 

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Just now, usanyj said:

Maybe...but yesterday at the podium with his comments and hearing from Joe is the first time Saleh really hasn't played "good soldier"

I mean he’s obviously frustrated. Just going back to last offseason and connecting some dots, there were reports that JD wanted to move off of Wilson as well. After the Jaguars debacle, everyone felt it was over. Glazer reported it was over for Wilson in NY. And then something changed.

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5th losing season in a row for JD, 3rd for Saleh, 2nd annual massive collapse has begun leading to a likely losing-out scenario down the line.

Clearly everyone is going to be in CYA mode, and looking for scapegoats to save their own underperforming asses.

Last year it was O-Co MLF, this year it's likely to be Zach Wilson.  

I'm sure we'll hear stories and unnamed sources tell us that Saleh was never REALLY sold on Zach, but at the time MLF pushed for him and JD liked him.  And other sources will say Wilson was lazy, or stupid, or not what he appeared to be, and that COVID really hurt the team when evaluating him, etc.  And assuredly we will hear Wilson-side unnamed sources say he was never treated right, was never properly coached up, was rushed, etc, etc, etc.

Everyone Jets is now angling for their jobs in 2024, here or elsewhere.

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Saleh took the job likely knowing that someone else would be pulling the strings regarding personnel decisions, specifically at QB, so I can't sit here and feel sorry for him. He signed up to be a puppet and he's been a puppet. Boo f'n hoo.  He can pack his sh*t and leave town along with Wilson. 

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1 minute ago, ChuckkieB said:

Saleh took the job likely knowing that someone else would be pulling the strings regarding personnel decisions, specifically at QB, so I can't sit here and feel sorry for him. He signed up to be a puppet and he's been a puppet. Boo f'n hoo.  He can pack his sh*t and leave town along with Wilson. 

Is it fair to expect as a HC that performance should be the determining factor in playing time? Zach was forced on him for a 3rd year for reasons unknown (actually not unknown, but you know what I mean).

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Eh.  I see a few things going on here.  

First, if Saleh is truly buddies with Joe Beningo and does not just have a relationship to feed things and shape his narrative I question Saleh's judgment to the point of joining the he's clueless, dump him group. 

Second, the buying the groceries thing has long been around.  I think when Saleh was hired, Douglas said that they would have discussions about what type of player or role Saleh was looking to fill and it was the responsibility of Douglas to find a player that fit that, but not necessarily that player.  Obviously they have to work together to build a team.

I think that works pretty well everywhere but at QB.  QB needs to be in sync with the coaching staff.  There are so many stories of good QBs joining good systems and still needing small changes to make huge gains in efficiency.  Not sure what happened here, but I think it also ends up being problematic if you keep a QB around that isn't a fit.  Guys look to him, people expect things, when things go wrong blame gets flashed around.  This fanbase tends to have pie in the sky dreams about guys that obviously suck and that amplifies it.  Tebow did not belong taking snaps at QB.  Hackenberg?  Nope.  Still people on here think they didn't get a fair shot.  There are still people here that think Manziel is an option as NFL QB.  Not sure if other fanbases are that clueless, but you knuckleheads are enough for me.  If what we are reading is correct, I expect Zach to be dumped for peanuts this offseason.  I don't think that was an option this past offseason because of the contract.  Maybe it still isn't.

I get not liking the hires, but they were obviously designed to get Rodgers here.  In that respect they worked.  I also am concerned about a late season collapse, but I have a few comments about that.  Yes, it looks like they will drop a bunch of games, but this team has often won games it should lose (okay maybe not that often, but often as a percentage of wins) and lost games it should win.  Just because we look at the schedule and see losses does not mean they will materialize.  We were all counting wins down the stretch last year and we lost all those games.  Late season swoons hit some teams, but they aren't guaranteed.  Coughlin's Giants tanked to end a bunch of seasons, but had two huge, improbable Super Bowl runs.  Finally, I think there is the built in Rodgers angle.  He is both an excuse and hope for the future.  They will get one more opportunity to run it back the way they wanted.  Rodgers isn't a mercenary hired to come here that has no relationship to the coaches.  These are his guys.  Some of that means we are held hostage, but if we trusted that lunatic last offseason he should get one more.  

Finally, while I think Rodgers December comeback is nutty and dumb, I think it is also designed to keep these guys from having their seats get too hot. It's a sucky ride, but I am here until the end.  How many times has this trip looked like smooth highway 100 mph to Vegas and then veered off course into the desert?  We keep getting sucked back in.  Just because we are off road now, I am still riding this wagon.  I kind of like this team, even though I don't think I was actually high on a single one of the hires.  That's not really true.  I was excited to have Mike LaFleur on staff.

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47 minutes ago, usanyj said:

Maybe...but yesterday at the podium with his comments and hearing from Joe is the first time Saleh really hasn't played "good soldier"

He’s had to defend a draft bust for over a year. He just said f’it, “no mas”. Cant blame him. Zach has been awful. He has been shoved down Jets fans throat. And clearly he has been shoved down the coaching staff’s throat. They made a mistake during the scouting process. Worse was not moving on earlier. The 49ers moved on from their bust in the same draft class. Yet here we are. Teams are going to draft bust. Cant let that bust drag the team down for this long.

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1 hour ago, ChuckkieB said:

Saleh took the job likely knowing that someone else would be pulling the strings regarding personnel decisions, specifically at QB, so I can't sit here and feel sorry for him. He signed up to be a puppet and he's been a puppet. Boo f'n hoo.  He can pack his sh*t and leave town along with Wilson. 

Spot on.

JD hired Saleh and Saleh answers to JD. 

In the end, the success or failures of this team falls on the JD. period

I'll repeat what i said when JD hired Saleh, then picking Zack at #2 as the next blessed FQB:

Rookie GM,

Rookie HC,

Rookie Offensive coordinator,

Rookie QB

What can go wrong?

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1 hour ago, Matt39 said:

League insiders here in Vegas were not complimentary of the recent moves by the New York Jets, specifically the hiring of offensive coordinator Nathaniel Hackettand offensive line coach Keith Carter. Some were extremely harsh on the hiring of Carter, and as one source told PFN on Saturday, it seems as if the Jets have a “death wish” with the hiring of both.

Season 2 Omg GIF by The Office

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1 hour ago, Matt39 said:

It’s.The.Owner.

 

Here in Vegas, league sources say that the Jets front office is ready to move on from Wilson and trade for a veteran, but owner Woody Johnson believes the former BYU quarterback can be salvaged. We’re told Johnson, whose been fully engaged in the Jets’ decision-making the past few weeks, believes Wilson is still an arm talent that should not be discarded.

MORE: Latest Draft Buzz on QBs from Shrine Bowl in Las Vegas

Sources here in Vegas also tell PFN the Jets have said in conversations they will make a move for one of three veterans: Derek Carr, Jimmy Garappolo, or, yes — Aaron Rodgers. It is interesting that Rodgers is the only quarterback of the three who does not have a no-trade clause in his contract, though the belief is there’s a gentlemen’s agreement he’ll have a say where he’ll be sent when the Packers trade him.

League insiders here in Vegas were not complimentary of the recent moves by the New York Jets, specifically the hiring of offensive coordinator Nathaniel Hackettand offensive line coach Keith Carter. Some were extremely harsh on the hiring of Carter, and as one source told PFN on Saturday, it seems as if the Jets have a “death wish” with the hiring of both.

There is some good news, though. Jets offensive tackle Mehki Becton is training hard this offseason and tipping the scales under 370 pounds — about 40 pounds lighter than he was one year ago.

Becton has moved on from offensive line trainer Duke Mayweather and is training in New Jersey at the Parisi facility, which has helped his conditioning. With new coaches leading the Jets’ offense, the hope is Becton can get back to where he was as a rookie in 2020 when he had a terrific season at left tackle.

Everybody looking past the guy who literally brought TIm ******* Tebow here, as if he isn't the biggest rat in the building.

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The comment itself isn't a big deal. Wouldn't every head coach want a good QB? Doesn't everybody think the team would be better with a "'real' quarterback"? Does anybody think Saleh wouldn't have thought this for the past three years?

I struggle to believe Saleh said this to somebody he seems to trust and that person felt airing this out wouldn't ruin that trust. This paired with the comments yesterday implying he didn't want ZW gives the impression there's trouble behind the scenes. His seat may be getting hot despite Rodgers returning and he's trying to send an SOS to future employers. This is the kind of thing you do when you don't care if you get fired--especially if Woody was behind propping up ZW. 

 

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1 hour ago, CanadienJetsFan said:

Spot on.

JD hired Saleh and Saleh answers to JD. 

In the end, the success or failures of this team falls on the JD. period

I'll repeat what i said when JD hired Saleh, then picking Zack at #2 as the next blessed FQB:

Rookie GM,

Rookie HC,

Rookie Offensive coordinator,

Rookie QB

What can go wrong?

I'm convinced that Woody is the one that forcing Zach on them and not allowing a  competent QB on the roster. Picking Zach to begin with I can excuse. There are a lot of top 5 QB busts. That draft class was crap except for Lawrence. 

I do blame him for banking on Duane Brown. One of his biggest blunders for sure  

As far as the assistant coaches,  that's on Saleh. You don't normally see GMs overriding the HC on who he wants as his assistants

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3 hours ago, Matt39 said:

It’s.The.Owner.

 

i tend to disagree with this - mainly because last offseason Woody was making headlines say they're going "big game hunting" and they were going to go all in on a veteran QB.  

the fault was not signing a viable backup - especially when your HC/GM claimed zach needed a hard reset.  making him QB2 didn't accomplish that and put the season in jeopardy, if and obviously when AR got hurt.

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1 minute ago, heymangold said:

i tend to disagree with this - mainly because last offseason Woody was making headlines say they're going "big game hunting" and they were going to go all in on a veteran QB.  

the fault was not signing a viable backup - especially when your HC/GM claimed zach needed a hard reset.  making him QB2 didn't accomplish that and put the season in jeopardy, if and obviously when AR got hurt.

Woody brought Wilson back and made him the backup.  Front office was done with him after Jax. Read the report above. All on Woody.

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6 minutes ago, billo83 said:

I'm convinced that Woody is the one that forcing Zach on them and not allowing a  competent QB on the roster. Picking Zach to begin with I can excuse. There are a lot of top 5 QB busts. That draft class was crap except for Lawrence. 

I do blame him for banking on Duane Brown. One of his biggest blunders for sure  

As far as the assistant coaches,  that's on Saleh. You don't normally see GMs overriding the HC on who he wants as his assistants

Haven't the Jets been doing just that for years?  Westy on everyone.  Baby Schottenheimer on Rex.  Chan Gailey on Bowles.  Gregg Williams on Gase.  Joe Vitt on Gregg Williams.  Seems like a pattern to me.

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<<Haven't the Jets been doing just that for years?  Westy on everyone.  Baby Schottenheimer on Rex.  Chan Gailey on Bowles.  Gregg Williams on Gase.  Joe Vitt on Gregg Williams.  Seems like a pattern to me>>

Were these forced though? Westy was the best in the business, so I doubt he was "forced" on anyone. IIRC, Rex was fine on Shott. Gase speaks for itself. Who did Rex want if Shott was forced on him? 

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3 hours ago, ChuckkieB said:

Saleh took the job likely knowing that someone else would be pulling the strings regarding personnel decisions, specifically at QB, so I can't sit here and feel sorry for him. He signed up to be a puppet and he's been a puppet. Boo f'n hoo.  He can pack his sh*t and leave town along with Wilson. 

That is why they never seriously looked at McCarthy who wanted to be here or made a play For Harbaugh. They bass kissers, not coaches.

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3 hours ago, SoFlaJets said:

We all know that Joe Beningo and Rob Saleh are buddy buddy and they exchange text messages. it's really an insight into the inner workings of this team that we've never had before. Sure Manish had his inside info from one of the coaches which ended up with them both getting fired. But yesterday on The Fan Beningo revealed something that I never heard of before when he said that Saleh had told him "If I could only coach with a "real" quarterback". My jaw dropped, since when and where ELSE has a General Manager ever held that much power over a head coaching decision? When Tannenbaum was the GM his job was to "buy the groceries" for Mangini and Rex and they would use the goods he got them the best way that THEY saw fit.

Jerry Jones has had a lot to say about players playing or not but he's the owner, the owner HAS that option, never the GM-nowhere that I have ever heard of anyway. So it's either Douglas was given too much power ....or....maybe it's really like a lot of us suspected all along: maybe it IS Woody who made Saleh play a player that he didn't want to 

What coach would ever admit that?  LaFleur did and the next day he was canned.

Saleh has no excuses for the lack of discipline, mocked by commentators weekly.   He has no excuse for the horrible offensive line play for 3 years.  Ever see so many free runners at the QB.  He is responsible for selecting 2 horrible offensive coordinators.  These are things he controls and has done a lousy job of it.   

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33 minutes ago, billo83 said:

 

<<Haven't the Jets been doing just that for years?  Westy on everyone.  Baby Schottenheimer on Rex.  Chan Gailey on Bowles.  Gregg Williams on Gase.  Joe Vitt on Gregg Williams.  Seems like a pattern to me>>

Were these forced though? Westy was the best in the business, so I doubt he was "forced" on anyone. IIRC, Rex was fine on Shott. Gase speaks for itself. Who did Rex want if Shott was forced on him? 

When you tell a coach who his assistants will be, that is the definition of forcing them on the coach.  Rex was told that Schottenheimer was staying as OC.  Gase was told he would have to hire Gregg Williams.  It has been the team MO for quite some time.  Idzik was forced to keep Rex.  Everyone has a built in excuse because they are failing, but it isn't their full system failing.  Whether they would have hired somebody better is not the point.  The point is that the decisions are being made by others outside of the normal chain of command.  At least Saleh had a crossover with Hackett in Jacksonville.

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3 hours ago, usanyj said:

I found that statement to be eye opening too...something Joe probably should not have said, especially if he has the trust of Saleh...because now I can't trust him.  But it is telling that Saleh feels railroaded in a sense when it comes to having the groceries to make the dinner.

The old parcells/ Grier  confrontation.  Saleh wants to help fill the cart while Douglas fills it.  Ok fine but what makes anyone feel he can evaluate college or free agent talent?  I’m sure Douglas consults with saleh when he goes after certain positions and even certain players.

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I find it impossible to believe that Joe Douglas made the Zach Wilson pick against the wishes of his new head coach.   Just impossible to think such a major decision could be made in a unilateral manner like that - it would be doomed from the start.  Seems more like CYA season to me but the fact he is raising it now reeks of desperation and quite frankly weakness.    

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