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JonEJet

Beckett = Ace

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Scott Proctor is so much better when he gets rested. His fastballs are at 97 with nasty movement. But if he gets overworked it drops to 93 and is flat. Same for his slider. Torre needs to be careful with him. Use Myers more often, he can get RH hitters out too.

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Beckett is becoming an enigma.

Great stuff, nice win totals but his ERA is over 5 and he is on pace to give 50+ homers this year. Not exactly the ace material Scapegoat Nation tried to lead us to believe.

And since this board is basically about "what have you done for lately" then who really cares about what Josh Beckett did in 2003 to the Yankees in the World Series ?

For all the grief Randy Johnson gets Beckett deserves worse.

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Beckett is becoming an enigma.

Great stuff, nice win totals but his ERA is over 5 and he is on pace to give 50+ homers this year. Not exactly the ace material Scapegoat Nation tried to lead us to believe.

And since this board is basically about "what have you done for lately" then who really cares about what Josh Beckett did in 2003 to the Yankees in the World Series ?

For all the grief Randy Johnson gets Beckett deserves worse.

Nice Lil Jimmy pic i didn't notice that lol

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12-3 here, we better not see Proctor out there.

Who else we got in the pen? Not wasting Villone here either.

Put Chacon in. Let the whiner try to work his way back alittle.

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Not exactly the ace material Scapegoat Nation tried to lead us to believe.

.

Throw in Met fans to that mix as well.

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12-3 here, we better not see Proctor out there.

Who else we got in the pen? Not wasting Villone here either.

Put Chacon in. Let the whiner try to work his way back alittle.

Proctor with 1.1 IP and Villone with an inning.

Easy though Barton, it's their first apperances since Sunday.

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Beckett is becoming an enigma.

Great stuff, nice win totals but his ERA is over 5 and he is on pace to give 50+ homers this year. Not exactly the ace material Scapegoat Nation tried to lead us to believe.

And since this board is basically about "what have you done for lately" then who really cares about what Josh Beckett did in 2003 to the Yankees in the World Series ?

For all the grief Randy Johnson gets Beckett deserves worse.

Scapegoat Nation just got owned.

By the way, what happened to Beckett's complete games? 0 so far this year.

11-5, 5.12 ERA, 27 HR's allowed.

Boston scores when Beckett is on the hill. Same guys for Johnson which is why he's 10-7 with a 5.06. You don't win 10+ games with a 5+ ERA unless you get run support. Johnson has the 2nd best in the AL or the league, I'm not sure, but you've got to believe Beckett isn't too far behind, if not 1st.

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Any team could've had lowell for nothing that was just a fluky thing not part of a "good" trade. The marlins forced them to take him with beckett it's not like boston wanted him.

Well the all-knowing must have had a Freudian slip. The Sox needed a 3B and wanted Lowell knowing the kind of hitter he is and what he could do in Fenway. They want him. Don't forget we also got Mota in the deal which then became Riske which then became Lopez, who has been an effective lefty out of the pen. When Ramirez puts it together for a full season, we'll see. And Sanchez doesn't look like anything more than a 5th starter.

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If any of you yankee fans wouldn't want beckett, you're being extremely stupid. First of all, he's not nearly as bad as some of you are saying. Second, it would be taking away from your #1 division rival. Third, it would fill a need for you guys. I personally would love to have him in pittsburgh.

So what if he's got a 5+ ERA, its not like he's going out there and consistantly pitching at that level. Like I said before, in 15 of his games this year, he's averaged better than 6.2 innings and a 3.22 ERA. In four of his games, he's averaged less than 3.2 innings and a 18+ ERA. He is giving up way too many homers though. The run differential in his wins is something like 86-32 and he's only given up more than 3 runs in those wins once.

Also, he only has 3 complete games in his career, and all three were against the NL. Maybe they just don't want to wear him out considering his history with blisters.

To say a guy who has as good a chance as anyone to win 20 games this year as useless or a bust is absolutely ridiculous.

About Lowell, he looks to me to be pretty much on pace for how he did a couple years ago. In a better hitters park and a better lineup, he's bound to get more ABs and have better stats. Can't say if its a trend, but only time will tell.

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If any of you yankee fans wouldn't want beckett, you're being extremely stupid. First of all, he's not nearly as bad as some of you are saying. Second, it would be taking away from your #1 division rival. Third, it would fill a need for you guys. I personally would love to have him in pittsburgh.

So what if he's got a 5+ ERA, its not like he's going out there and consistantly pitching at that level. Like I said before, in 15 of his games this year, he's averaged better than 6.2 innings and a 3.22 ERA. In four of his games, he's averaged less than 3.2 innings and a 18+ ERA. He is giving up way too many homers though. The run differential in his wins is something like 86-32 and he's only given up more than 3 runs in those wins once.

Also, he only has 3 complete games in his career, and all three were against the NL. Maybe they just don't want to wear him out considering his history with blisters.

To say a guy who has as good a chance as anyone to win 20 games this year as useless or a bust is absolutely ridiculous.

About Lowell, he looks to me to be pretty much on pace for how he did a couple years ago. In a better hitters park and a better lineup, he's bound to get more ABs and have better stats. Can't say if its a trend, but only time will tell.

About Lowell, check out his second half stats...the guy almost always fades in the second half. Now, maybe it has to do with the Florida heat, I don't know, but heat is heat and it does get hot and humid up north as well.

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Lowell is WAY ahead of his carrer avg's in OPS AVG 2B and SLG. He will drop off.

Seriously, do you ever look at the big picture or is your motus operandi to throw out obscure stats to try to baffle people with your BS?

Lowell played 7+ seasons in Florida. What should that tell you?

One, he played in a pitcher friendly park half the year.

Two, outside of one 91-71 WS championship team, he largely played on good teams and sometimes worse.

He moves to Boston where he is surrounded by more talent and in a hitter's friendly park.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?playerId=3972

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/stats?playerId=3972

Look at his projected numbers and career avg prorated over 162 games. He is not having a career year, outside of doubles, he is close to where he has averaged for his entire career. If he starts hittin in Fenway like he hits on the road, then maybe he will be having a career year.

306

It is too early to judge him.

If he was just getting bombed every outing, that would be one thing, but for the most part he has been pitching good.

Pedro had a learning curve his first year in the AL. He started great and faded. Beckett, and I am not saying he will be as good as Pedro, has been more heaven or hell.

He is a 26yo pitcher going from a no pressure to the ultimate pressure environment. While his pitching has been decent, he has had about a quarter of his starts looks like he is over his head.

To write off a pitcher that has had an uneven first half is stupid. Maybe that is what the Yankees problem always been. Not giving players enough time to adjust.

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Beckett is a bust as an ace

sure, i'd love him as a 3-4-5 pitcher, but ace? thats a waste.

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Beckett is a bust as an ace

sure, i'd love him as a 3-4-5 pitcher, but ace? thats a waste.

Agreed.

I'd take Beckett to be in the middle / back end of the rotation, but I wouldn't want to count on him as a 1 or a 2.

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124 & BO

Luckily for the Sox, he is not need this year to step up and he can show this year was just an adjustment of going from teh NL to the AL.

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124 & BO

Luckily for the Sox, he is not need this year to step up and he can show this year was just an adjustment of going from teh NL to the AL.

Agreed this is his adjustment year. Once he makes his way around the league and the hitters have seen his stuff his ERA will skyrocket!

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Boston is gonna regret this trade the way the yankees regret the Vazquez and Weaver trades.

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Boston is gonna regret this trade the way the yankees regret the Vazquez and Weaver trades.

You never regret a trade for proven young quality for unproven young quality. Beckett will be better as he learns and progresses in the American League.

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You never regret a trade for proven young quality for unproven young quality.

Really? Tell that to the giants. Pierzynski for Liriano and Nathan. I love how boston fans can't bring themselves to admit it was a horrible trade. Typical delousional idiots.

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Josh Beckett will give his team a chance to win the vast majority of the time. When he's bad he's horrible and that inflates his numbers but with his stuff, the only issue is health. Staying healthy on a decent team means 20 wins for Beckett. If he's not an ace, he sure as hell isn't far from being one. A little more focus/concentration and he's among the elite.

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Really? Tell that to the giants. Pierzynski for Liriano and Nathan. I love how boston fans can't bring themselves to admit it was a horrible trade. Typical delousional idiots.

Actually, that was Nathan, Liriano, and Mauer:eek:

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Actually, that was Nathan, Liriano, and Mauer:eek:

No it wasn't lol Mauer was the twins first round pick a few years ago.

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Really? Tell that to the giants. Pierzynski for Liriano and Nathan. I love how boston fans can't bring themselves to admit it was a horrible trade. Typical delousional idiots.

Well, we won't actually know this for quite some time. Equating a run of the mill catcher for a front of the rotation starter is ridiculous. Sanchez will never touch Liriano and Ramirez will be decent.

You don't evaluate a trade after half a season. You have to give it usually a good 2-3 years to see how it pans out. Especially if prospects are involved. Anyone with half a brain should realize that.

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Well, we won't actually know this for quite some time. Equating a run of the mill catcher for a front of the rotation starter is ridiculous. Sanchez will never touch Liriano and Ramirez will be decent.

You don't evaluate a trade after half a season. You have to give it usually a good 2-3 years to see how it pans out. Especially if prospects are involved. Anyone with half a brain should realize that.

Pierzynski is a MUCH more valuable player then beckett. Not many catchers hit 320 with decent power like he does.

VORP

Beckett 2.7

Peirzynski 14.7

It's not even CLOSE.

By the way Hanley Ramriez's VORP 18.7

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No it wasn't lol Mauer was the twins first round pick a few years ago.

I stand corrected...I remembered hearing Mauers name so much when the deal was made but I suppose that was in anticipation of him coming up. I was thinking he was part of that deal.

Either way, Minnesota made out on that deal.

They did however get a guy who has one of the best names in pro sports....Boof Bonser (currently 3-4 with a 3.08 in the minors)

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I'm going to side with Bosox fans on this for now

Hanley's a great player. With that said, Lowell has been every bit as good this year as Hanley in his own way.

Beckett is a good 3/4/5 pitcher, but he's certainly been a huge disapointment for what they expected out of him

With that said, I still think the Sox got the better end of the deal overall.

One year from now things may be totally different

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I'm going to side with Bosox fans on this for now

Hanley's a great player. With that said, Lowell has been every bit as good this year as Hanley in his own way.

Beckett is a good 3/4/5 pitcher, but he's certainly been a huge disapointment for what they expected out of him

With that said, I still think the Sox got the better end of the deal overall.

One year from now things may be totally different

I think everyone forgets that Beckett is in his first year in the AL. Arroyo has proven that a medicore AL pitcher can do very well in the weak hitting NL.

Arroyo's ERA in Boston the past two season's was over 4. In Cincy it is 2.96.

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Pierzynski is a MUCH more valuable player then beckett. Not many catchers hit 320 with decent power like he does.

VORP

Beckett 2.7

Peirzynski 14.7

It's not even CLOSE.

By the way Hanley Ramriez's VORP 18.7

Catchers like Pierzynski are a dime a dozen. Plus he's a complete d-bag.

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Catchers like Pierzynski are a dime a dozen. Plus he's a complete d-bag.

catchers with 14 VORP's are NOT a dime a dozen and neither are 21 year old SS's with 18 VORP's

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Catchers like Pierzynski are a dime a dozen. Plus he's a complete d-bag.

I agee that AJ is a dooshie..but a dime a dozen????:eek:

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I agee that AJ is a dooshie..but a dime a dozen????:eek:

Yes. There is nothing about his game that is exceedingly good. He is an average catcher at best. And VORP is a meaningless stat. I'll take Alex Gonzalez over Hanley Ramirez and I'll take Beckett over whomever, it wouldn't be Sanchez in this case so I won't use him.

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I'm sure you'd take Alex Gonzalez ove hanley.....lol

What a douchebag

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Personally, I wish they Sox still had Orlando Cabrera. Yah, he makes WAY more than Gonzales and Ramirez, and he's 2 years older than Gonzales - but he had that Fenway "magic" thing going on. Still wonder why they did not try to re-sign him. I blame Lucchino. ;)

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Personally, I wish they Sox still had Orlando Cabrera. Yah, he makes WAY more than Gonzales and Ramirez, and he's 2 years older than Gonzales - but he had that Fenway "magic" thing going on. Still wonder why they did not try to re-sign him. I blame Lucchino. ;)

Orlando was not afraid of the Yankees. No fear. As a Yankee fan I was glad to see him go.

Remember PFSIKH telling us how it was such a good deal when they replaced him? LOL. Kind of like the Nomar is better debates. Sometimes I am not sure why I even bother.

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Yes. There is nothing about his game that is exceedingly good. He is an average catcher at best. And VORP is a meaningless stat. I'll take Alex Gonzalez over Hanley Ramirez and I'll take Beckett over whomever, it wouldn't be Sanchez in this case so I won't use him.

Of course VORP is a meaningless stat because it makes you look stupid.

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