MATT JONES

[Green Jets & Ham]

I voted "YES" ... his upside is too enormous to pass on at 26

How bout you?

[TomShane]

I love my man Ham. When he gets pumped about a player, he will go down with the ship for that player.

[Maxman]

I love my man Ham. When he gets pumped about a player, he will go down with the ship for that player.

Ham is usually right. But I voted for not crazy about the idea. Too many other needs to fill here.

[Savage69]

I love my man Ham. When he gets pumped about a player, he will go down with the ship for that player.

Ditto for me..If Ham likes him I like him!! Plus

if he sucks we can always bust Ham's chops!!

[The Troll]

I voted for the fourth option. Absolutely not.

[Green Jets & Ham]

BEHOLD MATT JONES ... Aka: The White Machine

That's what the bruthas used to call this dude from the lower eastside ... Jo Jo ... white dude who was an amazing street basketball player ... schoolyard legend

The bruthas used to call him THE WHITE MACHINE ... as a term of respect because he could smoke anyone on the court, black or white, and he played like a brutha

Anyway, here is THE REAL WHITE MACHINE ... Matt Jones

http://oinkville.tripod.com/mjtexas.wmv

http://oinkville.tripod.com/jones70.wmv

http://www.woopigsooie.net/mattslammajamma.mpeg

http://www.hogcall.com/funstuff/multimedia/video/20050227NFLCombine/

http://www.thehometownchannel.com/video/4332883/detail.html

http://www.hogcall.com/funstuff/multimedia/video/20050129SeniorBowl/20050129-SeniorBowl-sm.wmv

http://oinkville.tripod.com/jones54.mpeg

http://oinkville.tripod.com/mom.wmv

[Barton]

Matt Jones isn't worthy of a 1st rd pick

he's a luxury pick, and we have needs.

He's never done ANYTHING as a WR, NOTHING. No way you take him over a really good TE or CB prospect who's proven himself on the field.

[TomShane]

Here's a question-- Do they test for roids at the Combine?

[Verde]

Wow! Niiiiiiiiiiiiiiice clips Ham.

[Jetsfan80]

I take option 3. I don't feel we have the time window to be drafting a prospect. However, I wouldnt rule it out completely, because Ham is a smart man, and Mike Heimerdinger is a terrific OC with experience dealing with WR's.

[jetgreen13]

i voted yes. adding rotation depthat 26, can also be taken care of at 57 & beyond. it would be nice to be the team that guessed right on matt jones. instead of being part of a trivia question, on the teams that pass him up. i'm very sorry, but anybody who thinks they know he will fail is kidding themselves. the only time i can remember a player this talented, was in the "madden draft" in season mode!! live a little, guys. scratch that. terry bradway, live a little!!

[faba]

As much as a I respect Ham's opinion at 26 we have to go for more pressing need at CB/safety or offensive line. Bradway has to go for more of a sure thing in round one if there ever is a sure thing in a crap shoot as the college draft rather than Jones who is attempting a position change

[Green Jets & Ham]

As much as a I respect Ham's opinion at 26 we have to go for more pressing need at CB/safety or offensive line. Bradway has to go for more of a sure thing in round one if there ever is a sure thing in a crap shoot as the college draft rather than Jones who is attempting a position change

Faba, check this out my friend ... same goes for my friends TS, EB, 80, and others who are concerned about the position switch

Art Monk

Drew Bennett

Hines Ward

Antwan Randal EL

Former Cowboy Great, Drew Pearson

Just a few names off the top of my head ... all College QB's who made the transition from QB to WR in the Pros ... and not a one of them could hold a candle to Matt Jones size/speed ratio, which has no frame of reference in NFL history because there has never been a WR {or TE} who possessed the same

Closest thing is Randy Moss,

but while Moss is even faster than Matt Jones, MJ is the much bigger of the two {6' 6"/242} and he runs in the 4.3's

[stormshadow19]

While I do trust Ham's judgement, I'm not sold or crazy about Jones. Like YJF said in another thread, WR has the highest learning curve in the NFL, along with QB. Tight End, not so much, but he's not big enough to play TE.

You can put up all the highlight reel stuff of him you want, but that still doesn't change the fact that he'll be learning at the Pro level. And, right now, trying to battle the Pats, you really can't gamble on Jones. But, if they trade Abe and get a good lot back, then all bets are off.

[Barton]

But were hines ward, drew bennett and antwan randel el 1st rd picks? I'm not sure, but I don't think they were. Sure, none of them are 6'6 240 and run 4.3's

I dunno ham, we have holes at TE, DT, and pressing needs at corner and safety so I don't think it would be wise to use our 1st rd pick on a project wide receiver. I'd rather go with the safer pick this time around...

[faba]

Faba, check this out my friend ... same goes for my friends TS, EB, 80, and others who are concerned about the position switch

Art Monk

Drew Bennett

Hines Ward

Antwan Randal EL

Former Cowboy Great, Drew Pearson

Just a few names off the top of my head ... all College QB's who made the transition from QB to WR in the Pros ... and not a one of them could hold a candle to Matt Jones size/speed ratio, which has no frame of reference in NFL history because there has never been a WR {or TE} who possessed the same

Closest thing is Randy Moss,

but while Moss is even faster than Matt Jones, MJ is the much bigger of the two {6' 6"/242} and he runs in the 4.3's

Jones certainly has the physical tools to pull it off with his speed and toughness which should not be overlooked-does he have the mental toughness and ability? Arkansas games that I saw he was willing and able to take defensive players on even as a QB there. The question is can we afford in round one with other holes on the team to take this chance

[jetgreen13]

Like YJF said in another thread, WR has the highest learning curve in the NFL, along with QB.

is that why rookies start all the time?? or why QB's for years have been switching to WR at the pro level?? WR is an instintive position. run, catch & run some more. of course you need to learn to read NFL D's, but please...

[Savage69]

But were hines ward, drew bennett and antwan randel el 1st rd picks? I'm not sure, but I don't think they were. Sure, none of them are 6'6 240 and run 4.3's

Randel El was a 2nd rd'er Hines 3 rd and the Titans

signed bennett as a undrafted FA I think!!

[Green Jets & Ham]

QUESTION

How many of you guys are old enough to remember {vividly} watching the draft the day we passed on Dan Marino?

If you don't remember what that felt like ... watching him become a phenom ... trust me on this one, you don't ever wanna know how that feels

But I'm gonna share it with you so you can get an idea

For me that always stuck in my craw ... killed me for 15 Years ... I mean, Just made me sick to my stomach everytime I thought about it (and how could you not when Marino was in your face 24/7 as he became a phenom)

I swear to you, my friends ... if it was my call I would NEVER allow that to happen again ... I never want to live through that type of mistake again

Having said that, I KNOW Matt Jones can become a dominant player and an absolute phenom ... I KNOW IT CAN HAPPEN, and I suspect some of you know it as well ... so I CANNOT pass on this player at 26 while knowing that ... I CAN'T DO IT ... I cannot live with that for 15 Years when I KNEW it was a distinct possibility

Honestly, I would rather draft this player and have him bust, then take a pass {knowing what I know} and have to watch him reach his ceiling with some other team ... that would torture me

[RichardSeymour]

Faba, check this out my friend ... same goes for my friends TS, EB, 80, and others who are concerned about the position switch

Art Monk

Drew Bennett

Hines Ward

Antwan Randal EL

Former Cowboy Great, Drew Pearson

Just a few names off the top of my head ... all College QB's who made the transition from QB to WR in the Pros ... and not a one of them could hold a candle to Matt Jones size/speed ratio, which has no frame of reference in NFL history because there has never been a WR {or TE} who possessed the same

Closest thing is Randy Moss,

but while Moss is even faster than Matt Jones, MJ is the much bigger of the two {6' 6"/242} and he runs in the 4.3's

You may be able to add Ronald Curry's name to that list right now.

His numbers will be constrained playing behind Moss and Porter but the kid's good enough already that you can say it was a successful switch.

I'll point out again though that my man Vincent Jackson is similar in many ways, only he actually has years of experience at WR and good natural skills...

Vincent Jackson

He's got good ball skills.

He's got good hands.

He's catches naturally, away from his body.

He's got 4.46 40 speed

He's got 4.00 short shuttle time

He's got a 10'9 broad jump

He's got 23 reps at 225

He's got a 39 inch vertical

He's 6047, 240#

He got 2844 yards and 32 TDs in the last two years.

He's got a 33 wonderlic and he was a business major.

Of course, Matt Jones is no slouch himself

Matt Jones

He's got no real WR experience but....

He's got 4.37 40 speed

He's got a 4.11 short shuttle time

He's got a 6.65 3-cone time (!!!)

He's got a 10'9 broad jump

He's got a 39.5 inch vertical

He's 6061, 241#

I dunno, just worth noting.

[jetgreen13]

QUESTION

How many of you guys are olf enough to remember {vividly} watching the draft the day we passed on Dan Marino?

If you don't remember what that felt like ... watching him become a phenom ... trust me on this one, you don't ever wanna know how that feels

But I'm gonna share it with you so you can get an idea

For me that always stuck in my craw ... killed me for 15 Years ... I mean, Just made me sick to my stomach everytime I thought about it {and how could you not when Marino was in your face 24/7 as he became a phenom}

I swear to you, my friends ... if it was my call I would NEVER allow that to happen again ... I never want to live through that type of mistake again

Having said that, I KNOW Matt Jones can become a dominant player and an absolute phenom ... I KNOW IT CAN HAPPEN, and I suspect some of you know it as well ... so I CANNOT pass on this player at 26 while knowing that ... I CAN'T DO IT ... I cannot live with that for 15 Years when I KNEW it was a distinct possibility

Honestly, I would rather draft this player and have him bust, then take a pass {knowing what I know} and have to watch him reach his ceiling with some other team ... that would torture me

i mentioned marino in a thread jones thread last night, as well. how about portland taking sam bowie over michael jordan?? the guys that are killing the idea of taking jones at 26, are the same guys that did'nt want to trade for moss. that my guess anyway. because their's are "safer" picks at 26, than taking a guy with kyrptonian ability.

[124]

No f'n way.

[jetgreen13]

No f'n way.

yes f'n way.

[YJF]

is that why rookies start all the time?? or why QB's for years have been switching to WR at the pro level?? WR is an instintive position. run, catch & run some more. of course you need to learn to read NFL D's, but please...

There are very few examples of WR's making the transition quickly in their rookie years. You get a few every now and then but for the most part. It takes time.

It takes atleast 2 to 3 years for a WR to start to hit his stride. Even if you are a polished college WR. Jones has NEVER been a WR on any level.

It took Marvin Harrison 4 years before he even had a 1,000 yard season.

Jerry Rice couldn't even start in his rookie season and he's the greatest of all time.

Chad Johnson had 28 catches in his rookie year. It took Tim Brown 6 seasons to have a 1,000 yard year at WR.

It took Derrick Mason 5 seasons to become a 1,000 yard receiver. He was a college QB who Dinger groomed.Same for Drew Bennett, he was a college QB at UCLA and it's taken him 4 years to become a good WR. He's still learning.

Terrell Owens had only 35 catches in his rookie year. In his first 4 seasons. He only had 1 Thousand yard season.

Hines Ward was a college QB at Georgia. Had only 15 catches his rookie year and didn't start. It took him 4 years to become a great WR.

If you want me to continue to make my point, I can go on forever here.

Jerry Porter, Laveranues Coles, Santana Moss, Deion Branch, Donald Driver, Torry Holt, Mushin Muhammad. All these guys and many more took time to develop.

I voted for option 2 on Matt Jones. I see the reasoning behind drafting him. You are swinging for the fences and trying to hit a home run. But sometimes when you try to hit a homerun. You strike out.

Jones is a risk pick. You gotta have patience. He's never been a WR. How do you know that he can hold up physically as a WR? How do we know if he can get open in the NFL. There have been dozens of 4.3 guys in The NFL who couldn't get open on the next level.

[Barton]

Ham, pretend you are terry bradway for me

its april 23rd, jets are on the clock, ONLY heath miller and matt jones are on the board

A gun is held to your heas, all loaded and ready to fire................who do you choose?? YOUR JOB IS ON THE LINE.....

Seymour

You think Vincent Jackson moves to TE, he definetly looks like he's built for it. He looks like Winslow from last year

[afosomf]

everyone knows what i voting for!!!

GO MJ

Sadly bradway will not have the ball to pull the trigger. Pioli and Mumbles will

Sh*t Mumbles could play him at CB

[SoFlaJets]

I think we need another receiver and think that's where we're going in 13 days time-NOBODY is expecting us to do this but I believe we need a guy to beat out the NE CB's-it ain't gettin done lining up Sowell and Martin wide-we need to be able to go 5 wide to beat New England and lastly no rookie CB is beating Brady I don't care who it is.Play to beat the team to beat

[slats]

I KNOW Matt Jones can become a dominant player and an absolute phenom ... I KNOW IT CAN HAPPEN, and I suspect some of you know it as well ... so I CANNOT pass on this player at 26 while knowing that ... I CAN'T DO IT ... I cannot live with that for 15 Years when I KNEW it was a distinct possibility

Dude, I dig your passion.

I voted, "maybe, but I ain't thrilled."

If they're looking at Heath Miller, though, and Jones is still on the board... I'd jump all over Jones.

Miller's got the higher floor, no doubt, but a significantly lower ceiling.

The "project" thing is a concern, as is Jones saying that he's not all that thrilled with the idea of a move to TE. That's probably my biggest concern with the player.

If Dinghy thinks he can use Jones. That he can develop him, or that he can convince him to play TE at this level. And play it well.... Then I say, "Pull the trigger!"

I expect them to go in the direction of a defensive starter, though.

[RichardSeymour]

Seymour

You think Vincent Jackson moves to TE, he definetly looks like he's built for it. He looks like Winslow from last year

I think he *can* move to TE, and successfully. He could either stay around 245 and with proper coaching have a great shot at being a superb pure-receiving TE, or more dicily bulk up to 260 (hard to say how much of his speed he would lose by doing so) and have a solid shot at being a very good all around TE.

He's got some sick skills, a basketball background that gives him good spacial awareness and makes you think he'd do well playing in traffic, and he's got the frame for it.

That said, hell no. He's a WR. He can be a very, very, very good WR if his route running is solid at the next level, which will be a matter of effort and coaching. That Winslowesque frame you speak of offers some pretty nice potential both for muscling DBs and for run-blocking, again if properly coached.

You don't move Mike Williams to TE unless you have to.... if you draft Matt Jones you try him at WR and only move him to TE if you have to.... Same with Vince Jackson. You play him at WR. TE is strictly plan B.

[RichardSeymour]

Sh*t Mumbles could play him at CB

With that 3-cone....

actually one of the criticisms I've heard of Jones is that he doesn't have loose hips ( I knew a girl in college who.... oh never mind) which doesn't exactly make him sound like CB material.

But shoot, with Belichick I wouldn't rule anything out.

[jetgreen13]

I voted for option 2 on Matt Jones. I see the reasoning behind drafting him. You are swinging for the fences and trying to hit a home run. But sometimes when you try to hit a homerun. You strike out.

yjf, i would rather draft a homerun hitter with a late 1st round pick, then grab a utility infielder. think of all the amazing ways we could use jones in year one?? redzone, screens, QB for a play at a time, etc...if we strike out, at least we go down swingin...but what if we do hit it out of the park?? instead of stranding a man at 2nd base.

[RichardSeymour]

YJF is dead on and I'll tell you this.

NO TEAM should EVER draft a WR in the expectation of getting signifcant production in his rookie year. If it happens, bonus. Don't bet on it though.

For hiss second year hoping he'll be a quality #3, for 400-600 yards isn't too much to expect from a day 1 pick.

It's only year 3 where you can really start to expect something.

The Michael Clayton's, Anquan Boldin's, Randy Moss's, and Terry Glenn's of this world are pretty freaking rare. WRs develop a little SLOWER than DTs. Keep that in mind.

[Green Jets & Ham]

i mentioned marino in a thread jones thread last night, as well. how about portland taking sam bowie over michael jordan?? the guys that are killing the idea of taking jones at 26, are the same guys that did'nt want to trade for moss. that my guess anyway. because their's are "safer" picks at 26, than taking a guy with kyrptonian ability.

Funny you should mention that, J13

Some folks, and I'm referring to the ones who know full well what Matt Jones upside is, yet are still willing to take a pass because they view him as a WR and they say we don't need a WR

Now there aren't many of those, but I'm sure you have encountered that position as well

Well dig this ...

The reason Portland passed on Jordan was because they didn't need another Guard ... they already had their fair share of Guards ... what they needed was a Center, so they opted for Bowie

But wait, it gets better ... prior to the draft the Blazers GM was warned by his good friend Bobby Knight

Knight called him and specifically told him the pick was a no-brainer ... you have to take Michael Jordan

The Blazers GM proceeded to explain to Bobby Knight that he couldn't take Jordan because he didn't need another Guard ... told Knight he was taking Sam Bowie because they desperately needed a Center

Well here's the kicker ...

Bob Knight, making one last attempt to talk some sense into his friend, tried to frame it another way in response to his friends expressed concern

IS THAT IT ... Knight said ... THE REASON YOU ARE PASSING ON JORDAN IS BECAUSE YOU NEED A CENTER?

OKAY, Knight said ... IN THAT CASE DRAFT MICHAEL JORDAN AND PLAY HIM AT CENTER FOR ALL I GIVE A $HIT, BUT YOU HAVE TO DRAFT MICHAEL JORDAN!!

Well you know the rest of the story ... the Blazers GM, in spite of his friends every attempt to convince him otherwise, stuck to his guns and addressed the Blazers biggest "need"

And the Chicago Bulls were eternally grateful

[jetgreen13]

YJF is dead on and I'll tell you this.

NO TEAM should EVER draft a WR in the expectation of getting signifcant production in his rookie year. If it happens, bonus. Don't bet on it though.

For hiss second year hoping he'll be a quality #3, for 400-600 yards isn't too much to expect from a day 1 pick.

It's only year 3 where you can really start to expect something.

The Michael Clayton's, Anquan Boldin's, Randy Moss's, and Terry Glenn's of this world are pretty freaking rare. WRs develop a little SLOWER than DTs. Keep that in mind.

the guy has all galaxy talent. not to mention he would be a late 1st round pick. but the jets should'nt take him because he may not get big #'s his first year in the league???

[RichardSeymour]

the guy has all galaxy talent. not to mention he would be a late 1st round pick. but the jets should'nt take him because he may not get big #'s his first year in the league???

I didn't say that.

What I am trying to point out is that IF the Jets take him they shouldn't expect any impact in 2005, a small one in 2006, and should only start to expect serious production in 2007 even if he is everything promised.

You take a WR for 3 years down the line, not the following year. Everyone should just be aware of that.