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33 Dead in VT school shooting


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http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/04/16/vtech.shooting/index.html

shootings on the Blacksburg campus Monday morning.

"Some victims were shot in a classroom," Chief Wendell Flinchum said, adding that the gunman was dead.

"Today the university was struck with a tragedy that we consider of monumental proportions," said university President Charles Steger. "The university is shocked and indeed horrified."

The attacks mark the worst school shooting incident since 1999 when Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris killed 12 students and a teacher before killing themselves at Columbine High School in Littleton, Colorado.

A hospital spokeswoman told The Associated Press that 17 Virginia Tech students were being treated for gunshot wounds and other injuries.

Sharon Honaker at the Carilion New River Valley Medical Center told CNN that four patients had been transported there, one in critical condition.

One person was killed and others were wounded at multiple locations inside a dormitory about 7:15 a.m., Flinchum said. Two hours later, another shooting at Norris Hall, an engineering building, resulted in multiple casualties, the university reported. (Watch police, ambulances hustle to the scene )

The first reported shooting occurred at West Ambler Johnston Hall, a co-ed dormitory that houses 895 students. The dormitory, one of the largest residence halls on the 2,600-acre campus, is located near the drill field and stadium.

Amie Steele, editor-in-chief of the campus newspaper, said one of her reporters at the dormitory reported "mass chaos."

The reporter said there were "lots of students running around, going crazy, and the police officers were trying to settle everyone down and keep everything under control," according to Steele.

Kristyn Heiser said she was in class about 9:30 a.m. when she and her classmates saw about six gun-wielding police officers run by a window.

"We were like, 'What's going on?' Because this definitely is a quaint town where stuff doesn't really happen. It's pretty boring here," said Heiser during a phone interview as she sat on her classroom floor.

Student Matt Waldron said he did not hear the gunshots because he was listening to music, but he heard police sirens and saw officers hiding behind trees with their guns drawn.

"They told us to get out of there so we ran across the drill field as quick as we could," he said.

Waldron described the scene on campus as "mayhem." (Watch a student's recording of police responding to loud bangs )

"It was kind of scary," he said. "These two kids I guess had panicked and jumped out of the top story window and the one kid broke his ankle and the other girl was not in good shape just lying on the ground."

Madison Van Duyne said she and her classmates in a media writing class were on "lockdown" in their classrooms. They were huddled in the middle of the classroom, writing stories about the shootings and posting them online.

The university is updating its 26,000 students through e-mails, and an Internet webcam is broadcasting live pictures of the campus.

The shootings came three days after a bomb threat Friday forced the cancellation of classes in three buildings, WDBJ in Roanoke reported. Also, the 100,000-square-foot Torgersen Hall was evacuated April 2 after police received a written bomb threat, The Roanoke Times reported.

After the Monday shootings, students were instructed to stay indoors and away from windows, police at the university said.

"A gunman is loose on campus. Stay in buildings until further notice. Stay away from all windows," read a warning from the university.

"Virginia Tech has canceled all classes. Those on campus are asked to remain where they are, lock their doors and stay away from windows. Persons off campus are asked not to come to campus," a statement on the university Web site said.

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WTF is wrong with people? If you life is **** and you want to kill someone...Kill yourself...I'm sick of these people killing innocent people.

why is the world so cruel today?

because everyone is told since birth they are special/unique/amazing. it has created the greatest wave of narcissism the world has ever known. when kids aren't taught from an early age to deal with disappointment (no scores for ball games, no class rankings, everyone gets a trophy and a ribbon) they think they are naturally destined to excell at everything. when they get to the age where you leave the little caccoon of being bailed out from life's consequences and have been robbed of any of the skill necessary to deal with disappointment, you snap when something relatively major goes wrong (i.e. flunking a college exam, getting dumped by a girlfriend, etc). we've created a nation of ninnies who don't know how to cope with failure because they are never allowed to "practice" dealing with minor inconveniences like losing a little league game. when sh!t goes south, they can't handle it and they take it out on the world because naturally something must have conspired against them to make them fail since they have never tasted failure before.

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**** like this pisses me off...

You have THOUSANDS of students gathered on one campus... why is there not more security???

These kids are paying 10's of thousands of dollars and you cant even promise them they will be alive tommorow??? Thats such f*cking bull...

Hire more security, please... these schools have plenty of money to do it...

At any other event/place where there are thousands of people coming and going on a daily basis there are multiple security gaurds watching cameras and checking people at the door, why should it be any differnt for school?

America needs to learn how to protect its future and start investing money into stopping assh*les like this from taking innocent lives.

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because everyone is told since birth they are special/unique/amazing. it has created the greatest wave of narcissism the world has ever known. when kids aren't taught from an early age to deal with disappointment (no scores for ball games, no class rankings, everyone gets a trophy and a ribbon) they think they are naturally destined to excell at everything. when they get to the age where you leave the little caccoon of being bailed out from life's consequences and have been robbed of any of the skill necessary to deal with disappointment, you snap when something relatively major goes wrong (i.e. flunking a college exam, getting dumped by a girlfriend, etc). we've created a nation of ninnies who don't know how to cope with failure because they are never allowed to "practice" dealing with minor inconveniences like losing a little league game. when sh!t goes south, they can't handle it and they take it out on the world because naturally something must have conspired against them to make them fail since they have never tasted failure before.

i can see what are your getting at thanks.

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because everyone is told since birth they are special/unique/amazing. it has created the greatest wave of narcissism the world has ever known. when kids aren't taught from an early age to deal with disappointment (no scores for ball games, no class rankings, everyone gets a trophy and a ribbon) they think they are naturally destined to excell at everything. when they get to the age where you leave the little caccoon of being bailed out from life's consequences and have been robbed of any of the skill necessary to deal with disappointment, you snap when something relatively major goes wrong (i.e. flunking a college exam, getting dumped by a girlfriend, etc). we've created a nation of ninnies who don't know how to cope with failure because they are never allowed to "practice" dealing with minor inconveniences like losing a little league game. when sh!t goes south, they can't handle it and they take it out on the world because naturally something must have conspired against them to make them fail since they have never tasted failure before.

Im glad Im not alone in that way of thinking... its sick they way we try to make all kids "winners"... they need to know how to to lose and how to fight through it... otherwise you end up with a world full of losers that think they are winners... and freak out when the figure out it was all a lie...

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because everyone is told since birth they are special/unique/amazing. it has created the greatest wave of narcissism the world has ever known. when kids aren't taught from an early age to deal with disappointment (no scores for ball games, no class rankings, everyone gets a trophy and a ribbon) they think they are naturally destined to excell at everything. when they get to the age where you leave the little caccoon of being bailed out from life's consequences and have been robbed of any of the skill necessary to deal with disappointment, you snap when something relatively major goes wrong (i.e. flunking a college exam, getting dumped by a girlfriend, etc). we've created a nation of ninnies who don't know how to cope with failure because they are never allowed to "practice" dealing with minor inconveniences like losing a little league game. when sh!t goes south, they can't handle it and they take it out on the world because naturally something must have conspired against them to make them fail since they have never tasted failure before.

i'll be very surprised to find that the reasons for the shootings were society's fault cause little billy wasn't allowed to keep score in his youth baseball game. I'm gonna go out on a limb & saying some punk shows up on campus HEAVILY ARMED is not the fault of being too pampered as a youth

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i'll be very surprised to find that the reasons for the shootings were society's fault cause little billy wasn't allowed to keep score in his youth baseball game. I'm gonna go out on a limb & saying some punk shows up on campus HEAVILY ARMED is not the fault of being too pampered as a youth

i'm not blaming society for this guy being a psycho. there have always been psychos. society has just pushed them to more outrageous behavior. how else do you describe the exponential increase in these type of attacks versus 20, 30, 50 years ago? yesteryear's cry for attention is hardly a blip on the radar, to get the attention these freaks crave they have to do something completely horrific to be noticed in a society where anything goes. there are many more than a simple increase in population can explain.

my prediction is he's a spoiled upper middle class kid who failed or knew he was about to fail out.

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i'll be very surprised to find that the reasons for the shootings were society's fault cause little billy wasn't allowed to keep score in his youth baseball game. I'm gonna go out on a limb & saying some punk shows up on campus HEAVILY ARMED is not the fault of being too pampered as a youth

actually early word is its a student and bad grades may actually be a reason,,a 20s looking asian man in maroon hat and leather jacket, ,police are saying 'a earlier on campus incident may have fueled the shooting' ..my guess, grades, jilted, etc

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i'll be very surprised to find that the reasons for the shootings were society's fault cause little billy wasn't allowed to keep score in his youth baseball game. I'm gonna go out on a limb & saying some punk shows up on campus HEAVILY ARMED is not the fault of being too pampered as a youth

You would be suprised...

Sure it takes more than that, but that is a big part of the issue..

Up until high school and even in high school you dont know how to fail...

Sports up until high school its always "its not about winning its about having fun"

Did you know it is nearly impossible to fail a grade and stay back in school now?? You can screw around all year doing nearly no work and you still move on to the next grade.

In high school they are all about having strong graduation #'s, so they wont fail you for the risk you will drop out... instead they offer the chance to come for a couple months in the summer learn nearly nothing and make up the class you "failed"

So basically we dont let kids fail or lose at anything and then at the ages of 16-22 they get tossed into real life situations where not everything comes easy... that is VERY damaging to someones mind and can casue events like this.

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You would be suprised...

Sure it takes more than that, but that is a big part of the issue..

Up until high school and even in high school you dont know how to fail...

Sports up until high school its always "its not about winning its about having fun"

Did you know it is nearly impossible to fail a grade and stay back in school now?? You can screw around all year doing nearly no work and you still move on to the next grade.

In high school they are all about having strong graduation #'s, so they wont fail you for the risk you will drop out... instead they offer the chance to come for a couple months in the summer learn nearly nothing and make up the class you "failed"

So basically we dont let kids fail or lose at anything and then at the ages of 16-22 they get tossed into real life situations where not everything comes easy... that is VERY damaging to someones mind and can casue events like this.

potw, hobbymaster speaketh.

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This is insane. Tech is only 3-4 hours away from me and I don't know anyone personally that goes there but I have a lot of friends who know people there and this is unbelievable.

And JGB, I don't quite understand why you're so focused on whether you were right or not about why a student would do something like that. This is incredibly tragic and now there is 31 students dead. :character42:

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because everyone is told since birth they are special/unique/amazing. it has created the greatest wave of narcissism the world has ever known. when kids aren't taught from an early age to deal with disappointment (no scores for ball games, no class rankings, everyone gets a trophy and a ribbon) they think they are naturally destined to excell at everything. when they get to the age where you leave the little caccoon of being bailed out from life's consequences and have been robbed of any of the skill necessary to deal with disappointment, you snap when something relatively major goes wrong (i.e. flunking a college exam, getting dumped by a girlfriend, etc). we've created a nation of ninnies who don't know how to cope with failure because they are never allowed to "practice" dealing with minor inconveniences like losing a little league game. when sh!t goes south, they can't handle it and they take it out on the world because naturally something must have conspired against them to make them fail since they have never tasted failure before.

JGB --

That is a great theory. But I think you are applying it to everything. Kids aren't taught to deal with disappointment? A lot of kids care far less about the things you listed than you think. Why do people give the ribbons and not keep score at a young age? To keep the parents in line. Seriously.

I coached my daughter in her first ever softball game on Saturday. A teammate had a grown ball hit to her and didn't throw it to 1st. She got confused. The parents started screaming. I had to go over to the girl on the field and tell her it was okay.

This is not related to the shooting. My point is you are putting a lot of stock in something you don't know a lot about. Go to a pop warner football game. And tell me people are trying to hide who won and who lost. That stuff just isn't happening.

Why did this shooting happen? Not sure, bad things happen. Bad people do bad things. That is they way it has always been. In this electronic world we live in we hear about it much more often and faster because of the internet. I am not saying I know why people do stuff like this. I am saying it has nothing to do with little league baseball or teaching kids that winning isn't the most important thing. That is simply not true.

My thoughts and prayers go out to all those people who lost their lives today and their family\ friends.

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because everyone is told since birth they are special/unique/amazing. it has created the greatest wave of narcissism the world has ever known. when kids aren't taught from an early age to deal with disappointment (no scores for ball games, no class rankings, everyone gets a trophy and a ribbon) they think they are naturally destined to excell at everything. when they get to the age where you leave the little caccoon of being bailed out from life's consequences and have been robbed of any of the skill necessary to deal with disappointment, you snap when something relatively major goes wrong (i.e. flunking a college exam, getting dumped by a girlfriend, etc). we've created a nation of ninnies who don't know how to cope with failure because they are never allowed to "practice" dealing with minor inconveniences like losing a little league game. when sh!t goes south, they can't handle it and they take it out on the world because naturally something must have conspired against them to make them fail since they have never tasted failure before.

potw turdmaster :)

Video games (as usuall) play a part in all of this as well...

Kids can just set the game on easy and win all day long... so you have a kid that basically cant fail at anything in life... school, video games, sports, ect ect... leads to some very F'ed up kids... sure some can handle it and have parents who teach them the lessons they need to learn.. but many slip right through the cracks... its sad...

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JGB --

That is a great theory. But I think you are applying it to everything. Kids aren't taught to deal with disappointment? A lot of kids care far less about the things you listed than you think. Why do people give the ribbons and not keep score at a young age? To keep the parents in line. Seriously.

I coached my daughter in her first ever softball game on Saturday. A teammate had a grown ball hit to her and didn't throw it to 1st. She got confused. The parents started screaming. I had to go over to the girl on the field and tell her it was okay.

This is not related to the shooting. My point is you are putting a lot of stock in something you don't know a lot about. Go to a pop warner football game. And tell me people are trying to hide who won and who lost. That stuff just isn't happening.

Why did this shooting happen? Not sure, bad things happen. Bad people do bad things. That is they way it has always been. In this electronic world we live in we hear about it much more often and faster because of the internet. I am not saying I know why people do stuff like this. I am saying it has nothing to do with little league baseball or teaching kids that winning isn't the most important thing. That is simply not true.

My thoughts and prayers go out to all those people who lost their lives today and their family\ friends.

we actually agree-- the parents protect themselves from having to teach unsavory lessons--i.e. you can't always win--to their precious proginee. sometimes parents have to deliver tough lessons--it's their duty.

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we actually agree-- the parents protect themselves from having to teach unsavory lessons--i.e. you can't always win--to their precious proginee. sometimes parents have to deliver tough lessons--it's their duty.

"The World Is A Bad Place Because Parents Don't Put Enough Pressure On Their Kids" by JGB.

I coached against this guy the other day. My son's team beat his team 20 - 2. He YELLED like it was going out of style. You missed the cut off. You can't drop that ball. I didn't yell at my son's team once.

So by your calculations the kids I coach are being sheltered. And his kids are more likely to grow up normal?

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"The World Is A Bad Place Because Parents Don't Put Enough Pressure On Their Kids" by JGB.

I coached against this guy the other day. My son's team beat his team 20 - 2. He YELLED like it was going out of style. You missed the cut off. You can't drop that ball. I didn't yell at my son's team once.

So by your calculations the kids I coach are being sheltered. And his kids are more likely to grow up normal?

nah, either extreme is bad. the key is teach kids that sometime they will fail. it's not necessarily their fault but you cannot always succeed. teaching kids to deal with failure gracefully is the important lesson. too much pressure is just as bad as preventing your child from ever realizing that sometimes you're just bested and it's not the end of the world.

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"The World Is A Bad Place Because Parents Don't Put Enough Pressure On Their Kids" by JGB.

I coached against this guy the other day. My son's team beat his team 20 - 2. He YELLED like it was going out of style. You missed the cut off. You can't drop that ball. I didn't yell at my son's team once.

So by your calculations the kids I coach are being sheltered. And his kids are more likely to grow up normal?

You cant use specific factors like the coach of a team, it gets too deep into the issue and make sit more complicated...

But if there were 2 coaches like yourself that coached little league and the score is kept and the kids are encouraged to win, yes they are more likely to turn out good than the kids who are tought to go out screw around and just have fun...

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"The World Is A Bad Place Because Parents Don't Put Enough Pressure On Their Kids" by JGB.

I coached against this guy the other day. My son's team beat his team 20 - 2. He YELLED like it was going out of style. You missed the cut off. You can't drop that ball. I didn't yell at my son's team once.

So by your calculations the kids I coach are being sheltered. And his kids are more likely to grow up normal?

wow,, you are missing his point,,

he agrees that coaches do what you do,, I did the same thing..

he is saying the coaches/parents who dont even BEGIN to tell the kids their short-comings so they can improve,,

You cantell a kid they arent performing they waythey are capable of by being gentle and offering instruction, ,if the kid doesnt care then by all means backoff, ,but you have to tell the kids how to improve or when the were wrong..

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nah, either extreme is bad. the key is teach kids that sometime they will fail. it's not necessarily their fault but you cannot always succeed. teaching kids to deal with failure gracefully is the important lesson. too much pressure is just as bad as preventing your child from ever realizing that sometimes you're just bested and it's not the end of the world.

But the coach isn't pampering his kids. He is telling them that that winning is the most important thing. So according to your theory, that is very important for them to know.

JGB -- I am busting you because you use this theory often. I imagine the Chinese Deilvery guy running 10 minutes late and you somehow relate it to little league baseball. :Nuts:

I just think you are being simplistic with this viewpoint. Someday when you meet a nice guy and adopt children of your own you will see both sides of this issue. (Yeah that was a personal attack. I am sending myself an infraction now).

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But the coach isn't pampering his kids. He is telling them that that winning is the most important thing. So according to your theory, that is very important for them to know.

JGB -- I am busting you because you use this theory often. I imagine the Chinese Deilvery guy running 10 minutes late and you somehow relate it to little league baseball. :Nuts:

I just think you are being simplistic with this viewpoint. Someday when you meet a nice guy and adopt children of your own you will see both sides of this issue. (Yeah that was a personal attack. I am sending myself an infraction now).

Your just using a bad coach as an example... thats another issue in itself... the point is a good coach will like SJ said... tell the kids how to improve and tell them when they screw up... just in the proper way and not like an idiot...

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But the coach isn't pampering his kids. He is telling them that that winning is the most important thing. So according to your theory, that is very important for them to know.

JGB -- I am busting you because you use this theory often. I imagine the Chinese Deilvery guy running 10 minutes late and you somehow relate it to little league baseball. :Nuts:

I just think you are being simplistic with this viewpoint. Someday when you meet a nice guy and adopt children of your own you will see both sides of this issue. (Yeah that was a personal attack. I am sending myself an infraction now).

lol--i do believe very strongly that a lot of problems go back to this. my dad never let me win and when i finally beat him at 1-on-1 in basketball it actually meant something. likewise, when we won the little league city championship one year it actually meant something because we remembered how disappointing it was to lose the other years. if the first disappointment i ever faced in my life was being dumped by my college girlfriend maybe i would've freaked out--but when it happened i thought, "this is nothing compared to losing that t-ball game back in '83." :)

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But the coach isn't pampering his kids. He is telling them that that winning is the most important thing. So according to your theory, that is very important for them to know.

JGB -- I am busting you because you use this theory often. I imagine the Chinese Deilvery guy running 10 minutes late and you somehow relate it to little league baseball. :Nuts:

I just think you are being simplistic with this viewpoint. Someday when you meet a nice guy and adopt children of your own you will see both sides of this issue. (Yeah that was a personal attack. I am sending myself an infraction now).

If we lost becasue we screwed up i would tell kids:

"we beat ourselves today, we were the better team. here i swhat we did wrong and right. lets work onthe wrong stuff next practice. but did everyone have fun? "..

If we flat lost to a better team i would say 'great effort, but we got beat by a better ballclub tonight. here is how we can fix what we did wrong so we canbeat them next time, ,we are real close. but did everyone have fun? "..

If we won we mooned the other team ;)

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To me the bottom line is that there are to many suicidal people floating around today that have access to a small arsenal of weapons that would rather take their ****ty lives out on innocent people instead of just quietly offing themselves. Cowards.

What happened today was awful.

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To me the bottom line is that there are to many suicidal people floating around today that have access to a small arsenal of weapons that would rather take their ****ty lives out on innocent people instead of just quietly offing themselves. Cowards.

What happened today was awful.

You got that right... sadly they think they are being cool usually...

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