Jets\Pats -- Belly Cheated: MERGED

[Arsis]

Belichick was wrong. The Patriots deserve to be punished upto a point (i.e. loss of draft picks, belichick suspension, team fine, maybe loss of playoff berth (i.e. NCAA imposed sanction)).

However, you must admit that football has a culture of embrassing cheating.

Players and coaches have said that is a common practice.

Players cheat on every play (i.e. holding; fistful of jersey).

Please step off your soap boxes with this feigned moral disgust. Either all cheating is wrong or none is wrong.

says who? there are levels and degrees to everything. Nothing is as black and white and you want it to be. Stealing plays and signals isn't even close to the level of holding or disguising illegal picks. Oh and people who hold, generally lose the team ten yards.

[JetCane]

Belichick was wrong. The Patriots deserve to be punished upto a point (i.e. loss of draft picks, belichick suspension, team fine, maybe loss of playoff berth (i.e. NCAA imposed sanction)).

However, you must admit that football has a culture of embrassing cheating.

Players and coaches have said that is a common practice.

Players cheat on every play (i.e. holding; fistful of jersey).

Please step off your soap boxes with this feigned moral disgust. Either all cheating is wrong or none is wrong.

This is well above and beyond holding, or grabbing a facemask, or arguing with a ref about being in bounds when you are not. You cant equate the two.

Those in-game infractions are committed by players in the heat of battle, and there are refs on the field to flag them. This espionage/cheating was a premeditated plan by coaches and FO to intentionally be sneaky and dishonest, in violation of a specific memo by the commissioner not to use electronic recording devices to record other teams signals.

You are way off base trying to rationalize New England's DISGRACEFUL conduct by saying other players grab a jersey when they block. Holding does not threaten the integrity of the game nor compromise the competitive aspect of professional football.

Yours is a horrible analysis. The entire football world feels disgust at what Belidick did, all except for his delusional fans.

[SoFlaJets]

To be fair, there is no report on New England knowing anything with the Jets' offense, its about knowing their defense and protecting Brady really. Either way, even with Pete Kendall as a matter of fact, that play with Jarvis Green happens. Green just flat out destroyed Ferguson and got to Pennington. Can't do anything about that.

we were way behind because they knew what we were doing forcing us into passing situations which got Chad hurt-cause and affect

[wildthing2022000]

I don't want to be compensated. We lost the game....who would respect this team if they gave us the W?

The Pats deserve to be punished...we don't need to be compensated. Unless it's 0-0-1 ...The record should stay the same.

Lost the game because they cheated. This would be like getting your car stolen and you getting nothing from the insurance company. Sure the guy goes to jail, but guess what you have no car and nothing to help get another one.

[SoFlaJets]

but one thing I'm CERTAIN of, and that's HE would never even consider doing what Bekichick did. It comes down to basic moral judgement IMO and Beli-cheat has none-I'd hate to be him

[CoachTsurfing]

I don't want to be compensated. We lost the game....who would respect this team if they gave us the W?

The Pats deserve to be punished...we don't need to be compensated. Unless it's 0-0-1 ...The record should stay the same.

Agree, I don't want a win like that. I would like to be 0-0. and the Pats should be 0-1. They should also face a fine and the head coach should be fined. Them losing a draft pick is a bit overboard. And if they do lose one. I don't think we should get it. If the pats lose one they should just be skipped when their turn comes.

[Iceman88]

PFT has another interesting rumor on this subject...

"WERE PATS STUNG BY COMPETITION COMMITTEE?

There's a theory making the rounds in league circles that the Sunday confiscation of Matt Estrella's camera was the result of a specific effort by the NFL's Competition Committee to nail the Patriots.

It was, some believe, a sting operation.

Rumors also are swirling that Jets coach Eric Mangini, who was with the Pats through the 2005 season, began to spread the word to other teams in 2006 regarding the tactics that Bill Belichick employs. But even after a close call last year in Green Bay, the Patriots kept doing it.

The thinking in some circles is that the Competition Committee, which has endorsed the use of a radio receiver in the helmet of one defensive player, wants to use the Patriots' situation as the impetus for getting the additional two votes necessary to pass the rule.

In March 2007, 22 of the 24 teams needed to push the measure through voted in favor of it.

Though such a rule will not be perfect given the extent of the substitutions made on defense, it would eliminate the temptation to steal defensive signals, because it would eliminate the defensive signals.

And, in our view, it's a no-brainer that this rule will be passed come March 2008."

[joewilly]

This is well above and beyond holding, or grabbing a facemask, or arguing with a ref about being in bounds when you are not. You cant equate the two.

Those in-game infractions are committed by players in the heat of battle, and there are refs on the field to flag them. This espionage/cheating was a premeditated plan by coaches and FO to intentionally be sneaky and dishonest, in violation of a specific memo by the commissioner not to use electronic recording devices to record other teams signals.

You are way off base trying to rationalize New England's DISGRACEFUL conduct by saying other players grab a jersey when they block. Holding does not threaten the integrity of the game nor compromise the competitive aspect of professional football.

Yours is a horrible analysis. The entire football world feels disgust at what Belidick did, all except for his delusional fans.

good post jetcane.

[SoFlaJets]

I think the game should be re-played-and every one of you guys that went should be allowed in for free

[raffyD]

Belichick was wrong. The Patriots deserve to be punished upto a point (i.e. loss of draft picks, belichick suspension, team fine, maybe loss of playoff berth (i.e. NCAA imposed sanction)).

However, you must admit that football has a culture of embrassing cheating.

Players and coaches have said that is a common practice.

Players cheat on every play (i.e. holding; fistful of jersey).

Please step off your soap boxes with this feigned moral disgust. Either all cheating is wrong or none is wrong.

Lame, just lame.

[BUM-KNEE]

The video footage was blurry because of the rain when we beat them last year, no film to study is a terrible thing.

[Verde]

Didn't the drive to an easy score. Then Wes Welker dropped a pass. Then Matt Cassell dropped a FG snap.

The score was close, but the game was not.

Oh please.

Didn't Rhodes almost intercept a pass, which he would've clearly ran all the way to the endzone...

And if I recall, Revis did too. So that's 14 woulda shoulda points for the Jets.

It goes both ways.

[Smizzy]

This would be like getting your car stolen and you getting nothing from the insurance company. Sure the guy goes to jail, but guess what you have no car and nothing to help get another one.

The NFL isn't in the business of compensating teams....so it would be more like going to the car thiefs mothers house and beggin her to have her son return your car.

[Maxman]

Oh please.

Didn't Rhodes almost intercept a pass, which he would've clearly ran all the way to the endzone...

And if I recall, Revis did too. So that's 14 woulda shoulda points for the Jets.

It goes both ways.

Verde you replied with facts which was good. But you shouldn't waste so much energy. A simple if my Aunt had balls response would have taken care of it.

[joewilly]

I am only illustrating a point (probably badly). My point is, that was a clear case of error that affected the outcome of a game and someone's job. Nothing was done. How much or little the Patriots gained is disputable. What happens then next time a player cheats on the field and turns the balance of the game?

You are funny when you are righteous.

thanks man, i'm gonna ask max to include a most righteous poster category this year

I trust you'll vote for me

[Arsis]

what should the penalty be?

DEATH!

[Verde]

Verde you replied with facts which was good. But you shouldn't waste so much energy. A simple if my Aunt had balls response would have taken care of it.

lol. You crazy!

[joewilly]

Verde you replied with facts which was good. But you shouldn't waste so much energy. A simple if my Aunt had balls response would have taken care of it.

wow you sre all about the genitals today..... what gives

good reply verde

[DaBrick Wall]

If you really want to hit the Pats where it hurts consider the following:

1. Will losing a couple of mid round picks hurt? No

2. Will being fined hurt? No, owners are billionaires

3. Will a forfiet hurt? No, they will most likely still win the division

4. Will a Belicheck 4 game suspension hurt? NO. Players still play

If you want to hit the Pats where it hurts.........Hit them with a ban on post season play. You cheat to win, if you win more than your opponent you advance. A ban on the post season would assure them no benefit from cheating as to not allow them a run at another Lombardi.

Great post...Exactly my thinking. Though the NFL will probably give them nothing more than a fine and, at worst, a loss of a draft pick.

My question: Do the Jets get the draft pick?

[joewilly]

he says he soory to the team, ownership the players oand anyone else affected by this.

he'll comment again when roger makes a ruling.

[Smizzy]

"Are there any questions about the chargers? "

No bill...you cheating ,rat ****! Could you be anymore guilty?

[JetCane]

http://jetnation.com/forums/showthread.php?t=41371

It's alright, jw. It was hard to miss, being a multi page thread on page 1.

[will]

but one thing I'm CERTAIN of, and that's HE would never even consider doing what Bekichick did. It comes down to basic moral judgement IMO and Beli-cheat has none-I'd hate to be him

I agree. But only because Herm wouldn't know what to do with the information.

[L.I.MikeBleedsGreen]

Lots of rain ,alot of Brady mistakes ,alot of Tom Picking himself up out of the Mudd.

how good do camera's work in the rain??

Even the NFL camera's were having a hard time showing the game on TV because of the rain and foggyness on the Camera's!!!

Translation: JETS WIN

[Arsis]

innocent people don't apologize.

[joebabyny]

Not much of an apology, from what i read he said, it sounded like he was trying to offer up excuses slick-willy style talking about his interpretation of the rules blahblahblah.

[BUM-KNEE]

Lots of rain ,alot of Brady mistakes ,alot of Tom Picking himself up out of the Mudd.

how good do camera's work in the rain??

Even the NFL camera's were having a hard time showing the game on TV because of the rain and foggyness on the Camera's!!!

Translation: JETS WIN

Thats what Im saying, no film --no win. Cameras dont get the best images in the rain.

[joewilly]

http://jetnation.com/forums/showthread.php?t=41371

It's alright, jw. It was hard to miss, being a multi page thread on page 1.

crap I finally get the courage to start a thread in the football forum and...........well it's back to therapy for joewilly

[raffyD]

BB should be suspended, maybe for the season if the powers see this as a potential pandora's box.

Let the pats keep their tainted titles and what not, nobody cares anymore.

Move the December 16th game from New England to the Meadowlands and let the blood bath begin.

Fine the Pats and use some of the money to pay back the New England ticket holders for that December game they will lose against the Jets. The fans did nothing to deserve this so they shouldn't be punished by losing money.

[Bugg]

Didn't the drive to an easy score. Then Wes Welker dropped a pass. Then Matt Cassell dropped a FG snap.

The score was close, but the game was not.

Cheating is cheating. And the rule was empahsized by the Commissioner in a memo just last summer. Either it's cheating or it's not,and Belichick already apologized for cheating because even he knows he has no good defense.

Problem is under that analysis,at what score would such cheating require a penalty? 21-14? 28-14?That's crazy.It's not wortha specific point value. Are you saying a cheating team should a team be less penalized if the talent disparity is greater than usual? Your logic is no logic at all; it's simply too inexact to say, so you have to punish the cheater severly either way. It's no less a violation of the rules to cheat simply because you team is better than your opponent's. And it must give them some advantage or they wouldn't risk doing it. It's all to slippery a slope,which means the penalty is going to be very high,and may include a forfeit.

[JetCane]

crap I finally get the courage to start a thread in the football forum and...........well it's back to therapy for joewilly

LOL!

Here's an idea for a thread for ya, jw.

How about...

-should the Pats be penalized...ummm...coulda already been used.

-everyone should support whoever is playing QB for the J-E-T-S...wait, i think that one was used, too.

-who was a bigger criminal, Nixon or Beli?

-Did NE really get an advantage from spying...

ehhh, never mind, stick with this one you already started

[NIGHT STALKER]

Who tested positive for HGH? Anyway, I think he got a 5 game suspension if I recall.

What does a HC get for using video/audio technology to gain the upper hand? Certainly I would think as much as an assistant's fine. Both instances are illegal according to the NFL.

Damn, when you really think about the Pats organization, it has really gone into the dumpster this year...they sign a few character issue guys and now they have their HC breaking NFL rules...great message being sent to players and fans alike. Unless you're a Patsie fan and don't give two ****s.

[Bugg]

I think the game should be re-played-and every one of you guys that went should be allowed in for free

And free parking. And free beer and food. And a ride home. And air conditioning-it was freaking hot on Sunday.

[joewilly]

Okay, I just got back from class and have no idea what was said. Can somebody fill me in? Thanks.

yes.... senior called alk a gravy sucking pig & alk told senior to have intercourse both himself & the horse he rode in on. max stepped in & tried to get them both to drop their drawers for a good spanking. they both complied which prompted both greengal & verde to puke all over page 3 so it got deleted.

max has been following seniorjet around ever since mumbling something about tryin sum old a$$

[Bugg]

Wade Wilson.