For The Anti-Mangini Crowd

[Maxman]

Are you guys writing him off for good? Like there is no chance in him ever doing a good job here? Seems a bit harsh. A coaching staff as young as this was bound to have some growing pains. IN a lot of ways he is getting punished for winning 10 games last year.

They have done a terrible job this year. Tyson wrote about this before the season. A step back this year was possible he said.

I see a lot of people blasting them for talent evaluation. Saying they missed on free agents. But in their defense they only signed b level free agents. They didn't break the bank for anyone. DBrick and Mangold are doing better this year. Revis looks good and Harris we will find out about soon enough. Those are the top 4 picks from the past 2 years, not too bad. Agreed -- they need much more talent so there is little room for error going forward. But it isn't like they paid 40 million in bonuses to 2 free agents and missed. If anything they have been conservative in that regard. Maybe waiting until a better foundation has been built.

I am not ready to write off Mangini. He is stubborn, I would like to see him change. But he still has my faith. The team is playing hard. He is doing a decent job with the media. The on the field results have to change. Personally I think he has to mature a bit. But I like his chances. Even after the poor start this year.

Who is ready to write him off? Let us hear it...

[timbok]

he can still get it done.Its been 1.5 years,he needs to change his miserble defense scheme though

[AFJF]

Are you guys writing him off for good? Like there is no chance in him ever doing a good job here? Seems a bit harsh. A coaching staff as young as this was bound to have some growing pains. IN a lot of ways he is getting punished for winning 10 games last year.

They have done a terrible job this year. Tyson wrote about this before the season. A step back this year was possible he said.

I see a lot of people blasting them for talent evaluation. Saying they missed on free agents. But in their defense they only signed b level free agents. They didn't break the bank for anyone. DBrick and Mangold are doing better this year. Revis looks good and Harris we will find out about soon enough. Those are the top 4 picks from the past 2 years, not too bad. Agreed -- they need much more talent so there is little room for error going forward. But it isn't like they paid 40 million in bonuses to 2 free agents and missed. If anything they have been conservative in that regard. Maybe waiting until a better foundation has been built.

I am not ready to write off Mangini. He is stubborn, I would like to see him change. But he still has my faith. The team is playing hard. He is doing a decent job with the media. The on the field results have to change. Personally I think he has to mature a bit. But I like his chances. Even after the poor start this year.

Who is ready to write him off? Let us hear it...

I'm not writing him off at all. I like his beliefs and the way he goes about things. I am frustrated by the fact that Clemens isn't in there yet but lets face it...last week was a very good performance by Chad and the defense gave it away. I didn't expect him to bench Chad after a game like that. Now if Chad has another terrible performance, the move has to be made. Also, if he doesn't bring in a legit 3-4 NT and stays with that alignment then he's an idiot. That's why I selected "have to see more".

[Maxman]

I just saw the other thread about Mangini. This one is very similar. I would merge them but I don't know if it preserves the poll or not if I do.

[afosomf]

i said fire him, right after season is finished

If the team shows marked improvement maybe i change my stance, as long as Noodle plays i doubt it.

several reasons

1) in the 2nd half of most games, no adjustments made at least none that were visible or worked;)

2) Continuing to play Barilla after week 4. You drafted a young stud that has

a NFL arm ....there is no more time to have a player sit and watch for 3 years.

3) sticking with the 3-4 , where has all his defensive genious been?

4) I believe his brutal training camps will keep attractive FA's away? I have some reason to believe that some players may be faking injuries during training camp. If you are a winning org you can get away with tough camps, losing teams well... cannot.

5) the product is unwatchable...no explosion plays(cept for Leon KR ret)

I wouldn't mind going 4-12 as long as team is playing hard, is exciting, the

team is improving.

Can anyone on this board be real confident with EM?

[Pragmatic Bus]

you can't just write him off after 1.5 years. specially after last year he took a team with no talent to the playoffs. yeah he is stuborn but most head coaches are.

[Green DNA]

This year is a disaster no doubt, but if you look at this objectively, every loss (except the Patriots) has hinged on a couple of plays that could have resulted in a win, so I don't see a great deal of difference from last year. Having said that, the D sucks royally and a couple of things need to happen:

Enough of the quick interior D-lineman nonsense, get a fat ass load in the middle next year (Pat Williams?) to clog up the running lanes and protect the linebackers so that they can make plays.

Spend all of the salary cap coin. Don't raise the effin ticket prices every year and try to run the team like the 99 cent store. Maybe Woody is exerting pressure to save money?

Make better FA decisions. Enough of the Chatam's and Kassel's of the world, get some playmakers in here.

Start Clemens so that we can use the entire playbook.

This team doesn't need to be overhauled in the short term, but some key areas need to be shored up and would definitely make a difference in these close games. If this team was 5-2 or 4-3 the mood on the board would be radically different.

[afosomf]

This year is a disaster no doubt, but if you look at this objectively, every loss (except the Patriots) has hinged on a couple of plays that could have resulted in a win, so I don't see a great deal of difference from last year. Having said that, the D sucks royally and a couple of things need to happen:

Enough of the quick interior D-lineman nonsense, get a fat ass load in the middle next year (Pat Williams?) to clog up the running lanes and protect the linebackers so that they can make plays.

Spend all of the salary cap coin. Don't raise the effin ticket prices every year and try to run the team like the 99 cent store. Maybe Woody is exerting pressure to save money?

Make better FA decisions. Enough of the Chatam's and Kassel's of the world, get some playmakers in here.

Start Clemens so that we can use the entire playbook.

This team doesn't need to be overhauled in the short term, but some key areas need to be shored up and would definitely make a difference in these close games. If this team was 5-2 or 4-3 the mood on the board would be radically different.

Yes it does, I do not feel confident that any FA will come play with us. Players talk... let them ask Jones or Coles if they should come play for Penguin.

[Pragmatic Bus]

Yes it does, I do not feel confident that any FA will come play with us. Players talk... let them ask Jones or Coles if they should come play for Penguin.

yeah nobody wanted to play for belly eigther but look now

[Green DNA]

Yes it does, I do not feel confident that any FA will come play with us. Players talk... let them ask Jones or Coles if they should come play for Penguin.

Pay them and they will come. The Jets have been shopping on the clearance rack and the bargain bin so far.

[afosomf]

yeah nobody wanted to play for belly eigther but look now

when you can dangle 3 super bowl rings, you can run any type of camp you want, when you suck.. it doesn't work

Mumbles also has changed a bit, he let moss sit out entire training camp

Money itself will not attract players to play for EM, i am betting we will get squat.

[Pragmatic Bus]

when you can dangle 3 super bowl rings, you can run any type of camp you want, when you suck.. it doesn't work

Mumbles also has changed a bit, he let moss sit out entire training camp

Money itself will not attract players to play for EM, i am betting we will get squat.

hey if porter can sign with the dolphins the jets have chance

[afosomf]

hey if porter can sign with the dolphins the jets have chance

Porter is kaput, and Pitt knew it.

[Pragmatic Bus]

Porter is kaput, and Pitt knew it.

porter might be an idiot but he sure beats what we have right now

[afosomf]

porter might be an idiot but he sure beats what we have right now

we will not be a player for young FA talent. Do not see it happening.

[Pragmatic Bus]

we will not be a player for young FA talent. Do not see it happening.

you rarely get young top tier players now adays and when those few come on the markets mostly go for a really high rate. way more than what tangini would go for any ways

[drago]

Are you guys writing him off for good? Like there is no chance in him ever doing a good job here? Seems a bit harsh. A coaching staff as young as this was bound to have some growing pains. IN a lot of ways he is getting punished for winning 10 games last year.

They have done a terrible job this year. Tyson wrote about this before the season. A step back this year was possible he said.

I see a lot of people blasting them for talent evaluation. Saying they missed on free agents. But in their defense they only signed b level free agents. They didn't break the bank for anyone. DBrick and Mangold are doing better this year. Revis looks good and Harris we will find out about soon enough. Those are the top 4 picks from the past 2 years, not too bad. Agreed -- they need much more talent so there is little room for error going forward. But it isn't like they paid 40 million in bonuses to 2 free agents and missed. If anything they have been conservative in that regard. Maybe waiting until a better foundation has been built.

I am not ready to write off Mangini. He is stubborn, I would like to see him change. But he still has my faith. The team is playing hard. He is doing a decent job with the media. The on the field results have to change. Personally I think he has to mature a bit. But I like his chances. Even after the poor start this year.

Who is ready to write him off? Let us hear it...

great post max, too bad i don't nominate mods.

In response - Mangini showed a lot of promise in that he doesnt' bend with the media, he is willing to go all out on a blitz, and always plays for the win (bears game, onside kick). A lot of coaches just refuse to go for the win when the chips look down, they play conservative and try to keep the score close enough to not be considered a blow out.

Mangini really attacks when their down, and really attacks when they're up. He's got stones, and he's got my support (as if he cares ).

[awats]

i said fire him, right after season is finished

If the team shows marked improvement maybe i change my stance, as long as Noodle plays i doubt it.

several reasons

1) in the 2nd half of most games, no adjustments made at least none that were visible or worked;)

2) Continuing to play Barilla after week 4. You drafted a young stud that has

a NFL arm ....there is no more time to have a player sit and watch for 3 years.

3) sticking with the 3-4 , where has all his defensive genious been?

4) I believe his brutal training camps will keep attractive FA's away? I have some reason to believe that some players may be faking injuries during training camp. If you are a winning org you can get away with tough camps, losing teams well... cannot.

5) the product is unwatchable...no explosion plays(cept for Leon KR ret)

I wouldn't mind going 4-12 as long as team is playing hard, is exciting, the

team is improving.

Can anyone on this board be real confident with EM?

I'm real confident in Mangini. If there are players (as you suggest) faking injuries, then they should get the boot. If they are not willing to transfer their hard practices to the actual game, then the are doing a disservice to themselves as well as their teammates.

[CoachTsurfing]

Are you guys writing him off for good? Like there is no chance in him ever doing a good job here? Seems a bit harsh. A coaching staff as young as this was bound to have some growing pains. IN a lot of ways he is getting punished for winning 10 games last year.

They have done a terrible job this year. Tyson wrote about this before the season. A step back this year was possible he said.

I see a lot of people blasting them for talent evaluation. Saying they missed on free agents. But in their defense they only signed b level free agents. They didn't break the bank for anyone. DBrick and Mangold are doing better this year. Revis looks good and Harris we will find out about soon enough. Those are the top 4 picks from the past 2 years, not too bad. Agreed -- they need much more talent so there is little room for error going forward. But it isn't like they paid 40 million in bonuses to 2 free agents and missed. If anything they have been conservative in that regard. Maybe waiting until a better foundation has been built.

I am not ready to write off Mangini. He is stubborn, I would like to see him change. But he still has my faith. The team is playing hard. He is doing a decent job with the media. The on the field results have to change. Personally I think he has to mature a bit. But I like his chances. Even after the poor start this year.

Who is ready to write him off? Let us hear it...

I knew we were going to take a step back, but not like this. I thought we would be close in a lot of games. I thought we would be behind a bit and then the coaching staff would make changes in the second half. But it's just been the opposite. We've been ahead for close games and then we lose them. My biggest complaint isn't even about the whole QB thing. My biggest complaint has been Mangini forcing schemes that he didn't acquire the correct personal to run. Then being so stubborn and arrogant not to change things up.

[awats]

Yes it does, I do not feel confident that any FA will come play with us. Players talk... let them ask Jones or Coles if they should come play for Penguin.

If they talk to Jones or Coles they may very well say that he works them pretty hard during the week and they would prefer to be left to their own devices at practices, but they would not tell them not to come here.

[afosomf]

If they talk to Jones or Coles they may very well say that he works them pretty hard during the week and they would prefer to be left to their own devices at practices, but they would not tell them not to come here.

I disagree, players talk all the time

we are in bad shape so players will not come here for the almighty $

Sh1t A Thomas took less $ to play for the Pukes.

[Pragmatic Bus]

i guess its not a crowd, more of a bunch than huh max?

[JetCane]

Are you guys writing him off for good?

Yes, i have written him off as being a scumbag of a person, just like his idol belichick is.

Like there is no chance in him ever doing a good job here?

He still might do a good job here, but he has a long ways to go, and must admit to himself he has made some bad mistakes and must change some of his ways.

Seems a bit harsh.

No harsher than the posters who have spewed their hate for players on the team for the past two years. No harsher than putting a vet in the rookie dorm for having the audacity to say he wants to be traded since the FO reneged on what he thought was a gentleman's agreement.

IN a lot of ways he is getting punished for winning 10 games last year.

That's an apologists view. He has been outcoached in every game this season, including the Fins game.

A coaching staff as young as this was bound to have some growing pains

Like i said, he needs to recognize where he has made mistakes and must change some of his ways if he is going to ever improve. Sutton isnt young. Where are the halftime adjustments? The handling of the QB situation is the LEAST of the growing pains.

They have done a terrible job this year. Tyson wrote about this before the season. A step back this year was possible he said.

This team has taken more than a step backwards this season. i think the whispers that he has lost at least part of the locker room are true. Yes, they have done a terrible job this year, so why make excuses?

Who is ready to write him off? Let us hear it...

I am done listening to his press conferences. I cant remember the last time i heard a sports figure so full of BS- he's worse than Herm when it comes to using a lot of words to say nothing. I dont like him, and I am not impressed with his football knowledge or judgment of talent. What is there to really like about him, other than he isnt Herm Edwards or Rich Kotite?

BTW, I didnt vote in the poll. I'll wait until the end of the season, to see how it plays out.

[Irish Jet]

Yes, i have written him off as being a scumbag of a person, just like his idol belichick is.

Scumbag of a person????

What the hell is wrong with you???!!!

[afosomf]

Yes, i have written him off as being a scumbag of a person, just like his idol belichick is.

He still might do a good job here, but he has a long ways to go, and must admit to himself he has made some bad mistakes and must change some of his ways.

No harsher than the posters who have spewed their hate for players on the team for the past two years. No harsher than putting a vet in the rookie dorm for having the audacity to say he wants to be traded since the FO reneged on what he thought was a gentleman's agreement.

That's an apologists view. He has been outcoached in every game this season, including the Fins game.

Like i said, he needs to recognize where he has made mistakes and must change some of his ways if he is going to ever improve. Sutton isnt young. Where are the halftime adjustments? The handling of the QB situation is the LEAST of the growing pains.

This team has taken more than a step backwards this season. i think the whispers that he has lost at least part of the locker room are true. Yes, they have done a terrible job this year, so why make excuses?

I am done listening to his press conferences. I cant remember the last time i heard a sports figure so full of BS- he's worse than Herm when it comes to using a lot of words to say nothing. I dont like him, and I am not impressed with his football knowledge or judgment of talent. What is there to really like about him, other than he isnt Herm Edwards or Rich Kotite?

BTW, I didnt vote in the poll. I'll wait until the end of the season, to see how it plays out.

Amen

[Matt39]

Its a "process."

The Pete Kendall situation was all you needed to know about what type of guy he is.

[NJ]

One can only go with the data they see up to the moment. I'd like to say it's the difference between the schedules last year to this year thats making 07 look bad, but it isn't. We're not discriminating between bad and good teams on who we suck against. If you could see any light at the end of the tunnel or could rationalize some of the manuvers as good for the long term it would be easier to swallow. All's I'm seeing looks like bumbling and thats not a confidence builder. I'm still not ready to write him off though.

[BUM-KNEE]

Im still confident that Mangini brings success to this franchise. I dont agree 100% with everything he does, but I like his determination and devotion to forming a team that he envisions as a frontrunner for years to come. I do wonder where the adjustments are in the second half, as they would be a measure of his football prowess. It is up to the players to put those halftime changes into motion though, and the on-field performance hasnt impressed me much.

I dont like the whole "tight lipped" nature of Mangini though, couldnt we shoot for somewhere in the middle of Herms media lovefest and Manginis non speak? At least we could get an actual bearing on whats going on, so we wouldnt have to speculate so much about so many aspect of this team.

[Arsis]

Change my vote to fire mangina

[SpartanJet]

I've seen enough.

I have no confidence in this staff to evaluate players in the draft, to get free agents, or to manage the game and personnel.

Putting KC in on the last drive was an impossible situation to put a young QB in. Simply ridiculous. The time to put KC in the game was about 5 weeks ago.