Untouchable Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 Jets beat Miami and Kansas City ending the season at 4-12 picking in the 5-7 range. Trades LB Jonathan Vilma and a 6th round pick to Baltimore for a 2008 2nd round pick Chad Pennington to Minnesota for a 2008 5th round pick Free Agent Signings OG Stacy Andrews WR D.J. Hackett CB Drayton Florence DE Tommy Kelly Mock Draft (5 Rounds) 1st round: OLB Vernon Gholston - Ohio State 2nd round: OT Jeff Otah - Pittsburgh 2nd round: ILB Beau Bell - UNLV 3rd round: OG Eric Young - Tennessee 4th round: DE Nick Hayden - Wisconsin 5th round: OT Pedro Sosa - Rutgers 5th round: FB Peyton Hillis - Arkansas 2008 Starting Lineup QB Kellen Clemens RB Thomas Jones FB Peyton Hillis WR Laveranues Coles WR Jerricho Cotchery TE Chris Baker LT D'Brickashaw Ferguson LG Stacy Andrews C Nick Mangold RG Brandon Moore RT Jeff Otah DE Kenyon Coleman NT Dewayne Robertson DE Tommy Kelly/Shaun Ellis OLB Bryan Thomas ILB David Harris ILB Eric Barton/Beau Bell OLB Vernon Gholston CB Darrelle Revis CB Drayton Florence FS Kerry Rhodes SS Abram Elam/Eric Smith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gang_green03 Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 Love the Gholston pick and as a whole that offseason would be solid. But you don't even have us addressing the NT position at all?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Untouchable Posted November 30, 2007 Author Share Posted November 30, 2007 Love the Gholston pick and as a whole that offseason would be solid. But you don't even have us addressing the NT position at all?? How can we upgrade the NT position? Much like last year, there are no solid NT's via the draft or free agency. It's looking like another year of Robertson in the middle. Atleast with Kelly we're adding a 310 pounder at DE and Gholston would be a beast at OLB. We'd be adding much needed talent AND size. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 NT Dewayne Robertson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Troll Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 DJ Hackett is good, so there is no way the Jets make a play for him. The rest is very realistic, unfortunately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 I love this offseason, but I think Young doesn't last to the 3rd. Guard prospects usually jump up just a bit before combine when they're discussed a little more. It would be a pretty decent offseason though. Doesn't solve everything, but thats not exactly easy to do . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gang_green03 Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 How can we upgrade the NT position? Much like last year, there are no solid NT's via the draft or free agency. It's looking like another year of Robertson in the middle. Atleast with Kelly we're adding a 310 pounder at DE and Gholston would be a beast at OLB. We'd be adding much needed talent AND size. Just because there's no obvious stud doesn't mean there are no potential NT in the draft. There are a few that are possibilities. The most obvious one would be B.J. Raji but who knows if he'll come out at this point. Robertson is a waste at NT so to not even try to upgrade doesn't make sense. Why not take a risk on some later round potential NT's? You can't tell me taking a flier on a late round DT is a worse option than taking a FB in the 5th round. Even if they're not ideal guys like Dre Moore, Frank Okam, or Red Bryant, or a big body DT that is lesser known could turn out to be effective at that spot. Even if they're not, they can't be much worse than Robertson. Its much better to give someone else a shot than just settle with a player we already know can't do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 Jets beat Miami and Kansas City ending the season at 4-12 picking in the 5-7 range. Trades LB Jonathan Vilma and a 6th round pick to Baltimore for a 2008 2nd round pick Chad Pennington to Minnesota for a 2008 5th round pick Free Agent Signings OG Stacy Andrews WR D.J. Hackett CB Drayton Florence DE Tommy Kelly Mock Draft (5 Rounds) 1st round: OLB Vernon Gholston - Ohio State 2nd round: OT Jeff Otah - Pittsburgh 2nd round: ILB Beau Bell - UNLV 3rd round: OG Eric Young - Tennessee 4th round: DE Nick Hayden - Wisconsin 5th round: OT Pedro Sosa - Rutgers 5th round: FB Peyton Hillis - Arkansas 2008 Starting Lineup QB Kellen Clemens RB Thomas Jones FB Peyton Hillis WR Laveranues Coles WR Jerricho Cotchery TE Chris Baker LT D'Brickashaw Ferguson LG Stacy Andrews C Nick Mangold RG Brandon Moore RT Jeff Otah DE Kenyon Coleman NT Dewayne Robertson DE Tommy Kelly/Shaun Ellis OLB Bryan Thomas ILB David Harris ILB Eric Barton/Beau Bell OLB Vernon Gholston CB Darrelle Revis CB Drayton Florence FS Kerry Rhodes SS Abram Elam/Eric Smith Just because there's no obvious stud doesn't mean there are no potential NT in the draft. There are a few that are possibilities. The most obvious one would be B.J. Raji but who knows if he'll come out at this point. Robertson is a waste at NT so to not even try to upgrade doesn't make sense. Why not take a risk on some later round potential NT's? You can't tell me taking a flier on a late round DT is a worse option than taking a FB in the 5th round. Even if they're not ideal guys like Dre Moore, Frank Okam, or Red Bryant, or a big body DT that is lesser known could turn out to be effective at that spot. Even if they're not, they can't be much worse than Robertson. Its much better to give someone else a shot than just settle with a player we already know can't do it. True... Frank Morton, Henry Smith, Jason Shirley, Marcus Harrison, and Carlton Powell all have NT size, builds, and skillsets. They just aren't Wilfork/Hampton/Ngata type prospects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
124 Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 Someone on that line has to be replaced, whether its Roberston or Ellis. I like our current line, but they are just not getting it done so its clear that someone has to go. That or maybe not having another OLB is hurting this unit more than we know and Gholston could be that solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barton Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 Very nice job, UT. I really like the FA signings you chose and Gholston has been my favorite OLB in this draft for awhile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 Awful. We'd be just awful & Tangini should be fired if this ends up being our off-season/draft. If these f***ing clowns go with DRob as a 3-4 NT again for a 3rd consecutive season, AND let him carry a $10M cap # to do it, AND don't make the slightest effort in the draft or FA to acquire someone who MIGHT fill the position appropriately, the stadium should be empty until their dismissal. Not even taking a flyer on a NT prospect while still keeping us in the 3-4 is probably enough to stop reading. Gholston is a fine pick if we're in the 5-7 range. After that, I don't like this draft. Jeff Otah with a top 5-7 pick in round 2??? Are we afraid he won't be there a full round (or two) later? There may be as many as 10 better OT prospects than Otah. He hardly warrants burning a top-40 pick on. Beau Bell is yet another reach with a top-50 pick. He'll almost definitely be there in round 3 & might even be there in round 4. Eric Young is probably ok for a 3rd-rounder, but not incredible value with a top-5 pick in the round. He might even be there a round later. Nick Hayden is another reach. He's already on the team & his name is Kareem Brown. Pedro Sosa? What, we don't have enough undersized linemen as it is? He's barely 290 lbs and he'll be 280 lbs at the most after Mangini's boot camp. We have D'Brick; you're drafting Otah and Young; we still have Clement signed up as a backup for the league minimum & Jacob Bender as well; you don't think this would be a good place to take a flyer on a real NT instead of a 5th OT? DJ Hackett has had serious leg injuries twice this season, his only as starter. Tommy Kelly is ok I guess...or at least he was. I'm not that impressed with anything other than his size, as people have run on Oakland at will with him in there. Further, he's on IR right now after tearing a knee ligament last month. Screw that. Drayton Florence is supposedly as dumb as a bag of rocks & frankly he usually sucks. SD liked him so much they burned a first-round pick on Cromartie. And isn't he the dumbass who Troy Brown stripped of the ball after what should have been a back-breaking turnover in the playoff game last year? THIS is what we're doing with all this cap room (and potential cap room)??? We've got at least $12M right now (maybe more). Trading Chad clears up another $5M. Presumably, you're releasing Barrett as well, which could clear up as much as $3M more. So with $20M in cap room, you want to keep DRob for $10M (instead of making that # $30M), pick up a WR in DJ Hackett who's coming off two serious ankle injuries (to the same ankle) in the same season, a 300-lb DE with a torn knee ligament, a career backup OLman, and a 2nd-round bust DB? And then top it off by taking most of our draft picks like a round ahead of where they're projected (at this point)? If this was the extent of our off-season moves, I'd throw up in my mouth. UT, usually your mocks are more well-though-out than this & I like a lot of your ideas. This one sucks & would probably doom us to another losing season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayKwaz Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 [beau Bell is yet another reach with a top-50 pick. He'll almost definitely be there in round 3 & might even be there in round 4. I have only seen him play once but Bell to me would look great next to Harris in the middle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoFlaJets Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 I read the other day that some insiders are saying we will be going after Alan Faneca from Pittsburgh-I like that Clement is being replaced at RT I don't like that Moore is still starting and that you don't have David Bowens finally replacing the underachieving Bryan Thomas at OLB-as for the college kids I can't really say yet. I don't start studying up on them until the season is over-I mean****OFFCIALLY****over Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayKwaz Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 I read the other day that some insiders are saying we will be going after Alan Faneca from Pittsburgh-I like that Clement is being replaced at RT I don't like that Moore is still starting and that you don't have David Bowens finally replacing the underachieving Bryan Thomas at OLB-as for the college kids I can't really say yet. I don't start studying up on them until the season is over-I mean****OFFCIALLY****over I would love to get Justin Smiley and Faneca. Maybe draft a RT like Otah and let him battle Bender for that spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 I have only seen him play once but Bell to me would look great next to Harris in the middle. Harris is awesome so far, but back in April would you have taken him with a top-10 pick? No. Reaching for players you want, ahead of their projected draft slot, is how you end up burning day-one picks on Victor Hobson, Anthony Schlegel, and Sione Pouha. If you want them & they're available later in the draft, then take them. If someone else wants to reach for lesser prospects, then let them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoFlaJets Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 Harris is awesome so far, but back in April would you have taken him with a top-10 pick? No. Reaching for players you want, ahead of their projected draft slot, is how you end up burning day-one picks on Victor Hobson, Anthony Schlegel, and Sione Pouha. If you want them & they're available later in the draft, then take them. If someone else wants to reach for lesser prospects, then let them. SE-in comparison to the 07 draft class how is this one shaping up to be..better? worse? I mean New England had a bunch of picks and right now the only guy left on their roster is Merriweather and all he's doing is playing special teams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 SE-in comparison to the 07 draft class how is this one shaping up to be..better? worse? I mean New England had a bunch of picks and right now the only guy left on their roster is Merriweather and all he's doing is playing special teams 07 draft was weak 06 draft was stacked almost like never before for many positions; there were first-round prospects still available on day two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoFlaJets Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 07 draft was weak 06 draft was stacked almost like never before for many positions; there were first-round prospects still available on day two. how's '08 stacking up at this point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 how's '08 stacking up at this point? First of all, keep in mind that I get a lot of information reading what others have written. But from what I gather, at positions we should be looking at: Certain positions seem pretty deep, like OT. A lot of the RB's seem kind of puny (not a lot of 220 lb backs in there; most seem to be in the 200-205 lb range, which can be tough with today's monster-sized d-linemen). They still have talent, but more often they turn into Brian Calhoun types rather than Clinton Portis or Brian Westbrook types. There are a bunch of big WR's (6'2-6'4) with at least 4.5 speed that you won't need to burn a top-10 pick to get. Of course talent as it translates to the NFL will vary. Look at the 3 gigantic WR's Jacksonville has (all are at least 6'4) & not one of them deserves to start. There should be decent OG depth in the mid-rounds; no need to burn a pick in rounds 1-2. They probably won't have Steve Hutchinson type production, but then Hutchinson was taken 17th in the country. Once again, the candidates for NT in the 3-4 are thin. Even if we stick with the 3-4 (which I'm sure we will) we would still be better off taking a solid one who's probably more suited to the 4-3 like Okam & bulking up at the end position. Certainly would serve us better than our current front-3. There are a couple of guys who physically fit the mold, but it's anyone's guess which (if any) will translate into solid NFL-starters. It's what made passing on Ngata & Watson so inexcusable; truly talented guys with their size are simply a rare, rare breed. At ILB, most of the guys (as usual) are either more-suited to the 4-3, or if they're 3-4 size are Schlegel-like in their speed/quickness. CB seems pretty deep. There are some good DE/OLB 'tweeners, but you never really know which college down-linemen are going to translate well in coverage. Pretty slim at TE's over 250 lbs, but it's not a big hole for us. There are a handful of good blocking FB's as well (with this line we need more than an Askew-sized FB imo). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoFlaJets Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 First of all, keep in mind that I get a lot of information reading what others have written. But from what I gather, at positions we should be looking at: Certain positions seem pretty deep, like OT. A lot of the RB's seem kind of puny (not a lot of 220 lb backs in there; most seem to be in the 200-205 lb range, which can be tough with today's monster-sized d-linemen). They still have talent, but more often they turn into Brian Calhoun types rather than Clinton Portis or Brian Westbrook types. There are a bunch of big WR's (6'2-6'4) with at least 4.5 speed that you won't need to burn a top-10 pick to get. Of course talent as it translates to the NFL will vary. Look at the 3 gigantic WR's Jacksonville has (all are at least 6'4) & not one of them deserves to start. There should be decent OG depth in the mid-rounds; no need to burn a pick in rounds 1-2. They probably won't have Steve Hutchinson type production, but then Hutchinson was taken 17th in the country. Once again, the candidates for NT in the 3-4 are thin. Even if we stick with the 3-4 (which I'm sure we will) we would still be better off taking a solid one who's probably more suited to the 4-3 like Okam & bulking up at the end position. Certainly would serve us better than our current front-3. There are a couple of guys who physically fit the mold, but it's anyone's guess which (if any) will translate into solid NFL-starters. It's what made passing on Ngata & Watson so inexcusable; truly talented guys with their size are simply a rare, rare breed. At ILB, most of the guys (as usual) are either more-suited to the 4-3, or if they're 3-4 size are Schlegel-like in their speed/quickness. CB seems pretty deep. There are some good DE/OLB 'tweeners, but you never really know which college down-linemen are going to translate well in coverage. Pretty slim at TE's over 250 lbs, but it's not a big hole for us. There are a handful of good blocking FB's as well (with this line we need more than an Askew-sized FB imo). excellent post SE-I too get most of my info on prospects from the boards-there are a lot of guys who pay attention to the college game (like Bit R44 Untouchable and I know Jetcane can always tell me about possible Canes) and know what they're talking about. I think we could be OK at RB for another year unless that McFadden kid falls in our lap. FB? why even bother at this point? We never even use them anyway. The good news from your post is the possibility of upgrading our O-line or restocking should be a better term (get rid of Clarke, Clement, A.Jones-those stiffs) and look hard at signing a veteran RT and a LG in free agency. LBer is a position I think we're going to have to roll the dice on in the draft. I have hope that this kid we picked up from NE Kareem Brown could turn into a guy we can use. WR too is gonna have to be addressed and CB-we're looking OK at safety with Rhodes and the emergence of Eric Smith-who I like Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 excellent post SE-I too get most of my info on prospects from the boards-there are a lot of guys who pay attention to the college game (like Bit R44 Untouchable and I know Jetcane can always tell me about possible Canes) and know what they're talking about. I think we could be OK at RB for another year unless that McFadden kid falls in our lap. FB? why even bother at this point? We never even use them anyway. The good news from your post is the possibility of upgrading our O-line or restocking should be a better term (get rid of Clarke, Clement, A.Jones-those stiffs) and look hard at signing a veteran RT and a LG in free agency. LBer is a position I think we're going to have to roll the dice on in the draft. I have hope that this kid we picked up from NE Kareem Brown could turn into a guy we can use. WR too is gonna have to be addressed and CB-we're looking OK at safety with Rhodes and the emergence of Eric Smith-who I like We used to use a FB a little bit, even with Askew. Then Tutt got injured and Barnes was well...Barnes. Kowalewski or whatever his name is & Pociask aren't real FB's either. I think we're past upgrading the whole line in the draft in 1 season. No one wants to endure another season with two rookies on the OL at once. LG and RT should be the most pressing upgrades. We can make arguments about whether Moore or Clement is the bigger liability, but the fact is that Moore is under contract long-term and Clement is not. Upgrade LG through FA if possible. Upgrade RT through this deep OT draft. Draft another guard & hope by next year he's beaten out Moore for the job. If not, go back to work in the draft or FA in '09 for a RG. LB'er I don't know about rolling the dice in the draft. There are some good UFA's this season (Suggs & also a guy from Arizona) who fit the 3-4 (and also one that morphs back & forth from a 3-4 to a 4-3). CB I would like to see addressed in the draft rather than FA b/c they're just an incredible rip-off. To get a top one like Samuel, at this point you may be talking about up to $25M in bonus/guaranteed money. Ridiculous. That money needs to be spent on the OL and front-seven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoFlaJets Posted November 30, 2007 Share Posted November 30, 2007 We used to use a FB a little bit, even with Askew. Then Tutt got injured and Barnes was well...Barnes. Kowalewski or whatever his name is & Pociask aren't real FB's either. I think we're past upgrading the whole line in the draft in 1 season. No one wants to endure another season with two rookies on the OL at once. LG and RT should be the most pressing upgrades. We can make arguments about whether Moore or Clement is the bigger liability, but the fact is that Moore is under contract long-term and Clement is not. Upgrade LG through FA if possible. Upgrade RT through this deep OT draft. Draft another guard & hope by next year he's beaten out Moore for the job. If not, go back to work in the draft or FA in '09 for a RG. LB'er I don't know about rolling the dice in the draft. There are some good UFA's this season (Suggs & also a guy from Arizona) who fit the 3-4 (and also one that morphs back & forth from a 3-4 to a 4-3). CB I would like to see addressed in the draft rather than FA b/c they're just an incredible rip-off. To get a top one like Samuel, at this point you may be talking about up to $25M in bonus/guaranteed money. Ridiculous. That money needs to be spent on the OL and front-seven. agreed about the FA CB's-no position has demanded more money in the off season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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