Zero Sox being named = bogus

[GimmeShelter]

Its amazing how Big (steroid user) Papi head size grew between Minn and Boston isn't it. I guess its just natural your head blows up 3 times its original size...I mean come on aren't all of our heads 3x as big as they were when we were in the 20's? The report is a joke and certainly bias.

It's a sad day for MLB......let's not be childish though.

[Bugg]

There is no evidence at all that David Ortiz took steroids. At all. To continually bring it up and try to make something out of nothing is wrong and ill-advised. Sure his rookie picture looks different. You can say that about just about everybody. It's ridiculous and makes you look incompetent.

Yeah, peopel's hast size double in their 30s. Happens all the time. Sure!

[faba]

Blame the people using the steroids not the messenger.

[CrazyCarl40]

He's on leave, but he went to games with his son over the summer and sat on the bench. BFD. This is a joke; what does on leave even mean if he still going to games and interacting with players and management? Again, I have zero doubt Ortiz used, but really, so what? It's simply an embarrassment that Mitchell used this job to make his own team's players look good and the Yanks' players look bad.

Mo Vaughn is one of the most popular Red Sox in team history. His name is on the list. If you think that Mitchell "protected" his own you are not seeing anything behind your Yankees colored glasses. I am glad you can assume without hesitation that Ortiz used. I wish I had the same super human powers that you have.

[TaborJet]

thats current sox,,are nt several ex sox players named,,indicating they offended while on sox

True.

I guess I won't finger-point. There are players league-wide who were named. Pettitte was a bit of a surprise, but then again he is Clemen's buddy. I hope this dark chapter will end once and for all, and we can go back to the players who hit .299 and hit 23 HRs and call that an All-Star season.

[Alk]

So now the question is, why even try to ban them? As widespread as this is, why not just make them legal? Players get bigger and faster. More home runs and more fans. What harm can come from it? If the players want to wreck their own bodies then let them.

[Mavrik]

a report is issued regarding the use of steroids in ALL of major league baseball and of course you guys have to harken it back to something as petty as a yanks-red sox rivalry. Have you read the report? He's basing all this information off a yanks personal trainer who came forward, the Balco investigation by federal agencies, and a former employee of the Mets who was a steroid distributor. The vast bulk of the players identified were from that Mets employee, as evident with the copies of checks and mail receipts in the report.

The report is thorough. The guy was a U.S. Senator and at one time nearly a supreme court justice I doubt he's going to waste his time trying to hide the Red Sox from any harm. If that was the case, Selig wouldn't have asked him to do it.

[CrazyCarl40]

The problem I have is that so many people here are trying to bring up a topic that is much baseless as it is useless. The problem of steroids in baseball has always been taboo. Now that it is out in the open, people want to try and justify something that they just cannot. Baseball, as well as all of us, have to move on and start doing something proactive and try and come to some sort of decisions that can try and rectify past wrongs. In effect, we need to do exactly as Mitchell said and try to alleviate the problem quickly and without hesitation. I applaud Mitchell and his team and hope that good comes from this.

[CrazyCarl40]

Brendan Donnelly and Eric Gagne were both known to be steroid users when the Sox signed them. This is in the report. Theo Epstein is known to have inquired about both of their histories and known they were users. This does not bode well for the Sox management either. So it's not just players that we have to be focusing on.

[Mavrik]

The problem I have is that so many people here are trying to bring up a topic that is much baseless as it is useless. The problem of steroids in baseball has always been taboo. Now that it is out in the open, people want to try and justify something that they just cannot. Baseball, as well as all of us, have to move on and start doing something proactive and try and come to some sort of decisions that can try and rectify past wrongs. In effect, we need to do exactly as Mitchell said and try to alleviate the problem quickly and without hesitation. I applaud Mitchell and his team and hope that good comes from this.

Good post

[faba]

Mitchell is well respected nationally and internationally- as evidenced by his career and things he has been involved in- get the facts straight on him-blame the players not the messenger.

[AVM]

How can people continually say no Red Sox players are on the list, then in the very next post, Varitek(the captain) is on the list?

You cant really have it both ways--either Varitek is on the list, and is a cheater(meaning the report is UNBIASED, he's the captain for crying out loud)....or...

Varitek is completely clean, and then you can attempt to say its biased.

You really cant do both.

[CrazyCarl40]

How can people continually say no Red Sox players are on the list, then in the very next post, Varitek(the captain) is on the list?

You cant really have it both ways--either Varitek is on the list, and is a cheater(meaning the report is UNBIASED, he's the captain for crying out loud)....or...

Varitek is completely clean, and then you can attempt to say its biased.

You really cant do both.

Tek was on a rumored list. He is not on the official list.

[Mavrik]

So now the question is, why even try to ban them? As widespread as this is, why not just make them legal? Players get bigger and faster. More home runs and more fans. What harm can come from it? If the players want to wreck their own bodies then let them.

I could care less whether a player destroys their body or not, the only problem I've ever had with taking roids is the fact that...it is hard enough to make it to the bigs to begin with..when guys who are trying to make it the clean way have to compete with guys who are juicing and getting an inherent advantage it is unfair. It also places immense pressure on these guys to start juicing and they think they have to do it to succeed. It puts even more pressure on high school players to start using. It wasn't that long ago I played high school ball and for those guys I knew who were looking to get drafted, don't think the idea didn't cross their mind.

[Maxman]

I am not going to read everything in this thread.

But Mitchell is as honorable as they come. If he had information about a Red Sox player, it would have been in the report.

He dealt with those that cooperated. A lot of it was NY based, that is the way it works. This list is a group of people that they can prove did steroids. There are many others that were not named.

The fallout should be interesting. But anyway you slice it this is a good second step to fixing the sport so many of us love. The first step was a few years ago when the union gave in a bit and they actually started doing some testing.

[Mavrik]

He's on leave, but he went to games with his son over the summer and sat on the bench. BFD. This is a joke; what does on leave even mean if he still going to games and interacting with players and management? Again, I have zero doubt Ortiz used, but really, so what? It's simply an embarrassment that Mitchell used this job to make his own team's players look good and the Yanks' players look bad.

Do you think 9/11 was an inside job also? Because this conspiracy theory is a joke.

Maybe Kennedy was killed by space aliens.

[Matt39]

But the likelyhood of someone who worked for the Red Sox putting together the report which in turn compromises the reports integrity is totally out of the realm of possibility right?

Please.

[SouthernJet]

But the likelyhood of someone who worked for the Red Sox putting together the report which in turn compromises the reports integrity is totally out of the realm of possibility right?

Please.

matt,,calm down..

[Matt39]

matt,,calm down..

Perfectly calm

[Mavrik]

Rondell White

Gregg Zaun

Kevin Brown

Matt Herges

Fernando Vina

Miguel Tejada

Glenallan Hill

Jerry Hairston

Jason Grimsley

Howie Clark

Larry Bigbie

David Belle

John Rocker

Darren Holmes

Ismael Valdez

Matt Williams

Steve Woodard (formerly with Sox)

Manny Alexander (formerly with Sox)

Mike Spinelli

Paxton Crawford (formerly with Sox)

Jeremy Giambi (formerly with Sox)

BRIAN ROBERTS

Lenny Dykstra

Jack Cust

Tim Laker

Josiaz Manzanillo

Todd Hundley

Hal Morris

Matt Franco

Andy Pettitte

Roger Clemens (formerly with Sox)

Chuck Knoblaugch

David Justice

Mo Vaughn (Formerly with Sox)

Ron Villone

Ryan Franklin

Todd Williams

Phil Hiatt

Todd Pratt

Mike Lansing

Kent Mercker (formerly with Sox)

Adam Piatt

Mike Stanton (formerly with Sox)

Eric Gagne (Formerly with Sox)

Brendan Donnelly (current Red Sox player)

Wow..yeah...no Sox players on that report at all.

[124]

I thought Nixon and Varitek were on this list? Oh yeah, Varitek is too big of a Sox player to be named.

Mav, it doesn't matter if they're formerly of the Red Sox, its current day players on the Sox that arn't included in this list thanks to Mitchell.

Where's Pujols on your list Mav? Bonds?

[Matt39]

I thought Nixon and Varitek were on this list? Oh yeah, Varitek is too big of a Sox player to be named.

Mav, it doesn't matter if they're formerly of the Red Sox, its current day players on the Sox that arn't included in this list thanks to Mitchell.

To say his role in the Sox organization isnt a conflict of interest is completely naive.

[Mavrik]

I thought Nixon and Varitek were on this list? Oh yeah, Varitek is too big of a Sox player to be named.

Mav, it doesn't matter if they're formerly of the Red Sox, its current day players on the Sox that arn't included in this list thanks to Mitchell.

You do realize what the majority of the Mitchell Report is based off of right? 3 testimonies. A distributor who worked for the Mets (which comprises the bulk of the players on the report) Balco. And a Yankees trainer. Why? Because no one else would cooperate with him on the investigation, save for Giambi and an unidentified player. You can only collect so much information as your given. Mitchell does not have the power of subpoena so players don't have to be forced to speak with him. There are I'm sure plenty of big name players who have tested positive. The one thing that the report is good at is providing evidence that the player took roids. He can't make an accusation in an independent report without having the evidence to justify it. Do I think they were big name players on the Sox that could have taken roids? Sure it's possible. But I'm not going to make some assumption that this is some vast JFK-like conspiracy to screw the Yankees. That's ridiculous.

[Barton]

He's on their board of directors. he owns stock in them. He went to games with his young son all summer, sitting in the dugout, getting autographs and sounvenirs on the arm. This is a complete joke. It's like putting Carlos Escobar's brother-in-law in the DEA. And Mitchell is a pompous blowhard. This is a joke.

Agreed. How a man with a vested interest in a specific team can conduct this entire operation is ridiculous.

Total crock. He WORKS for the red sox for Christ sake. How more obvious can it get????

[Arsis]

Maybe ortiz and manny aren't juicers? I think that it's possible they could still be juicers but if they aren't they aren't not that big of a deal. I think this report is an embarassment for the league as a whole. And really? who from the yankess has been named that we didn't already knew was a roid-head? JASON GIAMBI TOOK ROIDS!? NO WAY!!! NOT ROGER HE COULDN't HAVE! You knew pettite was juicing ever since he became roger's gay lover. The only question I have is if he started roiding before or after all those world series wins and my guess would be after.

[AVM]

You do realize what the majority of the Mitchell Report is based off of right? 3 testimonies. A distributor who worked for the Mets (which comprises the bulk of the players on the report) Balco. And a Yankees trainer. Why? Because no one else would cooperate with him on the investigation, save for Giambi and an unidentified player. You can only collect so much information as your given. Mitchell does not have the power of subpoena so players don't have to be forced to speak with him. There are I'm sure plenty of big name players who have tested positive. The one thing that the report is good at is providing evidence that the player took roids. He can't make an accusation in an independent report without having the evidence to justify it. Do I think they were big name players on the Sox that could have taken roids? Sure it's possible. But I'm not going to make some assumption that this is some vast JFK-like conspiracy to screw the Yankees. That's ridiculous.

Good post. There are plenty of players not on this list who are questionable. Maybe Ortiz did, maybe he didnt--but as you said, you cant just throw "so and so did steroids" out there without proof--its no different from the media doing it.

[Barton]

But the likelyhood of someone who worked for the Red Sox putting together the report which in turn compromises the reports integrity is totally out of the realm of possibility right?

Please.

And we all know US Senators are squeaky clean too. This whole report is a load of sheet.

[Bugg]

And we all know US Senators are squeaky clean too. This whole report is a load of sheet.

Ted Kennedy, Bob Packwood, Larry "Wide Stance" Craig, Al Damato. Yeah, being a senator automatically means you're a wonderful person. Sure.

Better they just say what ever happened before this is over. Anyone who fails a test now is in trouble. This report and RSN Member Mitchell are a joke. And I hope one of these guys who is falsely accused in this report sues the balls off MLB and Mitchell.

[AVM]

Brendan Donnelly and Eric Gagne were both known to be steroid users when the Sox signed them. This is in the report. Theo Epstein is known to have inquired about both of their histories and known they were users. This does not bode well for the Sox management either. So it's not just players that we have to be focusing on.

Great post. Just heard on ESPN about the scouting report in which Donnelly was referred to by a Red Sox scout as a "former juice guy". Doesnt look good for much of anyone in baseball right now, honestly.

Tek was on a rumored list. He is not on the official list.

Thanks, I was really confused. On another note--I got to meet Trot Nixon when he was down in my hometown a few years ago(he got inducted into the NC-baseball HOF there). Nixon seems like one of the nicest guys, and was really saddened when I saw his name thrown around. Hopefully it was a completely off-base rumor, but who knows honestly. I kind of doubt names are just "thrown around" with this--more likely theres no actual proof than anything else.

[Mavrik]

Ted Kennedy, Bob Packwood, Larry "Wide Stance" Craig, Al Damato. Yeah, being a senator automatically means you're a wonderful person. Sure.

Better they just say what ever happened before this is over. Anyone who fails a test now is in trouble. This report and RSN Member Mitchell are a joke. And I hope one of these guys who is falsely accused in this report sues the balls off MLB and Mitchell.

There was substantial evidence provided along with every player he listed in the report.

[AVM]

Ted Kennedy, Bob Packwood, Larry "Wide Stance" Craig, Al Damato. Yeah, being a senator automatically means you're a wonderful person. Sure.

Better they just say what ever happened before this is over. Anyone who fails a test now is in trouble. This report and RSN Member Mitchell are a joke. And I hope one of these guys who is falsely accused in this report sues the balls off MLB and Mitchell.

I havent read the whole thing...but seeing as theres a ton of pages, and quite a bit of evidence for each person(which is why some names were left off--no evidence)--good luck with that faslely accused thing.

Also good luck with the bitterness thing. Geez dude, stop getting mad because a couple of big time Yanks are cheaters. News flash--so are a ton of other players and EVERY TEAM IN BASEBALL.

[Barton]

Can you say "bullsh#t" ??

I can!

[Bugg]

There was substantial evidence provided along with every player he listed in the report.

"Susbstantial evidence"-Brian Macnamee,Radomski, and two players, including Giambi being forced to do so, and some unnamed player. So 1 guys who worked for the Jays and Yankees, 1 for the Mets. Susbtantial indeed.

Note-remarkably Mark Mcgwire isn't named.

Giambi was the only known active player forced to talk to Mitchell by Selig. Macnamee and Radomski were both facing jail sentences and looking to name names to avoid it. So Mitchell either didn't get cooperation from the team he's a board member of, or didn't bother to demand anyone else talk to him, and Sleig didn't threatn anyone other than Giambi. Why did they even bother, other than to embarrass some players? And notably many with ties to the Yankees and few with ties to the Red Sox.

[SouthernJet]

"Susbstantial evidence"-Brian Macnamee,Radomski, and two players, including Giambi being forced to do so, and some unnamed player. So 1 guys who worked for the Jays and Yankees, 1 for the Mets. Susbtantial indeed.

Note-remarkably Mark Mcgwire isn't named.

Giambi was the only known active player forced to talk to Mitchell by Selig. Macnamee and Radomski were both facing jail sentences and looking to name names to avoid it. So Mitchell either didn't get cooperation from the team he's a board member of, or didn't bother to demand anyone else talk to him, and Sleig didn't threatn anyone other than Giambi. Why did they even bother, other than to embarrass some players? And notably many with ties to the Yankees and few with ties to the Red Sox.

damn,, u r right,,the more i read this the worse the yankee organization looks,,damn, borderline criminal

[GimmeShelter]

Some of you Yankee fans are unbelievable.