Mets will win the WORLD SERIES in 2008!!!

[SouthernJet]

Good lord man!

ya , i am so hoping blackin was being sarcastic,,if not, i am afraid for him when he goes out in public

[Blackout]

i was serious

[SouthernJet]

[quote name='Blackout

[GimmeShelter]

we sucked for a good portion of last year.

we traded away a young outfielder for an older outfielder.

we let Loduca walk and replaced him with a worse hitting catcher and near equal on defense (in that outfielder trade)

we added Santana (15 wins), but lost Glavine (13 wins).

Did this team really make any acquisitions that were amazing? No.

The only hope for the Mets is Alou plays more than 100 games, Delgado plays like he should, relievers dont get overworked, Reyes doesnt disappear, starters dont get hurt.

Too many things have to happen for them to even have a chance to win the division. And with Randolph as manager, that costs us a win or 2 every year.

-Church will have a better year than Milledge. IMO , much better.

-Santana-Glavine is not worth debating.

-Duaner Sanchez healthy will be a big addition to the pen....would you prefer we had signed Latroy Hawkins?

-Delgado and Reyes will both likely be better than last year.

- David Wright continues his enormous growth as NY's best player not named ARod.

- Maine and Perez have another season under their belts. Our 1-5 SP's are arguably the best in baseball.

-Schneider is a better defensive catcher than LoDuca.

-Pedro is reportedly healthier than he has been in years.

Yes, I think we improved big time and should be fine in what will be a very tough 3 team race.

Also: Why do Yankee fans insist on posting as if Johan has not already pissed all over the big bad AL?

[Zeebers]

we sucked for a good portion of last year.

we added Santana (15 wins), but lost Glavine (13 wins).

Did this team really make any acquisitions that were amazing? No.

Did you just really compare Santana to Glavine???

[faba]

To compare Santana's 15 wins to Glavine's 13 wins is justification enough to ignore.

[BP]

-Delgado and Reyes will both likely be better than last year.

That remains to be seen. Reyes is lazy and has become complacent.

- Maine and Perez have another season under their belts. Our 1-5 SP's are arguably the best in baseball.

-Pedro is reportedly healthier than he has been in years.

I wouldn't expect too much from him. he was lucky to get his fastball up around 90mph before he was unhealthy, so I doubt he will be throwing that hard regardless.

Yes, I think we improved big time and should be fine in what will be a very tough 3 team race.

You're relying heavily on two injury prone pitchers to be your main work horses. I'll believe it when I see it.

Also: Why do Yankee fans insist on posting as if Johan has not already pissed all over the big bad AL?

He had ONE great year, that's it. why do all Mets fan insist on acting like you picked up Sandy Koufax?

Disclaimer: you know I love you Gimmieshelter

[Irish Jet]

[quote name='Blackout

[Blackout]

can you repost the link???

[Lil Bit Special]

no i wasnt comparing Glavine to Santana. But we did lose a 13 game winner last year and gained a 15 game winner. Its not as if we lost a 5th starter, we lost our #2 from last year.

[Blackout]

no i wasnt comparing Glavine to Santana. But we did lose a 13 game winner last year and gained a 15 game winner. Its not as if we lost a 5th starter, we lost our #2 from last year.

you lost a crappy #2 and replaced him with THE BEST pitcher in baseball.

major upgrade.

[Lil Bit Special]

[quote name='Blackout

[Blackout]

glavine is washed up and old he won 13 games with a good offense behind him

[Lil Bit Special]

[quote name='Blackout

[LiLMiCKMANTLE]

Johan could win 30 in that minor league, if the Mets score any runs for him.

EXACTLY!!! YOU CANT WIN GAMES IF YOU DONT SCORE RUN!! LOOK OUT FOR THE DODGERS THIS YEAR THEY DO HAVE ONE OF THE BEST MANAGERS IN BASEBALL NOW OF DAYS!!

[Scott Dierking]

well, in his 13 wins he never allowed more than 3 runs in the game.

Problem is, he allowed 4 or more runs in 10 games, including his last 3 starts (only 5 times did he receive the loss.

Comparison to O. Perez- He allowed more than 3 runs once in his 15 victories. He allowed 4 or more runs 7 times, receiving the loss in 5 of those games.

So, Perez is better than Glavine, but not by much.

If Glavine pitched well, the team usually won (6 times the mets lost when Glavine allowed 2 or fewer runs. Mets won 11 times when Glavine allowed 2 or less runs)

I think you are missing the biggest differnce between Glavine and Santana- The number of innings that Sanatana will be able to give, compared to Glavine. Prior to last year(when he pitched 219 innings), Santana gave back to back 230+ innings years. And that was in the AL with having to deal with a DH.

Those innings will be huge for a Met bullpen that had to buckle under the weight of relieving short outings because of an old Glavine nibbling the corner with high pitch counts, a rehabbing Pedro coming back in August with limits, an El Duque who can no longer go deep, and a Perez who can have bouts of wildness.

That wears a bullpen down quickly, and it did in September with the Mets.

Having a pitcher like Santana, who you KNOW will give you 7 minimum and sometimes 8 and an occasional complete game every 5 days is HUGE.

And Tom Glavine had ZERO ability to do just that.

That is teh biigest thing the Mets get.

[Lil Bit Special]

I think you are missing the biggest differnce between Glavine and Santana- The number of innings that Sanatana will be able to give, compared to Glavine. Prior to last year(when he pitched 219 innings), Santana gave back to back 230+ innings years. And that was in the AL with having to deal with a DH.

Those innings will be huge for a Met bullpen that had to buckle under the weight of relieving short outings because of an old Glavine nibbling the corner with high pitch counts, a rehabbing Pedro coming back in August with limits, an El Duque who can no longer go deep, and a Perez who can have bouts of wildness.

That wears a bullpen down quickly, and it did in September with the Mets.

Having a pitcher like Santana, who you KNOW will give you 7 minimum and sometimes 8 and an occasional complete game every 5 days is HUGE.

And Tom Glavine had ZERO ability to do just that.

That is teh biigest thing the Mets get.

Im not saying that Santana isnt an upgrade. All Im saying is the impact will not be as great as everyone is expecting since he is replacing a starter who was somewhat successful last year.

And yes, Santana will give us an average of 1 extra inning than Glavine. But still having 3 other pitchers who dont go deep into games not much is going to change with the bullpen. Santana only went past 7 ip in 5 games last year (with only once going 9ip), so the bullpen will still be relied upon.

If you think Santana is going to have a tremendous impact on the Mets, I respect your opinion. I just disagree on the impact he will have. He isnt replacing a scrub.

And I hope you're right and Im wrong.

[GimmeShelter]

A "crappy" #2 who won 13 games. Only 36 pitchers had more than 13 wins last year.

if we had a staff that all won over 10 games I would agree. But we dont. We have 3 pitchers plus Pedro and El Duckie. I'd rather have Glavine than El Duque. And who knows what Pedro is going to give us.

Yes Im happy Glavine choke is gone. Dont get me wrong. with santana on this team last year they still miss the playoffs.

You realize we have 3 of them in Johan, Maine and Perez. Pedro if healthy will win 13-15 and we'll get 10 or so from Duke/Pelfrey. Duke when healthy was much better than Glavine last season.

This is a very good staff barring injury.

[Arsis]

Is this Bizarro world?

[Lil Bit Special]

You realize we have 3 of them in Johan, Maine and Perez. Pedro if healthy will win 13-15 and we'll get 10 or so from Duke/Pelfrey. Duke when healthy was much better than Glavine last season.

This is a very good staff barring injury.

Pedro wont get 15 wins. We'll be lucky if he makes it through the season healthy.

Duke/ Pelfrey- I can see 10 wins. 5th starter should get about 10 wins. So Im ok with that. But El Duque was not MUCH better than Glavine last year. He was very inconsistent. And he is very injury prone. He is not reliable at all.

The top 3 are very good, as long as Ollie doesnt self destruct. But Pedro and El Duque are huge question marks.

As I've said earlier this offseason, this Mets team is relying on hope and prayers that every one stay healthy and plays as well as we expect. And hope and prayers dont win ball games.

And just a question for everyone, are you hating on Glavine based on performance or because you are bitter? I cant believe everyone believes that Glavine is such a lousy pitcher. And the stats dont back it up.

[Lil Bit Special]

Is this Bizarro world?

depends. If you dont know how to read or understand the original point I made, then yes. If you think I am comparing Glavine vs. Santana, then yes. You'd also be an idiot.

Again, as stated a few times. My point is the acquistion of Santana is not as huge as everyone makes it out to be since the player he is replacing was a decent player.

If he replaced a lousy 5th starter, his acquistion would have a greater impact.

Thats all. If you disagree. Fine. I just hope Im wrong and Santana wins 20+ games, Pedro, Maine, Perez all win 15+ and El Duque/ Pelfrey win 10+. But I just dont see it happening.

Sorry if Im pissing in all the Mets fans optimism for this season. I just cant get excited for a team that collapsed last year and only made one significant acqusition this offseason.

[Arsis]

depends. If you dont know how to read or understand the original point I made, then yes. If you think I am comparing Glavine vs. Santana, then yes. You'd also be an idiot.

Again, as stated a few times. My point is the acquistion of Santana is not as huge as everyone makes it out to be since the player he is replacing was a decent player.

If he replaced a lousy 5th starter, his acquistion would have a greater impact.

Thats all. If you disagree. Fine. I just hope Im wrong and Santana wins 20+ games, Pedro, Maine, Perez all win 15+ and El Duque/ Pelfrey win 10+. But I just dont see it happening.

Sorry if Im pissing in all the Mets fans optimism for this season. I just cant get excited for a team that collapsed last year and only made one significant acqusition this offseason.

I have no idea who you are and what the **** you're talking about, man are you paranoid. I was talking about the idea that people think the Mets are going to win the world series. The Mets will win the World series in 08, in Bizarro world.

[Lil Bit Special]

I have no idea who you are and what the **** you're talking about, man are you paranoid. I was talking about the idea that people think the Mets are going to win the world series. The Mets will win the World series in 08, in Bizarro world.

ok, then yes, you are in bizarro world.

[Zeebers]

It's Bizzaro to believe that this Mets team have not improved a great deal over last year's disaster.

I'm not even going to discuss Glavine vs. Santana, the difference is night and day.

Perez and Maine, they're both relatively young guys, and "should" get better, but I'll be fine with them repeating last year's performance, and I don't see why not.

Pedro, I think is the biggest question mark. Is he going to give us 20 starts or 30 starts? If it's closer to 30 than we're looking at a minimum of a +8 wins from Pedro.

El Duque, I'm sick of him, but the combination of Pelfrey and El Duque should produce 10-12 wins.

Looking at that it's hard for any other team in the NL to match that staff.

The bullpen is going to be crucial and I think Matt Wise and Duaner Sanchez will make a big difference, especially if they don't get worn out like they did last year.

Offensively, I expect the team to perform to at least last year's standards which wasn't great but was far from terrible. I happen to believe Delgado still has something left in the tank and look for a bounce back year. David Wright is an all-star for the next 10 years. Reyes, as much as he struggled last year, is still only 24 and has the skills to win an MVP. He's going to get better, hopefully the Mets don't fool around with him too much and take his enthusiasm away. Beltran's been a lot more vocal this year which I think Met fans will love, and he's probably the best overall CF in the league. Ryan Church if you look at his body of work is actually a pretty good hitter, obviously he has to prove he can hit lefties but, he's a solid if unspectacular. I loved watching LoDuca like most Met fans did and he's a better overall hitter than Schneider but lets face it Loduca wasn't very good last year offensively. From all accounts Schneider is a great catcher and he should be able to help the staff.

All in all I don't see how this is not a major improvement over last year's team. To me anything other than a world series appearance would be a disappointment.

[rillo]

Way to jinx it.....

[Arsis]

It's Bizzaro to believe that this Mets team have not improved a great deal over last year's disaster.

I'm not even going to discuss Glavine vs. Santana, the difference is night and day.

Perez and Maine, they're both relatively young guys, and "should" get better, but I'll be fine with them repeating last year's performance, and I don't see why not.

Pedro, I think is the biggest question mark. Is he going to give us 20 starts or 30 starts? If it's closer to 30 than we're looking at a minimum of a +8 wins from Pedro.

El Duque, I'm sick of him, but the combination of Pelfrey and El Duque should produce 10-12 wins.

Looking at that it's hard for any other team in the NL to match that staff.

The bullpen is going to be crucial and I think Matt Wise and Duaner Sanchez will make a big difference, especially if they don't get worn out like they did last year.

Offensively, I expect the team to perform to at least last year's standards which wasn't great but was far from terrible. I happen to believe Delgado still has something left in the tank and look for a bounce back year. David Wright is an all-star for the next 10 years. Reyes, as much as he struggled last year, is still only 24 and has the skills to win an MVP. He's going to get better, hopefully the Mets don't fool around with him too much and take his enthusiasm away. Beltran's been a lot more vocal this year which I think Met fans will love, and he's probably the best overall CF in the league. Ryan Church if you look at his body of work is actually a pretty good hitter, obviously he has to prove he can hit lefties but, he's a solid if unspectacular. I loved watching LoDuca like most Met fans did and he's a better overall hitter than Schneider but lets face it Loduca wasn't very good last year offensively. From all accounts Schneider is a great catcher and he should be able to help the staff.

All in all I don't see how this is not a major improvement over last year's team. To me anything other than a world series appearance would be a disappointment.

Last years team didn't even make the playoff's. I think El Duque gets hurt and Pedro starts at most ten games.

[Zeebers]

Last years team didn't even make the playoff's. I think El Duque gets hurt and Pedro starts at most ten games.

It's true, even though they really sucked last year. They missed the playoffs by one game. All I'm saying is that this is a better team than last year, significantly better in my opinion.

[Blackout]

It's true, even though they really sucked last year. They missed the playoffs by one game. All I'm saying is that this is a better team than last year, significantly better in my opinion.

they got better pitching wise

[GimmeShelter]

Pedro wont get 15 wins. We'll be lucky if he makes it through the season healthy.

Duke/ Pelfrey- I can see 10 wins. 5th starter should get about 10 wins. So Im ok with that. But El Duque was not MUCH better than Glavine last year. He was very inconsistent. And he is very injury prone. He is not reliable at all.

The top 3 are very good, as long as Ollie doesnt self destruct. But Pedro and El Duque are huge question marks.

As I've said earlier this offseason, this Mets team is relying on hope and prayers that every one stay healthy and plays as well as we expect. And hope and prayers dont win ball games.

And just a question for everyone, are you hating on Glavine based on performance or because you are bitter? I cant believe everyone believes that Glavine is such a lousy pitcher. And the stats dont back it up.

Duke was much better than Glavine. In fact there were stretches where Duke was the best SP on the team. Glavine had a 4.44 ERA and a 1.4 WHIP.....if he wasn't on a good team he would have been lucky to be a .500 pitcher. Great pitcher in his day but now just doing what's best for Tom.

BTW, show me one rotation in baseball that doesn't need it's SP's to be healthy to win.

Mets are no different than anyone else in that area.

[Lil Bit Special]

we sucked for a good portion of last year.

we traded away a young outfielder for an older outfielder.

we let Loduca walk and replaced him with a worse hitting catcher and near equal on defense (in that outfielder trade)

we added Santana (15 wins), but lost Glavine (13 wins).

Did this team really make any acquisitions that were amazing? No.

The only hope for the Mets is Alou plays more than 100 games, Delgado plays like he should, relievers dont get overworked, Reyes doesnt disappear, starters dont get hurt.

Too many things have to happen for them to even have a chance to win the division. And with Randolph as manager, that costs us a win or 2 every year.

Ok, so I was wrong about LoDuca/ Schneider. Loduca has barely played due to injury. Schneider still is a mediocre hitter, right at his recent career numbers. But as a catcher, he has good CS %, but the pitching staff hasnt improved under him. Johan is great, but where are the others.... Still, schneider is the better player.

Santana has been pitching great, but getting no support from either his offense or relievers. 7 wins in 14 games, and really hasnt had a bad start all year. If he continues to pitch well, he can still reach the 20 win mark. But 17 will probably be more likely. So its nice we added Santana, and he and John Maine have kept us somewhat close, but they need help.

The only hope for the Mets is Alou plays more than 100 games, Delgado plays like he should, relievers dont get overworked, Reyes doesnt disappear, starters dont get hurt.

Too many things have to happen for them to even have a chance to win the division. And with Randolph as manager, that costs us a win or 2 every year.

Well, Alou wont play 100 games,

Delgado sucks,

relievers havent been overworked (13th in MLB in Reliever IP, but 23rd in ERA, and 6th in most runs allowed)

reyes: hitting fairly well, but far from the great player we need him to be. hitting .240 with runners in scoring position.

starters hurt this year: Schneider, Castillo, Alou, Church, Pedro. am I missing anyone?

As I had said, too many good things had to happen, and almost no good things happened. If it werent for Santana, we would be at the bottom of the league.

[Lil Bit Special]

No they wont. They wont even make the playoffs.

And this is coming from a Mets fan.

Woof.

one prediction of mine that came true...

[Lil Bit Special]

Does everyone else love the bravado coming from Carlos Beltran? I think he's finally comfortable in New York. I'd love to see him take on more of a leadership role on this team. He's had one bad year and 2 good years. I'm looking for a big year from Beltran now that the nagging injuries are behind him hopefully.

Glad Beltran stayed healthy all year... 161 games played. stats were almost even to last year when he played 144 games... but not enough...

[Lil Bit Special]

If the Mets don't make the playoffs this year it will equal last year's disaster X10.

Do you still agree Peter????

[Lil Bit Special]

1.we sucked for a good portion of last year.

2.we traded away a young outfielder for an older outfielder.

3.we let Loduca walk and replaced him with a worse hitting catcher and near equal on defense (in that outfielder trade)

4.we added Santana (15 wins), but lost Glavine (13 wins).

5.Did this team really make any acquisitions that were amazing? No.

6.The only hope for the Mets is Alou plays more than 100 games, Delgado plays like he should, relievers dont get overworked, Reyes doesnt disappear, starters dont get hurt.

7.Too many things have to happen for them to even have a chance to win the division. And with Randolph as manager, that costs us a win or 2 every year.

1. and we sucked for a good portion this year

2. milledge- .268, 14hr 61 rbis in 523ab's.... church- .276, 12hr, 49 rbis... in 319 AB's. ok... so I was wrong on this one...

3. Schneider was decent enough... hitting was around what was expected, his CS % was what we expected, but the effect on the pitching staff never materialized... but still better than LoDuca or Torrealba or Estrada. whoops... wrong again.

4. Santana- 16-7 2.53 era. and his bullpen blew plenty more chances for him.

5. Outside of Santana, church and schneider were ok, Tatis was ok...

6. Alou didnt play 100 games... in fact he played in 15. Delgado finally woke up and played up to his potential. Relievers were overworked and sucked ass. Reyes had a lousy april and september, but was good the rest of the way. Starters did get hurt and our backup plans didnt work out.

7. not enough things did happen to give them a chance. the phillies tried their best to blow it but we just couldnt get it together... and that 1 or 2 wins willie cost us kept us from winning the division...

[Lil Bit Special]

Last years team didn't even make the playoff's. I think El Duque gets hurt and Pedro starts at most ten games.

HA! Pedro started 20 games.