Pennington to the Pro Bowl

[HardKoreXXX]

Let's not forget who the GM is in Minny... It's not too unrealistic to assume that Spielman thinks he can win with Jackson.

HAHA I almost forgot about Spielman. No way Jackson wins that game last night btw.

[Sperm Edwards]

So now Pennington, with no running game, would do a better job in Arizona than Warner?

As in Chad Pennington would be a better gunslinger to Fitz & Boldin than Kurt Warner?

Kurt Warner, who has the most TD passes in the NFL (31) in the 13 games since the 2nd half of last year, with a has-been at RB and a defense that's given up like 25 ppg over that span?

Chad Pennington would be gun-slinging the ball all over the place, putting up almost 400 points in 13 games, better than Warner has done in Arizona?

I wish I still had a child's imagination.

Oh wait, I forgot. Pennington only needs the following:

- tons of time in the pocket

- dominant running game

- defense that holds everyone to under 15 points

...and then he's an excellent QB, as evidenced by the all-important QB rating statistic that also ranks Daunte Culpepper as the 8th-best in NFL history & David Garrard slightly ahead of Dan Marino.

Holy Christ.

[Vudu]

Chad P is on PTI right now!

[villain_the_foe]

They got the best out of him alright... line him out as wide as possible and snap it to the RB... keeping the ball totally out of his hands.

Well, he's on the field isnt he? They seem to be utilizing him better than we ever did. besides, its not like hes not throwing the ball at all. He's still setting up field position for the team. Im not saying that we're in a worse position, Im just saying that maybe Penny's in a position to win.

[Smizzy]

Allow me to speak my mind....

**** Chad Pennington & that scrub team he plays for.

End of discussion.

[ZachEY]

Russell is going to be a beast

Think Big Ben

Yeah, Big Ben without accuracy, smarts, or ability to hold onto the football when hit.

[kelticwizard]

Kurt Warner, who has the most TD passes in the NFL (31) in the 13 games since the 2nd half of last year, with a has-been at RB and a defense that's given up like 25 ppg over that span?

Chad Pennington would be gun-slinging the ball all over the place, putting up almost 400 points in 13 games, better than Warner has done in Arizona?

I wish I still had a child's imagination.

Warner has won the starting job for almost 3 years now. ...Warner is, has been, and will always be better than Chad. Warner has a legit case to make the HOF.

I am incredulous. Are you gentlemen even remotely aware that Kurt Warner has not been a starting QB in any real sense of the word since 2001?

Look, you can't string together some loose amalgam of half-seasons and one third seasons, toss in a three-quarter season, and call it a starting career. Even if a few good performances are sprinkled in along the way.

Kurt Warner has had 10 NFL seasons before this one. Here they are, along with the number of games started in each season.

Games Started Per Season

2007: 11

2006: 5

2005: 10

2004: 9

2003: 1

2002: 6

2001: 16

2000: 11

1999: 16

1998: 0

I don't care if hed a short period of glory-does THAT look like a starting career to you? And you guys are talking Hall of Fame?

Chad might have been injured a lot, but while he was injured everyone knew he was No. 1 and would start as soon as he was healthy enough to play. He only got sat down in late 2007 because the season was lost and the coach wanted to see the young guy play-nobody ever announced the change was permanent. The only guy Chad ever lost his job to-once-was Brett Favre. And that's no shame.

Warner lost his job in 2002. He went to the Giants in 2004 and lost his job there. He went to Arizona in 2005 and lost his job to Josh McCown before reclaiming it. Then he lost his job to Leinart before reclaiming it. He's a well-travelled journeyman who had a few great years, well in the past.

[serphnx]

lol, this is hilarious. The guy claiming Warner isn't a starting QB because he hasn't played full seasons is promoting Chad Pennington. He of the 1 full season of play in his entire career.

The only reason Chad Pennington had a starting job for so long is because of how dumb Bradway and Herm are. A real NFL franchise would have drafted a QB high and as soon as Chad got injured again, he would no longer have that starting job. Instead, we wasted 6 years, until someone finally decided they'd trade for a damn real QB since they didn't have the balls to draft one. If we drafted Eli Manning, Chad would have lost his job. If we had drafted Cutler, Chad would have lost his job. If Martz was our coach, and we had Bulger or freaking JT O'Sullivan or some other random player, Chad would not have a job. But we did none of those things, because we had ****ty FO and CS.

Warner has 2 MVPs, won an SB and went to another one, and puts up insane numbers even though he's an old man and teams want to move on and hand the job to some kid. Leinart was too stupid to take the job, or else he'd have it. They wanted to hand it to him after all. And then maybe Warner could have gone to the Vikings or something. Hell, if Warner was on the Jets all those years, Chad doesn't have a job here either. Then again, as I said before, the CS were idiots.

Chad probably loses his job by the mid-point of this year, if they really think Henne is their QB of the future. It's sad that even the Dolphins are run better than the Jets have been for the past 6 years, but now that Tangini finally woke up and had enough, we're free of him.

[Sperm Edwards]

I never said Warner is a HOF QB. I'm saying he's better than Chad Pennington. I'm not even going to touch the idea that Chad might be better than him because of all of the complete seasons he's had. Apparently being on IR still counts as starting football games due to intent of his then HC. That HC who is now considered by more than just me to be the worst HC in football, and this is after he's had more than a couple of seasons of experience under his belt. The HC who seems to be doing a real bang-up job with his QB's in Kansas City the past 3 seasons. Even when he gets lucky (Huard in 2006) he still manages to screw that up by benching his hot hand. This clown would have benched Tom Brady in 2001. And because HE thought Pennington was worthy of starting for all those years, that makes it a good decision?

lol

[kelticwizard]

A real NFL franchise would have drafted a QB high and as soon as Chad got injured again, he would no longer have that starting job.....

......If we drafted Eli Manning, Chad would have lost his job....

.....If we had drafted Cutler, Chad would have lost his job.....

.....If Martz was our coach, and we had Bulger or freaking JT O'Sullivan or some other random player, Chad would not have a job......

......Leinart was too stupid to take the job, or else he'd have it.....

.....And then maybe Warner could have gone to the Vikings or something. Hell, if Warner was on the Jets all those years, Chad doesn't have a job here either.....

.....Chad probably loses his job by the mid-point of this year........

Hee hee hee, am I the only guy here amused by this laundry list of excuses about how a guy who hasn't held down a steady job since 2001 is superior to one who has? Mind boggling.

This entire post ignores the fact that since 2001 Warner has lost his starting job with three different teams, sometimes reclaiming it. He's a journeyman, plain and simple. He had his glory years way in the past, but for a long time he has been on the market, available to anyone for starting duty, and he hasn't had a single period of two straight years where he has not been beaten out as starter, at least for a few games.

A well-travelled journeyman since 2001.

[kelticwizard]

Apparently being on IR still counts as starting football games due to intent of his then HC. That HC who is now considered by more than just me to be the worst HC in football......The HC who seems to be doing a real bang-up job with his QB's in Kansas City the past 3 seasons. .......And because HE thought Pennington was worthy of starting for all those years, that makes it a good decision?

Yes, Edwards made Pennington his starting quarterback. Then when Edwards was replaced by Mangini, Mangini made Pennington his starting quarterback. Then when a living legend became suddenly available, Mangini cut Chad and Tony Sporano made Pennington his starting quarterback. There's no shame in losing out to the likes of Brett Favre, especially when you commence your starting job with a new team THE NEXT DAY after losing it.

In the meantime, Warner has been bouncing from team to team, losing his job, reclaiming it for a time, losing it again, going to another team, losing his job again, reclaiming it again then losing it again, and on and on. You can make up all the excuses you want, Pennington has been a legit starting QB in this league since he first got his chance, and Warner has not been since 2001.

[aec4]

Yes, Edwards made Pennington his starting quarterback. Then when Edwards was replaced by Mangini, Mangini made Pennington his starting quarterback. Then when a living legend became suddenly available, Mangini cut Chad and Tony Sporano made Pennington his starting quarterback. There's no shame in losing out to the likes of Brett Favre, especially when you commence your starting job with a new team THE NEXT DAY after losing it.

In the meantime, Warner has been bouncing from team to team, losing his job, reclaiming it for a time, losing it again, going to another team, losing his job again, reclaiming it again then losing it again, and on and on. You can make up all the excuses you want, Pennington has been a legit starting QB in this league since he first got his chance, and Warner has not been since 2001.

I'd take Warner over Pennington right now and I wouldn't even blink. Pennington is a starter on Miami because LOOK at Miami's other options. Do you really think Miami was his 1st choice? BS. He wanted to go to a playoff calibur team I'm sure and they all said NFW.

[shawn306]

It amazes me that this thread just continues to roll.

Let it go folks. Chad plays for the enemy now.

[NJ]

Yes, Edwards made Pennington his starting quarterback. Then when Edwards was replaced by Mangini, Mangini made Pennington his starting quarterback. since 2001.

Yes .... because when Mangini took the Jet HC job he had vast array of future HOF guys already on board to compete with pus arm for the starting job. Then going forward, Mangini had unlimited draft picks to choose all incoming QB's to unseat the mediocre cheerleader. Along with rebuilding both lines and his D backfield.

Give it up dude.

[Boozer76]

Yes, Edwards made Pennington his starting quarterback. Then when Edwards was replaced by Mangini, Mangini made Pennington his starting quarterback. Then when a living legend became suddenly available, Mangini cut Chad and Tony Sporano made Pennington his starting quarterback. There's no shame in losing out to the likes of Brett Favre, especially when you commence your starting job with a new team THE NEXT DAY after losing it.

In the meantime, Warner has been bouncing from team to team, losing his job, reclaiming it for a time, losing it again, going to another team, losing his job again, reclaiming it again then losing it again, and on and on. You can make up all the excuses you want, Pennington has been a legit starting QB in this league since he first got his chance, and Warner has not been since 2001.

Since 2002, in Warner's decline here's his numbers:

54 Games

12,829 yards

1114 completions

1739 Att

64 TD's

51 ints

Here's Chad's in his prime:

70 games

14396 yards

1322 completions

2006 Att

83 TD's

56 INT's

So, let's average out each players game performance by the numbers during this time and here's what you get:

Warner in decline:

238 yards, 21 for 32 completions at 66%, 1.2 TD's, .95 Int's

Pennington in his prime:

206 yards, 19 for 29 completions at 66%, 1.2 TD's, .8 Int's

So Kurt Warner at his worst on his way down (as you put it) is pretty much exactly equal to what Chad Pennington has been during the prime of his career. Don't let me hear injuries as the excuse, Warner has been hurt just as many, if not more, times than Pennington has in the past. This includes multiple injuries top his thumb on his throwing hand.

[Fin Fan In Cali]

I think Pennington was exactly what we needed at QB, stability, and veteran leadership. He doesn't have the strongest arm like I have said in the past, but he has a never say die attitude, that is spreading through our offense. It is just awesome to know as a long time Dolphins fans that we are going to be in games until then end, rather then getting stomped on by everyone. He has got a good level head about himself. Thanks for making it posiible for us. Best of luck the rest of the way.

[Boozer76]

I think Pennington was exactly what we needed at QB, stability, and veteran leadership. He doesn't have the strongest arm like I have said in the past, but he has a never say die attitude, that is spreading through our offense. It is just awesome to know as a long time Dolphins fans that we are going to be in games until then end, rather then getting stomped on by everyone. He has got a good level head about himself. Thanks for making it posiible for us. Best of luck the rest of the way.

Yes, the stability of 1 TD pass in the last 3 games is exactly what the doctor ordered

[Fin Fan In Cali]

Yes, the stability of 1 TD pass in the last 3 games is exactly what the doctor ordered

By stability, I also meant a QB that can lead this team, and is sure of himself.

[Boozer76]

By stability, I also meant a QB that can lead this team, and is sure of himself.

Ahhhh how quickly you forget. Let me ask you this....how many times has someone on Finheaven mentioned "oh man do you realize we could have been 3-1 right now!!"? Here's a little secret that really should come as no surprise to you or any Phin fans out there: Your running game and defense were already very good and basically won both of your gmes for you. There was a game this year where you needed you QB to come through to pull out the victory. Remember that game??? The one that could have you sitting at 3-1 and put the Jets at 1-3??? That's the one you needed your QB to actually put the team on his shoulders and make a play. And, as always, he came up short. Being on the other side now, I can tell you that no matter how tense the end of that game may have seemed, I sat back knowing that you had Chad, and Chad wasn't going to pull it out. I knew the game was sealed even as you marched down the field and had plenty of time to complete just one TD pass to win the game. I simply sat back and sipped my beer knowing thousands of Dolphins fans were about to experience the heartbreak that I had endure for years with Chad.

Rest assured, Chad is only "sure of himself" when his running game and defense are doing all the work.

[Fin Fan In Cali]

Ahhhh how quickly you forget. Let me ask you this....how many times has someone on Finheaven mentioned "oh man do you realize we could have been 3-1 right now!!"? Here's a little secret that really should come as no surprise to you or any Phin fans out there: Your running game and defense were already very good and basically won both of your gmes for you. There was a game this year where you needed you QB to come through to pull out the victory. Remember that game??? The one that could have you sitting at 3-1 and put the Jets at 1-3??? That's the one you needed your QB to actually put the team on his shoulders and make a play. And, as always, he came up short. Being on the other side now, I can tell you that no matter how tense the end of that game may have seemed, I sat back knowing that you had Chad, and Chad wasn't going to pull it out. I knew the game was sealed even as you marched down the field and had plenty of time to complete just one TD pass to win the game. I simply sat back and sipped my beer knowing thousands of Dolphins fans were about to experience the heartbreak that I had endure for years with Chad.

Rest assured, Chad is only "sure of himself" when his running game and defense are doing all the work.

There is your first mistake bro. I am not from Finheaven, nor do I visit the site. I am from ThePhins.

[GangGreen]

Warner over Pennington? This year?

Have you watched any football at all this year? Obviously not if you believe Chad is better than Warner this year.......

[kelticwizard]

Have you watched any football at all this year? Obviously not if you believe Chad is better than Warner this year.......

This year is only four or five games old. We've been watching Warner since 1999 and know his career by now. He hasn't been a starting QB since 2001.

It's one thing to be a starting QB and lose out to one great QB. In the last seven years, Warner has lost out, at various times, to four.

He had a great three years at the beginning where he looked like just about the greatest thing to play the position. After that, he's been bouncing around the league playing a few games, losing his job, going to a new team and playing a few games, losing his job, getting his job back, losing his job again, going to a new team, playing for awhile, losing his job...........

Penny got his job in 2002 and kept it until Favre displaced him. That's it. And when he was displaced, it took him exactly one day to find a new team to install him as starter immediately.

Quite a difference. For the past several years, Pennington has been a legitimate starter in the NFL, Warner has been a sometime starter, sometime backup.

[GangGreen]

For the past several years, Pennington has been a legitimate starter in the NFL

:rl:

[kelticwizard]

With all due respect GangGreen, I think you might be a bit out of time. You see, this is October. This spring was the time when it was fashionable to sneer and guffaw on internet message boards at the statement the Chad has been a legitimate starter in this league. After all, the Kellen Clemens era had begun and Chad was scheduled to be cut loose, unwanted, once this farce of a "contest" with Clemens was over. Indeed, it was clear by the comments here that several members had already sent along applications from Burger King and Taco Bell to Chad to start him on his way in his new career.

Then a few things happened.

Chad was well on his way to beating out Clemens for the starting job when Favre became available. Chad was cut and immediately picked up by Miami as starter. Clemens was not just relegated to the bench, but most of his erstwhile "suppporters" have taken to wishing he would just go away and make room for Ratliff. Meanwhile, Chad has performed more than creditably, helping the former 1-15 Miami rebound to respectability.

And you're still laughing at Pennington? Maybe all you Chad bashers might try laughing at yourselves. After all, everyone else is.

[Boozer76]

Since 2002, in Warner's decline here's his numbers:

54 Games

12,829 yards

1114 completions

1739 Att

64 TD's

51 ints

Here's Chad's in his prime:

70 games

14396 yards

1322 completions

2006 Att

83 TD's

56 INT's

So, let's average out each players game performance by the numbers during this time and here's what you get:

Warner in decline:

238 yards, 21 for 32 completions at 66%, 1.2 TD's, .95 Int's

Pennington in his prime:

206 yards, 19 for 29 completions at 66%, 1.2 TD's, .8 Int's

So Kurt Warner at his worst on his way down (as you put it) is pretty much exactly equal to what Chad Pennington has been during the prime of his career. Don't let me hear injuries as the excuse, Warner has been hurt just as many, if not more, times than Pennington has in the past. This includes multiple injuries top his thumb on his throwing hand.

With all due respect GangGreen, I think you might be a bit out of time. You see, this is October. This spring was the time when it was fashionable to sneer and guffaw on internet message boards at the statement the Chad has been a legitimate starter in this league. After all, the Kellen Clemens era had begun and Chad was scheduled to be cut loose, unwanted, once this farce of a "contest" with Clemens was over. Indeed, it was clear by the comments here that several members had already sent along applications from Burger King and Taco Bell to Chad to start him on his way in his new career.

Then a few things happened.

Chad was well on his way to beating out Clemens for the starting job when Favre became available. Chad was cut and immediately picked up by Miami as starter. Clemens was not just relegated to the bench, but most of his erstwhile "suppporters" have taken to wishing he would just go away and make room for Ratliff. Meanwhile, Chad has performed more than creditably, helping the former 1-15 Miami rebound to respectability.

And you're still laughing at Pennington? Maybe all you Chad bashers might try laughing at yourselves. After all, everyone else is.

Hey Keltic, instead of talking from your rear end why don't you just look at the numbers.

[GangGreen]

Brett just raped you......

[kelticwizard]

Since 2002.....

So, let's average out each players game performance by the numbers during this time and here's what you get:

Warner in decline:

238 yards, 21 for 32 completions at 66%, 1.2 TD's, .95 Int's

Pennington in his prime:

206 yards, 19 for 29 completions at 66%, 1.2 TD's, .8 Int's

These numbers prove that if you take all the bits, pieces and fragments of the seasons that Warner has played in since losing his job in St. Louis in 2002, and average them out on a per-game basis, you arrive at some pretty good numbers-numbers comparable to Chad Pennington's.

Now, please explain the relevance of this to our discussion.

Do you honestly think this is the way football works? That the coach takes the stats of partial seasons, averages them out, and names his starter on the basis of per-game averages?

If so, then I am sorry, you don't know much about pro football.

There are probably a lot of guys tending bar and selling insurance right now who have per-game averages better than Marino, Montana or anybody else. Too bad they just couldn't get themselves invited to a training camp and impress the coach with their abilities enough to win the starting job, and then keep that job by going out there game after game and winning the confidence of their coach and teammates. Year after year.

How do you think Warner has kept himself in the league for all these years? By playing reasonably well for a while. But then the offense kind of stalls and the coach looks to somewhat else for a spark and they get it from them for a few games. Then the other guy fizzles and Warner comes back in and looks pretty good for a few games, and so on. And at the end of the year you look at Warner's numbers and they aren't half bad, once you adjust for the number of games he played.

But since his glory years of 1999-2001, Warner has not been able to show what he can do and make a coach say, "That's the guy". He's only been good enough to make a coach say, "That's the guy for now". You can cobble together all of Warner's partial seasons and staple his collective numbers together and that's not going to change the fact that for quite a few seasons now, Chad Pennington has been a starting NFL quarterback. And Kurt Warner has not been.

[Barton]

If I should stay,

I would only be in your way.

So I'll go, but I know

I'll think of you ev'ry step of the way.

And I will always love you.

I will always love you.

You, my darling you. Hmm.

Bittersweet memories

that is all I'm taking with me.

So, goodbye. Please, don't cry.

We both know I'm not what you, you need.

And I will always love you.

I will always love you.

I hope life treats you kind

And I hope you have all you've dreamed of.

And I wish to you, joy and happiness.

But above all this, I wish you love.

And I will always love you.

I will always love you.

I will always love you.

I will always love you.

I will always love you.

I, I will always love you.

You, darling, I love you.

Ooh, I'll always, I'll always love you.

[Boozer76]

These numbers prove that if you take all the bits, pieces and fragments of the seasons that Warner has played in since losing his job in St. Louis in 2002, and average them out on a per-game basis, you arrive at some pretty good numbers-numbers comparable to Chad Pennington's.

Now, please explain the relevance of this to our discussion.

Do you honestly think this is the way football works? That the coach takes the stats of partial seasons, averages them out, and names his starter on the basis of per-game averages?

If so, then I am sorry, you don't know much about pro football.

There are probably a lot of guys tending bar and selling insurance right now who have per-game averages better than Marino, Montana or anybody else. Too bad they just couldn't get themselves invited to a training camp and impress the coach with their abilities enough to win the starting job, and then keep that job by going out there game after game and winning the confidence of their coach and teammates. Year after year.

How do you think Warner has kept himself in the league for all these years? By playing reasonably well for a while. But then the offense kind of stalls and the coach looks to somewhat else for a spark and they get it from them for a few games. Then the other guy fizzles and Warner comes back in and looks pretty good for a few games, and so on. And at the end of the year you look at Warner's numbers and they aren't half bad, once you adjust for the number of games he played.

But since his glory years of 1999-2001, Warner has not been able to show what he can do and make a coach say, "That's the guy". He's only been good enough to make a coach say, "That's the guy for now". You can cobble together all of Warner's partial seasons and staple his collective numbers together and that's not going to change the fact that for quite a few seasons now, Chad Pennington has been a starting NFL quarterback. And Kurt Warner has not been.

Huh!!?? When Warner is healthy he plays. Period. He hasn't been benched for futility, he's been benched due to injuries. The only players in the league that has "unseated" Warner was Bulger and Manning. Bulger and Manning would also unseat Pennington any day of the week.

And as for this:

How do you think Warner has kept himself in the league for all these years? By playing reasonably well for a while. But then the offense kind of stalls and the coach looks to somewhat else for a spark and they get it from them for a few games. Then the other guy fizzles and Warner comes back in and looks pretty good for a few games, and so on. And at the end of the year you look at Warner's numbers and they aren't half bad, once you adjust for the number of games he played.

The same EXACT thing can be said for Pennington. He has a couple good games here and there and then blows chunks right when you need your QB most. Hell, he even did it against us in his first game in MIA. That game was his for the taking. It was the only game where MIA has really needed Pennington to do more than just "manage the game" or "be efficient" and he failed. Like every other time in the past with the Jets he failed.

The only reason Pennington has been a starter for so long is because the Jets were too stupid to actually try drafting a real QB that could actually push him for a job. Warner lost his job to Bulger and Manning. Not really a bad pair of QB's considering they're both considered top 10 QB's.

[kelticwizard]

Huh!!?? When Warner is healthy he plays. Period. He hasn't been benched for futility, he's been benched due to injuries. The only players in the league that has "unseated" Warner was Bulger and Manning.

Sorry, but that is completely untrue. He's been benched plenty of times for futility, by several quarterbacks. Please note the following:

In contrast to his 103.4 career passer rating entering the season, Warner posted a minuscule 67.4 rating in 2002. Warner was replaced as the Rams' starting quarterback after fumbling six times in the opener of the 2003 season against the New York Giants. Warner's replacement as the Rams quarterback, Marc Bulger, would be named to two Pro Bowls.......

.......Warner started the 2004 season as the starting quarterback, winning five of his first seven games, but following several poor performances in a two-game losing streak, rookie quarterback Eli Manning was given the starting job........

........In early 2005, Warner signed a one-year, $4-million contract with the Arizona Cardinals, and was quickly named the starter by coach Dennis Green. Warner posted three relatively mediocre performances before injuring his groin and being replaced by former starter Josh McCown. McCown played in two games during Warner's injury, performing well enough that Green named McCown the starter for the remainder of the season........

........In Week One of the 2006 NFL season, Warner won the NFC Offensive Player of the Week award, throwing for 301 yards and three touchdowns in a win over San Francisco.......After three subpar games in Weeks 2-4, Warner was replaced at quarterback by rookie Matt Leinart in the fourth quarter of Week 4. Then-coach Dennis Green stated that Warner would be the backup quarterback for the remainder of the season.......

.......On September 30, 2007, during the week 4 game against the Pittsburgh Steelers, Warner relieved Matt Leinart following another ineffective start by Leinart....

From this article you can see that since his glory years of 1999-2001, Warner has

A) Had one year, (2002) where he was still indisputably the starter despite being out of the lineup frequently for injuries and performing badly when he was in there-67.4 QB rating.

Since 2002, Warner has not had one single year-not a single one-where he started the year as starter and stayed starter throughout. I'm not talking about being on the bench for injuries-an injured starter is still the starter. I'm talking about having the job throughout the season whether you are injured or not. . Warner has either been beaten out for the starter's position at the beginning of the year, or been beaten out at some point of the season every year since 2003. Some years he regained the job-but he was still beaten out for a time. Every year since 2003.

Warner has not been a starter since he lost his job to Bulger after his glory years. He has been a sometime starter, sometime backup. Pennington has been a starter all the way through until Favre came along. Unless you want to count his being being benched late in the 2007 season so that the Front Office could see what Clemens could do, which was never announced as a permanent change.

[JohnnyLV]

Sorry, but that is completely untrue. He's been benched plenty of times for futility, by several quarterbacks. Please note the following:

From this article you can see that since his glory years of 1999-2001, Warner has

A) Had one year, (2002) where he was still indisputably the starter despite being out of the lineup frequently for injuries and performing badly when he was in there-67.4 QB rating.

Since 2002, Warner has not had one single year-not a single one-where he started the year as starter and stayed starter throughout. I'm not talking about being on the bench for injuries-an injured starter is still the starter. I'm talking about having the job throughout the season whether you are injured or not. . Warner has either been beaten out for the starter's position at the beginning of the year, or been beaten out at some point of the season every year since 2003. Some years he regained the job-but he was still beaten out for a time. Every year since 2003.

Warner has not been a starter since he lost his job to Bulger after his glory years. He has been a sometime starter, sometime backup. Pennington has been a starter all the way through until Favre came along. Unless you want to count his being being benched late in the 2007 season so that the Front Office could see what Clemens could do, which was never announced as a permanent change.

Dude, please. If you are just trolling and trying to rile fine, but no one can honestly look at Pennington in actual games and think he is even AVERAGE. He was ridiculously inept last year and this year the fish coaching staff believes so little in Pennington that they run the friggin single wing offense when it MATTERS. In between Pennington dumps off and dumps off and every once in a while throws an OK seam route, but he does nothing to really be effective in leading the team to scores. He is at the very bottom of QBs in 2 minute and red zone situations. Truth is really, that he is terrible. It was a great day when we kicked this steaming turd to the street.

In terms of Warner, Chad cannot hold Warner's jock in terms of skill at QB. Warner's issue is that he is not mobile and fumbles A LOT when sacked. But with good protection, he is still easily in the top 10 as a QB. Pennington is easily in the bottom 10, maybe 5. And I could care less about statistics, they are incredibly misleading with Pennington.

And when it really matters, Chad chokes. HARD.

[kelticwizard]

In terms of Warner, Chad cannot hold Warner's jock in terms of skill at QB. Warner's issue is that he is not mobile and fumbles A LOT when sacked.

Warner's problem is that he has not been able to hold onto a job for even as much as one single season since his glory years. You can give whatever excuses you wish, that's the case. He's lost his job to four quarterbacks, as the article outlines, sometimes regaining his position. Chad's lost his job to one-Brett Favre.

I will admit that from 1999-2001 Warner played like a house on fire, and Chad can't touch him for those years. Few can. But after that Kurt has been a sometime starter, sometime backup year after year.

[Arsis]

Warner's problem is that he has not been able to hold onto a job for even as much as one single season since his glory years. You can give whatever excuses you wish, that's the case. He's lost his job to four quarterbacks, as the article outlines, sometimes regaining his position. Chad's lost his job to one-Brett Favre.

I will admit that from 1999-2001 Warner played like a house on fire, and Chad can't touch him for those years. Few can. But after that Kurt has been a sometime starter, sometime backup year after year.

Warner is still better than chad pennington.

[serphnx]

Warner has had injuries and as other people have shown his stats "in decline" are right there with Chad's in his "prime." Maybe you can say he made bad choices on the teams he signed with. Few teams have an Eli Manning or Marc Bulger waiting in the wings, but Warner managed to be on those teams. Kind of like Drew Bledsoe's luck too, what were the chances of being replaced by talent on the level of Tom Brady and Tony Romo?

If Warner was on a team with Kellen Clemens or Chad Henne, he'd have always been the starter. I'm surprised that teams like the Bears or Vikings didn't have any interest in Warner, and also Pennington in all honesty, as they generally didn't have better options. Orton might develop into one now so I guess maybe the Bears knew what they were doing, but I don't really believe that.

[jack48]

It's simple, Chad was trying to play through a bad ankle injury, crappy O-line play and no running game last year and ended up 1-7. Now he's playing great ball and they hate him for it, not to mention he's doing it for us, that really gets their panties in a bunch.

I disagree. Chad was a media darling who did not deserve as much credit as he received, because he was friendly and hard-working and disgustingly polite. I could not dislike him. But as a pro QB he was a bit of a charlatan. He does not have the tools. He will never win a game when the run game is taken away from him. Good QBs can do that some of the time. Great QBs can do it even more often. Chad could never do it. Well.....maybe against Miami, he could.