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Is Sutton too soft ?


Larz

Which is it ?  

1 member has voted

  1. 1. Which is it ?

    • Sutton has the horses, he is just too conservative
      22
    • Sutton would like to blitz more, but he knows his guys just can't get there
      4


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or does he just know his blitzers can't "get home" ?

I was keeping an eye on sutton's pass rush, and I saw 3-4 guys rushing almost all game. I'm sure he did send 5 at least once, but I can't remember it

As I watched Harrison of the steelers humiliate and embarrass matt "light in the pants", it made me rethink my position

I wonder if the JETS simply don't have a pass rusher sutton can rely on to "get home"

so I pose a question to the board;

Is sutton too conservative and soft, or does he just know his blitzers can't get the job done ?

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Probably a little of both. We don't have a James Harrison or Demarcus Ware, but the defense still seems too vanilla and predictable.

I wonder if there are any stats out there that show some sort of blitz success rating

he can't be so stupid he deosn't know to pressure a QB, can he ?

I have to think along the way they realized they just don't have good pass rushing talent

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I blame Mangini mostly but I agree with dbatesman about it being a little of both, which btw is why Gholston is sooo disappointing. I'm not writing him off, but it's very concerning that he's shown no explosiveness so far. For a guy that was billed as a physical freak, he should flash superior athleticism once in awhile..

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I blame Mangini mostly but I agree with dbatesman about it being a little of both, which btw is why Gholston is sooo disappointing. I'm not writing him off, but it's very concerning that he's shown no explosiveness so far. For a guy that was billed as a physical freak, he should flash superior athleticism once in awhile..

I honestly think he just never needed technique, ever. My perfect comparison is Greg Oden in the NBA. Dude just towered and was bigger then anyone his entire life. Now he's in the NBA with guys bigger or as big as him who have technique and he's horrid. I'm with you in that I'm not writing him off yet. Also I agree with Dbates on the "vanilla" D. I feel that people know what's coming and Sutton has failed at disguising our blitz packages and we're entirely predictable to good O coaches.

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I honestly think he just never needed technique, ever. My perfect comparison is Greg Oden in the NBA. Dude just towered and was bigger then anyone his entire life. Now he's in the NBA with guys bigger or as big as him who have technique and he's horrid. I'm with you in that I'm not writing him off yet. Also I agree with Dbates on the "vanilla" D. I feel that people know what's coming and Sutton has failed at disguising our blitz packages and we're entirely predictable to good O coaches.

Right, but he should flash occasionally no? Everytime I've seen him in pursuit he looks slow, which is scary or a guy who was getting buy on measurables..

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I still wonder how much of this is Sutton and how much is Mangini. Sutton is definitely a dumbass, but Mangini is the HC, and has a defensive background--if he were unhappy with the defense, don't you think he would have changed some things? It's disheartening to think, but maybe this is how he wants things to run.

On the other hand, Mangini clearly knows Sutton is a moron--not only does he constantly chew him out on the sidelines, he was ready to drop Sutton like a bad habit the second Rob Ryan was (briefly) available. So Mangini clearly thinks there's room for improvement--but that begs the question, why isn't he taking more ownership of the D? (It also causes one to keep Ryan in mind, since his contract expires at the end of this season.)

As for Gholston: he is what he is, a kid who has great physical tools but little awareness or instincts. His lack of explosiveness is disturbing, but he is making progress every week (got tons of PT last week against Tennessee, had that good pressure on Cutler yesterday), and hopefully he'll continue to improve. As others have said though, this is more or less a redshirt year for him anyway--though the redshirting might end if Pace and Thomas continue to struggle, as they have the last few weeks...

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Right, but he should flash occasionally no? Everytime I've seen him in pursuit he looks slow, which is scary or a guy who was getting buy on measurables..

Yea it's scary. I've seen the same thing you have from him which is "Oh hey, that was Gholston... and he did nothing." Over here in Portland it's the same thing with Oden that if he was gonna be this "dominating force" he'd show flashes. All he's shown is he can rebound and block some shots. Gholston has showed almost nothing.who knows maybe it all comes together. As of right now we all knew the kid was potential bust or potential all-pro.

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Pace and Thomas were getting to the QB often in the first fews games when it seemed like we were blitzing more. Just look back at the first half of the Cardinals game. They were blitzing like crazy and shut down Warner. Then look at what happened in the second half. The Jet LBers were made for rushing the passer and not for pass coverage. Aren't coaches supposed to put players in the best position for them to succeed?

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Pace and Thomas were getting to the QB often in the first fews games when it seemed like we were blitzing more. Just look back at the first half of the Cardinals game. They were blitzing like crazy and shut down Warner. Then look at what happened in the second half. The Jet LBers were made for rushing the passer and not for pass coverage. Aren't coaches supposed to put players in the best position for them to succeed?

First game being a Jets fan? Come on DM, this staff is full of revolutionists, they do not follow your silly book of playing the percentages or using common sense.

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First game being a Jets fan? Come on DM, this staff is full of revolutionists, they do not follow your silly book of playing the percentages or using common sense.

Not for nothing, because I know what you mean about putting the guys in the places to succeed, but Mangini is known, and often berated, for playing the percentages...especially on the prevent defense type of things.

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Pace and Thomas were getting to the QB often in the first fews games when it seemed like we were blitzing more. Just look back at the first half of the Cardinals game. They were blitzing like crazy and shut down Warner. Then look at what happened in the second half. The Jet LBers were made for rushing the passer and not for pass coverage. Aren't coaches supposed to put players in the best position for them to succeed?

Coverage is not what it used to be. You cannot reallty cover any more. Receivers are allowed to run free. I am surprised they are letting Law mug people the way he has been doing. The Giants beat Brady by sitting him on his ass over and over again, whether he got the pass off or not. The less time a QB has, the better. That is the new paradigm. Someone pass that along to Mangini.

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Not for nothing, because I know what you mean about putting the guys in the places to succeed, but Mangini is known, and often berated, for playing the percentages...especially on the prevent defense type of things.

That's the whole point. Mangini and Sutton are reading from Coaching for Idiots and not adjusting for their players' strengths and weaknesses. If they had Mo Lewis, Lance Mehl and Al Atkinson playing LB, then yeah, drop them into coverage most of the time. I swear, these guys would have Lawrence Taylor chasing TEs down the field instead of rushing the passer.

And remember back in 2006 when Kerry Rhodes had 5 sacks? How many times have they sent him on a safety blitz this year?

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or does he just know his blitzers can't "get home" ?

I was keeping an eye on sutton's pass rush, and I saw 3-4 guys rushing almost all game. I'm sure he did send 5 at least once, but I can't remember it

As I watched Harrison of the steelers humiliate and embarrass matt "light in the pants", it made me rethink my position

I wonder if the JETS simply don't have a pass rusher sutton can rely on to "get home"

so I pose a question to the board;

Is sutton too conservative and soft, or does he just know his blitzers can't get the job done ?

He stinks!No stunts,no twists,o delay blitzes,no zone blitzes,just rush the man in front of you.BORING!

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I think in those Nickel situation Sutton should change things up a little. Push Coleman over the guard, tackle gap or sub in Mosley. And let Gholston go to d-end. Let Gholston do what he knows best, getting after the Qb.

Atleast we will know what type of player Gholston is, and if he is even worth keeping for another year.

We have been pulling Jenkins in passing situation. And putting in Pouha and Mosley. Jenkins is such a threat to so many teams they double team him almost every play.

Knowing if they have to double team Jenkins in a four man front. Bring one or two extra guys their is no reason we shouldn't be hitting the Qb.

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I think Mangini is the kind of coach that would like for to be able to sit back drop 7 or 8 into coverage and let the QB make the mistake.

If he thinks though he can get to the QB. (Like a Warner) then he will send everyone.

The biggest problem I have is that if they get the lead, they just sit back and give up the short pass after short pass until they let the opponent get back into the game or the QB makes a mistake. We have seen it go both ways this year. We have seen them make guys like Cassell and Tyler Thigpen look like all pros and guys like Warner look like a scrub.

My feeling is that if you have an opponent down you go for the kill. You don't sit back and let the game come to you. It is exactly what we hated about Herm and Hackett. Get the lead and sit back, hope for the best.

It will be very interesting when the playoffs come around how will they scheme against a guy like a Cutler who tore them apart, or a Manning who can throw the ball all over the place.

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