Barton Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Jenkins cant do it all, Ellis is just decent. The Jets badly need another guy thats capable of taking on 2 blockers to help out Jenkins and the linebackers. I'd put DE up there with ILB, CB and WR as far as needs go. He's not Seymour, but Igor Oshansky from the Chargers is a FA. A sure upgrade from Ellis and Coleman. Thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
124 Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Igor would be a welcomed addition but Shaun Ellis is very UNDER-RATED by you and others on this board as a 34 DE. If we were to replace one of our DE's it would have to be Coleman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 we need to draft a DE, Ellis is getting old, but I think as far a FA's go, we really need a CB, ILB and S first Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stoicsentry Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Igor would be a welcomed addition but Shaun Ellis is very UNDER-RATED by you and others on this board as a 34 DE. If we were to replace one of our DE's it would have to be Coleman. It's true. Ellis is definitely underrated. He's average sometimes but other times he's actually a beast... most people here treat him like a bum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Ellis is average. Beastly at times and then invisible for the most part. We do indeed need a huge upgrade and some depth on the D-line. Igor would be a good signing. Is there any notable 3-4 End prospects in the draft? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 I agree with those who like Ellis. The guy is consistently solid and never misses a game. I like Coleman also, so I don't think DLine (besides depth) is an issue. But having someone named Igor on the team would definately be cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Ellis is average. Beastly at times and then invisible for the most part. We do indeed need a huge upgrade and some depth on the D-line. Igor would be a good signing. Is there any notable 3-4 End prospects in the draft? People who call Ellis "average" simply don't know what they are watching. It's actually become a good test to know whether someone actually understands the 3-4 defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 People who call Ellis "average" simply don't know what they are watching. It's actually become a good test to know whether someone actually understands the 3-4 defense. I understand the 3-4 defense and I know that as is the case with the rest of the D-line, it isn't Ellis primary job to make defensive plays. That being said I still don't think he's anything special at the 3-4 End. Maybe "average" was a bit of a stretch but he's far from great. He was a lot better early on in the season when Kris Jenkins was playing at DPOY standard, when Jenkins wore down and Ellis was getting double blocked he went into invisible mode and teams were again running all over us. He's a good player, but don't underestimate how better Jenkins made him look at times last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ECURB Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 People think Ellis is average because he is the guy the offense focuses on... put a threat at the other side and they will both put up good stats... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetfan718 Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 i'd like us to draft either Tyson Jackson or Fili Moala...i think either one would make a good DE!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 I understand the 3-4 defense and I know that as is the case with the rest of the D-line, it isn't Ellis primary job to make defensive plays. That being said I still don't think he's anything special at the 3-4 End. Maybe "average" was a bit of a stretch but he's far from great. He was a lot better early on in the season when Kris Jenkins was playing at DPOY standard, when Jenkins wore down and Ellis was getting double blocked he went into invisible mode and teams were again running all over us. He's a good player, but don't underestimate how better Jenkins made him look at times last season. pop quiz did teams have more success running at the jets LDE, RDE, or up the middle in '08 ? (ellis is the LDE) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
124 Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 I understand the 3-4 defense and I know that as is the case with the rest of the D-line, it isn't Ellis primary job to make defensive plays. That being said I still don't think he's anything special at the 3-4 End. Maybe "average" was a bit of a stretch but he's far from great. He was a lot better early on in the season when Kris Jenkins was playing at DPOY standard, when Jenkins wore down and Ellis was getting double blocked he went into invisible mode and teams were again running all over us. He's a good player, but don't underestimate how better Jenkins made him look at times last season. Without good / great play at the Nose Tackle position in the 34 Defense, nobody will succeed to their full potential, especially those at Defensive End and Outside Linebacker. Nobody. There is a reason Shaun Ellis is the longest tenured Jet and there is a reason he will survive the Rex Ryan Era as well (unless he retires before Rex is gone). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rillo Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 pop quiz did teams have more success running at the jets LDE, RDE, or up the middle in '08 ? (ellis is the LDE) I'll say RDE, but Ellis is average and we do need a DE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 pop quiz did teams have more success running at the jets LDE, RDE, or up the middle in '08 ? (ellis is the LDE) Where did I ever say Kenyon Coleman (Who is garbage) is a better player? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Without good / great play at the Nose Tackle position in the 34 Defense, nobody will succeed to their full potential, especially those at Defensive End and Outside Linebacker. Nobody. There is a reason Shaun Ellis is the longest tenured Jet and there is a reason he will survive the Rex Ryan Era as well (unless he retires before Rex is gone). I agree with this. I'm happy with Ellis at 3-4 End, I just think he's overrated by some. We NEED to replace Coleman though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Without good / great play at the Nose Tackle position in the 34 Defense, nobody will succeed to their full potential, especially those at Defensive End and Outside Linebacker. Nobody. There is a reason Shaun Ellis is the longest tenured Jet and there is a reason he will survive the Rex Ryan Era as well (unless he retires before Rex is gone). Not necessarily. If they want to save some cap space Ellis has a pretty big number. He costs in the $6-7M range and they will save nearly $5M by cutting him. Ellis is a better player than Coleman, but if Ryan wants to bring in some of his guys, Ellis and Brandon Moore are in some pretty serious jeopardy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
124 Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Moore are in some pretty serious jeopardy. If Rex Ryan wants to run the ball, why would he get rid of the Jets best run blocker? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 If Rex Ryan wants to run the ball, why would he get rid of the Jets best run blocker? There are $5.5 million reasons. Check his cap figure. They aren't signing, Scott and Leonhard without cutting some fat. I'm not saying they are gone, I'm saying they are in danger and I'm pretty sure the rules on restructuring are very restrictive with the CBA ending for '10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 If Rex Ryan wants to run the ball, why would he get rid of the Jets best run blocker? Damien Woody is the best run blocker on our offensive line. He's one of the best in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Where did I ever say Kenyon Coleman (Who is garbage) is a better player? coleman ? this is about Ellis the answer is this football outsiders avg yards per carry vs RDE = 4.50 LDE = 2.84 NT = 3.98 Ellis is a stud, and totally unappreciated by Jets fans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barton Posted January 21, 2009 Author Share Posted January 21, 2009 Look around the league at all the good 3-4 defenses (Pitt, San Diego, NE). Ellis would be their worst starting Dlineman. Right now he's our 2nd best. Thats a problem. He's solid, nothing more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack48 Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Ellis is average. Beastly at times and then invisible for the most part. We do indeed need a huge upgrade and some depth on the D-line. Igor would be a good signing. Is there any notable 3-4 End prospects in the draft? I pick on Ellis a lot, but seeing him in an attacking defense, not necessarily taking on two guys every down, might be illuminating. Sometimes these guys we do not like are products of the system they are playing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larz Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 Look around the league at all the good 3-4 defenses (Pitt, San Diego, NE). Ellis would be their worst starting Dlineman. Right now he's our 2nd best. Thats a problem. He's solid, nothing more. so we should replace coleman ? agreed I say draft a guy to learn behind ellis, and he wins the job, great Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barton Posted January 21, 2009 Author Share Posted January 21, 2009 so we should replace coleman ? agreed I say draft a guy to learn behind ellis, and he wins the job, great Coleman absolutely has to be upgraded. FWIW I think Mosley is and would be better than him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 I pick on Ellis a lot, but seeing him in an attacking defense, not necessarily taking on two guys every down, might be illuminating. Sometimes these guys we do not like are products of the system they are playing. Good point. One guy I'd like to see in a one gap system is Mosley. He seems like a good slasher, but he was not big enough for NT. Too bad he's an UFA. Everybody is predicting half of Baltimore's D following Rex over, but one guy I'd be interested in is Kelly Gregg. He's older and coming off microfracture surgery, but I remember them being very high on him as 0-gap player (right over the center) and his ability to soak up blockers. He's coming off the injury and making a ton of money. Good chance they cut him and he'd be an interesting guy to rest Jenkins. I'd take a serious look at him if he gets cut and the money is right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gang_green03 Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 We can definitely use an upgrade there and should look hard at drafting Jackson out of LSU. He's made to play 3-4 end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rillo Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 Good point. One guy I'd like to see in a one gap system is Mosley. He seems like a good slasher, but he was not big enough for NT. Too bad he's an UFA. Everybody is predicting half of Baltimore's D following Rex over, but one guy I'd be interested in is Kelly Gregg. He's older and coming off microfracture surgery, but I remember them being very high on him as 0-gap player (right over the center) and his ability to soak up blockers. He's coming off the injury and making a ton of money. Good chance they cut him and he'd be an interesting guy to rest Jenkins. I'd take a serious look at him if he gets cut and the money is right. Gregg was good before he got injured, I would not mind bringing him in, good call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonEJet Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 Big Mike is the guy for the future at DE DeVito has a non stop moteor....like to see him get the chance.....Coleman can go to his bud down in Miami Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 With Ryan at the helm, Raji becomes a serious consideration at our spot... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gang_green03 Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 With Ryan at the helm, Raji becomes a serious consideration at our spot... Jenkins and Raji together on the line would be scary. The more I think about it the more I'd like them to go that route if they pick a defensive player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auburnjet Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 coleman ? this is about Ellis the answer is this football outsiders avg yards per carry vs RDE = 4.50 LDE = 2.84 NT = 3.98 Ellis is a stud, and totally unappreciated by Jets fans Agreed! Anyone who thinks he is mediocre or average just doesn't understand the defense the jets played last year. Even this 3-4 that Ryan runs is completely different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.