***Official JN Jay Cutler Talk - All Jay, All Day*** [Merged 49X]

[ZachEY]

Seriously. The argument is basically "I'd rather draft an unproven receiver that is unlikely to make much of an impact this season than trade for a franchise QB".

Drafting the receiver is a (poor) move that has nothing but the interest of the next season in mind. Just because we don't have a #2 receiver penciled in for 2009 does not mean we should piss away a golden opportunity at getting something this franchise hasn't had in over 30 years: a franchise QB.

People romanticize draft picks.

Would you rather have the 2nd or 3rd best WR in this draft, or Cutler.

I'd take Cutler.

At the end of the day, would you rather have Gholston and Keller, or Cutler.

I'd take Cutler. And I'm a big Keller guy.

Draft picks are nothing but players, and if you don't think you can do better with those 'players', you make a move like this.

[joebabyny]

Seriously. The argument is basically "I'd rather draft an unproven receiver that is unlikely to make much of an impact this season than trade for a franchise QB".

Drafting the receiver is a (poor) move that has nothing but the interest of the next season in mind. Just because we don't have a #2 receiver penciled in for 2009 does not mean we should piss away a golden opportunity at getting something this franchise hasn't had in over 30 years: a franchise QB.

True, a good qb makes his wr and the rest of the team better, a good wr at the end of the day still needs a good qb to hook up with. It is like a stereo, the speakers are the most important, great speakers make any stereo sound better, great components will still sound like crap if the speakers are crap.

[The Troll]

now you are reaching..the team made a mistake? If Cutler was so f'ing good McDaniels would be kissing his ass right now...instead he will trade him and go with Leinert? Please...

and as far as Marino, 20-something other teams screwed that up too..and comparing Marino to Cutler is plain stupid..

What the hell does Josh McDaniels know? Are you saying that Cassell is better than Cutler? Because you seem to be tauting Josh McDaniels' QB evaluation skills.

Whatever.

4,500 yards passing and 25 TDs with no running game whatsoever. Jay Cutler blows. We don't need him. We have....KELLEN CLEMENS!

[Thai Jet]

Agreed.. INSTANTLY pull the trigger. That is an absolute friggen STEAL.

Be careful what you wish for.

[ZachEY]

The team made a massive mistake, and now they have a chance to correct it.

D'Brick has turned into a great player, so I wont kill the Jets for the pick.

Now, they (may) have chance to get both.

If we don't draft D'Brick, we have Cutler, and some crap player lining up next to Adrian Clarke, and we likely don't have Cutler anymore.

[shutout]

I'm sorry, but how is there even any debate that if we can get Jay Cutler we do it? Many of us liked him in the 06 draft (I wanted D'Brick, but would have welcomed a trade up back into the high teens to get Cutler), and he is far and away better than anything available to us. We've built up one heck of a defensive unit (on paper), have one of the better run games in the league, and if we can add a legit QB like Cutler we become serious contenders.

No way Tanny/Ryan pass if there's a realistic chance they can move picks for Jay Cutler.

[neckdemon]

Generally (with few exceptions), a SB championship team has the following 3 things:

1. A defense ranked in the top 10 in both points & yards allowed

2. An offense that scores 23 ppg or more

3. A qb who puts up a pro bowl caliber season in the year the team wins the title.

yeah ho wmany teams with mediocre qb's have averaged 23 ppg in a season? i'm going to go out on a limb and say not very many at all. so, i'm thinking that #2 and #3 go hand in hand.

edit......sorry i was thinking 33 ppg.

[SoFlaJets]

great minds think alike Jimmy...how did the surgery go?

it hurts like a sonofabitch Al...I woke up from surgery and immediately started crying cause it hurts so much-what a pu$$y I am

As far as Cutler goes I'll do what I do for every new head coach we get, which is to defer to his better judgement. If Ryan thinks he needs Jay Cutler (who IS a pro bowler BTW) then I too want Cutler.

These guys do this stuff for a living and know a lot more about the Jets and professional football than any of us on the boards do. If the Jets don't think we can win a SB with Clemens/Ratliff and that they have a better shot at it WITH Cutler then I won't complain. They deserve to put their own team together the way they feel they have to. I trust in Rex Ryan-right now anyway...

[ZachEY]

my point is I don't think we should give away all those picks to sign a guy we could have had a few years back for a single pick...and I am not a fan of signing dis-gruntled players from other teams for any amount of picks...its my opinion, if you don't agree fine, if you don't like it, tough

Yes, but we went with a pretty good player with that pick. You couldn't have Culter and D'Brick in 2006. Now you can.

Now, the question is do you value a proven franchise QB over the 17th overall pick.

As to your 'disgruntled player' theory, there are instances of it backfiring, and instances of it working. I'd be happy to have 'disgruntled WR' Randy Moss... wouldn't you?

And none of this has anything to do with the fact that your more recent point, the one I responded to, was about the QBs. And, at the end of the day, that one is proven wrong by the statistical evidence. So, you can keep your opinion, but in the face of measurable data, it's a weak one.

[Jetfan13]

it hurts like a sonofabitch Al...I woke up from surgery and immediately started crying cause it hurts so much-what a pu$$y I am

As far as Cutler goes I'll do what I do for every new head coach we get, which is to defer to his better judgement. If Ryan thinks he needs Jay Cutler 9who IS a pro bowler BTW) then I too want Cutler.

These guys do this stuff for a living and know a lot more about the Jets and professional football than any of us on the boards do. If the Jets don't think we can win a SB with Clemens/Ratliff and that they have a better shot at it WITH Cutler than I won't complain. They deserve to put their own team together the way they feel they have to. I trust in Rex Ryan-right now anyway...

take a couple percs and lie down bro..lol

for the record, I am not against getting Cutler, but not for a 1st's, a 2nd and a 3rd?..too much

[The Troll]

D'Brick has turned into a great player, so I wont kill the Jets for the pick.

Now, they (may) have chance to get both.

If we don't draft D'Brick, we have Cutler, and some crap player lining up next to Adrian Clarke, and we likely don't have Cutler anymore.

Well, we could have ended up with Cutler + Marcus McNeil.

Our chances of landing a capable tackle in the three years since that draft are considerably higher than landing a QB on the level of Jay Cutler.

[neckdemon]

Yes, but we went with a pretty good player with that pick. You couldn't have Culter and D'Brick in 2006. Now you can.

Now, the question is do you value a proven franchise QB over the 17th overall pick.

As to your 'disgruntled player' theory, there are instances of it backfiring, and instances of it working. I'd be happy to have 'disgruntled WR' Randy Moss... wouldn't you?

And none of this has anything to do with the fact that your more recent point, the one I responded to, was about the QBs. And, at the end of the day, that one is proven wrong by the statistical evidence. So, you can keep your opinion, but in the face of measurable data, it's a weak one.

no but we could have had cutler and mcneil. instead we got ferguson and clemens.....downgrades at both positions.

[ZachEY]

Well, we could have ended up with Cutler + Marcus McNeil.

Our chances of landing a capable tackle in the three years since that draft are considerably higher than landing a QB on the level of Jay Cutler.

Possibly true, but at present, D'Brick looks like the best of the bunch.

Remember, Cutler was a risk then too. In hinsight, you could have done it different, but in this case, I can't call it a mistake at the time.

[ZachEY]

no but we could have had cutler and mcneil. instead we got ferguson and clemens.....downgrades at both positions.

McNeil was better year one. I'd take D'Brick today.

[Jetfan13]

why don't you guys work for an NFL team, you have everything figured out, years later...

we could have had Jerry Rice too instead of Al Toon , if only the Jets knew then right????

[NFLs StepChild]

no but we could have had cutler and mcneil. instead we got ferguson and clemens.....downgrades at both positions.

Are you serious?

Brick>McNeil

[The Troll]

why don't you guys work for an NFL team, you have everything figured out, years later...

we could have had Jerry Rice too instead of Al Toon , if only the Jets knew then right????

Yep, stupid, stupid.

If only Jerry Rice would have become available three years after we passed on him.

[uart]

You'd have to be crazy. Straight up LW for JC you do in a heartbeat.

LW is awesome no question. QBs win in this league though.

Straight up I'd do it and then (probably) take Knowshon Moreno with the 17th pick.

[The Troll]

Possibly true, but at present, D'Brick looks like the best of the bunch.

Remember, Cutler was a risk then too. In hinsight, you could have done it different, but in this case, I can't call it a mistake at the time.

D'Brick is still a disappointment to me, because when you draft a tackle that high, you are expecting an Orlando Pace/Tony Boselli/Jon Ogden type. And, while a solid player, Brick certainly is not nearly on the level of any of the guys I mentioned.

I wanted Brick with the fourth pick of that draft. And if not that, then I wanted a trade down for Cutler. I actually preferred Cutler, but four was "too high" to take him. **** that...I wish we'd reached now.

[aec4]

Are you serious?

Brick>McNeil

I wouldn't want to live on the difference between the 2 players..

Brick at his price < McNeil at his.

[124]

Are you serious?

Brick>McNeil

Are YOU serious?

There isn't a big gap, but McNeil so far has been the better LT. D'Brick's best year so far came in 2008 when Alan Faneca showed up.

[NFLs StepChild]

I wouldn't want to live on the difference between the 2 players..

Brick at his price < McNeil at his.

McNeil looked downright poor at times this year. Brick has been upward since day 1. You have to let these guys play out and develop and not make it about their rookie years. Brick is a bonafide LT in this league and has come a long way in his run blocking to get to be a true franchsie LT. He was great this year.

McNeil walked into a situation where all he was asked to do was run block for LT and Rivers lived off the PA nicely that year and everyone looked great. Last year Rivers as the centerpiece, McNeil wasn't the all pro everyone made him out to be. Pass protection proved more difficult for him as he progressed. Brick has gotten consistently better in all phases and has more than lived up to his billing.

It's ridiculous to say that at his position he has to be a Pace or Boselli based on where he was picked. That's like saying any player in any draft has to become a hall of famer. So any WR in the 1st round had better be Jerry Rice, and any QB picked 1 overall had better be Peyton Manning or Elway or Aikman. No he has to be a franchise caliber LT for the long term. which he is.

[NFLs StepChild]

Are YOU serious?

There isn't a big gap, but McNeil so far has been the better LT. D'Brick's best year so far came in 2008 when Alan Faneca showed up.

LOL. Ok.

[SoFlaJets]

Josh McDaniel is supposedly pissed at his old boss for some reason isn't he? I can see this happening for that reason alone-oh yea it was b/c of the Casssell deal to Pioli and KC when Denver had a better offer on the table. Just one more of Beliscum's ex-employees who hate his guts.

[ZachEY]

D'Brick is still a disappointment to me, because when you draft a tackle that high, you are expecting an Orlando Pace/Tony Boselli/Jon Ogden type. And, while a solid player, Brick certainly is not nearly on the level of any of the guys I mentioned.

I wanted Brick with the fourth pick of that draft. And if not that, then I wanted a trade down for Cutler. I actually preferred Cutler, but four was "too high" to take him. **** that...I wish we'd reached now.

I'm not sure guys like that exist anymore. Schemes have gotten more complex, and DE's have become more complete athletes.

I'm happy with D'Brick.

[afosomf]

Josh McDaniel is supposedly pissed at his old boss for some reason isn't he? I can see this happening for that reason alone-oh yea it was b/c of the Casssell deal to Pioli and KC when Denver had a better offer on the table. Just one more of Beliscum's ex-employees who hate his guts.

if joshie was pissed at mumbles, a trade to jets would be his next move.

i think joshie was late to the table and doubt that mumbles was too dumb to turn down a #1 pick.

that said I hope joshie can't stand mumbles guts and trades him to us.

[NFLs StepChild]

Josh McDaniel is supposedly pissed at his old boss for some reason isn't he? I can see this happening for that reason alone-oh yea it was b/c of the Casssell deal to Pioli and KC when Denver had a better offer on the table. Just one more of Beliscum's ex-employees who hate his guts.

Hell than pass him over to us for dirt cheap, allowing the Jets to be holding the cards for not giving up too much for him and be able to cut ties if he goes TO in the lockerroom. Also you can hold it over his head that he was had for peanuts because he is percieved as Jeff George and we could then submarine his career if he pulls any more crap by releasing him and citing lockerrom chemistry issues. He'd then be out chasing opportunities for much less money and have a long journeyman career. There's a lot of upside to the kid, but if the Jets are the ones in the drivers seat and everybody including Cutler knows Rex is the man in control, then ok. We could win with him if he's properly managed. But Bart Scott or whoever the leader is needs to know that he can go punch him in the mouth for being a douchebag without fear of retribution for touching the untouchable QB. In fact take away Cutlers Red jersey in practice for the 1st week and set the tone.

[Irish Jet]

McNeil has been pretty awful after his rookie season. D'Brick has developed into a much better player.

That being said, it's pointless. We have what we have. Cutler is obviously looking head and shoulders above any other QB in that draft class. If we can get him we should but I would not give up Revis, Brick or Mangold like some others were suggesting. Not sure why Denver would be radically chasing those players either. When they trade Cutler QB is there #1 priority.

[aec4]

McNeil looked downright poor at times this year. Brick has been upward since day 1. You have to let these guys play out and develop and not make it about their rookie years. Brick is a bonafide LT in this league and has come a long way in his run blocking to get to be a true franchsie LT. He was great this year.

McNeil walked into a situation where all he was asked to do was run block for LT and Rivers lived off the PA nicely that year and everyone looked great. Last year Rivers as the centerpiece, McNeil wasn't the all pro everyone made him out to be. Pass protection proved more difficult for him as he progressed. Brick has gotten consistently better in all phases and has more than lived up to his billing.

It's ridiculous to say that at his position he has to be a Pace or Boselli based on where he was picked. That's like saying any player in any draft has to become a hall of famer. So any WR in the 1st round had better be Jerry Rice, and any QB picked 1 overall had better be Peyton Manning or Elway or Aikman. No he has to be a franchise caliber LT for the long term. which he is.

I'd argue Ferguson has looked poor from day 1. He's the weak link on that side of the line by far.

[Sharrow]

Lol, he ****ed up big time with this Cutler thing, and NE threw him to the wolves, imo. I bet in his mind, the deal for Cassel was already done.

[neckdemon]

why don't you guys work for an NFL team, you have everything figured out, years later...

we could have had Jerry Rice too instead of Al Toon , if only the Jets knew then right????

i was yelling and screaming that we shoudl have taken brady in the 6th round that year..........but people were saying it was a reach.

[NFLs StepChild]

I'd argue Ferguson has looked poor from day 1. He's the weak link on that side of the line by far.

I'd argue that you have not been paying attention then. Faneca was fading down the stretch and was a weaklink at OG in pass protection. He still can run block, but is not close to the player he once was. We are severely overpaying for him and need to atart looking for his replacement immediately. Brick on the otherhand was looking very good in pass protections and had been improving steadily all year in his run blocking. Brick outplayed Faneca in the 2nd half of the season and it is clear. Go watch the tape if you don't believe me.

[Larz]

I think this will result in a trade to the browns, or cutler gets an extension with a big raise to stay in denver.

I really can't see the broncos trying to sell Brett "my arm is shot, I won't get surgery to fix it or come to mini-camps to learn a new offense, you see I like hunting" favre to their fans

but lets play fantasy and say tanny gets it done for favre and 3 picks

cutler just aint worth the 3 picks

he has 42 turnovers in 37 starts

he has a losing record as a starter

he has as many playoff wins as ainge

his TD/INT ratio has been getting worse as he goes

coming down the stretch, he couldn't muster up a win 3 straight weeks, when one win would have gotten them in

not one win in three tries

is that a savior you give up 3 picks for ?

NO

and a thin skinned primma donna in NY ?

a thin skinned guy in NY ?

if this happens, I give it 4 weeks before jets fans start asking, "was the trade worth it ?"

[afosomf]

I think this will result in a trade to the browns, or cutler gets an extension with a big raise to stay in denver.

I really can't see the broncos trying to sell Brett "my arm is shot, I won't get surgery to fix it or come to mini-camps to learn a new offense, you see I like hunting" favre to their fans

but lets play fantasy and say tanny gets it done for favre and 3 picks

cutler just aint worth the 3 picks

he has 42 turnovers in 37 starts

he has a losing record as a starter

he has as many playoff wins as ainge

his TD/INT ratio has been getting worse as he goes

coming down the stretch, he couldn't muster up a win 3 straight weeks, when one win would have gotten them in

not one win in three tries

is that a savior you give up 3 picks for ?

NO

and a thin skinned primma donna in NY ?

a thin skinned guy in NY ?

if this happens, I give it 4 weeks before jets fans start asking, "was the trade worth it ?"

you are in the minority skippy

[NFLs StepChild]

if this happens, I give it 4 weeks before jets fans start asking, "was the trade worth it ?"

You are too generous.