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JN Mafia Game 2: Dawn of The Dead Edition


ZachEY

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These are two more things that bothered me early on about vicious but let it slide.

Day 1 votes are usually random, especially early on in the game. I'm pretty sure vicious was aware of this fact.

again, day 1 lynches are for the most part random and the probability says that it's more likely to get a townie than a mafia member. Suspicion goes more for people who bandwagon more than people who start off the vote.

Vicious is a smart guy with experience. Again, i'm confident that Vicious already knew this part of the game.

Funny words coming from a guy who was on every single bandwagon.

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Sorry if my reasoning ain't good enough for you tough guy. It'll be interesting if you can circle the wagons around me cause that'll put the bulls-eye squarely on you when you find out I'm a townie. I pointed to his reply to JB, and him saying "it stinks" he was acknowledging his inactivity. He didn't defend it, he acknowledged he should be posting more. A mafia member would've sooner made an excuse as to why he was inactive.

Your reasoning is sound, but your targeting the wrong guy.

I fully understand the implication. If you are townie i'm the next guy to go. There's really no question about it. I'm not wavering though because I actually believe in this.

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I fully understand the implication. If you are townie i'm the next guy to go. There's really no question about it. I'm not wavering though because I actually believe in this.

So make that 2 games in a row your bringing unwarranted focus on yourself for. I'm innocent. I've been forthright and given you my reasons. It's a gut feeling which happens in these games, sorry it's not a mathematically calculated reason. 1+1 does not always = 2 in these games.

My hope is that you don't waste your vote when we could be close to lynching a mafia.

One other thing. If I was mafia... why the hell would I make myself so vulnerable in the straight wide open from the get go? I've been one of the most active people in this thread. No offense, I still think you're an innocent but you're being dumb in wasting your vote.

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So make that 2 games in a row your bringing unwarranted focus on yourself for. I'm innocent. I've been forthright and given you my reasons. It's a gut feeling which happens in these games, sorry it's not a mathematically calculated reason. 1+1 does not always = 2 in these games.

My hope is that you don't waste your vote when we could be close to lynching a mafia.

One other thing. If I was mafia... why the hell would I make myself so vulnerable in the straight wide open from the get go? I've been one of the most active people in this thread. No offense, I still think you're an innocent but you're being dumb in wasting your vote.

I'm not saying i'm 100 percent certain that you are mafia, i mean who could be? But why are you getting so defensive over one vote? Norway has 4 you aren't even the vote leader. I just pointed out something I found suspicious and I wasn't satisfied with your answer. If it looks like my reasoning is faulty or that they believe you more other people are free to not vote you vicious.

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I'm not saying i'm 100 percent certain that you are mafia, i mean who could be? But why are you getting so defensive over one vote? Norway has 4 you aren't even the vote leader. I just pointed out something I found suspicious and I wasn't satisfied with your answer. If it looks like my reasoning is faulty or that they believe you more other people are free to not vote you vicious.

Cause quite frankly, its' a wasted vote.

It's a free choice. Just like I'm free to defend myself. Plus I'm pretty active in this thread and the topic of the moment is me. We'll see were it goes.

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hmm... interesting stuff going on...

I agree with JIF, particularly about WP posting so quickly after being voted for. That needs to be explained satisfactorily..

JVOR might be on to something as well. The timing of that is a bit curious, in Vicious's favor though he hadn't tried to capitalize off his "call"... but... numerous proclamations of players innocence is suspicious cause scum are the only ones who know who's innocent and who isn't..

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hmm... interesting stuff going on...

I agree with JIF, particularly about WP posting so quickly after being voted for. That needs to be explained satisfactorily..

JVOR might be on to something as well. The timing of that is a bit curious, in Vicious's favor though he hadn't tried to capitalize off his "call"... but... numerous proclamations of players innocence is suspicious cause scum are the only ones who know who's innocent and who isn't..

Perhaps this is a poor play on my part. I understand the "trust no one" mentality. But that bit me square in the rear last time. I'm trying to believe in some people (you included CTM) so I've publicly stated who I think is innocent or not.

I agree on JiF's post on WP, and what's more curious is how he happened to sweep in, make one post, and bow out only to be forgotten in the argument between JVOR and myself.

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Well, my vote for Irish was just based on wanting to stir the pot, and I changed my vote. My vote for JB was based on a scum vibe that was obvioulsy incorrect, but I was far from alone.

Well, I'd had a few ****tails, and there wasn't much to analyze so was just having some fun. But you guys are way off. I'm already halfway to lynched, but I don't think there is much of a case on me. I guarantee I'm a townie, don't make another mistake.

This defense feels a little half hearted, particularly from an edgy poster such as yourself.. I'm comfortable with my vote..

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hmm... interesting stuff going on...

I agree with JIF, particularly about WP posting so quickly after being voted for. That needs to be explained satisfactorily..

JVOR might be on to something as well. The timing of that is a bit curious, in Vicious's favor though he hadn't tried to capitalize off his "call"... but... numerous proclamations of players innocence is suspicious cause scum are the only ones who know who's innocent and who isn't..

I was on shortly after he voted for me so I responded. I was not around much this weekend which is why I didn't post then. Its really nothing more than that.

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Well, that's that.... Dont' blame anyone who voted JB really. The caught in a stretch of the truth thing was pretty convincing and I would've insisted she claim a power role or hammered her myself there. Alluding to a power role to save your ass and then backing off is VERY scummy, scum will do that to cause the town to back off without having to commit to an actual role reveal that can easily be counter claimed.

For those that think we gained nothing today, I disagree. We had two wagons go to within -3 and a player martyred herself who admitted she'd be highly unavailable for a week or so. This actually happened once before with JB I believe and the game slowed to a crawl. Also, we managed to make it through day 1 without outing a cop or doctor which is also an accomplishment. Far to often the power role acts like mafia in the early stage as they are also hiding something. It's easy to confuse the two. So, obviously nabbing mafia would've been ideal but it's not often that it actually happens on day 1 and I think we had the second best case scenario..

before night ends, I'd like to look at the wagons..

I've taken the liberty of highlighting those of us that were eager enough to be on 2 fast moving day 1 wagons. I'm going to lower doggin's scum level a bit as he was #1 on the JB wagon and #2 on IJ, as he'd really have no idea that a wagon was going to form at that point. Anyone's whose played enough with me knows I like to look at positions 3, 5, L-1 as great scum wagon votes as they are inconspicuous but serve to add momentum to the wagon. I find it very interesting that Norway and JVOR were in my favorite scum finding spots on both wagons.

Well, there weren't that many people playing at that point. I had the time so I was monitoring closely and wanted to help spur some action/responses from the accused.

Vote: Vicious

Even though JVoR is helping to get me lynched, I like his thoughts on Vic. It's so well known that Day one lynches are a crap-shoot, why use Day one bandwagoning to start a case?

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Perhaps this is a poor play on my part. I understand the "trust no one" mentality. But that bit me square in the rear last time. I'm trying to believe in some people (you included CTM) so I've publicly stated who I think is innocent or not.

I agree on JiF's post on WP, and what's more curious is how he happened to sweep in, make one post, and bow out only to be forgotten in the argument between JVOR and myself.

Hey man, these are all just clues. As you know being active puts a target on your back cause everything you do/say gets scrutinized more. I don't think you are playing poorly at all, but you are doing something mildly suspicious particularly due to the timing of the SMC call.

At the end of the day, it's hard for the town to win without a successful cop investigation and there's a reason for that. On some sites they like to do role reveals right out of the gate to help keep the cop alive and focus his scum hunting. I know for a fact we would've won last game had we done it. The only issue is that the game becomes too mechanical when played out this way. I enjoy trying to find scum the old fashion way.

In order to do it the old fashion way, the most crucial thing to do is force people into contributing, create multiple wagons, avoiding speed lynches, etc..The more people move votes around and offer opinions, the better the chance they slip up a bit a create a pattern that can be found. I will tell you right now that Norway is my favorite as scum, but I will unvote if he's getting speed lynched. Not because I think he's innocent, but just to slow the process down a bit and make more people offer their thoughts..

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Well, there weren't that many people playing at that point. I had the time so I was monitoring closely and wanted to help spur some action/responses from the accused.

Vote: Vicious

Even though JVoR is helping to get me lynched, I like his thoughts on Vic. It's so well known that Day one lynches are a crap-shoot, why use Day one bandwagoning to start a case?

Because it's all we got...

The good thing about cases is they aren't static and evolve with new information..

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Hey man, these are all just clues. As you know being active puts a target on your back cause everything you do/say gets scrutinized more. I don't think you are playing poorly at all, but you are doing something mildly suspicious particularly due to the timing of the SMC call.

At the end of the day, it's hard for the town to win without a successful cop investigation and there's a reason for that. On some sites they like to do role reveals right out of the gate to help keep the cop alive and focus his scum hunting. I know for a fact we would've won last game had we done it. The only issue is that the game becomes too mechanical when played out this way. I enjoy trying to find scum the old fashion way.

In order to do it the old fashion way, the most crucial thing to do is force people into contributing, create multiple wagons, avoiding speed lynches, etc..The more people move votes around and offer opinions, the better the chance they slip up a bit a create a pattern that can be found. I will tell you right now that Norway is my favorite as scum, but I will unvote if he's getting speed lynched. Not because I think he's innocent, but just to slow the process down a bit and make more people offer their thoughts..

I'd love to role reveal. But I don't think it'd be wise to at this time. If the vote gets to within 2 I'll do it.

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I'd love to role reveal. But I don't think it'd be wise to at this time. If the vote gets to within 2 I'll do it.

no.. I was talking about a mass role reveal.. where everyone has to reveal (except the doctor). You don't do that unless everyone agrees to it

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no.. I was talking about a mass role reveal.. where everyone has to reveal (except the doctor). You don't do that unless everyone agrees to it

OOHHHH. Still. I think I'll stick to my statement, if my vote tally gets to within 2 I'll reveal. It'd be fair to the town.

Is it just me or is it not all that mind blowing that throughout this JVOR and Norway are paired up... again.

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That's very suspicious. I'm not sure they could be that dumb though.

I'd like to point out that Norway basically paraphrased my answer for his reason to vote. Mine was more specific and most importantly was posted first. He's also piggybacking off of my vote. The only thing i've done after Norway was vote for Irish Jet and JB, which i already described my reasons for. Believe me, i'm not happy he's taking actions that look like it links us together because it's making me look bad.

and norway, you still haven't posted any original analysis in this thread.

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That's very suspicious. I'm not sure they could be that dumb though.

Agreed which still leads me to believe that JVOR (although voting for me) is innocent and Norway is voting right after JVOR to keep it muddled. JVOR isn't exactly helping his case going after me, and if I'm lynched, he'll have a big fat bulls-eye on his head. Norway jumping in would keep them linked and if I'm lynched, an innocent, then dont' you think that they can use the fact that JVOR spearheaded this and then Norway joined in with him against JVOR?

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OOHHHH. Still. I think I'll stick to my statement, if my vote tally gets to within 2 I'll reveal. It'd be fair to the town.

Is it just me or is it not all that mind blowing that throughout this JVOR and Norway are paired up... again.

Not surprising at all at this point. I kinda like CTM's idea about multiple trains rather than just pushing to get Norway decapitated, however at this point this is 3 votes they've backed each other up on. If Norway is a brain eater like we suspect, we should set a record in the speed in which we take care of JVOR.

However, it can not be completely ruled out that proposing a mass role reveal and spreading votes out could be the work of scum trying to either figure out who's got what special powers or take some pressure off of fellow scum leading to a random kill.

One more thing to consider is a sylar-like character (or in this case a Tom Savini-like biker who storms into our mall and looks to kill ANYTHING that moves).

I'm also a bit surprised by Thor's lack of involvement. Here I figured being locked up in a small area with 13 other guys would be like a dream for him.

In the end we've got some stuff to be suspicious of now, but nothing solid enough to make me change my vote off of Norway

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So make that 2 games in a row your bringing unwarranted focus on yourself for. I'm innocent. I've been forthright and given you my reasons. It's a gut feeling which happens in these games, sorry it's not a mathematically calculated reason. 1+1 does not always = 2 in these games.

My hope is that you don't waste your vote when we could be close to lynching a mafia.

One other thing. If I was mafia... why the hell would I make myself so vulnerable in the straight wide open from the get go? I've been one of the most active people in this thread. No offense, I still think you're an innocent but you're being dumb in wasting your vote.

You're not close to lynching a mafia, I'm a townie. And how does being active make you less suspicious? You're savvy enough to be active but not incriminate yourself. The inactives (Woody, Thor) look every bit as scummy as you do, if not more.

CTN says that all we have to go are the voting patterns. That's true to a degree. But if I'm lynched for a whimsical vote for Irish (later unvoted) and a vote for JB, that she earned and half the game agreed with, so be it.

In fact, this is the first vot, imo, that actually has some value, in terms of creating data. If I'm lynched, take a close look at Thor, CTM, Vic, etc....

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I'd like to point out that Norway basically paraphrased my answer for his reason to vote. Mine was more specific and most importantly was posted first. He's also piggybacking off of my vote. The only thing i've done after Norway was vote for Irish Jet and JB, which i alreadydescribed my reasons for. Believe me, i'm not happy he's taking actions that look like it links us together because it's making me look bad.

and norway, you still haven't posted any original analysis in this thread.

Is that all? :rolleyes:

Right, I put my votes in before you, but I'm piggybacking? Please.

Only thing Thor does is drop in to vote but no suspicion there? I just feel that I've not been scummy at all. I know I'm innocent.

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Not surprising at all at this point. I kinda like CTM's idea about multiple trains rather than just pushing to get Norway decapitated, however at this point this is 3 votes they've backed each other up on. If Norway is a brain eater like we suspect, we should set a record in the speed in which we take care of JVOR.

However, it can not be completely ruled out that proposing a mass role reveal and spreading votes out could be the work of scum trying to either figure out who's got what special powers or take some pressure off of fellow scum leading to a random kill.

One more thing to consider is a sylar-like character (or in this case a Tom Savini-like biker who storms into our mall and looks to kill ANYTHING that moves).

I'm also a bit surprised by Thor's lack of involvement. Here I figured being locked up in a small area with 13 other guys would be like a dream for him.

In the end we've got some stuff to be suspicious of now, but nothing solid enough to make me change my vote off of Norway

Again, what the hell have I personally done to indicate i'm linked to Norway. He's the one following me around and trying to maintain a linkage.

Like I said i'm not 100 percent certain vicious is mafia, he's still acted suspicious but that doesn't confirm that he's guilty. So you guys decide what is more beneficial. Have 3 wagons up right now or switching my vote to Norway. Like I said, he's still has not tried to contribute an original analysis even though i've asked him to twice already.

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Honestly i don't know what the best thing to do here. On the one hand, we don't want to speed lynch Norway, but at the same time I hate the fact that he's trying to bring me down with him.

Unvote: Vicious

Vote: Norway

I'm still wary of Vicious and I don't think i'm wrong about the inconsistency in his posting, but I think i laid out enough for the cop in the town to be curious enough to investigate vicious.

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Sorry for missing most of the morning, but to catch up I just wanted to throw out a few quick thoughts on the things I caught. For starters, regarding the vote-getters so far:

Norway - The voting tendency is certainly sketchy, but considering it was day one (aka random votes) I generally was a little less suspicious of it . Certainly something to keep an eye on, but that alone hasn't given me enough reason to be sure about him. His avoidance of the issues certainly ads some fuel to that fire though and he certainly got defensive (which lead to now voting for one of the people most convinced of his guilt).

Vicious - I'm not entirely sold yet on the initial reasoning given against Vic, but I also don't buy some of the responses either. Based on past experience, I don't think the level of contribution necessarily means one thing or another for a persons guilt, so I don't buy that as a defense.

Also, I'm not sure I understand the point of hinting at a role without revealing. Its pretty much the same thing JB did (and it basically got her killed). The problem is you're either lying or just made yourself target #1 for the mafia. If you are on the town's side, the mafia now knows you have a role, yet the rest of us only know you claim to have a role. Without knowing what it is, nobody can possibly counter-claim and we don't even know what kind of extra info you have that could be of benefit. I guess my point is, knowing a player has a role, but not what it is, seems like a bigger mafia advantage than a town one, which makes me a little suspicious of why someone would put that out there with only two votes on them.

Woody - The problem with him actually exists with a few other people so far and is something I'm pretty sure somebody already pointed out about Norway too. Which is being around while not getting mixed up in debate. The fact is that with few exceptions, the more people talk in this game the more likely they are to become a target, so laying low is an obvious tactic. Its not just him and a few guys here probably need to be prodded a bit. At the very least to get them talking more and then it at least gives the rest of us something to go on about them.

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Sorry for missing most of the morning, but to catch up I just wanted to throw out a few quick thoughts on the things I caught. For starters, regarding the vote-getters so far:

Vicious - I'm not entirely sold yet on the initial reasoning given against Vic, but I also don't buy some of the responses either. Based on past experience, I don't think the level of contribution necessarily means one thing or another for a persons guilt, so I don't buy that as a defense.

Also, I'm not sure I understand the point of hinting at a role without revealing. Its pretty much the same thing JB did (and it basically got her killed). The problem is you're either lying or just made yourself target #1 for the mafia. If you are on the town's side, the mafia now knows you have a role, yet the rest of us only know you claim to have a role. Without knowing what it is, nobody can possibly counter-claim and we don't even know what kind of extra info you have that could be of benefit. I guess my point is, knowing a player has a role, but not what it is, seems like a bigger mafia advantage than a town one, which makes me a little suspicious of why someone would put that out there with only two votes on them.

It's simple, you do that early on and you dissuade people from voting for you, while at the same time preventing a counter claim. Vicious knows how to play this game, like I said he's an intelligent guy.

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After reading through the thread my vote is on Woody.

JiF made some great points in regards to your his inactivity which just so happened to stop once he was called out. Now that's not what has me ireally suspicious as I can understand that it's easier to post in this thread when you have a good reason. What I do find scummy though is the attempts at activity in the earlier part of the thread. He was posting without saying or doing anything to contribute. He really does look as though he was trying to fly under the radar.

Vote: WoodyPaige

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After reading through the thread my vote is on Woody.

JiF made some great points in regards to your his inactivity which just so happened to stop once he was called out. Now that's not what has me ireally suspicious as I can understand that it's easier to post in this thread when you have a good reason. What I do find scummy though is the attempts at activity in the earlier part of the thread. He was posting without saying or doing anything to contribute. He really does look as though he was trying to fly under the radar.

Vote: WoodyPaige

Ninja'd..

This is good as I prefer to have two competing wagons... anyone who votes on either side should offer an explanation of why they are choosing one over the other.. If you are voting someone else, explain why you like them better then the current town favorites.. (in other words, don't feel like you have to vote for one of these two )

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Ninja'd..

This is good as I prefer to have two competing wagons... anyone who votes on either side should offer an explanation of why they are choosing one over the other.. If you are voting someone else, explain why you like them better then the current town favorites.. (in other words, don't feel like you have to vote for one of these two )

Fair enough.

I dont like the case against Norway. Everyone was throwing out random votes. It was day 1, that is common. In fact, if you want to look into the random voting, Doggin was all over the place. And you were pretty much following him on everything, followed by JVOR.

Personally, I think my case against Woody is solid. If you notice my earlier post, he provided nothing at all, and truly hasnt yet to this moment. I baited him, and he took it. He hasnt posted since Friday, and then very shortly after I vote him, he miraculously appears. This is coming from the guy who is only over here at JN to play mafia. Maybe the "Where's SMC" post was purely coincedence, maybe not.

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Ninja'd..

This is good as I prefer to have two competing wagons... anyone who votes on either side should offer an explanation of why they are choosing one over the other.. If you are voting someone else, explain why you like them better then the current town favorites.. (in other words, don't feel like you have to vote for one of these two )

I really don't see much in Norway thus far. It was day one so I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. Even though I was one of the people he was voting for I can understand it. Day one is incredibly unreliable when it comes to analyzing voting patterns and I do think we're grasping at straws when accusing Norway. His defense was a little hazy though, more so than it probably had to be. I would stay suspicious of him for that reason, but not enough to vote for him.

I do just find Woody's posting to be very strange at this point. The fact that his only post with any real substance comes directly after he gets a vote intrigues me. I would never vote too strongly for someone based on inactivity as I understand more than anyone how difficult it can be to get a chance to post. That isn't the issue with Woody, it's the timing and content of his posts which have me suspicious.

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