#27TheDominator Posted April 2, 2009 Share Posted April 2, 2009 Exactly. All these people falling in love with Pettigrew will realize he's nothing more than Daniel Graham, and what a waste of a 1st round pick that will be. Take a Wide Receiver who will START, as opposed to a blocking Tight End that you can get in Round 3 or Round 4. If you take a blocking TE at 17 and a WR in Round 3 or Round 4, you have 0 starters. Do it the other way around, at least you have two starters. Pettigrew = Trash. I don't know about trash, but one of the things to be considered is the fact that these guys aren't necessarily worth keeping around beyond their rookie deals. Sure guys like Becht and Kyle Brady (shouldn't that be Kyle *****?) last 10-15 years in the league, but if they are only under contract for 4-5 of those years what's the big ****ing deal about that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted April 2, 2009 Author Share Posted April 2, 2009 I hear you, brother, and you KNOW I have a hard-on for tight ends (and, tight ends), but you have to admit that all holes are not created equally (snicker). You can fill the "blocking TE" role with a later pick, no? We are talking about position investment here. Look at the Colts and the Giants (when they had Shockey)--they went and FOUND guys to pinch the D-end, they didn't burn a high pick to fill a niche role. You can in theory draft a guy later but it takes years to groom him. baker took 3 years to become an NFL player. You mention the Giants with Shockey well he could block and catch and was a first round pick. The Jets didn't draft a Shockey when they took Keller, They took a Dallas Clark or Chris Cooley type. They need someone to block but also be a threat in passing. A 2009 4th round pick might not even be ready to see the field until 2011. If these mid rounders were ready to start they wouldn't be mid rounders. Ask yourself this question:: Would Bill Polian do it? Bill Polian could take a crap in a brown paper bag and tell the team it's the first round pick and it wouldn't matter because they have Payton Manning. without Payton Manning the Colts are a 1-15 squad. So i don't think WWBPD is a relevant question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted April 2, 2009 Share Posted April 2, 2009 You can in theory draft a guy later but it takes years to groom him. baker took 3 years to become an NFL player. You mention the Giants with Shockey well he could block and catch and was a first round pick. The Jets didn't draft a Shockey when they took Keller, They took a Dallas Clark or Chris Cooley type. They need someone to block but also be a threat in passing. A 2009 4th round pick might not even be ready to see the field until 2011. If these mid rounders were ready to start they wouldn't be mid rounders. But Pettigrew is ready to start from Day One? Kind of a reach, yes? TE's take some time to develop, unless they're athletic Tony Gonzalez-like freaks, because no position on the football field is more different from college to pro than LB. In the college ranks, LB's are played by slow safeties or skinny NT's--in the NFL, you see three or four elite athletes playing the position on every team (but the Jets). Young TE's, unless they can run past these LB's,, take time to adjust to beating 245 lb. freaks running toe to toe with them. Pettigrew is a 4-7 guy with a pretty good body. It's going to take him a while. Bill Polian could take a crap in a brown paper bag and tell the team it's the first round pick and it wouldn't matter because they have Payton Manning. without Payton Manning the Colts are a 1-15 squad. So i don't think WWBPD is a relevant question. Come on now, bit. You're not really going to make me defend Bill Polian's record as a GM, are you? I agree that Peyton is a difference changer, but show me where he went out and burned multiple high picks to fill niche positions. He doesn't do it. None of the big GM's do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted April 2, 2009 Author Share Posted April 2, 2009 But Pettigrew is ready to start from Day One? Kind of a reach, yes? TE's take some time to develop, unless they're athletic Tony Gonzalez-like freaks, because no position on the football field is more different from college to pro than LB. In the college ranks, LB's are played by slow safeties or skinny NT's--in the NFL, you see three or four elite athletes playing the position on every team (but the Jets). Young TE's, unless they can run past these LB's,, take time to adjust to beating 245 lb. freaks running toe to toe with them. Pettigrew is a 4-7 guy with a pretty good body. It's going to take him a while. Yes he starts day 1. No because of his run blocking and pass blocking he's not a reach (daniel graham but taller is a good comparison, he went I believe 21 overall and won multiple rings with NE). Pettigrew won't run past LBs but he's physical enough to jockey for position and get off the jams. He's a better route runner and receiver than people give him credit for... he's not like a big TE he's more like a small LT who can catch, he's that good of a blocker. And I can personally say from watching him in Mobile, his hands are extremely reliable. watch this clip http://draftguys.com/index.php/articles/dgtv_1/brandon_pettigrew_video/ Come on now, bit. You're not really going to make me defend Bill Polian's record as a GM, are you? I agree that Peyton is a difference changer, but show me where he went out and burned multiple high picks to fill niche positions. He doesn't do it. None of the big GM's do. Go ahead and defend him if you like, let's be real. The Colts DL are big LBs. Their LBs are big Safeties. and their Safeties are like the Lollypop guild. Without Payton Manning that team is a disaster, and it's easy to not make big moves when you have a HOF possible best ever QB on your team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aten Posted April 2, 2009 Share Posted April 2, 2009 Go ahead and defend him if you like, let's be real. The Colts DL are big LBs. Their LBs are big Safeties. and their Safeties are like the Lollypop guild. Without Payton Manning that team is a disaster, and it's easy to not make big moves when you have a HOF possible best ever QB on your team. Defend Polian? Pairing Manning with Dungy's Tampa 2 was an absolute masterstroke in terms of personnel strategy. Everybody used to laugh at the way the Colts always seemed to ignore the defense in favor of more and more overkill on offense, but that of course completely ignores that they were doing things that way by design. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 Yes he starts day 1. No because of his run blocking and pass blocking he's not a reach (daniel graham but taller is a good comparison, he went I believe 21 overall and won multiple rings with NE). Pettigrew won't run past LBs but he's physical enough to jockey for position and get off the jams. He's a better route runner and receiver than people give him credit for... he's not like a big TE he's more like a small LT who can catch, he's that good of a blocker. And I can personally say from watching him in Mobile, his hands are extremely reliable. . Hey, I LIKE Pettigrew. I think he's a nice prospect, but not for the Jets. And I don't know if you want to use Graham as your example, man: Belichick started angling to replace him almost as soon as he was drafted. How many TE's were brought in after him until he was finally allowed to walk into obscurity with the--who--Broncos? BUT, Pettigrew, even in his most glowing reviews, is projected to be a nice, solid player. Is that what you want with your #17? Especially on a team with so many other holes? I am against this move not only because of the player, but also because of the position. The player is just ok, and the position is too specialized to justify the pick. If the roster was loaded, yes, you can start drafting niche players--nickel corners, blocking TE's, coveage LB's--but the Jets have to upgrade EVERY skill position. Answer this question: If the following players are on the board at #17, who do you take? --Percy Harvin --Pettigrew --Beanie Wells --Knowshon Moreno --Darrius Heyward Bey [url=http://draftguys.com/index.php/articles/dgtv_1/brandon_pettigrew_video/] Go ahead and defend him if you like, let's be real. The Colts DL are big LBs. Their LBs are big Safeties. and their Safeties are like the Lollypop guild. Without Payton Manning that team is a disaster, and it's easy to not make big moves when you have a HOF possible best ever QB on your team. You are still not answering the question: Would Polian OR Jimmy Johnson OR Bill Walsh OR (Pick a Big GM) make that move? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aten Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 Answer this question: If the following players are on the board at #17, who do you take? --Percy Harvin --Pettigrew --Beanie Wells --Knowshon Moreno --Darrius Heyward Bey Moreno. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted April 3, 2009 Share Posted April 3, 2009 Moreno. Wells >>>> Moreno Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted April 4, 2009 Share Posted April 4, 2009 Wells >>>> Moreno Depends, imo. I think Wells is a banger who would best be used in tandem with another back, splitting carries. Wells was banged up alot at Ohio State and might not be the bell-cow that his size would lead you to believe he is. Moreno, on the other hand, I think has the potential to have a prolific five-to-seven year stretch because of his versatility: he can catch, and has the wiggle to avoid contact. The day of Ottis Anderson is over. None of these big backs who seek contact stay healthy anymore now that safeties are 220 lbs., and LB's run 4.4's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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