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TJ for Braylon very possible


leonwash29
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The drops can also be attributable to the ineffectiveness of the offense as a whole. The worse the rest of the team is playing the worse everyone plays. The Cleveland Browns offense averaged 25 pts per game in 2007 last year they averaged 14.5.

In 2007 they attempted 34 passes for game and completed 56% last year 30 passes per game and only 48.7% completion rate. In 2007 the offense averaged 351 yards per game and last year only 249 yards per game.

The entire offense was god awful last year and yes Braylon had a lot of drops, compared to TOs 10 drops which I believe were second in the league followed by Dwayne Bowe and I think Coles had 8, Keller had 5. However, am I going to say dont trade a 31 year old RB who hasn't had that great of a career for a guy when on a good offense can be dominant? No way. He is 26, for his career he averaged 14.5 games a year, 57 receptions 889 yards 7 tds and less than 1 fumble per year and 15.6 yards per reception. this was done on an awful team. He will be flat out dominating in a jet uniform and he is only 26. His drops have not been a problem his entire year, his focus has been called into question, but with Rex and a good team i dont think that will be a problem. I have never really heard anything else bad about the guy. He is just what the jets need and if he can come that cheap he is a better choice than plex or boldin

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While I will agree he dropped some catchable balls, a lot were challenging catches and with the amount of balls thrown his way, 16 drops, while still a large number could also be due to inconsistent quarterback play and a lousy OLine. I watched a lot of Cleveland games just because the bar I go to to watch games shows everything so I get to see a lot.

I am pretty sure he had 16 drops in one game... lol

Seriously though... if you watched "a lot" of Browns games.... you would not be usng that 16 drops stat... you would know he dropped a bunch more and a lot of them an Olineman could have caught...

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I am pretty sure he had 16 drops in one game... lol

Seriously though... if you watched "a lot" of Browns games.... you would not be usng that 16 drops stat... you would know he dropped a bunch more and a lot of them an Olineman could have caught...

How about a defensive lineman? It seems more relevant, what with Kareem Brown being our TE and all...

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Forget it. You're in the past. Vitony hadn't had his turn yet. But his time had finally come.

Wow, I feel like its graduation day! I'm so excited, I've got my big boy pull ups on and everything!

But seriously, you would rather not trade TJ for Braylon? Or you wouldnt want Braylon on this team, because he had one lackluster season on a lousy team?

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Vitony and fellow Braylon supporters, its okay. They would rather David Clowney or Chansi Stuckey and we would rather Braylon Edwards. Yeah, I know, nobody is as good as the great David Clowney, silly us. Braylon Edwards doesn't put up fantastic numbers each year or anything, minus 2008 when he had to work with 3 Quarterbacks. Nah. ;)

Totally ignore every other single season he had, just look upon his one poor season, in which he STILL put up 873 yards, more than any New York Jet receiver had with the great Brett Favre.

In Clowney we trust. :rl:

Edited by 124
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Wow, I feel like its graduation day! I'm so excited, I've got my big boy pull ups on and everything!

But seriously, you would rather not trade TJ for Braylon? Or you wouldnt want Braylon on this team, because he had one lackluster season on a lousy team?

They are not equal. One makes $900K and the other wants at least $9-10M.

I have no objection to the talent we brought in, but at some point every position can't be filled with a $7-10M per year player until such time as there is no salary cap.

In addition to other FA's we may have interest in next year & beyond, extensions and reworked deals are also going to be needed soon for D'Brick, Mangold, Sheppard, Harris, and we need a lot of depth so everyone who isn't a starter isn't of the Jamal Westerman variety. Salaries for current players inked to big deals of late go UP as the contract goes on. Pace's cap numbers jump up to $7-8M. Bart Scott's contract is $8M/yr, but this year it counts under $6M. It won't in the future. We'll need replacement for Ellis before long, and if a draftee doesn't pan out we'll have to seek that out in FA, which will cost bucks.

I'm not saying Jones is more valuable than Edwards, nor that Clowney with his 1 career catch is either. But rather, Edwards isn't right now worth $10M per season plus a day one pick next year. If he was, someone would have traded for him already before the draft.

Whichever team trades for Edwards before the season starts will be doing so after analyzing their own talent in minicamp (or training camp) and it will be a move based in desperation rather than outright desire.

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Vitony and fellow Braylon supporters, its okay. They would rather David Clowney or Chansi Stuckey and we would rather Braylon Edwards. Yeah, I know, nobody is as good as the great David Clowney, silly us. Braylon Edwards doesn't put up fantastic numbers each year or anything, minus 2008 when he had to work with 3 Quarterbacks. Nah. ;)

Totally ignore every other single season he had, just look upon his one poor season, in which he STILL put up 873 yards, more than any New York Jet receiver had with the great Brett Favre.

In Clowney we trust. :rl:

You would have given $10M per year and a day one pick for Koren Robinson after his 2003 season ended.

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You would have given $10M per year and a day one pick for Koren Robinson after his 2003 season ended.

Actually, no I wouldn't have.

Braylon Edwards is my all-time favorite Michigan Wolverine. :)

He IS a Top 10 Wide Receiver, whether you'd care to admit it or not. 26 drops in one season does not change that.

I guess Terrell Owens sucks too. He's had the most drops of anyone the past 5 years.

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Actually, no I wouldn't have.

Braylon Edwards is my all-time favorite Michigan Wolverine. :)

He IS a Top 10 Wide Receiver, whether you'd care to admit it or not. 26 drops in one season does not change that.

I guess Terrell Owens sucks too. He's had the most drops of anyone the past 5 years.

TO is not worth 10 million per... neither is Edwards... that hurts the team more than it helps...

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Actually, no I wouldn't have.

Braylon Edwards is my all-time favorite Michigan Wolverine. :)

He IS a Top 10 Wide Receiver, whether you'd care to admit it or not. 26 drops in one season does not change that.

I guess Terrell Owens sucks too. He's had the most drops of anyone the past 5 years.

Whatever. One great stat year & he's a top 10 WR. Okay.

Yeah, he sure killed the Bengals, Rams, Cardinals, Raiders, Jets, 49ers and Dolphins reeeeal good in his stellar season. It would be great if that's what our schedule looked like. But then, we wouldn't really need to pass the ball like Cleveland needed to either.

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Whatever. One great stat year & he's a top 10 WR. Okay.

You can try to name 10 better receivers, but you can't. The same people who bash on Braylon Edwards think Brandon Marshall is a Top 10 WR. :rl:

And yes, totally disregard the Cleveland QB situation since Braylon has been there.

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Wow, I feel like its graduation day! I'm so excited, I've got my big boy pull ups on and everything!

But seriously, you would rather not trade TJ for Braylon? Or you wouldnt want Braylon on this team, because he had one lackluster season on a lousy team?

Would you replace Jones with a veteren? Michael Pittman, Duece, Deshaun Foster, someone like that? Or just go with Greene and Leon?

I'm just curious.I was a Boldin fan,but whatever they do, I can see why they did it.

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You can try to name 10 better receivers, but you can't. The same people who bash on Braylon Edwards think Brandon Marshall is a Top 10 WR. :rl:

And yes, totally disregard the Cleveland QB situation since Braylon has been there.

I'd take Brandon Marshall over Braylon Edwards. And I am pretty sure I could put together a list of 9 other guys I would take as well.

Regardless, I would love to get a guy like Braylon on our squad...but I dont think he is a top 10 WR.

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You can try to name 10 better receivers, but you can't. The same people who bash on Braylon Edwards think Brandon Marshall is a Top 10 WR. :rl:

And yes, totally disregard the Cleveland QB situation since Braylon has been there.

Better receivers?

Andre Johnson

Randy Moss

Wes Welker

Larry Fitzgerald

Anquan Boldin

Terrell Owens

Brandon Marshall

Reggie Wayne

Roddy White

Calvin Johnson

Greg Jennings

Steve Smith

Lee Evans

Donald Driver

Plaxico (if he's in the league)

Chad Johnson

Colston when he's healthy

Hines Ward

not to mention TE's who don't stay in to block on passing downs, are like oversized slot receivers like Gonzalez and Witten and Gates.

Edwards may have more innate talent and a longer future than some of these guys, but they are right now better football players. For Edwards to get a salary/contract higher than everyone here (and-or equal to Larry Fitzgerald) is insane.

Edited by Sperm Edwards
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Better receivers?

Andre Johnson

Randy Moss

Wes Welker

Larry Fitzgerald

Anquan Boldin

Terrell Owens

Brandon Marshall

Reggie Wayne

Roddy White

Calvin Johnson

Greg Jennings

Steve Smith

Lee Evans

Donald Driver

Plaxico (if he's in the league)

Chad Johnson

Colston when he's healthy

Hines Ward

not to mention TE's who don't stay in to block on passing downs, are like oversized slot receivers like Gonzalez and Witten and Gates.

Edwards may have more innate talent and a longer future than some of these guys, but they are right now better football players. For Edwards to get a salary/contract higher than everyone here (and-or equal to Larry Fitzgerald) is insane.

I will give you:

Plex (if he plays)

Ward (because of his toughness)

Fitz(because he is the best in the game)

Calvin Johnson (because he is the second best in the game)

Andre Johnson

TO

Randy Moss

Anquan Boldin (but I would rather have Braylon on this team cause Anquan is older and is Cotchery except with more publicity and better QB play)

Brandon Marshall (but I think Braylon is a tie, Marshall just has better QB play with Cutler, lets see how he is with Orton at the helm)

Out side of that I would say that Braylon is the 10th best. I will not give you Welker he is a system wideout who actually isnt that good just fast and they use him right. Roddy White, you have to be kidding me the guy just had his first good year, Braylon has been consistent with 800+ yards per season and a 15.6 yard per catch average.

Braylon is exactly what we need, he is not going to command 9-10 mil a season, I NEVER heard those demands (and with my work I am in a business that would have heard that) but he will comand upwards of 7. But with Tannenbaum the genius of the cap, we will backload it and make it friendly. He will stretch the field make big plays and open up the underneath for guys like Keller, Stuckey, Clowney to succeed. and if he costs a 31 year old JAG running back who we already replaced and a 2nd, its a no brainer.

I have been reading this board for a long time (along with JI) and Sperm I respect your opinion, but I think you are over analyzing this one.

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No one is saying he's the perfect solution but if Cotch + Clowney are our 1 and 2, Tanny should be fired after Game 1.

Right now, you'd have to pencil Stuckey into the other starting spot. He had 32 catches last year and looked pretty good, Clowney had one. Under that scenario, Dustin Keller is almost certainly the #2 man in receptions next year.

The Jets have needed a #1 WR for a long time. I'd take a chance on Edwards.

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Right now, you'd have to pencil Stuckey into the other starting spot. He had 32 catches last year and looked pretty good, Clowney had one. Under that scenario, Dustin Keller is almost certainly the #2 man in receptions next year.

The Jets have needed a #1 WR for a long time. I'd take a chance on Edwards.

Agree. You need to look in terms of:

(1) is this an upgrade -- DEFINITELY, UNDENIABLE "YES"

(2) can we get him for a fair price -- remains to be seen but if someone else gets him for a 2nd I'm gonna be effing pissed.

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I will give you:

Plex (if he plays)

Ward (because of his toughness)

Fitz(because he is the best in the game)

Calvin Johnson (because he is the second best in the game)

Andre Johnson

TO

Randy Moss

Anquan Boldin (but I would rather have Braylon on this team cause Anquan is older and is Cotchery except with more publicity and better QB play)

Brandon Marshall (but I think Braylon is a tie, Marshall just has better QB play with Cutler, lets see how he is with Orton at the helm)

Out side of that I would say that Braylon is the 10th best. I will not give you Welker he is a system wideout who actually isnt that good just fast and they use him right. Roddy White, you have to be kidding me the guy just had his first good year, Braylon has been consistent with 800+ yards per season and a 15.6 yard per catch average.

Braylon is exactly what we need, he is not going to command 9-10 mil a season, I NEVER heard those demands (and with my work I am in a business that would have heard that) but he will comand upwards of 7. But with Tannenbaum the genius of the cap, we will backload it and make it friendly. He will stretch the field make big plays and open up the underneath for guys like Keller, Stuckey, Clowney to succeed. and if he costs a 31 year old JAG running back who we already replaced and a 2nd, its a no brainer.

I have been reading this board for a long time (along with JI) and Sperm I respect your opinion, but I think you are over analyzing this one.

800 yards per season? You're serious? Jerricho Cotchery has three of those also. Is he a top-10 WR?

Roddy White did not just have his first good year. He has more good seasons than Braylon Edwards, as I don't consider 800 yards a good season for a WR with Edwards' ability & expectations. 2008 was White's his second straight 1200+ yard season. And don't even go there with QB play because last year his QB trio was Joey Harrington (10 games) & Chris Redman (4 games) & Byron Leftwich (2 games). Clearly you know very little about this player so I'll take that into account when you render your opinion about him. He's a friggin' stud.

Wes Welker is freakin' awesome and it pains me to say it. He is a different type of receiver than Edwards, but he is flat-out a better football player.

Lee Evans is freaking awesome. There isn't another legitimate target on the whole team to stop him from getting double-triple teamed every pass play, let alone someone like Winslow or Jurevicius. Peerless Price & Josh Reed. lol. He got a little time with a washed-up Bledsoe as a rookie and since then it's been JP Losman and Trent Edwards. Whatever low opinion you have of Derek Anderson (mine isn't too high either), both of these clowns are worse. Edwards is like Pennington without the accuracy or experience.

Wayne is just a better WR. Place the credit for that on Manning if you like, but Manning has other receivers who didn't do crap last year. Whether it's Manning or Anderson throwing the ball, if it hits your hands it hits your hands. He gets open even as the main target, and doesn't drop the ball nearly as much as Edwards. 80-odd catches & at most he dropped 3 or 4 (if he in fact even dropped that many).

Chad Johnson, for all his idiocy, is a better WR. Being injured & playing with Ryan Fitzpatrick last year doesn't make Braylon Edwards a better player. He's still only 31 and has plenty of football left in him.

Steve Smith is just a better WR and a better football player than Braylon Edwards. I can't see how anyone could think otherwise.

A couple of the others are debatable (Jennings, Driver, Colston), but Edwards isn't definitively a better WR than any of them.

Edwards has as much innate talent as anyone. Potential doesn't make him a top 10 WR. It means he has the potential to be one. His age may make his future brighter than some of these guys, but that doesn't make him a top 10 wideout today.

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No one is saying he's the perfect solution but if Cotch + Clowney are our 1 and 2, Tanny should be fired after Game 1.

If you're so sure the outcome will be a disaster why wait until after the game?

Agree. You need to look in terms of:

(1) is this an upgrade -- DEFINITELY, UNDENIABLE "YES"

(2) can we get him for a fair price -- remains to be seen but if someone else gets him for a 2nd I'm gonna be effing pissed.

I'll agree with this, except the "fair price" isn't just the trade compensation. It includes the contract. Edwards is a prima donna looking for $8-10M per year. That's where I'd balk. Not the 2nd and 5th or whatever it would probably take to get him (or Boldin)

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Roddy White is a decent receiver, but let me ask you something. How with 83, and 88 receptions respectively do you only have 6 and 7 touchdowns, not to mention that while Braylon did have dropsies last year Roddy perpetually has them as evidenced by his fumble problems also. He did have a good year last year with Ryan but once again it goes back to QB play. Atlanta has a good QB Roddy White does better, when Cleveland QBs were playing great than Braylon went off. One hand washes the other.

Wes Welker is another animal but I am sorry I do not value a lot of players from the Patriots because they are such system players, its like Duke Basketball, most those guys dont translate to the pro's but they play great in that system and produce a winning team. The Patriots have (and i hate saying it) the best system in place in all of football, they find guys that fit what they need. Welker was average for the Dolphins and then gets put in a spread system and is successful. We wont run that so he wont fit. Braylon will fit what we want to do long term. Rex will hopefully install a winning system where we can produce guys and find guys but we dont have it yet, but getting Braylon would go a long way and it would help Sanchez by having that saftey net, just throw it up there and Braylon will out jump or run someone and at least make a play on it.

I am all for Braylon, I would be fine with Boldin, I would be happy with Plex, but we need someone who is established opposite Cotchery otherwise its gonna be a long year for Sanchez and a lot of dinks and dunks down the field (a la Chad Pennington) because there is no one that needs to be feared besides Keller, Washington, Cotchery. Cotchery will see double coverage, Keller will draw a safety and whenever Leon is in he will have a LB shadowing his every move. Braylon or a wide-out of his ilk opens up the entire field, because now you have to play the Jets straight up.

You are correct that Braylon's potential is what makes him so attractive but he has already realized that potential when he made the probowl in his third season, last season was a down year for the entire organization. No matter where he plays this season, he will be GREAT. He is also the youngest and can work and grow with Sanchez for the longest amount of time.

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Calling Braylon Edwards a top 10 WR at this point is laughable. I think people really do underestimate just how bad he was last season. He had one great season and has the potnetial to be top 10 or even top 3 WR but based on what he's done through his career he's not even close.

For someone to claim that he's better than Reggie Wayne and especially Steve Smith (Who is probably as good or better than anyone not name Larry Fitzgerald) is lunacy.

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Better receivers?

Andre Johnson

Randy Moss

Wes Welker

Larry Fitzgerald

Anquan Boldin

Terrell Owens

Brandon Marshall

Reggie Wayne

Roddy White

Calvin Johnson

Greg Jennings

Steve Smith

Lee Evans

Donald Driver

Plaxico (if he's in the league)

Chad Johnson

Colston when he's healthy

Hines Ward

not to mention TE's who don't stay in to block on passing downs, are like oversized slot receivers like Gonzalez and Witten and Gates.

Edwards may have more innate talent and a longer future than some of these guys, but they are right now better football players. For Edwards to get a salary/contract higher than everyone here (and-or equal to Larry Fitzgerald) is insane.

I don't think Cotchery get enough credit. He's tough, he holds on to the ball he get to the marker. He makes magical catches, he floats, he cathes the ball with one and his shoulder pad while being dragged down. He's made on big play after another, whether it's a first down or a TD.

I think cothery can be a one if the definition of a one is the guy with the most catches and yards. What we need is a deep threat , a guy who will burn a corner one on one, therfore drawing attention from the safties, therefore opening up Cotchery, or Keller, or a Leon screen or a TJ draw , or a flea flicker. What's a one and a two, how about 1 and 1B?

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Calling Braylon Edwards a top 10 WR at this point is laughable. I think people really do underestimate just how bad he was last season. He had one great season and has the potnetial to be top 10 or even top 3 WR but based on what he's done through his career he's not even close.

For someone to claim that he's better than Reggie Wayne and especially Steve Smith (Who is probably as good or better than anyone not name Larry Fitzgerald) is lunacy.

Sorry I did leave those two out and that was my fault. I agree they are right now both better than Edwards but have also had more experience. In the case of Wayne he was the beneficiary of having Harrison on the opposite side and a guy by Peyton Manning throwing him the ball. Steve Smith is just an animal (or as he likes to call himself a big a** tree) he has never had a good corner and even without Muhammed he has produced. He is a true one much like Fitzgerald.

Cotchery is great, I live in NC and used to go to all the State games when they had Rivers and Cotch and he has just always been consistent and produced. He could be a one on this team if someone can open up the other side.

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Roddy White is a decent receiver, but let me ask you something. How with 83, and 88 receptions respectively do you only have 6 and 7 touchdowns, not to mention that while Braylon did have dropsies last year Roddy perpetually has them as evidenced by his fumble problems also. He did have a good year last year with Ryan but once again it goes back to QB play. Atlanta has a good QB Roddy White does better, when Cleveland QBs were playing great than Braylon went off. One hand washes the other.

Wes Welker is another animal but I am sorry I do not value a lot of players from the Patriots because they are such system players, its like Duke Basketball, most those guys dont translate to the pro's but they play great in that system and produce a winning team. The Patriots have (and i hate saying it) the best system in place in all of football, they find guys that fit what they need. Welker was average for the Dolphins and then gets put in a spread system and is successful. We wont run that so he wont fit. Braylon will fit what we want to do long term. Rex will hopefully install a winning system where we can produce guys and find guys but we dont have it yet, but getting Braylon would go a long way and it would help Sanchez by having that saftey net, just throw it up there and Braylon will out jump or run someone and at least make a play on it.

I am all for Braylon, I would be fine with Boldin, I would be happy with Plex, but we need someone who is established opposite Cotchery otherwise its gonna be a long year for Sanchez and a lot of dinks and dunks down the field (a la Chad Pennington) because there is no one that needs to be feared besides Keller, Washington, Cotchery. Cotchery will see double coverage, Keller will draw a safety and whenever Leon is in he will have a LB shadowing his every move. Braylon or a wide-out of his ilk opens up the entire field, because now you have to play the Jets straight up.

You are correct that Braylon's potential is what makes him so attractive but he has already realized that potential when he made the probowl in his third season, last season was a down year for the entire organization. No matter where he plays this season, he will be GREAT. He is also the youngest and can work and grow with Sanchez for the longest amount of time.

My point is that he is not a top 10 WR today right now. He has the potential to be one. Also, dismissing those who won't be in the league as long as him (going forward) eliminates those younger than he is. Some of those WRs will be better than Edwards and be in the league longer as well. The NFL's supply of top 10 WR's does not end with the current top 10.

He has great talent. He had one statistically great season when the overwhelming majority of the numbers were put up against garbage defenses. Whoopdie do.

I expect our offense to challenge defenses deep here & there. But if one of our current guys could be serviceable, frankly that $10M/yr is better spent on 4-5 $2M/yr backups at areas we're so thin like on the OL or DL. An injury to one or two of those starters could end the season without decent backups. The absence of Braylon Edwards does not.

And whether you've heard it at work or not, there's no way Edwards doesn't get a minimum of $9M/yr. When Coles, at 31 with concussion and turf toe history, and who once made a pro bowl 6 years ago, can get a $7M/yr contract...no way Edwards only gets the same money unless his agent is both drunk and high during negotiations.

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