GimmeShelter Posted September 15, 2005 Share Posted September 15, 2005 Mueller is a .300 hitter, Damon is right there for the batting title, Renteria is a pretty decent hitter. Nixon is pretty good as well. Lets not try to fit BS into our agendas by saying the sox lineup is better or worse without Ortiz than the Yankees lineup with or without Arod. Both have great hitters infront of them and behind them in the batting order. And I'd go out on a limb and guess that Ortiz has had more ABs with men on base than Arod has. Yankees without Arod arent in the playoff hunt, end of story. He has been clutch this team despite not hitting as many walkoffs as king kong in fenway, but he is still a better hitter, and a goldglove worthy 3rd baseman. Well EB that limb you went out on broke. You know how to look up splits. With RISP: Ortiz = 142 AB's...342 Avg which jumps to 370 w/ 2outs. 7 HR's 80 RBI's...592 Slg pct. ARod = 163 AB's ...276 AVG ....278 w/2 out. 6 HR's 64 RBI's...436 slg pct. Arod is in the race...Ortiz deserves it. Anyway didn't you kill ARod in April? How quickly we forget the ARod meaningless HR threads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PFSIKH Posted September 15, 2005 Share Posted September 15, 2005 Shelter here is all you need to know. Runners in scoring position Ortiz 142 ABs - .345 7 HRs 80 RBIs A-Rod 161 ABs - .273 6 HRs 63 RBIs Runners in Scoring Position w/2 outs Ortiz - 54 ABs - .370 5 HRs 33 RBIs A-Rod - 71 ABs - .282 4 HRs 31 RBIs Men on 2 out Ortiz - 88 ABs - .318 7 HRs 39 RBIs A-Rod - 113 ABs - .283 10 HRs 44 RBIs Men on 3rd less then 2 out Ortiz - 29 ABs - .345 29 RBIs A-Rod - 24 ABs - .292 17 RBIs Close and Late Ortiz - 69 ABs - .319 8 HRs 26 RBIs A-Rod - 67 ABs - .313 4 HRs 12 RBIs Bases Loaded Ortiz - 15 ABs - .400 2 HRs 20 RBIs A-Rod - 12 ABs - .417 1 HR 16 RBIs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barton Posted September 15, 2005 Share Posted September 15, 2005 good job finding all the stats guys, seriously. Ortiz is much better with RISP, but Arod is still hitting great in close and late situations and we all know Arods batting average is far superior as well as his play in the field. For Ortiz to be a DH and win the MVP over Arod, he (Ortiz) needs to be a much better hitter, and he is not. Alot of things will change from now until the end of the season. We'll see how it goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GimmeShelter Posted September 15, 2005 Share Posted September 15, 2005 On cue , Ortiz wins yet another game with a 2 run bomb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet/BosoxFan Posted September 15, 2005 Share Posted September 15, 2005 The correct answer to both questions is NO. Emphatically. Thats actually true. If the Yankees didnt have A-rod, they'd be winning the AL East by double digits. He is cur$ed...the baseball gods hate him. He is a $252 million anchor around your neck, Yankee fans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbn007 Posted September 15, 2005 Share Posted September 15, 2005 Well I personally have never called the NL a 2nd-rate league. And I've never said you can't win MVP just because you're a DH. However, if you do win it as DH, that person's offensive numbers should be off-the-charts better than anybody else's. Ortiz's are not so much better than A-Rods, infact A-Rod has a higher BA and OBP. And when you take into account his fantastic fielding, that really hurts Ortiz. Both players mean a ton to their teams. A-Rod means more because he does such a great job in the field. Fielding is also a reason Ramirez will never win it. Thank you. My point exactly. Ortiz should get serious consideration for MVP. But the fact that he does not play the defensive side of the game, should mean that he needs to be some much more dominant then any other 2 way player in the League. And he isn't. A-Rod is right there stats wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbn007 Posted September 15, 2005 Share Posted September 15, 2005 Exactly. If you take away A-Rod, if the Yankees were not still in the wild card race, it would be a complete joke. Without A-Rod, the Yankees payroll would still be $190 million. I'm sure they would have found a way to keep floundering below Cleveland with or without A-Rod's garbage time homers. If A-Rod was not playing, the Yankees would have been battling Baltimore for 4th this season. That's what happens when your lineup is not as productive (assuming A-Rod would have been hurt) and you lose your top 6 starting pitchers for various lengths of time. (from 3 starts to as much as 4 months). A-Rod is every bit a necessity to the Yankees as Ortiz is to the Bosox. Plain and simple. BTW - The Bosox still have Manny, Damon, Varitek and Nixon. All excellent talent. Minus Ortiz, that is a better lineup then the Yankees collection minus A-Rod. Or at least as good a lineup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbn007 Posted September 15, 2005 Share Posted September 15, 2005 Thats actually true. If the Yankees didnt have A-rod, they'd be winning the AL East by double digits. He is cur$ed...the baseball gods hate him. He is a $252 million anchor around your neck, Yankee fans Another informative post by the mis-guided one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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