Boozer76 Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 I'm going to tell a story. Much like Law and Order, the names and identities of the parties involved will not be revealed. Take this, if you will, as a story about fictional people that live by the rules that govern our society today. You can deduce it from there. A man, we'll call him Larry, who is in the midst of going through a divorce runs into a guy he used to know back in his married days. He lost contact with this person mostly by his own choice, mainly because this person wanted to remain a neutral friend to both spouses but he is known to have a blabber mouth. Larry knew that anything he did or said would get back to his soon to be ex if this person knew about it. After catching up for a while, the guy says "hey, how about your ex sleeping with her babysitter's boyfriend that night a few months ago"... Larry informs his old friend that he doesn't know anything about his ex's personal life and would rather stay out of it, but admittedly gets a chuckle out of it and doesn't stop the guy from telling him more. As the story goes on, he tells of a time where the ex left their small child at an local dive bar with a babysitter for what was originally supposed to be 1 hour, but turned into 6 hours while she went to another bar to meet friends and get trashed. He tells Larry how she finally showed up at this bar completely trashed and invited the young babysitter, her boyfriend, and some other young friends back to her house to party and drink some more. He tells Larry that she put her son in his car seat and drove him home trashed while they followed. He then couldn't wait to tell Larry that while the others were smoking drinking on the porch outside, the ex sneaks into the house with the babysitter's boyfriend and starts getting it on in the kitchen, only to be caught by the babysitter. Larry digests all of this and can't help but think disgustedly of the fact that the "sex" part of this story was the real kicker in his old friend's mind. Larry looks at him calmly and asks again "where was my son left for 6 hours"?? "with who!!??" "Until 11:30pm??", "She drove him home trashed!!??" . The old friend realizes he just put himself right smack in the middle of something big, and wanting to be the neutral party starts backpedalling his entire story. But he had already divulged enough to Larry. You see, Larry also knew the babysitter a little bit, and with a bit of investigating found her on facebook. After the babysitter confirmed that the old friend's story was true, Larry called his lawyer immediately. His lawyer takes a sworn statement from the babysitter and also tracks down the babysitter's offending boyfriend, who also confirmed the entire story and signed a sworn statement to it as well. Larry's lawyer informs him that this information would take things right to litigation and would be extensively expensive to Larry, even up to 100k when all is said and done. Larry would have to order and pay for Psych evals, Alcohol evals, etc.. and would have the fight of his life on his hands. Even for all that, Larry might not win even temporary custody pursuant to the ex getting help because the incident was a few months ago and might not constitue immediate or eminent danger to the child. After discussing further, Larry and his lawyer agreed that contacting Department of Youth and Family Services to intervene would be the way to go. Larry contacts DYFS, provides them with sworn statements and information to speak with the parties themselves. Larry doesn't want to take his child away from the mother, but he wants her to get help. Unfortunately, DYFS states to him that because the incident was almost 4 months ago, they do not feel there is imminent need to intervene at all. They recommended the mother receive alcohol treatment, but did not make it mandatory. Larry is in stunned disbelief. Larry has seen episodes like this in the past with his ex. He even found out about some he didn't even know about while they were together. This is a great factor of why he is now living the single Larry life. He just never thought his ex would do something like this to her own child and wonders what things she's done that he doesn't know about. But Larry has learned a very valuable and hard lesson. Larry knows that if the table was turned and he commited these atrocities to his child, it would be a long loooooooooong time before he'd see his child again. Larry has learned that simply having a vagina and breasts makes you a more fit parent in the eyes of our courts and child protective agencies. There are many fathers like Larry out there who would sacrifice everything for their child that are given no shot what so ever simply because society deems that humans with penises can't possibly be as good a parent as those with vaginas. So much so that the woman would practically have to use the child as a football and punt it before the system considers the father for the role. It's sad, and it needs to change now. The last time Larry checked it was a woman who drove trashed and killed 8 people on the Taconic. Larry prays every night that it doesn't happen to his child next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pragmatic Bus Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 The world is ****ed up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Has Larry tried talking to his Ex? It may be helpful to explain to her the risk Larry thinks she is putting his Child in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pragmatic Bus Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Has Larry tried talking to his Ex? It may be helpful to explain to her the risk Larry thinks she is putting his Child in. Larry might not be real. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gun Of Bavaria Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Hey Brother, I can feel for Larry to an extent. Having just went through an extremely nasty divorce a few years ago and being the one to discover candid, sordid emails detailing an ongoing affair first-hand, emails to which reading them was worse than the fact the ex was having an affair in the first place, I can still vividly remember the thoughts and emotions that immediately related to my child's welfare. I had the fortune of having parents who had just made enough money off their house sale to back be up and fight. I'm still paying them back, but it was worth it, as I have custody of my daughter. It was a long, hard fight and I am fortunate to a degree that my ex willingly gave up on wanting full custody to serve her own personal needs, but in the end I'm confident I would have won the trial anyways. Family court is always a toss up, but if Larry thinks there's a chance it can get custody or at least, better custodial circumstances, he should go for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boozer76 Posted October 20, 2009 Author Share Posted October 20, 2009 Has Larry tried talking to his Ex? It may be helpful to explain to her the risk Larry thinks she is putting his Child in. Larry has. The ex denies it ever even happened at all, much like most of the ex's excursions into drunken oblivion. The ex has a binge drinking problem, and Larry wants her to get the help she needs. Problem is most alcoholics don't think they have a problem. Larry has also recruited the ex inlaws for assistance. Hopefully that will help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Larry might not be real. Maybe not. But on the off chance that Larry is real, Larry should take note that it took Larry's friend by surprise when he found out that the sex was not the real issue. Perhaps Larry's ex needs this reminder, as Larry seems to have the more grounded perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Larry has. The ex denies it ever even happened at all, much like most of the ex's excursions into drunken oblivion. The ex has a binge drinking problem, and Larry wants her to get the help she needs. Problem is most alcoholics don't think they have a problem. Larry has also recruited the ex inlaws for assistance. Hopefully that will help. Perhaps Larry could attack this from another angle. Perhaps it's not 'her drinking problem' that concerns Larry, but rather, any drinking and partying around a young child. Maybe Larry simply offers his help and time with the child if she choses to continue to party in this manner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boozer76 Posted October 20, 2009 Author Share Posted October 20, 2009 Hey Brother, I can feel for Larry to an extent. Having just went through an extremely nasty divorce a few years ago and being the one to discover candid, sordid emails detailing an ongoing affair first-hand, emails to which reading them was worse than the fact the ex was having an affair in the first place, I can still vividly remember the thoughts and emotions that immediately related to my child's welfare. I had the fortune of having parents who had just made enough money off their house sale to back be up and fight. I'm still paying them back, but it was worth it, as I have custody of my daughter. It was a long, hard fight and I am fortunate to a degree that my ex willingly gave up on wanting full custody to serve her own personal needs, but in the end I'm confident I would have won the trial anyways. Family court is always a toss up, but if Larry thinks there's a chance it can get custody or at least, better custodial circumstances, he should go for it. Larry has done so, however Larry unfortunately doesn't have the financial backing to support such a fight. Larry is also not fortunate enough where the spouse would willingly give Larry primary custody of the child. Heck, Larry is lucky that he is getting as much as he is, which is 8 overnights a month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crusher Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Im trying to avoid this thread because it's a little too familiar. I will it up to the other posters to give Larry advice. I could offer a Larry a really good list on not what to do, but I think its better I leave now and let the other posters help out. I offer Larry sympathy and prayers for his child. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garb Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Wow - 'gotta admire Larry's level-head here. I would have her killed. Anyway, level-headed Garb says do what is best for the child - and it looks like Larry is. Hot-headed Garb would crucify this woman to the hilt.....and it would probably end badly. Larry is smarter than Garb. Good luck, Larry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny green balls Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 in family court the only people that win are the lawyers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boozer76 Posted October 20, 2009 Author Share Posted October 20, 2009 Perhaps Larry could attack this from another angle. Perhaps it's not 'her drinking problem' that concerns Larry, but rather, any drinking and partying around a young child. Maybe Larry simply offers his help and time with the child if she choses to continue to party in this manner. Larry thinks it's both. Larry has asked his lawyer to add a clause that not only would require the ex to seek alcoholic counseling, Larry has asked that the agreement contain the stipulation that neither party, Larry included, will consume any alcohol at all while caring for the child. Larry is completely at a loss that he, his inlaws, or his own family were not called to watch the child while she went out. Larry is living a pretty quiet life right now and really doesn't do much even on weekends. Larry would have changed his plans in a heartbeat to have time with his child on an unscheduled night, even if it was last second. Larry suspects that his ex didn't originally intend to stay out for more than an hour, but just as had happened in the past she started drinking and one thing led to another as her reasoning and parenting skills go on the decline with each drink she consumes. Larry does not question her parenting when sober. Only when she's drinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boozer76 Posted October 20, 2009 Author Share Posted October 20, 2009 in family court the only people that win are the lawyers. Larry says AMEN! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny green balls Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Larry thinks it's both. Larry has asked his lawyer to add a clause that not only would require the ex to seek alcoholic counseling, Larry has asked that the agreement contain the stipulation that neither party, Larry included, will consume any alcohol at all while caring for the child. Larry is completely at a loss that he, his inlaws, or his own family were not called to watch the child while she went out. Larry is living a pretty quiet life right now and really doesn't do much even on weekends. Larry would have changed his plans in a heartbeat to have time with his child on an unscheduled night, even if it was last second. Larry suspects that his ex didn't originally intend to stay out for more than an hour, but just as had happened in the past she started drinking and one thing led to another as her reasoning and parenting skills go on the decline with each drink she consumes. Larry does not question her parenting when sober. Only when she's drinking. INTERVENTION. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Larry thinks it's both. Larry has asked his lawyer to add a clause that not only would require the ex to seek alcoholic counseling, Larry has asked that the agreement contain the stipulation that neither party, Larry included, will consume any alcohol at all while caring for the child. Larry is completely at a loss that he, his inlaws, or his own family were not called to watch the child while she went out. Larry is living a pretty quiet life right now and really doesn't do much even on weekends. Larry would have changed his plans in a heartbeat to have time with his child on an unscheduled night, even if it was last second. Larry suspects that his ex didn't originally intend to stay out for more than an hour, but just as had happened in the past she started drinking and one thing led to another as her reasoning and parenting skills go on the decline with each drink she consumes. Larry does not question her parenting when sober. Only when she's drinking. EY isn't suggesting that the drinking isn't a problem for Larry, simply that approaching her without mentioning a drinking problem (immediately putting her on the defensive) might be a better method for achieving his most important goal, ensuring the welfare of his child. Larry's Ex likely views Larry's questioning her as an attack right now. Even if that isn't Larry's intent, people with addictions get defensive and, as you say, don't believe they have them. Perhaps your second paragraph is best, and Larry should simply say his life is simple now, and any time that she feels like she needs to 'have fun', then Larry is there to make that easier on her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boozer76 Posted October 20, 2009 Author Share Posted October 20, 2009 INTERVENTION. Larry has contacted his former mother in law. Larry was not surprised to hear that she had no idea of the incident or that DYFS was involved. Larry figured his ex would not want anyone in her family to have an idea of what she had done. Larry asked former MIL to put down the sword and just listen to what I say and to look at the evidence and to please get her daughter some help. He assured her that if she gets the help she needs, he will not pursue long term custodial arrangements in court. His former MIL also is well aware that his former FIL has a rampant drinking problem that is clearly trickling down is to his daughter. Larry's MIL does seem genuinely concerned and hopes she can convince his ex to go for help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxman Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Larry says AMEN! Wait Larry read this and said AMEN to you so you could type it? Or are you Larry? These people also sound like pig farmers if you ask me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny green balls Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Larry has contacted his former mother in law. Larry was not surprised to hear that she had no idea of the incident or that DYFS was involved. Larry figured his ex would not want anyone in her family to have an idea of what she had done. Larry asked former MIL to put down the sword and just listen to what I say and to look at the evidence and to please get her daughter some help. He assured her that if she gets the help she needs, he will not pursue long term custodial arrangements in court. His former MIL also is well aware that his former FIL has a rampant drinking problem that is clearly trickling down is to his daughter. Larry's MIL does seem genuinely concerned and hopes she can convince his ex to go for help. PIs are cheaper than lawyers.... you catch her on tape, you win at the settlement table, with her family, and in the courts if necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boozer76 Posted October 20, 2009 Author Share Posted October 20, 2009 Wait Larry read this and said AMEN to you so you could type it? Or are you Larry? These people also sound like pig farmers if you ask me. Hahaha, Larry may or may not farm pigs. He is, however, more partial to farming goats and large men at Walmart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gun Of Bavaria Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Tell Larry "Peace Be with You". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aten Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Larry's lawyer informs him that this information would take things right to litigation and would be extensively expensive to Larry, even up to 100k when all is said and done. Larry would have to order and pay for Psych evals, Alcohol evals, etc.. and would have the fight of his life on his hands. Even for all that, Larry might not win even temporary custody pursuant to the ex getting help because the incident was a few months ago and might not constitue immediate or eminent danger to the child. After discussing further, Larry and his lawyer agreed that contacting Department of Youth and Family Services to intervene would be the way to go. Larry's lawyer is not especially interested (probably because he wants no part of Larry's psycho ex), but he doesn't want to just tell Larry that he's not interested (probably because Larry is a good client), so he quotes an arbitrarily large figure that bears no rational relationship to the actual cost of such an action hoping that Larry will go bother DYFS or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Larry's lawyer is not especially interested (probably because he wants no part of Larry's psycho ex), but he doesn't want to just tell Larry that he's not interested (probably because Larry is a good client), so he quotes an arbitrarily large figure that bears no rational relationship to the actual cost of such an action hoping that Larry will go bother DYFS or something. How cheap you think it's going to be? Any trial is going to probably be at least $30K. Start adding in the forensics and it can add up fast. I don't think anybody is charging less than $300/hour and I don't know many lawyers that will turn down money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gun Of Bavaria Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 4HAQ3pNHwj4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green DNA Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Larry asked former MIL to put down the sword and just listen to what I say and to look at the evidence and to please get her daughter some help. Larry was doing quite well up until this point. Larry should proofread before hitting submit. In all seriousness, approaching the MIL is a great move as she can be great ally in ensuring attention to the well being of Larry's child. However, there is no way in hell that the MIL will support custody for Larry as that will lessen the contact and influence of the in-laws and I am sure the Larry's ex trashed his reputation to the MIL in the time leading up to and after the divorce. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aten Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 How cheap you think it's going to be? Any trial is going to probably be at least $30K. Start adding in the forensics and it can add up fast. I don't think anybody is charging less than $300/hour and I don't know many lawyers that will turn down money. Trial? Forensics? Might as well throw Tom Cruise's nut in there too as we're clearly working from an understanding informed primarily by fiction. We're talking about a motion for a contempt order relative to the custody decree and an evidentiary hearing. $100k is laughable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Trial? Forensics? Might as well throw Tom Cruise's nut in there too as we're clearly working from an understanding informed primarily by fiction. We're talking about a motion for a contempt order relative to the custody decree and an evidentiary hearing. $100k is laughable. How much to exhume Cochran? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
De-Jet-Erate/Duane Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Wait Larry read this and said AMEN to you so you could type it? Or are you Larry? These people also sound like pig farmers if you ask me. Why are you always trying to start trouble.... Larry and the pig farmers made peace. LOL!! Best of luck to you Larry! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boozer76 Posted October 20, 2009 Author Share Posted October 20, 2009 Why are you always trying to start trouble.... Larry and the pig farmers made peace. LOL!! Best of luck to you Larry! Actually Duane I still remember how you scared the sh*t out of me and might need your intimidation services, and your pigs haha! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faba Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Booz I do not know enough about these type of cases to comment but hopefully Larry will get that child that he obviously loves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Women are ****ing nuts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Trial? Forensics? Might as well throw Tom Cruise's nut in there too as we're clearly working from an understanding informed primarily by fiction. We're talking about a motion for a contempt order relative to the custody decree and an evidentiary hearing. $100k is laughable. The guy didn't say it would cost $100K. He said it could cost "even up to" that amount. You never heard of a $100K divorce/custody case? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
De-Jet-Erate/Duane Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Actually Duane I still remember how you scared the sh*t out of me and might need your intimidation services, and your pigs haha! Let me know how I can help... and the pigs work cheap! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyHector Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 Let me know how I can help... and the pigs work cheap! I was under the impression that JN Mods were well-compensated... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyHector Posted October 20, 2009 Share Posted October 20, 2009 I think if I was in Larry's position, I would've purchased a wood-chipper a long time ago. (Note: I am not condoning such activities). Tough situation... I wish Larry the best of luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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