sold a bill of goods on sanchez

[ZachEY]

That team is lucky to be as good as the raiders with jag at qb instead of manning..

Agreed. But that doesn't mean they'd pack it in this late in the season.

[Mandarinia]

Didn't expect you to give up and hop on the feigned indignation train this early in our debate but I'll take the easy wins when I can get them.

When did I say I give up? Please proceed.

[ZachEY]

I agree. But you have to expect this from a rookie QB. Anyone who thought he would be the "2nd coming of christ" his rookie year seriously needs to go to the doctor and get their brain checked out for posible damage.

I didn't define my expectations in this thread.

But, calling a guy who at minimum, cost you 4 games, is far from a 'bright spot'. The best you can say about Sanchez right now is 'he's shown flashes at times, and hopefully he'll get better'.

[Jet Moses]

Clemens is a dog but the only reason you may be right is it would've forced Schott to run 60 times in those games.

4th quarter against the Bills (first game) and the Jax game. Those are your two wins right there.

[CTM]

Agreed. But that doesn't mean they'd pack it in this late in the season.

But the arguement was not signing garcia just in case manning got injured somehow is an indictment of garcia. Not only has manning never gotten injured, he also is by far the biggest reason for that teams success by a wide margin

[ZachEY]

But the arguement was not signing garcia just in case manning got injured somehow is an indictment of garcia. Not only has manning never gotten injured, he also is by far the biggest reason for that teams success by a wide margin

Agreed.

I just don't hate the idea that if there was a capable guy out there, they wouldn't bring him in.

With that said, if Manning goes down, I bet they do bring him in.

[Mandarinia]

I didn't define my expectations in this thread.

But, calling a guy who at minimum, cost you 4 games, is far from a 'bright spot'. The best you can say about Sanchez right now is 'he's shown flashes at times, and hopefully he'll get better'.

Excatly at this point in his career thats what you can hope for. However, It is not fair to throw him under the bus at this point, let him grow. Until then, enjoy the ride.

[donboyO]

Obviously the missed FGs were a problem. But, you rarely win football games where you throw 3 picks. Sanchez was awful, again. If he wasn't awful, the game would have been a blow-out to the tune of 24-3, or something of that nature.

Well last i looked there are no BCS style points in NFL, 13-10 16-10 equals 8-6

If Garcia was go good, why didnt Pats sign him too, all they have is Hoyer at

backup.

The last pick was meaningless, trying to make a play on 3rd and 15, and no

one was open. Blame the idiot OL for making dumb penalty,

The two other picks were poor and cost the team 3 points.

There is a reason i rarely post, too many cliff divers here. I do get a good

laugh though so all is good

[CTM]

Well last i looked there are no BCS style points in NFL, 13-10 16-10 equals 8-6

If Garcia was go good, why didnt Pats sign him too, all they have is Hoyer at

backup.

The last pick was meaningless, trying to make a play on 3rd and 15, and no

one was open. Blame the idiot OL for making dumb penalty,

The two other picks were poor and cost the team 3 points.

There is a reason i rarely post, too many cliff divers here. I do get a good

laugh though so all is good

what exactly is your point? that sanchez isn't to blame?

And garcia wouldn't have to be "good" to be a big improvement over Sanchez.. average would do the job just fine

[donboyO]

what exactly is your point? that sanchez isn't to blame?

And garcia wouldn't have to be "good" to be a big improvement over Sanchez.. average would do the job just fine

I blame him for Bills Saints and Pats losses

When a team cannot execute an extra point FG and miss two others inside 38 yards

i would say Special teams cost us yesterday's win.

You really think Clemens running 60 times wins us the game, that would be

laughable.

[ZachEY]

Well last i looked there are no BCS style points in NFL, 13-10 16-10 equals 8-6

If Garcia was go good, why didnt Pats sign him too, all they have is Hoyer at

backup.

The last pick was meaningless, trying to make a play on 3rd and 15, and no

one was open. Blame the idiot OL for making dumb penalty,

The two other picks were poor and cost the team 3 points.

There is a reason i rarely post, too many cliff divers here. I do get a good

laugh though so all is good

If saying that the QB who threw the ball to the other team 3 times in a game is a big part of the reason we lost is 'cliff diving', I would find some zoloft and blow it down quickly.

As to your argument 'the last pick is meaningless', what you're telling me is that down by 3, with over a minute and a half left, and a timeout, the game is over, so it doesn't matter what the QB does?

[ZachEY]

Excatly at this point in his career thats what you can hope for. However, It is not fair to throw him under the bus at this point, let him grow. Until then, enjoy the ride.

No. You can hope for a lot more than blowing over 25% of your season on his own. You can hope that he limits his mistakes and learns from them. He's done neither. I don't expect him to be great, or win games on his own like Manning, but I do expect him to not suck as bad as he had. I don't think that's asking too much.

[CTM]

I blame him for Bills Saints and Pats losses

When a team cannot execute an extra point FG and miss two others inside 38 yards

i would say Special teams cost us yesterday's win.

You really think Clemens running 60 times wins us the game, that would be

laughable.

Well, i really know that Sanchez has been worse this season then Clemens was in 2007. The dude (clemens) seems to have the mental strength of an egg shell, but perhaps with a full offseason of rexfelation, clemens could've put up something resembling an average season and have this team thinking about winning the division instead of backing into WC..

[donboyO]

If saying that the QB who threw the ball to the other team 3 times in a game is a big part of the reason we lost is 'cliff diving', I would find some zoloft and blow it down quickly.

As to your argument 'the last pick is meaningless', what you're telling me is that down by 3, with over a minute and a half left, and a timeout, the game is over, so it doesn't matter what the QB does?

Who was open on that play did you watch game? I guess he could have threw it

in the dirt and he would have had 4th and whatever it was, 13 or 15 yards

Fine blame him for loss, you seem to be quite the expert

[ZachEY]

Fine blame him for loss, you seem to be quite the expert

What does this even mean?

[CTM]

Who was open on that play did you watch game? I guess he could have threw it

in the dirt and he would have had 4th and whatever it was, 13 or 15 yards

Fine blame him for loss, you seem to be quite the expert

watch it again dood.. keller was wide open underneath and would've picked up around 8 atleast.. woodhead was wide open as well..

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d8151d14a/Grimes-ends-it-with-a-pick

[CTM]

What does this even mean?

punting

[Thai Jet]

Guy is terrible. Knock on him coming out of combine was that he was a one read QB and could it be any more obvious after yesterday?

He looks at his primary, and either throws it (sometimes forces it) or takes off running before diving head first.

I've also been saying for months that he lacks arm strength.

Best we can hope for is that his football IQ increases and we get another chad pennington... with a 5th overall pick.

Disgusting.

I'm on record as NEVER wanting Sanchez. I did NOT like him while he was at USC and thought nhe should have stayed at Troy his senior year. That being said he IS a rookie and should be given a lot more time to develop.

[Mandarinia]

No. You can hope for a lot more than blowing over 25% of your season on his own. You can hope that he limits his mistakes and learns from them. He's done neither. I don't expect him to be great, or win games on his own like Manning, but I do expect him to not suck as bad as he had. I don't think that's asking too much.

Yes, some of the losses we're his fault. BUT YOU HAVE TO EXPECT THIS! He is a rookie. People are so impatient.

Give him a year with a proper OC then we'll see how "bad" is.

Thats what all I'm saying. You need to give him a chance to grow. I know he cost us some games. This was always an 8-8 team. Yes I thought we could do better and I bieleve we could have done better this season. (damn kool-aid) However, Sanchez is our guy. Clemens is crap. Ainge is crap. Ratlif is crap. Garcia a "has been"

Favorate this thread..please. You'll see next season. (as long as Schotty isn't part of the team)

[Sperm Edwards]

Yes, some of the losses we're his fault. BUT YOU HAVE TO EXPECT THIS! He is a rookie. People are so impatient.

Give him a year with a proper OC then we'll see how "bad" is.

Thats what all I'm saying. You need to give him a chance to grow. I know he cost us some games. This was always an 8-8 team. Yes I thought we could do better and I bieleve we could have done better this season. (damn kool-aid) However, Sanchez is our guy. Clemens is crap. Ainge is crap. Ratlif is crap. Garcia a "has been"

Favorate this thread..please. You'll see next season. (as long as Schotty isn't part of the team)

If the rest of this team had a myriad of holes on offense and defense like the 2007 team I think people would be much less critical. Same goes for the special teams gaffes.

You can plan to build on the year before all you want. It doesn't always work out that way. Sometimes an unspectacular QB who keeps his mistakes to a minimum can be enough when surrounded by solid talent.

Too late now. I just hope they don't give Sanchez another year of the same 5 clowns around him (3 nobody QB's and two losers at QBC and OC) to further his development.

[johnny green balls]

The last pick was meaningless, trying to make a play on 3rd and 15

Ever hear of "4 down territory?"

[ZachEY]

Yes, some of the losses we're his fault. BUT YOU HAVE TO EXPECT THIS! He is a rookie. People are so impatient.

Give him a year with a proper OC then we'll see how "bad" is.

Thats what all I'm saying. You need to give him a chance to grow. I know he cost us some games. This was always an 8-8 team. Yes I thought we could do better and I bieleve we could have done better this season. (damn kool-aid) However, Sanchez is our guy. Clemens is crap. Ainge is crap. Ratlif is crap. Garcia a "has been"

Favorate this thread..please. You'll see next season. (as long as Schotty isn't part of the team)

I didn't say anything about his performance going forward. Nor did I say we should pull the plug on him and not give him a chance to grow.

I simply said that he's the reason we lost a lot of our games, and I'd expect to see better right now. Problem is, when someone says they'd like to see better, everyone reads that as they expect him to be Peyton Manning right now. Sanchez, at this point, has not learned from his mistakes, and that is a problem.

[ZachEY]

Ever hear of "4 down territory?"

Forget 4 down territory. Apparently 3rd and 15 means you should just walk off the field and quit. Gosh, I hope we don't get into any of those early in the game.

[CTM]

If the rest of this team had a myriad of holes on offense and defense like the 2007 team I think people would be much less critical. Same goes for the special teams gaffes.

I don't know.. The team was 1-7 when clemens took over and that dude caught a ton of heat for basically playing the same as sanchez has this season on a much better team..

SOmething about Chad and Sanchez made fans get so protective over them.. Both are kind of girlie whereas Clemens looks like eddie munster.. I'm not sure.. but something is going on..

[Mandarinia]

If the rest of this team had a myriad of holes on offense and defense like the 2007 team I think people would be much less critical. Same goes for the special teams gaffes.

You can plan to build on the year before all you want. It doesn't always work out that way. Sometimes an unspectacular QB who keeps his mistakes to a minimum can be enough when surrounded by solid talent.

Too late now. I just hope they don't give Sanchez another year of the same 5 clowns around him (3 nobody QB's and two losers at QBC and OC) to further his development.

+1 Blame the awful coaching. But not sanchez (at least for now) for an average season.

[johnny green balls]

+1 Blame the awful coaching. But not sanchez (at least for now) for an average season.

Some of us blame the Jets for drafting Sanchez and many more of us for putting him in a position to fail with no vet QB guidance.

If you want to say that's "blaming the poor rookie," then you're just not listening.

[CTM]

watch it again dood.. keller was wide open underneath and would've picked up around 8 atleast.. woodhead was wide open as well..

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d8151d14a/Grimes-ends-it-with-a-pick

Watching this again, it makes me remember that sanchez does appear to zone in on the big guy a lot,,

in that nfl network promo I believe Sanchez is hanging with Rhodes and Edwards at KR's house.. wonder if he's part of that crew?

[Sperm Edwards]

I don't know.. The team was 1-7 when clemens took over and that dude caught a ton of heat for basically playing the same as sanchez has this season on a much better team..

SOmething about Chad and Sanchez made fans get so protective over them.. Both are kind of girlie whereas Clemens looks like eddie munster.. I'm not sure.. but something is going on..

Agree completely. But I've seen enough of Clemens by now. Whatever skills he has or had isn't enough. Whatever glimpses you saw in 2007 are gone. He is totally different from the neck up. Happy feet have been combined now with happy brain cells and happy hands. He's got plenty enough of an arm and can move but he's too fragile mentally. Being careful and being scared s***less of making a mistake aren't the same thing. He's got too much of the latter.

[Mandarinia]

Some of us blame the Jets for drafting Sanchez and many more of us for putting him in a position to fail with no vet QB guidance.

If you want to say that's "blaming the poor rookie," then you're just not listening.

Reread your first post in this thread. You blamed Sanchez. Then when you lost that battle then you changed your argument to not having a vet QB.

[johnny green balls]

Reread your first post in this thread. You blamed Sanchez. Then when you lost that battle then you changed your argument to not having a vet QB.

Do you know what a strawman argument is?

[ZachEY]

Watching this again, it makes me remember that sanchez does appear to zone in on the big guy a lot,,

in that nfl network promo I believe Sanchez is hanging with Rhodes and Edwards at KR's house.. wonder if he's part of that crew?

Sad part is, if Sanchez makes a good throw there, Edwards could have made the catch. But you're right, he goes to keller and we've live to play another down, with manageable distance.

[CTM]

Agree completely. But I've seen enough of Clemens by now. Whatever skills he has or had isn't enough. Whatever glimpses you saw in 2007 are gone. He is totally different from the neck up. Happy feet have been combined now with happy brain cells and happy hands. He's got plenty enough of an arm and can move but he's too fragile mentally. Being careful and being scared s***less of making a mistake aren't the same thing. He's got too much of the latter.

ohh no doubt.. said it in another thread but he has no mental strength, none..

I still do believe that Rex could've pumped him up enough for him to be average this season, but ultimately a guy like that is going to crumble at some point anyway..

[CTM]

Sad part is, if Sanchez makes a good throw there, Edwards could have made the catch. But you're right, he goes to keller and we've live to play another down, with manageable distance.

There was also only 1 CB out there to prevent keller from getting the first down. It's certainly within the realm of possiblity that he picks it up anyway. Atlanta was conceding the short pass and defending the first own marker, it was stupid not to take it there..

my larger point is that if Sanchez is getting tunnelvision for BE, it's actually hurting him more then BE's helping by openinng up other things.. I haven't been counting, but it seems to me that a large % of sanchez's most recent INT's were headed for BE.

Someone should pull the kid aside and whipser in his ear that BE is more of a decoy then a viable target most downs..

[Mandarinia]

Do you know what a strawman argument is?

Yes. But the point is you attacked Sanchez and I defended him.

Guy is terrible. Knock on him coming out of combine was that he was a one read QB and could it be any more obvious after yesterday?

He looks at his primary, and either throws it (sometimes forces it) or takes off running before diving head first.

I've also been saying for months that he lacks arm strength.

Best we can hope for is that his football IQ increases and we get another chad pennington... with a 5th overall pick.

Disgusting.

I made the point that it is unfair to throw him under the bus in his rookie season. He has shown us what he could be, both his good side and his bad side. Which direction he goes in is unknown at this time. So give him time.

[johnny green balls]

Yes. But the point is you attacked Sanchez and I defended him.

What are we fighting over exactly? We both agree he sucks but you don't hold him accountable for his poor performance?

I made the point that it is unfair to throw him under the bus in his rookie season. He has shown us what he could be, both his good side and his bad side. Which direction he goes in is unknown at this time. So give him time.

No thanks, I'm ready to judge him now.