Stonehands Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 After all, Painter was nurtured the precise way many on this board feel Sanchez should have been. He sat and learned under the tutilage of a veteran quarterback for the whole season. I am surprised he looked so lost after such a well planned method of tutoring him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green DNA Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 After all, Painter was nurtured the precise way many on this board feel Sanchez should have been. He sat and learned under the tutilage of a veteran quarterback for the whole season. I am surprised he looked so lost after such a well planned method of tutoring him. Touche, well done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicious89x Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 After all, Painter was nurtured the precise way many on this board feel Sanchez should have been. He sat and learned under the tutilage of a veteran quarterback for the whole season. I am surprised he looked so lost after such a well planned method of tutoring him. 6th round draft pick playing with all back ups vs the #1 D and a 1st round QB that we traded up to get with the #1 rushing attack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 After all, Painter was nurtured the precise way many on this board feel Sanchez should have been. He sat and learned under the tutilage of a veteran quarterback for the whole season. I am surprised he looked so lost after such a well planned method of tutoring him. +1 lol yes and let's not forget he had the added benefit of playing for a genius offensive coordinator in Tom Moore. not like that bum Schotty who calls plays that people throw interceptions on... the plays Tom Moore calls and designs are _so_ much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gyno-Tony Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 he looked lost cuz we the real deal baby!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 I don't care if this one's full of holes. A+ for effort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 +1 lol yes and let's not forget he had the added benefit of playing for a genius offensive coordinator in Tom Moore. not like that bum Schotty who calls plays that people throw interceptions on... the plays Tom Moore calls and designs are _so_ much better. I'm not sure how many times we must go over this. Regardless of how poorly Sanchez has played, it doesn't change the fact that Schottenheimer ****ing sucks at his job. Because he does. A lot. Really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceman88 Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 6th round draft pick playing with all back ups vs the #1 D and a 1st round QB that we traded up to get with the #1 rushing attack. +1 Seriously this entire thread is a complete joke, trying to make a comparison between these two right now is idiotic. Painter had no starters playing with him and was a 6th rd pick who arguably shouldn't have been drafted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 After all, Painter was nurtured the precise way many on this board feel Sanchez should have been. He sat and learned under the tutilage of a veteran quarterback for the whole season. I am surprised he looked so lost after such a well planned method of tutoring him. You do realize when Manning sat out so did ALL his WR's Wayne, Collie, Clark and Garcon was out for the whole game. Some O-lineman also sat out. Not sure Painter had much of a chance with no one to throw too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stonehands Posted December 28, 2009 Author Share Posted December 28, 2009 Seriously this entire thread is a complete joke, trying to make a comparison between these two right now is idiotic. Painter had no starters playing with him and was a 6th rd pick who arguably shouldn't have been drafted. Yeah you are right, especially since Painter started 41 games in college vs Sanchez's 16. Painter should have looked more polished than he did. Maybe Manning wasn't as good a tutor as Jeff Garcia would have been. Or maybe, you were wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stonehands Posted December 28, 2009 Author Share Posted December 28, 2009 Seriously this entire thread is a complete joke Brilliant deduction by the way.....you ever post anything for the entertainment value? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 I'm not sure how many times we must go over this.. im not sure either playoff teams don't fire their OC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 im not sure either playoff teams don't fire their OC If its deserved they do. Hell, sometimes they fire their head coach: http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2763552 And that Chargers team was a hell of a lot better coached than this train wreck of an offense. And before you tell me how wrong the Chargers were it should be noted that they went to the AFC Championship the following season and made a great effort in attempting to knock off the undefeated Pats despite injuries to their QB and two best offensive playmakers in LT and Gates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 After all, Painter was nurtured the precise way many on this board feel Sanchez should have been. He sat and learned under the tutilage of a veteran quarterback for the whole season. I am surprised he looked so lost after such a well planned method of tutoring him. LOL Great effort, epic fail. When was Painter selected? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 If its deserved they do. Hell, sometimes they fire their head coach: curtis painter has such a good OC why didn't he play better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 curtis painter has such a good OC why didn't he play better? Because he sucks? Again, Sanchez sucking and Schottenheimer sucking are NOT mutually exclusive. You know how I know this? Because Schotty sucked before Sanchez ever put on that Jets hat on draft day. The point you seem to be missing is that I'm not arguing Sanchez has played well, I know he hasn't, but that doesn't miraculously excuse Schottenheimer's poor play-calling. Just look at yesterday as proof enough, early in the game even when Sanchez was playing well and the drives were going well, time and time again they were killed by mind-numbingly stupid playcalls that put an end to any and all offensive momentum. Just because he finally pulled his head out of his ass later on and the Colts pulled their starters to allow a Jets win doesn't change that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 To the original point of the thread, I'm not sure the argument is that sitting a QB will magically make them play better, I think its more a situation of circumstances. Sitting a QB could be beneficial under the circumstances of not pushing them into a position that they aren't yet ready to handle and basically completely destroying their confidence and killing their career. Just look at a guy like David Carr, by the time he was in any position to legitimately have some success, the beating he had already taken was too much for him to overcome. Some will argue had he had some time on the bench and was put into a better situation, he would've had a better chance for success. Of course, it really seems to vary on a player by player basis, so its really tough to say what's right for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 Because Schotty sucked before Sanchez ever put on that Jets hat on draft day. Jets fans know a certain Schotty... for better or worse he has a terrible reputation among fans. but the league knows him as a football lifer who bred Drew Brees.... arguably the best QB in the league right now (up there with Payton and Brady at least). the truth is somewhere in the middle. I would bet that switching Tom Moore and Schotty you get similar results. I.e. coaches coach, players play. When Schotty had brees he was great, when he had noodle arm chad he wasn't. Not a surprise. Tom Moore is a genius when Payton is under center, when Curtis Painter is under there he's a bum. Give Schotty Payton Manning or Drew Brees again he probably looks like a great coach. When tom moore dials up a bad play, Payton audibles out it and calls one that works. when Schotty dials up a bad play, Sanchez runs it and gets murdered. Coaching in general is overrated. Even bill parcells, for all his genius, never won a ring without Lawrence Taylor. he needed the greatest defender of all time to win a ring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicious89x Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 Jets fans know a certain Schotty... for better or worse he has a terrible reputation among fans. but the league knows him as a football lifer who bred Drew Brees.... arguably the best QB in the league right now (up there with Payton and Brady at least). the truth is somewhere in the middle. I do know that switching Tom Moore and Schotty you get similar results. I.e. coaches coach, players play. When Schotty had brees he was great, when he had noodle arm chad he wasn't. Not a surprise. Tom Moore is a genius when Payton is under center, when Curtis Painter is under there he's a bum. Give Schotty Payton Manning or Drew Brees he probably looks like a great coach. Coaching in general is overrated. Even bill parcells, for all his genius, never won a ring without Lawrence Taylor. he needed the greatest defender of all time to win a ring. You mean that Drew Brees who after he got out from Shottenheimer went on to become a Touchdown throwing monster with less int's and with a lesser running game that he had in SD? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stonehands Posted December 28, 2009 Author Share Posted December 28, 2009 To the original point of the thread, I'm not sure the argument is that sitting a QB will magically make them play better, I think its more a situation of circumstances. Sitting a QB could be beneficial under the circumstances of not pushing them into a position that they aren't yet ready to handle and basically completely destroying their confidence and killing their career. Just look at a guy like David Carr, by the time he was in any position to legitimately have some success, the beating he had already taken was too much for him to overcome. Some will argue had he had some time on the bench and was put into a better situation, he would've had a better chance for success. Of course, it really seems to vary on a player by player basis, so its really tough to say what's right for sure. Well, Carr has been on the bench a lot lately, he must be scary good, now. Or, does this phenomenon only take place at the very beginning of a guys career? Do you only get one chance to get better while you sit on the bench and then it is gone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 You mean that Drew Brees who after he got out from Shottenheimer went on to become a Touchdown throwing monster with less int's and with a lesser running game that he had in SD? the Jets have fired at least 1 coach a year (head or coordinator level) every year since woody has been around how many rings did all these changes produce? it's fun to talk about but we forget firing coaches, cutting players doesn't actually make the team better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 You mean that Drew Brees who after he got out from Shottenheimer went on to become a Touchdown throwing monster with less int's and with a lesser running game that he had in SD? Nevermind that, the same Drew Brees who Brian Schottenheimer never once in his career called plays for? The Chargers OC that whole time was Cam Cameron. Its possible that B-Schott is a great QB coach, but just doesn't have the chops for play-calling (although I'm not sure I even believe that). Of course on the other hand, in Cameron's next gig as OC in Baltimore (after his 1 year HC disaster in Miami) he took a young QB who was considered pretty raw coming out of the draft in Joe Flacco, who's had a pretty successful first two years. Meanwhile, Schottenheimer is now in the process of his second young QB he's groomed for the Jets that has had serious turnover problems to say the least. Yet why does Schottenheimer supposedly get credit for Brees over Brees' OC? Something doesn't add up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 6th round draft pick playing with all back ups vs the #1 D and a 1st round QB that we traded up to get with the #1 rushing attack. well done.. I can't tell if the op was trolling or if he really thinks he has a point.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 +1 lol yes and let's not forget he had the added benefit of playing for a genius offensive coordinator in Tom Moore. not like that bum Schotty who calls plays that people throw interceptions on... the plays Tom Moore calls and designs are _so_ much better. lol... and bi tonti gets to squeeze his agenda in there, even though it doesn't agree with the op's (and his ilk's) agenda at all... equally applicable though, equally applicable.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 Jets fans know a certain Schotty... for better or worse he has a terrible reputation among fans. but the league knows him as a football lifer who bred Drew Brees.... arguably the best QB in the league right now (up there with Payton and Brady at least). the truth is somewhere in the middle. I would bet that switching Tom Moore and Schotty you get similar results. I.e. coaches coach, players play. When Schotty had brees he was great, when he had noodle arm chad he wasn't. Not a surprise. Tom Moore is a genius when Payton is under center, when Curtis Painter is under there he's a bum. Give Schotty Payton Manning or Drew Brees again he probably looks like a great coach. When tom moore dials up a bad play, Payton audibles out it and calls one that works. when Schotty dials up a bad play, Sanchez runs it and gets murdered. Coaching in general is overrated. Even bill parcells, for all his genius, never won a ring without Lawrence Taylor. he needed the greatest defender of all time to win a ring. Peyton Manning doesnt need an OC. Drew Brees blew up with a great OC in Cam Cam and now with Sean Petyon. There play calling is superior to BSchitt. Lots of screens, lots of down field crossing patterns and tons of stuff underneath to make it easy on their QB's throwing to one on one coverage. I think giving him Peyton Manning, Manning makes B. Schitt. I dont think Drew Brees makes him look good, I think BSchitt would quickly show how bad he sucks with a guy like Brees. He'd still have play calls that stall drives, whether its a double reverse or an empty set. Peyton would never let that call happen on the field. And using Chad as an example further helps our case against B. Schitt. Chad left and went to a 1-15 team, had his best season as a pro and helped make the Dolphags AFCE Champs. BSchitt is terrible. And how does Parcells winning with LT prove your point? Did he not take 2 different teams to the SB? Did he not almost take 3? This has been your new thing to say when saying coaching is overrated, but it makes zero sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 the Jets have fired at least 1 coach a year (head or coordinator level) every year since woody has been around how many rings did all these changes produce? it's fun to talk about but we forget firing coaches, cutting players doesn't actually make the team better. Neither does retaining crappy players and coaches. The connections you make are beyond asinine. The Jets have drafted players every year since Woody has been around, maybe they should stop drafting. Same with signing FAs. You know what the problem is? This damn team has actually tried to improve each and every year. Lets just put a stop to that right now. Maybe if the Jets don't try to get better at a ll, a championship will just fall into their laps. Un-freakin'-believable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicious89x Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 the Jets have fired at least 1 coach a year (head or coordinator level) every year since woody has been around how many rings did all these changes produce? it's fun to talk about but we forget firing coaches, cutting players doesn't actually make the team better. ORLY?? Cause my impression was the Steelers lost a bunch of Coaches, appointed a new one and went on to win a SB? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JETS11269 Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 After all, Painter was nurtured the precise way many on this board feel Sanchez should have been. He sat and learned under the tutilage of a veteran quarterback for the whole season. I am surprised he looked so lost after such a well planned method of tutoring him. Actually, he has a point. Tom Brady was also taken out of the 6th round, and watched behind Drew Bledsoe for some time. It doesn't make sense; why didn't Curtis Painter play that well?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceman88 Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 Yeah you are right, especially since Painter started 41 games in college vs Sanchez's 16. Painter should have looked more polished than he did. Maybe Manning wasn't as good a tutor as Jeff Garcia would have been. Or maybe, you were wrong. I'm wrong that Mark Sanchez has been a terrible QB for us and if we even had an average starting QB at best we would be Super Bowl contenders? Really? Sanchez may become a good QB but I don't really care cause all we needed was consistent decent (not even good) QB play to be a real threat this year. Sanchez killed our season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 Matt Moore. More typical NFL stupidity. Does this guy get a chance if Delhomme does not go on IR ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villain_the_foe Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 After all, Painter was nurtured the precise way many on this board feel Sanchez should have been. He sat and learned under the tutilage of a veteran quarterback for the whole season. I am surprised he looked so lost after such a well planned method of tutoring him. Painter didnt have a year like Sanchez to use the skills taught. It also depends on his raw talent (what he can and cant do) as well. What Peyton, like Marino has that Painter doesnt is a lightning fast release. You cant teach that. The play that Pace made on that fumble wouldnt have happened IMO to Peyton given his much quicker decision making and release. Sanchez I believe is more talented than Painter to begin with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 Some of us wanted to sit Sanchez, but didn't necessarily think he'd automatically blow people away out of the gate if he did. The point was to have him ready so that his long term development would go well. Avoid 5 and 3 INT games and him crying in the post game press conference. Make sure that he didn't have his confidence ruined completely like Carr. FWIW, Collie did play with Painter. Clark and Wayne didn't. LOL at Sean Payton being a genius that caused Brees to break out. The same genius that Fassell had to take play calling duties away from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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