Belichick to act as OC in 2005 ?

[GimmeShelter]

Mangurian hiring completes staff

By Jerome Solomon, Globe Staff | March 8, 2005

Patriots coach Bill Belichick yesterday announced the hiring of Pete Mangurian as tight ends coach and said that his coaching staff for the 2005 season is complete.

"I'd say that's pretty much it," Belichick said.

If that is the case, it means the Patriots will go without a titled offensive coordinator.

On their websites, every other NFL team lists an offensive coordinator, except the Cleveland Browns, though that may be a technicality because Romeo Crennel hired Maurice Carthon for that post last month.

Charlie Weis, who was the Patriots offensive coordinator, left after the Super Bowl to become head coach at Notre Dame. Eric Mangini, who was the secondary coach, replaced Crennel as defensive coordinator less than a week after the Patriots toppled Philadelphia to claim their second consecutive Super Bowl title.

Weis's play-calling duties could be handled by Belichick, wide receivers coach Brian Daboll, running backs coach Ivan Fears, or quarterbacks coach Josh McDaniels.

Belichick said he isn't as concerned as others seem to be about the changes on his staff; he is pleased with the additions.

"There's change every year in some aspect of the organization," Belichick said. "This was not unexpected. Charlie was hired some time ago, and Romeo had been on lists.

"I think you can get some fresh ideas and those type things, but a big part of a new coach coming in is he has to learn how we do things."

Mangurian, 49, comes to the team with 13 years of NFL experience, much of it under Dan Reeves. He started with Reeves as a tight ends coach in Denver (1988), was promoted to offensive line coach three years later, and stayed in that position for seven seasons, including four years with the New York Giants and one with the Atlanta Falcons.

In 1998, Mangurian took over as head coach at Cornell, where he compiled a 16-14 record in three seasons. His 10-4 Ivy League mark in his last two seasons with the Big Red is the best two-year conference record in school history.

Mangurian returned to Reeves's staff as offensive line coach with the Falcons in 2001, took over play-calling duties in the middle of the 2002 season, and was the team's offensive coordinator for the 2003 season. He was out of football last year.

"He is very experienced and has been in the league a while," Belichick said. "And he was with Dan Reeves in an offense that did a lot with the tight ends." . . .

The Patriots formally announced the re-signing of running back Patrick Pass to a two-year contract.

I'd imagine Brady may call a lot of the plays this year.

[PFSIKH]

I think that is about what was expected.

I think the last sentence says it all. Weis noted alot this year that Brady was more involved in the offense then he ever was before.

[joewilly]

I think belly's genius status will start diminishing early in the season.

[Savage69]

Real Coaches know every aspect of the Game!

Political Appointee's Like Herm know that

when the Big Hand is on the little hand it's

play time at Michael Jacksons Neverland Ranch!

Other then that Hermie makes a Great Grilled Chicken!

[jetswin]

History tells us that rarely works out very well.

[PFSIKH]

I think belly's genius status will start diminishing early in the season.

The belief that Belichick is some puppet master pulling all the strings is foolish. Read Michael Holley's book Patriot Reign. He was able to follow the team and get in on meetings for over a year. The Patriots are not built to crumble with the loss of one player or coach.

The same thing they look for in players they look for in coaches. You will not see any Steve Spurrier types working only eight hours a day. They want players and coaches that live and breath football.

The Patriots will be okay.

[Jetfan13]

Real Coaches know every aspect of the Game!

Political Appointee's Like Herm know that

when the Big Hand is on the little hand it's

play time at Michael Jacksons Neverland Ranch!

Other then that Hermie makes a Great Grilled Chicken!

its always the same bs with you isn't it...

[124]

We'll see how Billy boy does calling the shots on offense in his gray hoody.

[RSJ]

History tells us that rarely works out very well.

I agree, it is a very, very difficult thing to do. I know BB knows every aspect of offense and had been a HC for a while now. But even guys that have that same background have struggled not having an OC. This is a big mistake on his par, imo.

[Savage69]

its always the same bs with you isn't it...

And always the same BS with you whining about my

Freedom of Speech!!It's seems you have a personal

problem..Why not use your Vast influence and have

me banned then!!Bob the Jet Fan,Tom and others aren't

a Big Fan of Hermie either..Yet they don't seem to

bother you?? Maybe you need Help or a sense of Humor? :wink:

[Warfish]

This year will be a solid test of the genius of Bill Bellichek.

If he succeeds without his Co's, then his genius is confirmed.

If he is mediocre, then his genius becomes debatable to a point.

If he fails miserably, after losing players ALL the Pats fans here claim mean nothing at all, then his genius needs to be re-examined in light of that result.

[Savage69]

This year will be a solid test of the genius of Bill Bellichek.

If he succeeds without his Co's, then his genius is confirmed.

If he is mediocre, then his genius becomes debatable to a point.

If he fails miserably, after losing players ALL the Pats fans here claim mean nothing at all, then his genius needs to be re-examined in light of that result.

I agree Warfish!! The Buck stops with the HC! That's

the way it should be..Unless your the Jets of course!

[Jetfan13]

And always the same BS with you whining about my

Freedom of Speech!!It's seems you have a personal

problem..Why not use your Vast influence and have

me banned then!!Bob the Jet Fan,Tom and others aren't

a Big Fan of Hermie either..Yet they don't seem to

bother you?? Maybe you need Help or a sense of Humor? :wink:

just as you are allowed to bash Herm at every corner, so am I to allowed to dissagree with & voice my opinion against such bash..do we agree? lol

[Garb]

This would be scarier if the battle-tested Tom Brady was NOT the QB. What this tells me is that BB has superior confidence in Mangini and he will concentrate on the offensive side of the ball. Risky move - but BB loves a challenge, loves to prove people wrong and just loves getting in the last laugh. He could fall flat on his face - but I wouldn't bet on it.

[RichardSeymour]

If he fails miserably, after losing players ALL the Pats fans here claim mean nothing at all, then his genius needs to be re-examined in light of that result.

If the Pats go 6-10 with a healthy Brady, yes, I agree.

Let me get my $.02 in.

1) Belichick served as de facto QB coach for much of Brady's development. There's reason to think he brings more than a little bit to offensive gameplanning and play design.

2) That said, this move concerns me, particularly if Belichick is our de facto OC.

There are only so many hours in the day, and if Belichick is putting in major time on offense that eats into his overall QC time.

3) If the majority of OC duties are going to be hoisted by one of the offensive position coaches and Belichick is merely keeping a firm grip on things this way (liberal guidance and vetoing of playcalling and play design) I'm more comfortable, although I'd still rather have an OC.

Until proven otherwise, one overriding principle....

IBBWT.

[RSJ]

If the Pats go 6-10 with a healthy Brady, yes, I agree.

Let me get my $.02 in.

1) Belichick served as de facto QB coach for much of Brady's development. There's reason to think he brings more than a little bit to offensive gameplanning and play design.

2) That said, this move concerns me, particularly if Belichick is our de facto OC.

There are only so many hours in the day, and if Belichick is putting in major time on offense that eats into his overall QC time.

3) If the majority of OC duties are going to be hoisted by one of the offensive position coaches and Belichick is merely keeping a firm grip on things this way (liberal guidance and vetoing of playcalling and play design) I'm more comfortable, although I'd still rather have an OC.

Until proven otherwise, one overriding principle....

IBBWT.

It's not that I think BB can't handle the job of OC. It is more about the fact that there will be a ton of new coaches and players on the team and a lot of fires will need to be put out. I think this is the problem that will arise from having BB perform OC duties.

[joewilly]

The belief that Belichick is some puppet master pulling all the strings is foolish. Read Michael Holley's book Patriot Reign. He was able to follow the team and get in on meetings for over a year. The Patriots are not built to crumble with the loss of one player or coach.

The same thing they look for in players they look for in coaches. You will not see any Steve Spurrier types working only eight hours a day. They want players and coaches that live and breath football.

The Patriots will be okay.

I've heard a lot about the book & will read it sometime.

I agree with you that the pat's will be ok. just that .ok

he had to know he was gonna lose these guys, I just think maybe he thinks he can do it all without them. he's switching up a lot of players as well & I just think he's spreading himself too thin

[PFSIKH]

I've heard a lot about the book & will read it sometime.

I agree with you that the pat's will be ok. just that .ok

he had to know he was gonna lose these guys, I just think maybe he thinks he can do it all without them. he's switching up a lot of players as well & I just think he's spreading himself too thin

JW & rsherry - IMHO this year will be a transition year for the Patriots much like 2000 was. Before that season the Patriots cut alot of high priced 'old' veterans. Luckily in 2005, the team has alot more talent and should be able to weather the storm. Looking at the schedule, the Patriots have a gauntlet they have to run on the road. There are no gimmies. So, I do not think the Patriots will go 14-2 for a third straight year, but neither am I ruling out another run at the Superbowl. IMHO, short of injuries, if everything goes wrong as the Jets' fans want, we are looking at a 10-6 team. However, I believe the team will go about 12-4. Probably, losing a home game and a few road games.

[RSJ]

JW & rsherry - IMHO this year will be a transition year for the Patriots much like 2000 was. Before that season the Patriots cut alot of high priced 'old' veterans. Luckily in 2005, the team has alot more talent and should be able to weather the storm. Looking at the schedule, the Patriots have a gauntlet they have to run on the road. There are no gimmies. So, I do not think the Patriots will go 14-2 for a third straight year, but neither am I ruling out another run at the Superbowl. IMHO, short of injuries, if everything goes wrong as the Jets' fans want, we are looking at a 10-6 team. However, I believe the team will go about 12-4. Probably, losing a home game and a few road games.

It's not about things going the Jets fans way. The pats are a team that will finish between 10-6 and 12-4 at this point. If things go the Jet fans way it will be between 6-10 and 8-8.

[PatsFanTX]

Real Coaches know every aspect of the Game!

Political Appointee's Like Herm know that

when the Big Hand is on the little hand it's

play time at Michael Jacksons Neverland Ranch!

Other then that Hermie makes a Great Grilled Chicken!

Only Savage can reply to a thread about BB and get a good slam in on Hermy.

[Savage69]

just as you are allowed to bash Herm at every corner, so am I to allowed to dissagree with & voice my opinion against such bash..do we agree? lol

The difference being when Hermie's inept it hurts

the Team..My doing BBQ jokes doesn't!! You never

seem to chime in on any other Anti-Hermie poster..

Hmmm..I don't swing that way maybe you should try

stalking TS?? He's into that Stuff..

[Jetfan13]

The difference being when Hermie's inept it hurts

the Team..My doing BBQ jokes doesn't!! You never

seem to chime in on any other Anti-Hermie poster..

Hmmm..I don't swing that way maybe you should try

stalking TS?? He's into that Stuff..

I have no problem with you not liking Herm, thats your perogative...and I don't even mind a GOOD b-b-que joke ONCE IN A WHILE.

[bitonti]

bottom line the offense will grow stagnant - Bill seems to think he can just run Weiss' offense without Weiss - but who is gonna draw up the new plays? who is going to make in game adjustments? Belly is going to call the plays from the sideline? he's not even an OC by trade - having Tom Brady is all well and good but someone at some point is going to have to develop new plays -

if you ask me this is great news for the JETS -

[TomShane]

AHHHHHHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAA! Please tell me this is a joke. All you Patsie homers have to be clutching your bread-baskets right now. HAHAHAHAA!

Ladies and GENTLEMEN, the AFC EAST WINDOW is now OPEN FOR BUSINESS!!!

[PatsFanTX]

Ladies and GENTLEMEN, the AFC EAST WINDOW is now OPEN FOR BUSINESS!!!

Talk about a joke.

Yea, the Pats will probably slip to 13-3 next season.

Jets will be lucky to finish at 8-8.

That's a 5 game spread.

Yep, the AFCE window is wide open for business.

[TomShane]

Talk about a joke.

Yea, the Pats will probably slip to 13-3 next season.

Jets will be lucky to finish at 8-8.

That's a 5 game spread.

Yep, the AFCE window is wide open for business.

Does it sound to me like SOMEBODY WANTS TO BET!?!??

[PatsFanTX]

Does it sound to me like SOMEBODY WANTS TO BET!?!??

Quick, let's make one of those faggy signature bets like Smizzy does all the time.

[Maxman]

Talk about a joke.

Yea, the Pats will probably slip to 13-3 next season.

Jets will be lucky to finish at 8-8.

That's a 5 game spread.

Yep, the AFCE window is wide open for business.

Yeah you said the Jets would finish 8 and 8 a few years ago and couldn't have been more wrong.

You remember the year right?

The Jets overachieved that season and finished 9 and 7 and won a 3 way tie breaker to take the AFC EAST.

Bet you felt stupid then?

[Savage69]

The OC is relativly a new Position in Football

History! I always liked it when the HC and the

QB came up with the plays like the AFL used to

do! Weeb and Joe did the Game plan and Joe called

it..One of the best innovative HC's was Hank Stram

of KC!! Plus the Players on the field have a better

feel for what's happening in the Game then Hackett

did 10 stories up calling draws all day!!No wonder

some of the Jet offensive players used to groan

and shake their heads when Hackmeat sent in a play!

[TomShane]

Max, the Pats fans feel the walls closing in. Leave them be. MUUHUUAHAHAHHAAA!

[PatsFanTX]

Yeah you said the Jets would finish 8 and 8 a few years ago and couldn't have been more wrong.

Yea, I remember that.

They finished 6-10 in 2003.

What a dumbass for predicting 8-8.

[YJF]

Let's not get stupid.

Bill Belichick is not going to design the offense. They are going to use the same plays and system that they used the last 4 years.

Basically, Charlie left his playbook. No changes will be made.

It will be offensive coordinator by commitee. Belichick will call the plays.

Sort of like Tuna does in Dallas. Carthon and Payton put together the entire playbook. They design the weekly gameplan. Parcells goes through their call sheet and makes the play calls from the sideline.

Parcells is like an editor at a magazine. Writer does all the work, comes up with the ideas etc, Parcells takes his story and edits it.

[PatsFanTX]

Parcells is like an editor at a magazine. Writer does all the work, comes up with the ideas etc, Parcells takes his story and edits it.

Now that's what you call a damn good line.

[PFSIKH]

Bill Belichick is not going to design the offense. They are going to use the same plays and system that they used the last 4 years.

Exactly. This is not like the previous offenses that needed more trickery to be successful. They will tailor the offense to exploit the opposing teams defense, just like they did this past season.

[YJF]

Now that's what you call a damn good line.

Thank you very much. :wink:

The Pats are going to use the same terminology. So it's not like they are changing the offense. Will the staff be overworked? Probably. Will there be too many voices in the offensive meetings? Yes

Will Tom Brady get even more freedom to change calls? Sure, Staff has complete trust in him.

What seperated Charlie from alot of OC's was his in game playcalling. He had such a great feel for the game and was always in attack mode. His timing was almost always perfect.

It's a ready made offense. The only area which will be an issue is in game playcalling in crucial situations.

If Belichick calls the plays. It shows you that he doesn't have enough trustor faith in someone on his staff assuming Charlie's role.