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If Odrick is there he has to be the pick


RevisIsland24
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The Jets had the #1 defense in the NFL last year, the #1 pass defense. I think we all agree that they've already upgraded at CB this offseason. The ability to play teams' #1 & 2 WR's in man coverage all day long is going to work wonders for the Jets' pass rush - which was already part of the league's #1 passing defense! A pass rushing OLB would be a luxury, it's far from a "need."

Plus, these "pass rushing OLB's" are tough to draft. They're almost all converted college DE's, and they take time to develop, too. Rather than taking one early and trying to develop him (re: Gholston), it's a good position to address in the middle rounds.

I'd be looking for that 3-4 DE early, because Ellis is getting up there in age, and we have no depth. It's a rare place on the Jets roster where they could could be looking to draft a starter.

We don't have the age issue at WR, but we do have Braylon Edwards working on a one year deal. He's no lock to be with the team beyond 2010. We definitely have the depth issue, as the Jets cannot field a respectable 3 WR set right now, and would have to turn to David Clowney to start if Cotch or Edwards got hurt for any period of time. Again - they went way out of their way to draft & pay a young franchise QB, they really need to provide him with the tools he needs to succeed.

As of right now, the Jets don't have a 3rd round pick. Waiting until the end of the 4th to take a WR is waiting way too long. They really need a WR who can contribute as a rookie. I want them to go BAP, but they have to tailor their board to genuine needs at DE and WR. They really have to look to get those positions addressed in the first two rounds if they can.

UH NOT REALLY. While I am all in favor of drafting the BAP at #29 which will probably be a receiver, a pass rushing olb still remains our biggest need. How do you think Peyton Manning beat us? Also, if we acquire a formidable olb we could stop sending the whole dang front 7 to rush the QB! I will trust whatever tannenbaum does, whether its trading up to get brandon graham (beast) or stay at #29 and get tate(beast too). or even trading down, (though unlikely.)

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UH NOT REALLY. While I am all in favor of drafting the BAP at #29 which will probably be a receiver, a pass rushing olb still remains our biggest need. How do you think Peyton Manning beat us? Also, if we acquire a formidable olb we could stop sending the whole dang front 7 to rush the QB! I will trust whatever tannenbaum does, whether its trading up to get brandon graham (beast) or stay at #29 and get tate(beast too). or even trading down, (though unlikely.)

Peyton Manning beat us because we lost Strickland early in the game and we couldn't match up with their receivers at all after that point. Had we had better coverage, we would have more flexible with blitzing schemes and could have generated more of a pass rush.

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Peyton Manning beat us because we lost Strickland early in the game and we couldn't match up with their receivers at all after that point. Had we had better coverage, we would have more flexible with blitzing schemes and could have generated more of a pass rush.

I agree, but Manning will find his target and will get his completion one way or the other whether its his first option in Reggie Wayne or his fourth option is Austin Collie. Pass rush has proven more valuable than coverage over the years and in common sense it is.

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I agree, but Manning will find his target and will get his completion one way or the other whether its his first option in Reggie Wayne or his fourth option is Austin Collie. Pass rush has proven more valuable than coverage over the years and in common sense it is.

We got beat in the AFC Championship Game because we couldn't matchup with their receivers. What was our first offseason move?

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What's good about this thread is that we have no clue what we are doing at 29...hell, I wouldn't be surprised if we trade up again. Not saying I would want to, but this is one draft that is deep at a lot of positions and anything can happen...especially with the record Tanny has.

Hell, we might pull a Ditka and move up and grab Suh...j/k.

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We don't have the age issue at WR, but we do have Braylon Edwards working on a one year deal. He's no lock to be with the team beyond 2010.

+1

with Revis, Mangold, Brick and Harris all due deals...the chances of Braylon Edwards getting long term money are slim and none.

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What's good about this thread is that we have no clue what we are doing at 29...hell, I wouldn't be surprised if we trade up again. Not saying I would want to, but this is one draft that is deep at a lot of positions and anything can happen...especially with the record Tanny has.

Hell, we might pull a Ditka and move up and grab Suh...j/k.

If Eric Berry or Earl Thomas slip into the high teens, I wouldn't be surprised at all to see us trade up.

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de is even a bigger need than a pass rushing linebacker? heres my order of need. 1. pass rushing olb 2. wide receiver 3. run stuffing d end 4. safety

Yes DE is a bigger need. As of right now, who is the other starter at DE? What about if Ellis goes down? This is the weakest area on the team right now.

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One thing that suprises me is that carlos dunlap was mentioned in the top 10 in most mock drafts, now he is disappearing out of the first freakin round! Man, if he slips out of the top 20, he will be considered a steal down the road, mark my words.

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Yes DE is a bigger need. As of right now, who is the other starter at DE? What about if Ellis goes down? This is the weakest area on the team right now.

Your right, but a starting de will be easier to find than a starting olb. We shouldnt choose a de in the first round. Too much depth at the d line in this draft.

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UH NOT REALLY. While I am all in favor of drafting the BAP at #29 which will probably be a receiver, a pass rushing olb still remains our biggest need. How do you think Peyton Manning beat us? Also, if we acquire a formidable olb we could stop sending the whole dang front 7 to rush the QB! I will trust whatever tannenbaum does, whether its trading up to get brandon graham (beast) or stay at #29 and get tate(beast too). or even trading down, (though unlikely.)

I could easily make the argument that the reason the Jets lost to the Colts was because they didn't bring enough offense to the table. The Colts beat the NFL's #1 defense to get into the Super Bowl, then lost that Super Bowl to the league's #1 offense.

"Defense wins Championships," is a nice, old school, tough guy mantra - but it's just not true anymore in today's NFL. All the rules are in place to help offenses score points. Those that take the most advantage go the farthest.

Not that Tannenbaum should be drafting based on the results of a single game. Drafting like that is what leads to second round kickers. You draft based on value and overall team needs.

That pass rushing OLB is a luxury pick, man. Not a pick the Jets should go after early. DE and WR are clearly the biggest needs on the team. But this is an offensive league today. Passing wins championships. The Jets had the #1 passing dee in the NFL last year, which I would think makes it pretty obvious that their #1 need is not pass rushing help. Jets had the #31 passing offense in the NFL last year, which should make it fairly obvious that that's where they do need help. Yes, just a few more throws and Sanchez improving will go a long way, but the best way to help his improvement along and get those additional throws is to get him the weapons they need.

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Your right, but a starting de will be easier to find than a starting olb. We shouldnt choose a de in the first round. Too much depth at the d line in this draft.

Gholston was supposed to be that guy. I think the FO is still feeling burned on that one. Point here is that using a 1st on OLB is definitely not a guarantee. I agree with (I believe it was Slats) that said these type of players take a few years to develop. The Jets are SB ready now, and I'd rather get a DE that can start right away, or at least provide much needed depth to a razor thin position.

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Gholston was supposed to be that guy. I think the FO is still feeling burned on that one. Point here is that using a 1st on OLB is definitely not a guarantee. I agree with (I believe it was Slats) that said these type of players take a few years to develop. The Jets are SB ready now, and I'd rather get a DE that can start right away, or at least provide much needed depth to a razor thin position.

Yeah, again at #29 I dont even think there will be an olb worth taking. We would have to trade up. If we do go DE in the first I hope it is Dunlap. Say what you want but that guy reminds me of seymour. Gets double teamed and still gets pressure on the QB.

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I could easily make the argument that the reason the Jets lost to the Colts was because they didn't bring enough offense to the table. The Colts beat the NFL's #1 defense to get into the Super Bowl, then lost that Super Bowl to the league's #1 offense.

"Defense wins Championships," is a nice, old school, tough guy mantra - but it's just not true anymore in today's NFL. All the rules are in place to help offenses score points. Those that take the most advantage go the farthest.

Not that Tannenbaum should be drafting based on the results of a single game. Drafting like that is what leads to second round kickers. You draft based on value and overall team needs.

That pass rushing OLB is a luxury pick, man. Not a pick the Jets should go after early. DE and WR are clearly the biggest needs on the team. But this is an offensive league today. Passing wins championships. The Jets had the #1 passing dee in the NFL last year, which I would think makes it pretty obvious that their #1 need is not pass rushing help. Jets had the #31 passing offense in the NFL last year, which should make it fairly obvious that that's where they do need help. Yes, just a few more throws and Sanchez improving will go a long way, but the best way to help his improvement along and get those additional throws is to get him the weapons they need.

Stat wise what you are saying is true. The truth is the Jets got 2 sacks in the first two series. Both by Harris. The Colts weren

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Stat wise what you are saying is true. The truth is the Jets got 2 sacks in the first two series. Both by Harris. The Colts weren’t prepared for the middle blitz . Once they adjusted, Manning ate the Jets secondary alive.

If you add a pass rushing monster, it will be “Defense Wins Championships” again.

it should be noted that before those 2 sacks

manning had been sacked exactly 10 times the entire regular season

and his OL was garbage the whole time.

he saw alot of good pass rushers all year... no one could get him

Payton, like Brady and Brees, sees pressure exceptionally and has a super quick release

adding another pass rusher doesn't beat the COlts. They need more offense.

And the way they keep changing the rules, de-emphasizing big hits and letting receivers catch the ball... the future game will be more about offense... it's what the league wants... the league wants every game to be like last years' super bowl... scoring drives, TD's, few punts - entertainment.

Edited by bitonti
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Thats why n.f.l. is slowly becoming the No Fun League. But to go back to the topic at hand, I would have liked to see what the steelers could have done against the colts since the steelers have the best 3-4 combo pass rushers in the league.

Usually at times our middle linebackers get more pressure than our outside ones and thats bad because the middle of the field exposes us and gives the qb a wide area to throw.

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The NFL is really all about Grrr. Grrrrrrrrr smash mouth type tough guys. If they want to just have them playing high scoring touch football, no one will watch.

The NFL will be for what ever puts money in their pockets. Right now it is Peyton Manning and Tom Brady. They receive star treatment. Both of them are getting older.

you say 2 statements that seem unrelated but really are the heart of the matter

the league needs stars like Brady and Manning to be upright and on 2 feet to complete passes, sell tickets and command tv ratings.

so what does the league do? institute rules where you can hit the quarterback and how hard... not below the knees, not above the shoulder pads, cant drive him into the turf, can't swing him around like a ragdoll... etc.

it allows the tackles to offset their stances a yard behind the rest of the offensive line, to allow them advantages on pass rushers. it allows helmet radios that cut off a second before the snapp... but still enough time for the offensive coordinator to radio where the pressure might be coming from...

believe it or not no one wants to see a superbowl that finishes 10-7. they want to see a superbowl that's 35-31 or something like that.

so if LT was in the league, breaking legs of franchise QBs like Joe Theisman, they wouldn't want that.... i think they'd change the rules to stop it.

all this concussion business is only gonna make the game softer... as time goes on it will be more like basketball and less like boxing or MMA. that's just the way it's gonna go. they used to play the game without facemasks. It will change again...

Edited by bitonti
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THANK YOU!!!! Goodness Gracious!! Someone understands! In a 3-4 defense the most important thing after the nose tackle is the the ROLB. Every 3-4 team has theirs and we need to get ours. Steelers actually has two! Woodley and Harrison coming off the edge. We have no legit threat, and we only get pressure when we bring the whole house in.

Couple things...

1. We have our ROLB in Pace.

2. The most important thing about the 3-4 is the DL as a whole. Right now, we're short a starter or someone who can make starting DeVito for a full season at DE a whole lot easier to take.

Calvin Pace has to officially be the most underrated Jet by now...I can't think of anyone else on the team who gets little credit for being a top player at his position except maybe D'Brick.

Edited by SenorGato
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Couple things...

1. We have our ROLB in Pace.

2. The most important thing about the 3-4 is the DL as a whole. Right now, we're short a starter or someone who can make starting DeVito for a full season at DE a whole lot easier to take.

Calvin Pace has to officially be the most underrated Jet by now...I can't think of anyone else on the team who gets little credit for being a top player at his position except maybe D'Brick.

Pace isn't a true pass rusher though. he came from the cardinals and they run a 4-3. Pace is good, and hes servicable, but hes not the elite ROLB that other 3-4 teams have. D Brick is definitely the most underrated jet.

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Pace isn't a true pass rusher though. he came from the cardinals and they run a 4-3. Pace is good, and hes servicable, but hes not the elite ROLB that other 3-4 teams have. D Brick is definitely the most underrated jet.

Yet he's racked up 15 sacks and 8 FFs in his first two years with us...8 even with missing 4 games last year. Don't know what his Cardinals days have to do with anything either...but he played 3-4 OLB for them in his last year there.

Terrell Suggs has 17.5 sacks over the past 3 years, and he's a top 5 DE/OLB.

He's not elite, but he's a damn good one and he's certainly closer to the top of the position than what seems to be realized here.

I'll make a sig bet right now that he tops double digits in sacks next year...as corny as a sig bet sounds.

Also, this is not a D that relies on any one person to do any one thing...that means pass rush isn't a single person in this D.

Edited by SenorGato
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Our franchise QB needs more weapons. I know we have Edwards and Cotch, but I think we need to add another playmaking wideout (See sig).

It will also keep defenses off balances for sure.

Why is Dustin Keller such a forgotten factor this offseason? The guy made the biggest catch of the season when he caught that TD pass behind two defenders to win the playoff game against SD.

That was Sanchez's first big playoff moment too...New WR is behind Edwards, Cotchery, Keller, and the Leon/LT combo when it comes to catching passes.

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Why is Dustin Keller such a forgotten factor this offseason? The guy made the biggest catch of the season when he caught that TD pass behind two defenders to win the playoff game against SD.

That was Sanchez's first big playoff moment too...

Who's forgetting about him? He's our TE. I know we line him up in the slot too but that's not his game. We need a slot receiver and I think Tate can be that guy. I also think he can be a #1 or #2 in this league. We need to find our "Manning-Harrison" for Sanchez.

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Who's forgetting about him? He's our TE. I know we line him up in the slot too but that's not his game. We need a slot receiver and I think Tate can be that guy. I also think he can be a #1 or #2 in this league. We need to find our "Manning-Harrison" for Sanchez.

His game is catching passes...That's why we drafted him. By official position Dallas Clark and Antonio Gates are TEs too...their job in their respective offenses is to catch passes and be a safety valve for their QBs....much like the suddenly wildly overrated slot WR position.

We don't NEED a slot WR when we haven't even fully gelled Sanchez with his "Big 3" guys first. If we do get a slot WR, we could easily grab someone like Blair White in the 4th (or later) on draft day. If Edwards busts here, then we grab one of the beasts in 2011...preferably Jonathan Baldwin, Michael Floyd, or AJ Green.

Also, they went and used 2 picks in this upcoming draft on getting Sanchez a potential #1 WR...a potential #1 WR who's two whole years removed from a dominant NFL season and is just turning 27. First round WR is such an unlikely pick for this team...and grabbing this years' 3rd or 4th best WR in the first doesn't sound as appetizing when I know that next years' crop is way more talented at the top (Green, Baldwin, Jones, Floyd).

Who uses a first round pick on a slot WR anyway? It's not as if that suddenly makes our passing game dominant...if we get a first round WR it better be Dez Bryant....IMO he's as good or even better than the guys coming out next year...the only guy in this draft you can say that about.

This is ESPECIALLY true when you consider that Mike DeVito, our very excellent 4th DL, has now moved up to the starting DE spot. Do you trust DeVito as a full time starter? Does the depth behind him (besides Pouha) inspire any kind of confidence? Because those guys do for me what Clowney/Allison is doing for the WR pushers.

Edited by SenorGato
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His game is catching passes...That's why we drafted him. By official position Dallas Clark and Antonio Gates are TEs too...their job in their respective offenses is to catch passes and be a safety valve for their QBs....much like the suddenly wildly overrated slot WR position.

We don't NEED a slot WR when we haven't even fully gelled Sanchez with his "Big 3" guys first. If we do get a slot WR, we could easily grab someone like Blair White in the 4th (or later) on draft day. If Edwards busts here, then we grab one of the beasts in 2011...preferably Jonathan Baldwin, Michael Floyd, or AJ Green.

Also, they went and used 2 picks in this upcoming draft on getting Sanchez a potential #1 WR...a potential #1 WR who's two whole years removed from a dominant NFL season and is just turning 27. First round WR is such an unlikely pick for this team...and grabbing this years' 3rd or 4th best WR in the first doesn't sound as appetizing when I know that next years' crop is way more talented at the top (Green, Baldwin, Jones, Floyd).

Who uses a first round pick on a slot WR anyway? It's not as if that suddenly makes our passing game dominant...if we get a first round WR it better be Dez Bryant....IMO he's as good or even better than the guys coming out next year...the only guy in this draft you can say that about.

This is ESPECIALLY true when you consider that Mike DeVito, our very excellent 4th DL, has now moved up to the starting DE spot. Do you trust DeVito as a full time starter? Does the depth behind him (besides Pouha) inspire any kind of confidence? Because those guys do for me what Clowney/Allison is doing for the WR pushers.

Golden Tate is a very talented player. He's going to be the next Steve Smith (Carolina). I feel like he will eventually take on the #1 role.

The problem I have with DK at the slot is Ben Hartsock will be the TE unless we line up in a 3WR-2RB format.

I like having this:

Edwards-Tate-Cotchery

Dustin Keller

Shonn Greene.

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Golden Tate is a very talented player. He's going to be the next Steve Smith (Carolina). I feel like he will eventually take on the #1 role.

The problem I have with DK at the slot is Ben Hartsock will be the TE unless we line up in a 3WR-2RB format.

I like having this:

Edwards-Tate-Cotchery

Dustin Keller

Shonn Greene.

Steve Smith was not only not a first round pick when he was drafted...he gained 154 receiving yards as a rookie. This is ignoring that Tate doesn't have Smith's elite speed or quickness...

When did the slot WR position become such a big deal? There's a reason we gave up Stuckey (a prototypical slot) WITH 2 picks in this draft for Edwards (a prototypical outside WR)...it's not because we really wanted to spend a first round pick on a slot guy in the offseason.

Edwards - Cotcher - Keller can work this year for what we're doing on offense...which is still trying to run the ball down teams' throats. Use Leon and LT in the screen game and we're pretty much set with our passing offense. An Antonio Brown, Blair White, Brian Anderson, Danario Alexander, or one of the many talented non-first round WRs could easily do what will realistically get done by the rookie WR...

What kind of stats would you expect from Tate if we were to take him in the first? Just curiosity...You think he can just walk into the NFL and be Steve Smith or our Wes Welker in the slot? Is it an impossible task for a non-first round WR?

Give me McCluster in the 2nd or one of a number of guys later than that over Tate in the first anyday...

Edited by SenorGato
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What's good about this thread is that we have no clue what we are doing at 29...hell, I wouldn't be surprised if we trade up again. Not saying I would want to, but this is one draft that is deep at a lot of positions and anything can happen...especially with the record Tanny has.

Hell, we might pull a Ditka and move up and grab Suh...j/k.

+1

You all sound like a bunch of pansies screaming "WE NEED!" "WE NEED!" We don't need a ****ing thing. Anybody that can make plays will be helpful, but there is no desperate need on this team. If you think there is, you are blind. The only desperate need is for Sanchez to improve. Everything else is in place.

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Why is Dustin Keller such a forgotten factor this offseason? The guy made the biggest catch of the season when he caught that TD pass behind two defenders to win the playoff game against SD.

That was Sanchez's first big playoff moment too...New WR is behind Edwards, Cotchery, Keller, and the Leon/LT combo when it comes to catching passes.

I like Dustin Keller, too, but TE is another position the Jets need to look at. The have no depth at all behind Cotch, Edwards, or Keller. None. One of those guys goes down, and the offense is hurting. You want Clowny or Hartsock in the starting lineup for any period of time? Leon was a non-factor as a receiver before he got hurt, and I don't expect that to change all that much this year with LT.

Jets could put the additional playmaker to use today, and he'd have one year under his belt in the development of an NFL WR while the Jets are figuring out what to do with Braylon. Losing Braylon then drafting a WR is a worse plan.

They'd be foolish, IMHO, to not grab a WR in the first two rounds this year. It has to be a

+1

You all sound like a bunch of pansies screaming "WE NEED!" "WE NEED!" We don't need a ****ing thing. Anybody that can make plays will be helpful, but there is no desperate need on this team. If you think there is, you are blind. The only desperate need is for Sanchez to improve. Everything else is in place.

All my calls for WR, I do think the Jets *need* a DE in this draft, too. That's really the last starting void on the team. I still hope Marques Douglas comes back, but I'd really prefer a young player to step up into the starting lineup.

And yeah, I'd be shocked if the Jets drafted a pass rushing DE/OLB early this year. Between Gholston and Bryan Thomas, I think they've learned all they have to about taking these guys high. Thomas became a serviceable player, Gholston probably never will, and neither will ever be great. Very tough position to predict. Better to take the great athletes with the right size later on and develop them. You have to develop them, anyway.

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This is ESPECIALLY true when you consider that Mike DeVito, our very excellent 4th DL, has now moved up to the starting DE spot. Do you trust DeVito as a full time starter? Does the depth behind him (besides Pouha) inspire any kind of confidence? Because those guys do for me what Clowney/Allison is doing for the WR pushers.

I trust those players. Pouha and Devito made big plays for the league's best defense. They are key rotation members with tons of experience.

Meanwhile Allison hasn't done anything in his entire career and I think Clown has maybe 10 catches total. The DL situation isn't even comparable to the WR situation.

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I trust those players. Pouha and Devito made big plays for the league's best defense. They are key rotation members with tons of experience.

Meanwhile Allison hasn't done anything in his entire career and I think Clown has maybe 10 catches total. The DL situation isn't even comparable to the WR situation.

Actually, I'm kind of with Slats. While the D line rotation guys have shown more than Clowney and Allison, I'm a little bothered by the fact that there are only 3 DEs under contract. If and when they sign Douglas I'll be fine with it, but until then they are probably a body short. I'm fine with Devito starting, but they let Green and Douglas walk and don't have anybody to step in. I also think that Clowney may have a decent year.

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I trust those players. Pouha and Devito made big plays for the league's best defense. They are key rotation members with tons of experience.

Meanwhile Allison hasn't done anything in his entire career and I think Clown has maybe 10 catches total. The DL situation isn't even comparable to the WR situation.

That makes one...besides for DeVito I trust the backup DL as far as I can throw them. One season of playing over their heads (again, except DeVito, a damn good player) doesn't mean much of anything to me. Don't even get me started on the Pito's and Kroul's of the world...those guys are hoping to be JAGs one day.

The DL situation doesn't compare to the WR situation because at least the star talent we have at WR is young and entering their prime. Oh...then it does compare...and our DL situation is worse.

Also, Allison HAS caught passes and was a pretty dangerous KR in '07 (29 YPA). Just sayin'...if you can say the organization is high on Pito and Kroul because they exist within the organization then it's just as easy and logical to say the same about Allison...and Clowney too, even if I thew up in my mouth a little typing that one out.

Seriously...Mike DeVito goes from 4th DL to 3rd...Pouha from 5th to 4th (I'm counting Jenkins here)...what about that can be good? DeVito's one of the better young swing DL amongst the 3-4 teams...why would we blow that because of one season? Force him into a starting spot with NO competition and we're short a top swing DL...Oy...I don't get this offseason at all...everyone wants shiny new toys for Sanchez and skill position players when we very clearly lack depth in the trenches.

Edited by SenorGato
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I don't get this offseason at all...everyone wants shiny new toys for Sanchez and skill position players when we very clearly lack depth in the trenches.

what this all keeps coming back to is the defense was #1 in the league last year... the passing offense was 31st.

Defense needs less help than the offense. Others will disagree but the stats back it up.

All the defense lost was Marques Douglas... and they can still get him back.

end of the day, the defense doesn't need first rounders to replace Marques Douglas.

however they can use a first rounder to turn the offense from well below average to decent.

Rex has a long history of finding gems in the late rounds or after the draft, especially on defense. (Douglas, Scott, Leonard... Bannan, Gregg etc).

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