iPhone 4

[war ensemble]

You had me at FaceTime.

I'll withhold judgment on Facetime until I see how compatible it is with other programs--most notably Skype. As of now it's extremely limited--Wifi-only and one can only video call fellow iPhone 4 people. The software looks nice from what I've seen though.

[Jbro22]

I'll withhold judgment on Facetime until I see how compatible it is with other programs--most notably Skype. As of now it's extremely limited--Wifi-only and one can only video call fellow iPhone 4 people. The software looks nice from what I've seen though.

Another thing jailbreak will fix.

[Vicious89x]

Does anyone know what the backlog for getting one is? I want one and am eligible for an upgrade.

And the only thing that scares me is this whole glass breaking thing. If this becomes a common problem I might avoid this for a few months.

[ZachEY]

Just had a 5 minute call holding it with my left hand. No problem at all. Perhaps your phone doesn't like you because you're complaining about it too much.

Wait...

It makes and receives calls?

[RutgersJetFan]

The software looks nice from what I've seen though.

Took it for a spin yesterday and it's nothing short of awesome. Hi-def video chatting from a ****ing phone.

[RutgersJetFan]

Wait...

It makes and receives calls?

Unless your hand has AIDS or something, then the phone doesn't work.

[RutgersJetFan]

Does anyone know what the backlog for getting one is? I want one and am eligible for an upgrade.

And the only thing that scares me is this whole glass breaking thing. If this becomes a common problem I might avoid this for a few months.

If I were you I'd wait. From everything I've read, they rushed a ton of these beyond the first batch and there might be problems like that for lots of people (i.e., the yellow splotches are supposedly due to a bonding agent that hasn't fully dried yet). Luckily for me it looks like I got one of the early ones, but I'd give it another month or so until they catch up on pre-orders and get stores fully stocked.

[Vicious89x]

If I were you I'd wait. From everything I've read, they rushed a ton of these beyond the first batch and there might be problems like that for lots of people (i.e., the yellow splotches are supposedly due to a bonding agent that hasn't fully dried yet). Luckily for me it looks like I got one of the early ones, but I'd give it another month or so until they catch up on pre-orders and get stores fully stocked.

Yea, I was thinking August or so to get one. Plus HOPEFULLY, more information comes out as to what is going on with all of this stuff. For now I will just remain infinitely jealous.

[RutgersJetFan]

Yea, I was thinking August or so to get one. Plus HOPEFULLY, more information comes out as to what is going on with all of this stuff. For now I will just remain infinitely jealous.

Here's my take on it, seriously:

The antenna: Hasn't been a problem for me, but a case supposedly solves the problem and you're a ****ing ruh'tard if you don't get a case for any device that costs several hundred bucks anyways.

Splotches: Again, no problems here, but they admitted it's a bonding agent that was rushed and should be dry in a few days for those who've been dealing with it. If time doesn't solve the problem? Bring it in and they'll give you a new one. Problem solved.

Multi-tasking programs: Blame the app developers, not Apple. From this point on it's on them. Aside from that, it's something that'll change with time. It was either wait for them to catch up and delay the phone release, or put the phone out and give your customers what they want while developers can update their stuff accordingly. I'd definitely prefer the latter and I'm glad they did it that way.

Jailbreaking: I don't really care. I never programmed my last one to work in a way that it wasn't supposed to, therefore I'm not pissed that my new one doesn't do what the last one wasn't supposed to do either.

FaceTime restrictions: Again, I think this will be something that'll evolve with time. I'm no engineer by any means, but I'd guess that if Apple provided for unlimited hi-definition video calling right off the bat, that would probably be pretty bad for AT&T's network; same for why teethering isn't officially out there yet. Besides, am I really going to be video-chatting that often with people from my phone? I won't be doing it when I'm driving, or in a restaurant or anything. Therefore the likelihood of me being in a wi-fi spot when I want to video chat is pretty high. Sure, I can't tea-bag my friends via FaceTime when I emerge from the bar at 3 am, but for all the other upgrades, it's a sacrifice I'm willing to make.

[Vicious89x]

Here's my take on it, seriously:

The antenna: Hasn't been a problem for me, but a case supposedly solves the problem and you're a ****ing ruh'tard if you don't get a case for any device that costs several hundred bucks anyways.

Splotches: Again, no problems here, but they admitted it's a bonding agent that was rushed and should be dry in a few days for those who've been dealing with it. If time doesn't solve the problem? Bring it in and they'll give you a new one. Problem solved.

Multi-tasking programs: Blame the app developers, not Apple. From this point on it's on them. Aside from that, it's something that'll change with time. It was either wait for them to catch up and delay the phone release, or put the phone out and give your customers what they want while developers can update their stuff accordingly. I'd definitely prefer the latter and I'm glad they did it that way.

Jailbreaking: I don't really care. I never programmed my last one to work in a way that it wasn't supposed to, therefore I'm not pissed that my new one doesn't do what the last one wasn't supposed to do either.

FaceTime restrictions: Again, I think this will be something that'll evolve with time. I'm no engineer by any means, but I'd guess that if Apple provided for unlimited hi-definition video calling right off the bat, that would probably be pretty bad for AT&T's network; same for why teethering isn't officially out there yet. Besides, am I really going to be video-chatting that often with people from my phone? I won't be doing it when I'm driving, or in a restaurant or anything. Therefore the likelihood of me being in a wi-fi spot when I want to video chat is pretty high. Sure, I can't tea-bag my friends via FaceTime when I emerge from the bar at 3 am, but for all the other upgrades, it's a sacrifice I'm willing to make.

Cool. Like I said for me the only thing I'm concerned about is this supposed issue with the glass breaking. I've read a couple of things that it breaks REALLY easily and that frightens me.

[Jbro22]

Here's my take on it, seriously:

The antenna: Hasn't been a problem for me, but a case supposedly solves the problem and you're a ****ing ruh'tard if you don't get a case for any device that costs several hundred bucks anyways.

Splotches: Again, no problems here, but they admitted it's a bonding agent that was rushed and should be dry in a few days for those who've been dealing with it. If time doesn't solve the problem? Bring it in and they'll give you a new one. Problem solved.

Multi-tasking programs: Blame the app developers, not Apple. From this point on it's on them. Aside from that, it's something that'll change with time. It was either wait for them to catch up and delay the phone release, or put the phone out and give your customers what they want while developers can update their stuff accordingly. I'd definitely prefer the latter and I'm glad they did it that way.

Jailbreaking: I don't really care. I never programmed my last one to work in a way that it wasn't supposed to, therefore I'm not pissed that my new one doesn't do what the last one wasn't supposed to do either.

FaceTime restrictions: Again, I think this will be something that'll evolve with time. I'm no engineer by any means, but I'd guess that if Apple provided for unlimited hi-definition video calling right off the bat, that would probably be pretty bad for AT&T's network; same for why teethering isn't officially out there yet. Besides, am I really going to be video-chatting that often with people from my phone? I won't be doing it when I'm driving, or in a restaurant or anything. Therefore the likelihood of me being in a wi-fi spot when I want to video chat is pretty high. Sure, I can't tea-bag my friends via FaceTime when I emerge from the bar at 3 am, but for all the other upgrades, it's a sacrifice I'm willing to make.

You're way off on both these points.

1. Shouldn't be on the app's developers end, when it is clearly possible for apple to fix it.

2. Jailbreaking lets you use your phones to its maximum potential.

I understand your defending your purchase, everyone does it. No ones saying the phone sucks, I would love to have one. 3Gs for now. The problem is Apple limits and is still cutting corners even with the new competition. The limiting and corner cutting was reasonable when the iPhone had next to no competition.

But Apple's got ridiculous amount of loyal customers, and I'm one of them. Because of what you said earlier about everything syncing up.

But god damnit, can't Apple just iron out the bull**** people have been complaining about for 3 years now.

[RutgersJetFan]

You're way off on both these points.

You can keep prefacing everything you say with statements like this. It's not going to make your arguments anymore valid.

1. Shouldn't be on the app's developers end, when it is clearly possible for apple to fix it.

Meh, it's a new operating system. This is what happens. It's the developer's responsibility to make sure they can work within the OS, not the other way around. Hence why apps are already good to go for it, because they accounted for the change. Catch up or get lost. Welcome to Econ 101.

2. Jailbreaking lets you use your phones to its maximum potential.

No, it puts the device at risk to do things that the software isn't designed to handle for the long-term. It's why people experience the infamous bricking problem when they do it, disabling the mic and buttons, connection problems...etc. Just because a piece of technology is capable of doing something after hacking it doesn't mean that it's designed to do so. There's a huge difference between the two, and with how smooth Apple products run, it's dumb to even risk it. Complaining that Steve Jobs didn't design multi-tasking to parallel how some 19-year-old in Mom's basement designed it on a hacked program is absurd, especially when one is capable of crashing the device and another is made to work with it.

I understand your defending your purchase, everyone does it.

And I understand that you're going to complain about it regardless. Everyone does it. The phone could enable you to poop gold and I'm fairly certain that engadget would run an op-ed on how it's not shiny enough. It's lame to hint that I'm doing it blindly regardless. Guys like Vicious are friends of mine, and I wouldn't recommend that a friend go and throw away several hundred bucks on something if I wasn't speaking objectively.

I would love to have one. 3Gs for now.

Ah, got it, so 3 pages worth of complaints have been based on third party reports and not what's in front of you.

The problem is Apple limits and is still cutting corners even with the new competition.

The iPhone is a bilateral effort in terms of development. Apple and outside software developers. Both are equally as important. It's administratively impossible to coordinate an overhaul with the countless ones that exist. Putting the device out and then tailoring the software is a no-brainer. It saves time, money, and gets your product into the consumer's hand faster.

But god damnit, can't Apple just iron out the bull**** people have been complaining about for 3 years now.

The main complaints of the past 3 years have been the camera, flash, multi-tasking, email merging, and battery power. All have been provided for.

I'm not blindly defending a purchase here. It's pretty obvious why things are the way they are for now and that the current improvements are pretty awesome. Tech deficiencies happen. Consider yourself lucky that they happened with a company who improves upon them pretty quickly have already put in procedures to accommodate those affected. I haven't been, and as someone who was addicted to his 3GS I can say without question that this is a superior phone in every single way possible. It's just ludicrous to even try and argue otherwise, especially when your entire argument is based off of a comparison to bootleg software.

[ZachEY]

You're way off on both these points.

1. Shouldn't be on the app's developers end, when it is clearly possible for apple to fix it.

2. Jailbreaking lets you use your phones to its maximum potential.

I understand your defending your purchase, everyone does it. No ones saying the phone sucks, I would love to have one. 3Gs for now. The problem is Apple limits and is still cutting corners even with the new competition. The limiting and corner cutting was reasonable when the iPhone had next to no competition.

But Apple's got ridiculous amount of loyal customers, and I'm one of them. Because of what you said earlier about everything syncing up.

But god damnit, can't Apple just iron out the bull**** people have been complaining about for 3 years now.

I don't own an iPhone, nor will I be getting one, but you can't attack a product based on the difficulty/inability to hack it.

I'm pretty sure Apple's intent was not to make a product for computer dorks and hackers but rather as wide a base as possible.

[Sperm Edwards]

Here's my take on it, seriously:

The antenna: Hasn't been a problem for me, but a case supposedly solves the problem and you're a ****ing ruh'tard if you don't get a case for any device that costs several hundred bucks anyways.

Except that you have to buy a case, not merely to protect your device that cost several hundred bucks, but to get it to work properly. That's pretty sucky. If it requires a special case to function properly for most, it should be included with the device.

Your analogy is like saying someone who buys a car should have to pay extra to get the wipers to work 100% of the time, and that anyone who wouldn't buy this after-market add-on to their expensive purchase is stupid.

Splotches: Again, no problems here, but they admitted it's a bonding agent that was rushed and should be dry in a few days for those who've been dealing with it. If time doesn't solve the problem? Bring it in and they'll give you a new one. Problem solved.

Problem solved, after you make an "appointment" to go to an Apple store and wait around like an idiot for 30 minutes past the always-late appointment time, for some kid with a face full of pimples and piercings to take care of an issue that should have been corrected when you first picked up your phone. And that's IF you happen to live in an area with an Apple store nearby. There are countless people in the country who live hours away from the nearest airport, to say nothing of their proximity to the nearest Apple Store. If that's you then you have to mail your brand new phone back to Apple and - with no phone in the interim - wait for a new one in the mail from Apple. Problem solved, indeed.

[war ensemble]

Multi-tasking programs: Blame the app developers, not Apple. From this point on it's on them. Aside from that, it's something that'll change with time. It was either wait for them to catch up and delay the phone release, or put the phone out and give your customers what they want while developers can update their stuff accordingly. I'd definitely prefer the latter and I'm glad they did it that way.

FaceTime restrictions: Again, I think this will be something that'll evolve with time. I'm no engineer by any means, but I'd guess that if Apple provided for unlimited hi-definition video calling right off the bat, that would probably be pretty bad for AT&T's network; same for why teethering isn't officially out there yet. Besides, am I really going to be video-chatting that often with people from my phone? I won't be doing it when I'm driving, or in a restaurant or anything. Therefore the likelihood of me being in a wi-fi spot when I want to video chat is pretty high. Sure, I can't tea-bag my friends via FaceTime when I emerge from the bar at 3 am, but for all the other upgrades, it's a sacrifice I'm willing to make.

Refusing to blame the limitations on multitasking on Apple is silly. The APIs available for devs to use for multitasking just does not cover every app, unlike Android. You want to leave your chat/IM program running in the background? Too bad. There are other examples of things that can't be done that I'm too lazy to look up. Another thing to consider is that developers cannot directly update their apps--they must first pass the Cupertino Cops. Some apps might require some finagling to work within Apple's restrictions, and Apple might take some time with others. This is a fault on Apple's side.

Sprint can handle Fring/Skype/Qik over 3G with the EVO, although there's admittedly many less Evos than iPhones. Nevertheless, AT&T's network problems shows some of the limitations on a carrier-exclusive OS. (US, at least) I can think of many useful scenarios for video chatting not at home. And the options only increase when you can videochat with non-iPhone users, something so far impossible.

[war ensemble]

Meh, it's a new operating system. This is what happens. It's the developer's responsibility to make sure they can work within the OS, not the other way around. Hence why apps are already good to go for it, because they accounted for the change. Catch up or get lost. Welcome to Econ 101.

The main complaints of the past 3 years have been the camera, flash, multi-tasking, email merging, and battery power. All have been provided for.

You wrote the wrong type of Flash...Adobe's version is still sorely lacking on all iOS devices.

You also mention that people have a natural propensity towards complaining, and you cite Engadget's complaining about the iPhone. Which is laughable, seeing as they have been trying to dismiss/ignore most of the issues with the device.

One more technicality: iOS 4 is not a new operating system, but rather a software update.

[Vudu]

LMFAO@ "Just avoid holding it that way"

[RutgersJetFan]

Your analogy is like saying someone who buys a car should have to pay extra to get the wipers to work 100% of the time...

Except that you do have to pay extra to get your wipers to work on your car 100% of the time.

[RutgersJetFan]

Refusing to blame the limitations on multitasking on Apple is silly. The APIs available for devs to use for multitasking just does not cover every app, unlike Android. You want to leave your chat/IM program running in the background? Too bad. There are other examples of things that can't be done that I'm too lazy to look up. Another thing to consider is that developers cannot directly update their apps--they must first pass the Cupertino Cops. Some apps might require some finagling to work within Apple's restrictions, and Apple might take some time with others. This is a fault on Apple's side.

Sprint can handle Fring/Skype/Qik over 3G with the EVO, although there's admittedly many less Evos than iPhones. Nevertheless, AT&T's network problems shows some of the limitations on a carrier-exclusive OS. (US, at least) I can think of many useful scenarios for video chatting not at home. And the options only increase when you can videochat with non-iPhone users, something so far impossible.

Can't say I disagree with any of this. My #1 beef with the iPhone over the years is no GChat (ala Blackberrys) that doesn't have to run through Safari. But to be honest, it's really not that big of a deal to me considering I text everyone that I'd need to be on an IM with anyways. And the problems with AT&T's network are well known at this point, I don't mind because it's limitations are far outweighed by everything else.

You wrote the wrong type of Flash...Adobe's version is still sorely lacking on all iOS devices.

Ha, I was wondering if someone would catch that. My opinion's the same as it is for the iPad on Flash capabilities. For almost everything I'd need Flash for, there is or eventually will be an app for regardless. Youtube, DailyMotion...etc. Again, it's a limitation that I don't mind because I understand the hinderance it would put on the device. Jobs has explained countless times and it's pretty reasonable. Over the years, IMO Apple's been doing what they can to accommodate people who want to use the more popular stuff.

I think a lot of people take for granted just how new this thing still is. The first gen was introduced only 3 and 1/2 years ago, and the progression it's made since that point has been pretty remarkable. Some people are going to want everything at once and some are going to understand the need for patience in advancements, I understand both points of view, I just happen to be part of the latter. In the meantime, it's still an amazing device, the best out there in my opinion, and that's why I love it.

[Sperm Edwards]

Except that you do have to pay extra to get your wipers to work on your car 100% of the time.

No. Those are wiper BLADES you are referring to, and when you drive your car off the lot they do work 100% of the time. After a while they don't work as well as they did when new. Like a cell phone's battery. But the actual wiper mechanism still works fine.

Even still, have you ever bought a car that didn't come with wiper blades? "Standard equipment: intermittent wipers (wiper blades not included)." lol

This is a phone that doesn't work well while new. And to get it to work properly, you have to buy something else. If it requires a special case for it to work at all, they have to provide it for free. Unless, that is, they tell you at the time of purchase that the phone may not work without this special add-on case.

Regardless, it's pretty ridiculous that holding this phone just like people have done for decades causes the signal to drop out and the call to get disconnected.

[uart]

Sprint can handle Fring/Skype/Qik over 3G with the EVO, although there's admittedly many less Evos than iPhones. Nevertheless, AT&T's network problems shows some of the limitations on a carrier-exclusive OS. (US, at least) I can think of many useful scenarios for video chatting not at home. And the options only increase when you can videochat with non-iPhone users, something so far impossible.

Verizon's 3G network would be WRECKED if every iPhone user switched over to it today.

[war ensemble]

Ha, I was wondering if someone would catch that. My opinion's the same as it is for the iPad on Flash capabilities. For almost everything I'd need Flash for, there is or eventually will be an app for regardless. Youtube, DailyMotion...etc. Again, it's a limitation that I don't mind because I understand the hinderance it would put on the device. Jobs has explained countless times and it's pretty reasonable. Over the years, IMO Apple's been doing what they can to accommodate people who want to use the more popular stuff.

I think a lot of people take for granted just how new this thing still is. The first gen was introduced only 3 and 1/2 years ago, and the progression it's made since that point has been pretty remarkable. Some people are going to want everything at once and some are going to understand the need for patience in advancements, I understand both points of view, I just happen to be part of the latter. In the meantime, it's still an amazing device, the best out there in my opinion, and that's why I love it.

Adobe has been trying to create a Flash-to-Apple app conversion software, but Apple has said that it will block any app that uses this software. There is no other reason for them to do this other than to increase the Apple-Adobe wars. I believe Adobe has since halted production on the new Photoshop for Mac (or something similar, at least).

I find it hard to believe Apple is accommodating the most popular stuff when it purposely makes it harder for Flash-to-app ports, to force out perceived competitors. At least for this situation, it is not an issue of patience/Apple not doing something, but their doing something that unnecessarily limits the devs, and in turn app production.

*Also, you can only go so far with the "novelty" argument, seeing as Android has been updated with many of the improvements wanted on iOS, and it has been out for a lot less time than the iPhone.

[war ensemble]

Verizon's 3G network would be WRECKED if every iPhone user switched over to it today.

Depending on how they hold their iPhones, of course.

[Jbro22]

I don't own an iPhone, nor will I be getting one, but you can't attack a product based on the difficulty/inability to hack it.

I'm pretty sure Apple's intent was not to make a product for computer dorks and hackers but rather as wide a base as possible.

You must have mis read what I've said. Plus iOS4 was hacked 2 months before it was officially released.

[BP]

I just got the Curve 2 last week

[Maxman]

Verizon's 3G network would be WRECKED if every iPhone user switched over to it today.

Which makes the multiple carrier case stronger. Spread the love and make the iPhone experience even better.

I will say this, I wanted an iPhone for years but I am locked into Verizon. Now that I have the droid I can say I doubt I will ever switch.

[BP]

Which makes the multiple carrier case stronger. Spread the love and make the iPhone experience even better.

I will say this, I wanted an iPhone for years but I am locked into Verizon. Now that I have the droid I can say I doubt I will ever switch.

The Iphone is coming to verizon in December

[Maxman]

You must have mis read what I've said. Plus iOS4 was hacked 2 months before it was officially released.

These days I rarely apply any hacks. I used to do that back in the day to TIVO and things like that. But these "jailbreaking communities" really do extend a prodcut and get new features put on official support. Not right away but over time they show things can be done so they are good for that.

[BP]

IMO its not that ones better than the other. if you just wanna use it as a phone and surf the net the iphone is for you. for emailing and using the phone the blackberry curve is better..lol..I hate typing on a ****ing screen with my finger nail nubs..but thats just me.

[Maxman]

IMO its not that ones better than the other. if you just wanna use it as a phone and surf the net the iphone is for you. for emailing and using the phone the blackberry curve is better..lol..I hate typing on a ****ing screen with my finger nail nubs..but thats just me.

Dude aren't you like 100 years old? Please leave us hip kids alone. Your silly blackberry talk is ruining this site.

[BP]

Dude aren't you like 100 years old? Please leave us hip kids alone. Your silly blackberry talk is ruining this site.

<--my smiley..lol

seriously, how do you get your chubby fingers to type on a droid screen? lol

[Maxman]

<--my smiley..lol

seriously, how do you get your chubby fingers to type on a droid screen? lol

I would explain but I know you won't remember it in the morning. Friggin blackberry.

JN Mods protecting the virtual storefront on a blackberry.

[Jetsfan80]

How the hell has Max's Droid not participated in this thread yet?

Maybe he needs to be called. Max's Droid, what has Max has google searched in the last 24 hours?

[Falcon63]

Just buy an itouch, and get Metro's $40 unlimited plan with a Samsung Messenger II.

[/thread]

[Vudu]

FL7yD-0pqZg