Front Office has work to do...

[rollingrock49]

I hope the reports that the offers given to Revis have little to no fully guarenteed money are false. That's the dumbest thing you can do. Ferguson's contract could show they are trying to be a bit sneaky with it. They'd better not screw this up. And why cant they at least try to work on Mangold and Harris. The team finally has a good core in place and only 1 of 4 is signed now and he took a deal that had a strange setup that many players probably would have shot down.

[Klecko73isGod]

I hope the reports that the offers given to Revis have little to no fully guarenteed money are false. That's the dumbest thing you can do. Ferguson's contract could show they are trying to be a bit sneaky with it. They'd better not screw this up. And why cant they at least try to work on Mangold and Harris. The team finally has a good core in place and only 1 of 4 is signed now and he took a deal that had a strange setup that many players probably would have shot down.

They are. The only people who know what the offers were are the Jets front office and Revis and his agent and neither side is talking.

Any speculation of what was offered is pure bullsh*t.

[visajets]

There needs to be a rectification and quick. The longer this thing lingers the longer its gonna stink. He said she said I said you said. Revis obviously wants to be the highest paid CB in the league. Are the NYJETS willing to do that? Mangold and Harris want deals also. Im gonna say I can see guys like T-Rich and Clemens being cut,traded whatever it takes to free up some $$$$. Thoughts

[#27TheDominator]

There needs to be a rectification and quick. The longer this thing lingers the longer its gonna stink. He said she said I said you said. Revis obviously wants to be the highest paid CB in the league. Are the NYJETS willing to do that? Mangold and Harris want deals also. Im gonna say I can see guys like T-Rich and Clemens being cut,traded whatever it takes to free up some $$$$. Thoughts

I think cutting T-Rich and Clemens wouldn't free up enough money to sign Coles. IMO, unlike Bit's, the money isn't the problem, it's the fear of being locked in long term at a crazy figure when the financial/cap landscape is tenuous.

[visajets]

I think cutting T-Rich and Clemens wouldn't free up enough money to sign Coles. IMO, unlike Bit's, the money isn't the problem, it's the fear of being locked in long term at a crazy figure when the financial/cap landscape is tenuous.

Money has to be an issue here or else Revis would have been signed and in camp. Woody has got to be feeling the economic crunch in some way shape or form.

[rollingrock49]

I can see how teams would not want to spend since there could be a lockout. But why would they have went to him and said lets redo the deal (which Mike T admitted) and then apparently botch it. I say make him a solid offer of 13/year but give a good amount of guarenteed money. His people say its the guarenteed $$$ thats their concern so up that amount past other top CBs are getting. Then if he shoots it down at least you made a real offer that others would kill for. And for Nick and Harris at least take a shot at resigning them since they actually would be free agents after this year.

[Klecko73isGod]

Money has to be an issue here or else Revis would have been signed and in camp. Woody has got to be feeling the economic crunch in some way shape or form.

Do you not read anything? The Jets are handcuffed by CBA rules that makes it impossible to structure a deal to Revis' liking. This has nothing to do with whether or not Woody Johnson can afford it.

[slats]

I think cutting T-Rich and Clemens wouldn't free up enough money to sign Coles. IMO, unlike Bit's, the money isn't the problem, it's the fear of being locked in long term at a crazy figure when the financial/cap landscape is tenuous.

That's the excuse, but I'm much more cynical than that. The owners have an extremely good idea of what the financial landscape is going to look like in 2011 and beyond. They hold all the cards in negotiations with the players. They'll throw the NFLPA a couple bones, but they'll get what they want overall. The real battle is between the big and small market teams, but the big market teams are going to win that one, so it's really not much of a story. Jacksonville and Buffalo should get started heading to LA, otherwise they might end up in London.

But the Jets owners crying about financial uncertainty is like me depositing the money in my wallet in the bank, and then telling the kids I can't afford their allowance.

[visajets]

Do you not read anything? The Jets are handcuffed by CBA rules that makes it impossible to structure a deal to Revis' liking. This has nothing to do with whether or not Woody Johnson can afford it.

Do you actually believe that bullsh*t? Teams have been circumventing rules,salary caps for years. Its all about the money what the Jets are willing to spend and what Revis wants to accept. COME ON MAN

[Klecko73isGod]

Do you actually believe that bullsh*t? Teams have been circumventing rules,salary caps for years. Its all about the money what the Jets are willing to spend and what Revis wants to accept. COME ON MAN

[visajets]

Left you speechless huh? Better to say nothing than to speak again and look stupid----

[rollingrock49]

Right look at the other teams giving out big deals. Gates got his, Willis got his in SF, and dumervil in Denver. One way to beat the 30% rule (if thats an issue) is a big signing bonus. no CBA makes it complicated but other teams are doing it.

[visajets]

Right look at the other teams giving out big deals. Gates got his, Willis got his in SF, and dumervil in Denver. One way to beat the 30% rule (if thats an issue) is a big signing bonus. no CBA makes it complicated but other teams are doing it.

THANK YOU

[rillo]

This is what i've been reading/understanding, the offers had little to no 'bonus/guarantee" money, the 'lifetime' deal they offered had no guarantee/bonuses and the 'band aid' option gave him a raise but would still pay him $5.3 million less that D'brick in 2010. I don't who to believe here, but after reading Tanny's presser yesterday, he basically skirted the question. I also don't buy the CBA argument, the Jets should've never came to Revis looking to redo his deal IMO. Texans are looking to make Andre Johnson the highest paid @ his position and he still has 5yrs left on his deal. Nobody here knows anything.

[slats]

One of the things I like about the new software is that you can see who's typing up a post on the bottom of the page. I can't wait to see Sperm's manifesto. He's been typing awhile now.

[Klecko73isGod]

Left you speechless huh? Better to say nothing than to speak again and look stupid----

Someone in this conversation needs to learn this lesson.

[Jetsfan80]

One of the things I like about the new software is that you can see who's typing up a post on the bottom of the page. I can't wait to see Sperm's manifesto. He's been typing awhile now.

Doubtful. In all likelihood, all he's written "You guys are gay. I think that Askasdsjkhasd" and fell asleep at the keyboard.

[Sperm Edwards]

I think it may be true that none of the Jets offers have had any additional . Here's my take:

The Jets have no problem inking a player to a contract with tens of millions in guaranteed money. Woody Johnson certainly has enough cash no matter what conspiracy theories float around. Johnson just doesn't want the guarantees to be in the form of UP-FRONT money because then the players have more incentive to go along with a strike rather than pressure their union to play in 2011 even if they don't get the best terms possible in a new CBA. This would still work itself out with Revis and others the Jets plan on re-signing, except the Jets have cap restrictions on guaranteeing salaries starting now that have been well documented. The only way around it, without up-front bonus cash, is to do a deal like they did with Ferguson where the guarantees kick in if he makes it through one more season and remains on the roster the next season. I don't think it's so much a hedge against injury or declining skill so much as it is a hedge against a player holdout.

The flip-side to that is it would work a lot better on someone like Revis if he hadn't already pocketed so much from his first 3 years (~$15M). After his agent's cut and then the government taking half of what's leftover he's still got $6.5 to $7M in cash minus what he's spent so far. So he's not exactly in the poorhouse if he holds out in 2010 and then there's a work stoppage in 2011. Sure, he'd like a lot more to carry him over, but he'll manage. One never knows, but he doesn't seem the type that would have blown through it all already.

Then there's always that other possibility, though only the involved parties know for sure, that Revis isn't considering any deal that doesn't include all of the following: tear up his current contract, replace it with one that averages $16M per season, and also includes enough up front that he pockets $20-30M by the end of the 2010 season. I badly want him on the team but if that's his hard-line stance he will have more value to the Jets in trade; not only the generous draft picks he's likely to command, but the freed-up $16M per season in cap space - enough for 2 pro bowlers at other positions.

[rollingrock49]

My hope for now is that soon (VERY SOON) at least Mangold (and even Harris) gets his deal and then Revis comes back realizing that the good soldiers are the ones who get paid. Though if anyone goes from the core 4 my $$$ would be on Harris eventually leaving.

[rillo]

My hope for now is that soon (VERY SOON) at least Mangold (and even Harris) gets his deal and then Revis comes back realizing that the good soldiers are the ones who get paid. Though if anyone goes from the core 4 my $$$ would be on Harris eventually leaving.

I seriously doubt it, but who knows. However, I would really like for them to lock up Mangold in the meantime.

[rollingrock49]

I think it may be true that none of the Jets offers have had any additional . Here's my take:

The Jets have no problem inking a player to a contract with tens of millions in guaranteed money. Woody Johnson certainly has enough cash no matter what conspiracy theories float around. Johnson just doesn't want the guarantees to be in the form of UP-FRONT money because then the players have more incentive to go along with a strike rather than pressure their union to play in 2011 even if they don't get the best terms possible in a new CBA. This would still work itself out with Revis and others the Jets plan on re-signing, except the Jets have cap restrictions on guaranteeing salaries starting now that have been well documented. The only way around it, without up-front bonus cash, is to do a deal like they did with Ferguson where the guarantees kick in if he makes it through one more season and remains on the roster the next season. I don't think it's so much a hedge against injury or declining skill so much as it is a hedge against a player holdout.

The flip-side to that is it would work a lot better on someone like Revis if he hadn't already pocketed so much from his first 3 years (~$15M). After his agent's cut and then the government taking half of what's leftover he's still got $6.5 to $7M in cash minus what he's spent so far. So he's not exactly in the poorhouse if he holds out in 2010 and then there's a work stoppage in 2011. Sure, he'd like a lot more to carry him over, but he'll manage. One never knows, but he doesn't seem the type that would have blown through it all already.

Then there's always that other possibility, though only the involved parties know for sure, that Revis isn't considering any deal that doesn't include all of the following: tear up his current contract, replace it with one that averages $16M per season, and also includes enough up front that he pockets $20-30M by the end of the 2010 season. I badly want him on the team but if that's his hard-line stance he will have more value to the Jets in trade; not only the generous draft picks he's likely to command, but the freed-up $16M per season in cap space - enough for 2 pro bowlers at other positions.

Ah see thats why I want them to make him an offer at about 12-13/mill but to make the guarenteed dough high up there. paying 16 is nuts. Shoot why not start at 10/year with a big guarenteed value and see what happens. behind nmandi the next highest CB makes 10. 12-13 is fair especially if the guarenteed money is bigger than other recent CB deals. We aren't a scrub team that have no other stars to sign. IF they make a reasonable offer and he still shoots it down to be the highest paid CB than hopefully he at least plays this year then we tag him and trade him for what would be a good amount of picks. But to keep the tag option open we need to lock up our other core guys.

[Bleedin Green]

Right look at the other teams giving out big deals. Gates got his, Willis got his in SF, and dumervil in Denver. One way to beat the 30% rule (if thats an issue) is a big signing bonus. no CBA makes it complicated but other teams are doing it.

There are two major problems with that logic. For starters, none of those contracts had the kind of fully guaranteed money that Revis is looking for. It's either for skill or injury, not both. Secondly, the Jets would have to be idiots to give Revis a big signing bonus. You might as well send him a hand-written invitation that says "Dear Darrelle, Please enjoy holding out again in a couple of years from now. Love, The Jets." Revis has cost himself any chance of getting a big signing bonus by being completely untrustworthy.

And with all of that said, even if those weren't issues, the fact is that the Jets still shouldn't just submit to Revis' ridiculous demands to be paid more than Asomugha just because that's what he wants. There will be a salary cap again, and it would be nice if the team didn't blow over 10% of their space on one player.

[visajets]

Someone in this conversation needs to learn this lesson.

And that would be to agree with you and never disagree with you?-----

[Matt39]

What would solve this problem is the front office no longer drafting good players.

[Klecko73isGod]

And that would be to agree with you and never disagree with you?-----

No. That would be to actually read and make valid points based on logic and common sense.

Read Sperm Edwards post:

I think it may be true that none of the Jets offers have had any additional . Here's my take:

The Jets have no problem inking a player to a contract with tens of millions in guaranteed money. Woody Johnson certainly has enough cash no matter what conspiracy theories float around. Johnson just doesn't want the guarantees to be in the form of UP-FRONT money because then the players have more incentive to go along with a strike rather than pressure their union to play in 2011 even if they don't get the best terms possible in a new CBA. This would still work itself out with Revis and others the Jets plan on re-signing, except the Jets have cap restrictions on guaranteeing salaries starting now that have been well documented. The only way around it, without up-front bonus cash, is to do a deal like they did with Ferguson where the guarantees kick in if he makes it through one more season and remains on the roster the next season. I don't think it's so much a hedge against injury or declining skill so much as it is a hedge against a player holdout.

The flip-side to that is it would work a lot better on someone like Revis if he hadn't already pocketed so much from his first 3 years (~$15M). After his agent's cut and then the government taking half of what's leftover he's still got $6.5 to $7M in cash minus what he's spent so far. So he's not exactly in the poorhouse if he holds out in 2010 and then there's a work stoppage in 2011. Sure, he'd like a lot more to carry him over, but he'll manage. One never knows, but he doesn't seem the type that would have blown through it all already.

Then there's always that other possibility, though only the involved parties know for sure, that Revis isn't considering any deal that doesn't include all of the following: tear up his current contract, replace it with one that averages $16M per season, and also includes enough up front that he pockets $20-30M by the end of the 2010 season. I badly want him on the team but if that's his hard-line stance he will have more value to the Jets in trade; not only the generous draft picks he's likely to command, but the freed-up $16M per season in cap space - enough for 2 pro bowlers at other positions.

You might just learn something.

[faba]

OK lets stop bickering and concentrate on what the front office should do with Revis Hold the line or give in?

[Sperm Edwards]

One of the things I like about the new software is that you can see who's typing up a post on the bottom of the page. I can't wait to see Sperm's manifesto. He's been typing awhile now.

lol jerk.

[Klecko73isGod]

OK lets stop bickering and concentrate on what the front office should do with Revis Hold the line or give in?

The Jets need to offer Revis a fair deal that also leaves them the room to sign their other players.

[Sperm Edwards]

Ah see thats why I want them to make him an offer at about 12-13/mill but to make the guarenteed dough high up there. paying 16 is nuts. Shoot why not start at 10/year with a big guarenteed value and see what happens. behind nmandi the next highest CB makes 10. 12-13 is fair especially if the guarenteed money is bigger than other recent CB deals. We aren't a scrub team that have no other stars to sign. IF they make a reasonable offer and he still shoots it down to be the highest paid CB than hopefully he at least plays this year then we tag him and trade him for what would be a good amount of picks. But to keep the tag option open we need to lock up our other core guys.

Um, they can't. Did you read the post you replied to? Everyone can come up with the easy solution of:

OK we'll tear up your current contract. In the new deal, there's not much in terms of up-front bonus money, but the contract is for 8 years, averages $12.5M, and the first 3 years ($37.5M) is guaranteed for both injury and declining skill.

Even IF Revis was agreeable to that, the Jets wouldn't be permitted to make that offer due to CBA restrictions.

Matching Nnamdi's contract is preposterous. But even though I still think it's way high for a CB, the reality is that Revis is unique, and a contract in the Jared Allen or DeMarcus Ware range seems more reasonable. At issue is whether or not Revis also sees that as reasonable, and also that the Jets don't want to put up 8 figures of cash with a looming player strike and unknown future salary cap.

[Sperm Edwards]

The Jets need to offer Revis a fair deal that also leaves them the room to sign their other players.

You must be some kind of genius.

[Klecko73isGod]

You must be some kind of genius.

The Jets need to run their team and not let one player hold them up. I love Revis and we have the opportunity to have a really special defense with him but I think this team is more than good enough to win without him, especially when you consider what we could get for him in a trade.

Revis is the one who needs to wake up. He can't go anywhere. His only leverage is that some "experts" think the Jets defense will fall apart without him. Well Rex Ryan has coached number 1 defenses without Darrelle Revis before. Something tells me he can do it again.

[slats]

Matching Nnamdi's contract is preposterous. But even though I still think it's way high for a CB, the reality is that Revis is unique, and a contract in the Jared Allen or DeMarcus Ware range seems more reasonable. At issue is whether or not Revis also sees that as reasonable, and also that the Jets don't want to put up 8 figures of cash with a looming player strike and unknown future salary cap.

I essentially agree with this. I do think that Aso money over 6 years probably won't look so bad six years from now, but I understand the Jets wanting to stay below that average just on principle.

I definitely agree with you on the bonus money/pending lockout thing, but I think it's the Jets who are going to have to cave there. Throw him a bonus in the low teens, keep his existing three years ($1M, $5M, and $15M), and tack on a couple years at the end that add up close to the money he's looking for, but have a lot of it come in the form of bonuses for showing up to OTA's and training camp, completing workouts, etc. Make it as difficult for him to hold out again as they can.

[MadBacker Prime]

I hope the reports that the offers given to Revis have little to no fully guarenteed money are false. That's the dumbest thing you can do. Ferguson's contract could show they are trying to be a bit sneaky with it. They'd better not screw this up. And why cant they at least try to work on Mangold and Harris. The team finally has a good core in place and only 1 of 4 is signed now and he took a deal that had a strange setup that many players probably would have shot down.

Due to the the CBA not in place, any money guaranteed in a no CBA year is put under the 09 cap. This is the reallocation rule.

The Jets are now operating at $300 grand under the 09 cap and any deal offered to Revis will almost be identical to Brick's. Once this season is over the guaranteed can go up in 2011 if a new CBA is in place. That's why Brick chose the incentive based contract over the injury protection, which he took out a insurance policy to protect against that.

Unless Revis accepts the fact that the Jets hands are tied here, he has nothing to gain by playing since he already lost his buyout options that were to kick in next year.

He won't play for a million and risk injury with no guaranteed money at all in place now. I'm very curious to see how this plays out purely from the contract standpoint, Tanny must have something up his sleeve or is taking offers.

[Sperm Edwards]

I essentially agree with this. I do think that Aso money over 6 years probably won't look so bad six years from now, but I understand the Jets wanting to stay below that average just on principle.

I definitely agree with you on the bonus money/pending lockout thing, but I think it's the Jets who are going to have to cave there. Throw him a bonus in the low teens, keep his existing three years ($1M, $5M, and $15M), and tack on a couple years at the end that add up close to the money he's looking for, but have a lot of it come in the form of bonuses for showing up to OTA's and training camp, completing workouts, etc. Make it as difficult for him to hold out again as they can.

Yeah well I'd throw in there that Revis has to give the amortized amount of the money back if he holds out again, and that would include a player strike.

[rollingrock49]

Due to the the CBA not in place, any money guaranteed in a no CBA year is put under the 09 cap. This is the reallocation rule.

The Jets are now operating at $300 grand under the 09 cap and any deal offered to Revis will almost be identical to Brick's. Once this season is over the guaranteed can go up in 2011 if a new CBA is in place. That's why Brick chose the incentive based contract over the injury protection, which he took out a insurance policy to protect against that.

Unless Revis accepts the fact that the Jets hands are tied here, he has nothing to gain by playing since he already lost his buyout options that were to kick in next year.

He won't play for a million and risk injury with no guaranteed money at all in place now. I'm very curious to see how this plays out purely from the contract standpoint, Tanny must have something up his sleeve or is taking offers.

That was the best explanation Ive heard yet. Forgot 2009 cap part though now I remember reading it somewhere. Thanks for reminding me. Curious why they at least arent coming public with it as a team to make them look better. Stupid CBA. This really can bite us with 3 very important players that want dough. I wish at least one more thought like Brick.