Sanchez. Sanchez. Sanchez

[LWC611]

I like Sanchezx but the guy flat out sucked big balls in these preseason games!

he needs to get his sh*t together.

What she said.

This is his second year, the sophmore slump but I hope he can avoid that. The thought of him throwing more than 20 picks this year is frightening.....Rex is going to rest him until the opener, but the offense doesn't deserve a night off. The kid needs all of the reps he can get.....Give the ones one series and that's it.

The only team that deserves a game off is the Defense,even without revis they seem ready.

[bitonti]

And that happened because he played with 2 HOF QBs in Troy Aikman and Steve Young.

NEXT!

the Jets are not going to win a SB like the cowboys or the 49ers. they could in theory win like the bears, giants and bucs.

it should also be noted that every year they tweak the rules such that a CB is more important than the year before. Back in Deion's day they could get away with a lot more, both in pass rush and pass defense.

[flgreen]

I saw that part of the article, but a RB who puts points on the board, and an OLB & DE that rush the QB are >>>>>>> than a shutdown CB.

Smith, Taylor, and Strahan have a greater impact on a team's success than Revis will based on the position they play.

Here's food for thought as well:

Revis could be the greatest CB ever and he still wouldn't be worth 16 million a year.

CBs aren't worth QB money since QBs win games, not CBs.

Nnamdi Asomugha career record (0 winning seasons in 7):

2003: 4-12

2004: 5-11

2005: 4-12

2006: 2-14

2007: 4-12

2008: 5-11

2009: 5-11 (1st year of 3 yr $45 mill deal)

Dieon Sanders career record (6 winning seasons in 14):

1989: 3-13

1990: 5-11

1991: 10-6

1992: 6-10

1993: 6-10

1994: 13-3

1995: 12-4

1996: 10-6

1997: 6-10

1998: 10-6

1999: 8-8

2000: 8-8

2004: 9-7

2005: 6-10

Great Post

[s dubb]

I saw that part of the article, but a RB who puts points on the board, and an OLB & DE that rush the QB are >>>>>>> than a shutdown CB.

Smith, Taylor, and Strahan have a greater impact on a team's success than Revis will based on the position they play.

Here's food for thought as well:

Revis could be the greatest CB ever and he still wouldn't be worth 16 million a year.

CBs aren't worth QB money since QBs win games, not CBs.

Nnamdi Asomugha career record (0 winning seasons in 7):

2003: 4-12

2004: 5-11

2005: 4-12

2006: 2-14

2007: 4-12

2008: 5-11

2009: 5-11 (1st year of 3 yr $45 mill deal)

Dieon Sanders career record (6 winning seasons in 14):

1989: 3-13

1990: 5-11

1991: 10-6

1992: 6-10

1993: 6-10

1994: 13-3

1995: 12-4

1996: 10-6

1997: 6-10

1998: 10-6

1999: 8-8

2000: 8-8

2004: 9-7

2005: 6-10

Honestly, really hard to argue there you make a great points. However Deion Sanders usually played on some horrible teams or teams "without an adequate Q.B play" therefore meaning about 89% of the teams he played on were bad. Same thing can be said for Nnamdi and even Revis. Emmitt Smith had Troy Aikman and L.T had Phil Simms and a really good defense. The 07 Giants team had a Eli Manning and a really good defense.

So all 3 of those teams. Emmitt's Cowboys, L.T's Giants and Strahans Giants all had a really good supporting casts and definitely were adequate and stable at the Q.B position. So although you make some really good supporting arguments I think they really can't be discussed with any relevance to the topic at hand.

I do realize that a running back is more valuable to a team then a corner, I realize that a passing rushing DE in a 4-3 is more valuable then a corner but when we evaluate this in accordance to "teams best player" I think this renders true in the Revis situation given the fact that corner is highly coveted by Rex Ryan and his man to man blitzing scheme the importance of Revis TO THIS TEAM can absolutely be compared to the worth of other players to their team.

[SMC]

the Jets are not going to win a SB like the cowboys or the 49ers. they could in theory win like the bears, giants and bucs.

You mean, have a pro-bowl QB like McMahon and Johnson were for the Bears and Bucs? They both had good seasons. The Giants lost their pro-bowl QB with 3 games left in the season.

So I don't see how these 3 teams fit your argument.

[Biggs]

the Jets are not going to win a SB like the cowboys or the 49ers. they could in theory win like the bears, giants and bucs.

it should also be noted that every year they tweak the rules such that a CB is more important than the year before. Back in Deion's day they could get away with a lot more, both in pass rush and pass defense.

The Bears and Giants had mediocre at best secondaries. The Bucs over all D was great but they didn't win by having the best CB in the league they played cover 2.

[Bruce Banner]

Nnamdi Asomugha career record (0 winning seasons in 7):

2003: 4-12

2004: 5-11

2005: 4-12

2006: 2-14

2007: 4-12

2008: 5-11

2009: 5-11 (1st year of 3 yr $45 mill deal)

Worth noting that a lot of those crappy years came in a 3-4 defense coached by Rex Ryan's twin brother.

[CTM]

The 2000 Ravens were an absolute aberration. They needed to have the greatest season by a defense just to be a WC team.

great way of putting it

[DireJet38]

I saw that part of the article, but a RB who puts points on the board, and an OLB & DE that rush the QB are >>>>>>> than a shutdown CB.

Smith, Taylor, and Strahan have a greater impact on a team's success than Revis will based on the position they play.

Here's food for thought as well:

Revis could be the greatest CB ever and he still wouldn't be worth 16 million a year.

CBs aren't worth QB money since QBs win games, not CBs.

Nnamdi Asomugha career record (0 winning seasons in 7):

2003: 4-12

2004: 5-11

2005: 4-12

2006: 2-14

2007: 4-12

2008: 5-11

2009: 5-11 (1st year of 3 yr $45 mill deal)

Dieon Sanders career record (6 winning seasons in 14):

1989: 3-13

1990: 5-11

1991: 10-6

1992: 6-10

1993: 6-10

1994: 13-3

1995: 12-4

1996: 10-6

1997: 6-10

1998: 10-6

1999: 8-8

2000: 8-8

2004: 9-7

2005: 6-10

What do the 2010 Jets have to do with Deion's Cowboys and ASO's Raiders?

If only life was that cut and dry . . .

[CTM]

Every team tried to take the run away from the Jets last year too with little to no success. And now the Jets have stronger running backs.

Not really. Where do you come up with ths stuff? As usual your analysis is as shallow and filthy as an ashtray.

We faced 2 good run defenses last year, that's it. Atlanta #2, and Jac #7

Atlanta held Jones/Greene to 82 yards on 27 carries

Jacksonville held them to 103 yards on 28 carries

(a per rush average that would've landed us around last in the league last year)

The rest of the year we C R U S H E R E D up on bottom feeders such as (Mia x2, Oak, Buff x 2, Ind, NO, TB, TN, CIN) all of whome we're in the bottom third of run defenses. Thats 10 games against the worst run defenses in the league.

In reality we were a slightly above average running team last year (although a ton better with Greene in there), and if we have a tougher time of it this season, I'd expect Sanchez to struggle worse.

[JustInFudge]

Not really. Where do you come up with ths stuff? As usual your analysis is as shallow and filthy as an ashtray.

We faced 2 good run defenses last year, that's it. Atlanta #2, and Jac #7

Atlanta held Jones/Greene to 82 yards on 27 carries

Jacksonville held them to 103 yards on 28 carries

(a per rush average that would've landed us around last in the league last year)

The rest of the year we C R U S H E R E D up on bottom feeders such as (Mia x2, Oak, Buff x 2, Ind, NO, TB, TN, CIN) all of whome we're in the bottom third of run defenses. Thats 10 games against the worst run defenses in the league.

In reality we were a slightly above average running team last year (although a ton better with Greene in there), and if we have a tougher time of it this season, I'd expect Sanchez to struggle worse.

Ugh...we are going to suck so bad on offense this year its not even funny.

[Klecko73isGod]

Not really. Where do you come up with ths stuff? As usual your analysis is as deep and filthy as an ashtray.

We faced 2 good run defenses last year, that's it. Atlanta #2, and Jac #7

Atlanta held Jones/Greene to 82 yards on 27 carries

Jacksonville held them to 103 yards on 28 carries

(a per rush average that would've landed us around last in the league last year)

The rest of the year we C R U S H E R E D up on bottom feeders such as (Mia x2, Oak, Buff x 2, Ind, NO, TB, TN, CIN) all of whome we're in the bottom third of run defenses. Thats 10 games against the worst run defenses in the league.

In reality we were a slightly above average running team last year (although a ton better with Greene in there), and if we have a tougher time of it this season, I'd expect Sanchez to struggle worse.

Ever think that part of the reason Maimi and Buffalo ranked so low against the run is the Jets lighting up their D twice last year?

Umm, the Texans ranked 10th in the league against the run. The Jets lit them up to the tune of 190 yards and a 4.5 yard average.

In the playoffs against the Bengals, who had the 7th ranked rush defense, the Jets ran for 171 and a 4.3 YPC. The Bengals would have ranked higher if not for all the yards the Jets racked up against them in week 17 which I am not even using as an example because you're going to use the troll argument of the Bengals laying down. The Jets still lit up their run D in the playoffs.

You just love blaming a team for things they have no control over. The Dolphins ranked 19th vs. the run last year but were hardly inept.

BTW, the Jags ranked 19th against the run last year. How the Jets choked that one off is still beyond me.

So the Jets played all of three top 10 rush defenses last year and did well against two of them.

You're an idiot.

[CTM]

Ugh...we are going to suck so bad on offense this year its not even funny.

I think Greene/LT is a major upgrade over Jones/Leon or Jones/Greene.. major..

Obviously our receivers are better as well..

Really will depend on what kinds of defenses we face, and given that we have MN, GB, Balt and Pitt on the schedule this year instead I might agree with you...

[SMC]

What do the 2010 Jets have to do with Deion's Cowboys and ASO's Raiders?

If only life was that cut and dry . . .

Uhm, it just demonstrates that the best CBs in the NFL don't impact the win-loss record as Revites like to tell us.

The key determining factor is QB play, with a tiny exception.

[CTM]

Ever think that part of the reason Maimi and Buffalo ranked so low against the run is the Jets lighting up their D twice last year?

no

Umm, the Texans ranked 10th in the league against the run. The Jets lit them up to the tune of 190 yards and a 4.5 yard average.

Come on klacktard.. you've been reading posts like this for awhile. When is it going to get through your thick skull that any analysis void of level of competition is, well, ill-Klogical

In the playoffs against the Bengals, who had the 7th ranked rush defense, the Jets ran for 171 and a 4.3 YPC. The Bengals would have ranked higher if not for all the yards the Jets racked up against them in week 17 which I am not even using as an example because you're going to use the troll argument of the Bengals laying down. The Jets still lit up their run D in the playoffs.

No Bengals weren't 7th ranked + bengals we're banged up + greene was fresh

You just love blaming a team for things they have no control over. The Dolphins ranked 19th vs. the run last year but were hardly inept.

No, i love factoring in things that the team had no control over when making predictions. Fact is we played a very favorable slate of run defenses last year, making a mouth breather such as yourself think we we're some kind of dominant run team.

BTW, the Jags ranked 19th against the run last year. How the Jets choked that one off is still beyond me.

So the Jets played all of three top 10 rush defenses last year and did well against two of them.

Again, you have to look at stats more deeply then this if you want to converse with the grownups. Until then, go play with the dulphin fans and that big brother groupie..

You're an idiot.

self'd

[JustInFudge]

I think Greene/LT is a major upgrade over Jones/Leon or Jones/Greene.. major..

Obviously our receivers are better as well..

Really will depend on what kinds of defenses we face, and given that we have MN, GB, Balt and Pitt on the schedule this year instead I might agree with you...

The worst part about it is...all those teams you mentioned are vulnerable against the pass. All of them were lit the F up on multiple occasions last year...the model cant do that.

We're F'd. We are definitely starting the season 0-3.

[CTM]

The worst part about it is...all those teams you mentioned are vulnerable against the pass. All of them were lit the F up on multiple occasions last year...the model cant do that.

We're F'd. We are definitely starting the season 0-3.

heh.. not sure about that, our defense could carry us a bit ... but would be fitting given this teams history..

[Klecko73isGod]

no

Come on klacktard.. you've been reading posts like this for awhile. When is it going to get through your thick skull that any analysis void of level of competition is, well, ill-Klogical

No Bengals weren't 7th ranked + bengals we're banged up + greene was fresh

No, i love factoring in things that the team had no control over when making predictions. Fact is we played a very favorable slate of run defenses last year, making a mouth breather such as yourself think we we're some kind of dominant run team.

Again, you have to look at stats more deeply then this if you want to converse with the grownups. Until then, go play with the dulphin fans and that big brother groupie..

self'd

Bengals weren't ranked 7th against the run?

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tabSeq=2&defensiveStatisticCategory=RUSHING&conference=ALL&role=OPP&season=2009&seasonType=REG&d-447263-s=RUSHING_YARDS_PER_GAME_AVG&d-447263-o=1&d-447263-n=1

[DireJet38]

Uhm, it just demonstrates that the best CBs in the NFL don't impact the win-loss record as Revites like to tell us.

The key determining factor is QB play, with a tiny exception.

Are you really going to compare the Radiers to the Jets?

Really?

[stoicsentry]

Uhm, it just demonstrates that the best CBs in the NFL don't impact the win-loss record as Revites like to tell us.

Huh? How is ASO not impacting the W/L? Whether they're 4-12 or 12-4, he's obviously making a HUGE difference.

A complete shutdown corner like Revis is +1 man advantage, if not more, since he takes away a guy that's usually double covered and then you can roll coverage towards a #2 WR thus shutting down a team's passing game even more.

If you're right, why not just keep drafting QBs over and over... who cares about anything else? Well, you need a "D" to get your QB the ball, a line to protect him, a RB to take pressure off of him, a WR to make his life easier, a TE to be a safety net, a kicker to give you consolation when you don't reach the endzone and so on.

Every match up is important. QB more so, perhaps, but every single football match up is important.

[CTM]

Bengals weren't ranked 7th against the run?

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tabSeq=2&defensiveStatisticCategory=RUSHING&conference=ALL&role=OPP&season=2009&seasonType=REG&d-447263-s=RUSHING_YARDS_PER_GAME_AVG&d-447263-o=1&d-447263-n=1

Hey tubby, when someone says FO around here, they're not abbreviating food like you'd hoped..

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamdef

[Vicious89x]

The worst part about it is...all those teams you mentioned are vulnerable against the pass. All of them were lit the F up on multiple occasions last year...the model cant do that.

We're F'd. We are definitely starting the season 0-3.

I wouldn't be surprised. The only way we win is if our D creates points on turnovers.

[GodWearsAGrayHoodie]

Ever think that part of the reason Maimi and Buffalo ranked so low against the run is the Jets lighting up their D twice last year?

That theory holds a small quanity of credibility with the Bills as the Jets games was the worst and third worst performace by the Bills run defense.

It hold zero credibility with the Dolphins, in which the Jets were tied for 3rd worst and 7th worst performance by the D. The Steelers, Panthers, Saints, and Titans had as much or more to do with the Dolphin run defense woes as the Jets.

[Klecko73isGod]

Hey tubby, when someone says FO around here, they're not abbreviating food like you'd hoped..

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamdef

Ahhh, Football Outsiders, the football site for nerds that never played the game.

You put waaaay to much weight on what that site says. It is good analysis and it gives a different perspective but it ain't the end all, be all there poindexter.

There's a little thing called playing the ******* game.

Are you going to deny that the Jets were a good running team last year despite having a terrible number one RB?

You ever think that some of those top ranked rushing defenses last year got there because they didn't play a whole lot of games against top rushing teams?

It does work both ways numbnuts.

[SMC]

Are you really going to compare the Radiers to the Jets?

Really?

Yes, really. If the Raiders had a QB they wouldn't suck, they don't so they do.

[SMC]

Huh? How is ASO not impacting the W/L? Whether they're 4-12 or 12-4, he's obviously making a HUGE difference.

A complete shutdown corner like Revis is +1 man advantage, if not more, since he takes away a guy that's usually double covered and then you can roll coverage towards a #2 WR thus shutting down a team's passing game even more.

If you're right, why not just keep drafting QBs over and over... who cares about anything else? Well, you need a "D" to get your QB the ball, a line to protect him, a RB to take pressure off of him, a WR to make his life easier, a TE to be a safety net, a kicker to give you consolation when you don't reach the endzone and so on.

Every match up is important. QB more so, perhaps, but every single football match up is important.

If Aso is making such a "huge" difference, are you saying the Raiders would be going 0-16 or 1-15 every year? When they went 2-14 with Aso, how many wins did Aso account for?

Yes, every aspect of the team is important but none more important than the QB. No single player has a greater impact on wins and losses than the QB. That's the nature of the sport. Just like a starting pitcher in baseball and a goalie in hockey.

[DireJet38]

Yes, really. If the Raiders had a QB they wouldn't suck, they don't so they do.

Come on, the lack of a QB isn't the only reason the Raiders suck.

Don't be afraid to peel away the shades of gray.

[CTM]

Ahhh, Football Outsiders, the football site for nerds that never played the game.

Predictable unintelligible retort about nerds, was going to predict it in last post but I didn't want to be spoil it. Hey jowl boy, most of the modern conveniences you enjoy that allow you to thrive while being the size of small automobile were created by the same types of "nerds" you denigrate here. Show some gratitude.

You put waaaay to much weight on what that site says. It is good analysis and it gives a different perspective but it ain't the end all, be all there poindexter.

Nope, not the end all be all, but significantly better then the nfl.com non adjusted stats you are mindlessly quoting

You ever think that some of those top ranked rushing defenses last year got there because they didn't play a whole lot of games against top rushing teams?

It does work both ways numbnuts.

Wow. You obviously don't understand how FO's stats work at all. Again, study up a bit or drag your knuckles back to the kids table.

[CTM]

Huh? How is ASO not impacting the W/L? Whether they're 4-12 or 12-4, he's obviously making a HUGE difference.

For 3 of last 4 years he's been best CB in league and team has a horrible losing record..

For 3 of last 4 years Peyton Manning has been best QB in league and team has one 4 division titles

QB >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> CB

[bitonti]

If Aso is making such a "huge" difference, are you saying the Raiders would be going 0-16 or 1-15 every year? When they went 2-14 with Aso, how many wins did Aso account for?

Yes, every aspect of the team is important but none more important than the QB. No single player has a greater impact on wins and losses than the QB. That's the nature of the sport. Just like a starting pitcher in baseball and a goalie in hockey.

i think Aso and revis are both good for about 2 wins in and of themselves. not 4 not 8... about 2. So that means last year's Raiders are 0-16 and last year's Jets are 7-9. not good.

as for the QB red herring the Jets don't have a choice between signing Revis and signing Payton Manning. They can sign Revis OR not sign him. Either way they are hoping for Sanchez to get better. It's not like they can take the Revis money give it to Sanchez and make him better by giving him more money.

Or are you suggesting the Jets move on from Sanchez and use the Revis money on some free agent QB? that could be a logical equivalent. But if they are sticking with Sanchez there's no relevance to spending superstar money on a superstar CB.

it should also be noted Phillip Rivers made 25 mil last year. Jay cutler made 22. Franchise QB money and Franchise CB money are NOT the same. Payton manning made 14 so people think that 14 is a real number, that's not what these guys go for on the open market. Manning and Brady getting underpaid doesn't prove that Revis is worth less than what he's asking. it just proves they are underpaid.

[GodWearsAGrayHoodie]

If Aso is making such a "huge" difference, are you saying the Raiders would be going 0-16 or 1-15 every year? When they went 2-14 with Aso, how many wins did Aso account for?

Yes, every aspect of the team is important but none more important than the QB. No single player has a greater impact on wins and losses than the QB. That's the nature of the sport. Just like a starting pitcher in baseball and a goalie in hockey.

A bit narrow of analysis given how horrible the Raiders are all around. You could have added Manning, Brady, or Brees to Oakland and they still don't have a winning season.

I agree QB is more important. But not because of the position but because of the gulf between the best and the replacement.

Take who ever you consider the best QB in the league and compare him to whomever you consider the 33rd best QB in the league. Now compare whomever you consider the best CB in the league (Aso or Revis) and compare him to whomever you consider the 65th best CB in the league.

What you are going to find is that the 33rd best QB is utter crap and incapable of leading an offense and the 65th CB while not great is actually pretty decent and a solid player. This is the reason why the QB is worth more. The difference between him and his replacement is much more significant than between a CB and his replacement.

[stoicsentry]

For 3 of last 4 years he's been best CB in league and team has a horrible losing record..

For 3 of last 4 years Peyton Manning has been best QB in league and team has one 4 division titles

QB >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> CB

If it wasn't for the fact that Peyton Manning has a talented team around him and the Raiders are the biggest joke in football

[SMC]

If it wasn't for the fact that Peyton Manning has a talented team around him and the Raiders are the biggest joke in football

Peyton Manning makes the Colts. You put Peyton on the Raiders last year and they win 11 games easy.

[SMC]

i think Aso and revis are both good for about 2 wins in and of themselves. not 4 not 8... about 2. So that means last year's Raiders are 0-16 and last year's Jets are 7-9. not good.

So the year the Raiders went 2-14 with Aso, Aso was solely responsible for those 2 victories.

Gotcha.

[DireJet38]

Peyton Manning makes the Colts. You put Peyton on the Raiders last year and they win 11 games easy.

Archie disagrees.