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22 hours ago, gEYno said:

Baghdad Bob is at it again!

1) Even if we accept the premise that teens do not think things through, then you need to sell the premise that Carl's impulsivity put him on the truck, had him trick Jesus into jumping first (pretty calculated), kill two guys, and then the very moment he sees the person he is looking for, he's no longer impulsive at all.  

2 and 3)  There were plenty of times when Negan was addressing others, with Carl behind him with a the bat.  I realize it's not a knife or a gun, but there were many opportunities, and again, under your premise, we need to accept that Carl's not thinking clearly only long enough to get himself into trouble, but then never again for one moment to complete the stated goal he got in the truck for.

As for killing a dictator in real life, I made this point before... The real life dictators are behind their armies, not in front of them.  They don't open themselves up to the opportunistic like Negan does.  You wouldn't see a real life dictator banging at the gates when he can't even see what's behind them.

1)  Do you have a teenager?  Teens do not think things through.  They struggle with things right in front of them much less the cause and affect of their actions three or four steps down the line.  All of a sudden, it is "oh oh, wtf do I do now".

23)  You do understand the concept of time?  How emotion might ebb and flow over time.  How you might be really angry at someone or thing and then 10 minutes later you are not.  However Carl may have felt when he got on the truck, tricked Jesus and thought he could probably kill Negan crashed when stuff happened.  People sacrificed themselves to save Negan.  He stated I just want to kill Negan and what happened?  People still shielded Negan.  Well, there goes the parting of the sea plan were I can just walk up to Negan and kill him.  Now what?  Combine that with the mental games Negan plays.  There was a reason he made Rick and Carl carry Lucille.  Negan said it, I just put my dick down your throat and you said thank you.  Do you think the eye patch scene was a filler?  No.  It was Negan messing with Carl mind effing him even more.

Dictator)  You, JIFs and probably others whole point is, "why don't they do something...they have a chance".  Yeah, the dictator is on a reviewing stand looking over his army it might be difficult.  How many times in the history of this planet was a dictator in a room alone with somebody who could have killed the dictator regardless of the ramifications?  Billions of times.  Yet, no one martyred themselves for the needs of the many over the needs of the few.  Surprising not surprising.

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Hey man , I'm married with two kids under the age of 5....not only do I watch it but I'm pretty sure it qualifies as a night out for me .

***** SPOILERS ***** Worst episode of the season. 1 hour and 15 minutes of driving an RV to road blocks and the same 4 commercials over-and-over... for what? So we can not even see the kill

Translation: T0m enjoyed the Eric / Aaron kiss.

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24 minutes ago, PFSIKH said:

1)  Do you have a teenager?  Teens do not think things through.  They struggle with things right in front of them much less the cause and affect of their actions three or four steps down the line.  All of a sudden, it is "oh oh, wtf do I do now".

23)  You do understand the concept of time?  How emotion might ebb and flow over time.  How you might be really angry at someone or thing and then 10 minutes later you are not.  However Carl may have felt when he got on the truck, tricked Jesus and thought he could probably kill Negan crashed when stuff happened.  People sacrificed themselves to save Negan.  He stated I just want to kill Negan and what happened?  People still shielded Negan.  Well, there goes the parting of the sea plan were I can just walk up to Negan and kill him.  Now what?  Combine that with the mental games Negan plays.  There was a reason he made Rick and Carl carry Lucille.  Negan said it, I just put my dick down your throat and you said thank you.  Do you think the eye patch scene was a filler?  No.  It was Negan messing with Carl mind effing him even more.

Dictator)  You, JIFs and probably others whole point is, "why don't they do something...they have a chance".  Yeah, the dictator is on a reviewing stand looking over his army it might be difficult.  How many times in the history of this planet was a dictator in a room alone with somebody who could have killed the dictator regardless of the ramifications?  Billions of times.  Yet, no one martyred themselves for the needs of the many over the needs of the few.  Surprising not surprising.

I started a response, but honestly, you're way out of your depth in trying to provide me with an education on human behavior and emotion.  So with that said, I'm glad you're enjoying the show so much, and that you're not seeing the same massive plot holes that, so far as I can tell, all the other JN fans are.  It's certainly more enjoyable that way.

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9 hours ago, gEYno said:

I started a response, but honestly, you're way out of your depth in trying to provide me with an education on human behavior and emotion.  So with that said, I'm glad you're enjoying the show so much, and that you're not seeing the same massive plot holes that, so far as I can tell, all the other JN fans are.  It's certainly more enjoyable that way.

Why Dr. Phil?

You deflect from my point because you cannot argue it.  You know it is true.  I have been critical of the show.  Go read.  You will not even have to go go far.  Your premise is not thought out well.  That is a you problem.  Stopping watching the show.  There will still be 11 million watching it.

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38 minutes ago, PFSIKH said:

Why Dr. Phil?

You deflect from my point because you cannot argue it.  You know it is true.  I have been critical of the show.  Go read.  You will not even have to go go far.  Your premise is not thought out well.  That is a you problem.  Stopping watching the show.  There will still be 11 million watching it.

As I said, I'm glad you're enjoying the show.

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12 hours ago, PFSIKH said:

1)  Do you have a teenager?  Teens do not think things through.  They struggle with things right in front of them much less the cause and affect of their actions three or four steps down the line.  All of a sudden, it is "oh oh, wtf do I do now".

23)  You do understand the concept of time?  How emotion might ebb and flow over time.  How you might be really angry at someone or thing and then 10 minutes later you are not.  However Carl may have felt when he got on the truck, tricked Jesus and thought he could probably kill Negan crashed when stuff happened.  People sacrificed themselves to save Negan.  He stated I just want to kill Negan and what happened?  People still shielded Negan.  Well, there goes the parting of the sea plan were I can just walk up to Negan and kill him.  Now what?  Combine that with the mental games Negan plays.  There was a reason he made Rick and Carl carry Lucille.  Negan said it, I just put my dick down your throat and you said thank you.  Do you think the eye patch scene was a filler?  No.  It was Negan messing with Carl mind effing him even more.

Dictator)  You, JIFs and probably others whole point is, "why don't they do something...they have a chance".  Yeah, the dictator is on a reviewing stand looking over his army it might be difficult.  How many times in the history of this planet was a dictator in a room alone with somebody who could have killed the dictator regardless of the ramifications?  Billions of times.  Yet, no one martyred themselves for the needs of the many over the needs of the few.  Surprising not surprising.

Neagan's charater, in real life, is about as believable as Spaceghost.

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I just rewatched the episode , holy Christ Chandler Riggs has to be the worst actor ever to be in such a big show , he literally singlehandedly ruined every scene he was in , don't hit me with the child actor excuse , there's plenty of good teenage actors . He's God F'ing awful .

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Ok, that was a pretty fun episode.  It finally took care of some of the things that were annoying me about the Negan role with Rosita taking a shot at him.  I'm pretty sure I would have killed her if I was Negan but I'll let that slide because they shot the other lady and took Eugene. 

I wish they would do the hop back and forth all the time though.  It's so much more interesting and I think they could cover some of the plot holes and some of the sh*t that just doesnt make any sense by doing that more often than the solo focus.  Some characters just arent interesting and you they ended up writing in stupid sh*t that just doesnt fit or make sense to fill the episode.  Plus you dont go episodes without seeing the good characters.  

I knew Maggie was going become a bad ass after Glenn's death and the way that Deanna was grooming her before she died.

Interested to see how the Kingdom and the Crew come together.  I assume Jesus knows of them and will connect the dots or maybe Morgan goes looking for the Crew (what do we call them, I'm going with crew because its easy).  And then you have to figure that amazon women are going to come into the picture somehow with all those guns and ammo.

And then with Rick staring at that letter that got Aaron beat down for (which was weird, why did he tense up and not just tell them the truth?) but anywho.  You figure Rick was trying to figure out what it meant which we think is that shoe that appeared when they were loading the truick?  Figure they come in somehow...maybe that's the boats owner and he's got a arsenal as well?  Maybe people too?  It seemed like that whole thing was just a test to see if they could get to the boat.  I assume that person watched the whole time? 

Was that the season finale? 

 

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1 hour ago, JiF said:

Ok, that was a pretty fun episode.  It finally took care of some of the things that were annoying me about the Negan role with Rosita taking a shot at him.  I'm pretty sure I would have killed her if I was Negan but I'll let that slide because they shot the other lady and took Eugene. 

I wish they would do the hop back and forth all the time though.  It's so much more interesting and I think they could cover some of the plot holes and some of the sh*t that just doesnt make any sense by doing that more often than the solo focus.  Some characters just arent interesting and you they ended up writing in stupid sh*t that just doesnt fit or make sense to fill the episode.  Plus you dont go episodes without seeing the good characters.  

I knew Maggie was going become a bad ass after Glenn's death and the way that Deanna was grooming her before she died.

Interested to see how the Kingdom and the Crew come together.  I assume Jesus knows of them and will connect the dots or maybe Morgan goes looking for the Crew (what do we call them, I'm going with crew because its easy).  And then you have to figure that amazon women are going to come into the picture somehow with all those guns and ammo.

And then with Rick staring at that letter that got Aaron beat down for (which was weird, why did he tense up and not just tell them the truth?) but anywho.  You figure Rick was trying to figure out what it meant which we think is that shoe that appeared when they were loading the truick?  Figure they come in somehow...maybe that's the boats owner and he's got a arsenal as well?  Maybe people too?  It seemed like that whole thing was just a test to see if they could get to the boat.  I assume that person watched the whole time? 

Was that the season finale? 

 

Yeah, that shot from Rosita was seriously the first worthwhile moment of this entire season for me.  Of course it didn't work out, and we all knew it wouldn't, but it's still infinitely better than so much of that laughable nonsense we've seen from everyone else all season.  And it's kind of amazing that, when the opportunity first came for her, they didn't do more of their crap of dragging it on for hours for no discernible reason as they've done all season.  Hopefully the wrap-up of the episode is the sign of a much more interesting second half of the season, because it was pretty awful before this. They have some opportunities here, and like you said, can stop wasting so much time on characters/side stories absolutely nobody cares about.

It's not technically the season finale, but this mid-season break lasts until February.

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2 hours ago, JiF said:

Ok, that was a pretty fun episode.  It finally took care of some of the things that were annoying me about the Negan role with Rosita taking a shot at him.  I'm pretty sure I would have killed her if I was Negan but I'll let that slide because they shot the other lady and took Eugene. 

I wish they would do the hop back and forth all the time though.  It's so much more interesting and I think they could cover some of the plot holes and some of the sh*t that just doesnt make any sense by doing that more often than the solo focus.  Some characters just arent interesting and you they ended up writing in stupid sh*t that just doesnt fit or make sense to fill the episode.  Plus you dont go episodes without seeing the good characters.  

I knew Maggie was going become a bad ass after Glenn's death and the way that Deanna was grooming her before she died.

Interested to see how the Kingdom and the Crew come together.  I assume Jesus knows of them and will connect the dots or maybe Morgan goes looking for the Crew (what do we call them, I'm going with crew because its easy).  And then you have to figure that amazon women are going to come into the picture somehow with all those guns and ammo.

And then with Rick staring at that letter that got Aaron beat down for (which was weird, why did he tense up and not just tell them the truth?) but anywho.  You figure Rick was trying to figure out what it meant which we think is that shoe that appeared when they were loading the truick?  Figure they come in somehow...maybe that's the boats owner and he's got a arsenal as well?  Maybe people too?  It seemed like that whole thing was just a test to see if they could get to the boat.  I assume that person watched the whole time? 

Was that the season finale? 

 

 

51 minutes ago, Bleedin Green said:

Yeah, that shot from Rosita was seriously the first worthwhile moment of this entire season for me.  Of course it didn't work out, and we all knew it wouldn't, but it's still infinitely better than so much of that laughable nonsense we've seen from everyone else all season.  And it's kind of amazing that, when the opportunity first came for her, they didn't do more of their crap of dragging it on for hours for no discernible reason as they've done all season.  Hopefully the wrap-up of the episode is the sign of a much more interesting second half of the season, because it was pretty awful before this. They have some opportunities here, and like you said, can stop wasting so much time on characters/side stories absolutely nobody cares about.

It's not technically the season finale, but this mid-season break lasts until February.

Definitely a better episode, but the bar was pretty low.  Still some stuff that's really hard to stomach, but we didn't have to watch Rick sit quietly while Negan messed with Judith, so that was a positive.  At least they're setting up the battle now, though if I had to guess, the second half of the season will be build up to the battle which will begin in the finale and then we'll wait until next year to actually see it.

One question, where did Negan hide that giant knife in his skinny jeans?

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13 hours ago, JiF said:

Ok, that was a pretty fun episode.  It finally took care of some of the things that were annoying me about the Negan role with Rosita taking a shot at him.  I'm pretty sure I would have killed her if I was Negan but I'll let that slide because they shot the other lady and took Eugene. 

I wish they would do the hop back and forth all the time though.  It's so much more interesting and I think they could cover some of the plot holes and some of the sh*t that just doesnt make any sense by doing that more often than the solo focus.  Some characters just arent interesting and you they ended up writing in stupid sh*t that just doesnt fit or make sense to fill the episode.  Plus you dont go episodes without seeing the good characters.  

I knew Maggie was going become a bad ass after Glenn's death and the way that Deanna was grooming her before she died.

Interested to see how the Kingdom and the Crew come together.  I assume Jesus knows of them and will connect the dots or maybe Morgan goes looking for the Crew (what do we call them, I'm going with crew because its easy).  And then you have to figure that amazon women are going to come into the picture somehow with all those guns and ammo.

And then with Rick staring at that letter that got Aaron beat down for (which was weird, why did he tense up and not just tell them the truth?) but anywho.  You figure Rick was trying to figure out what it meant which we think is that shoe that appeared when they were loading the truick?  Figure they come in somehow...maybe that's the boats owner and he's got a arsenal as well?  Maybe people too?  It seemed like that whole thing was just a test to see if they could get to the boat.  I assume that person watched the whole time? 

Was that the season finale?

Biggest knock of the first half.  It really should be on about episode 4 or 5.

Interesting take on the boat and boot guy.  I am curious how they get the war started with staffs and only a handful of weapons unless the Kingdom has a cache.

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38 minutes ago, PFSIKH said:

Biggest knock of the first half.  It really should be on about episode 4 or 5.

Interesting take on the boat and boot guy.  I am curious how they get the war started with staffs and only a handful of weapons unless the Kingdom has a cache.

I've thought about this and I think they've got a couple advantages right now that they could work to their favor.  Jesus knows their routes.  He clearly knows their base.  Darryl now knows their base.  They also know they make their runs in small teams.  I think they have an opportunity to sneak attack them on their runs and make set up some traps to take their weapons and at least start small to grow...I dont know how many bullets they have, but they have 2 guns...it's at least enough to make a strategic attack to take some weapons from them.  We've know they're all a bunch of pussies who dont know how to fight.  The crew was dominating the Saviors before they brought out their entire army for the evening of Lucile. 

You have to figure those amazon women come into play.  They're all trained and they have an enormous arsenal.  I have to imagine that they send home girl back to try and get them to join forces.  

And as you said, I assume the Kingdom has some weapons around as well.  The one guy wanted to attack, I cant imagine he planned on doing it with sticks and stones. 

And then the boot and the boat...they didnt show that for no reason.  

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The boot thing is weird , it's probably the same person who gave daryl the "leave now " note . They're trying to get us to think the boot person is a threat but it's probably someone looking out for them . 

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Overall I thought this was by far the best episode of the season , I agree with Jif there's still some slow spots but the last 5 minutes was very good , the bottom line is the show isn't as good when Rick, Daryl etc etc are all split up , they've tried it in prior seasons and it never works. My feeling is the 2nd half of the season is going to move slow also , for those who expect immediate revenge your going to probably be disappointed again. They'll probably spend 7 episodes slowly recruiting the kingdom to help , pretending to play along with Negan when he comes to town , biding time etc etc...I wouldn't expect them to drop the gloves and completely go to war until season 7 finale going into season 8...just a feeling .

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The episode was quite slow until the final 10 minutes or so.

I was not a fan at all of Rositas shot miraculously hitting the center of Lucille and not even splintering it.  It was dangerously close to a jump the shark moment.  That was infinitely more improbable than Glenn being covered in guts and sliding under a dumpster.

I think if not for the reunion at the end complete with the emotional soundtrack, a lot more would be made of this.

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4 hours ago, Jolot said:

The boot thing is weird , it's probably the same person who gave daryl the "leave now " note . They're trying to get us to think the boot person is a threat but it's probably someone looking out for them . 

I figured Jesus gave him the note considering he was waiting for him outside. 

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55 minutes ago, JiF said:

I figured Jesus gave him the note considering he was waiting for him outside. 

Lol yea that would seem like the obvious person to leave the note your right , but if Jesus was outside Daryl prison door why not just open it ? Why slide the note ? It was unlocked , I'm thinking an inside job . 

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2 hours ago, Pac said:

The episode was quite slow until the final 10 minutes or so.

I was not a fan at all of Rositas shot miraculously hitting the center of Lucille and not even splintering it.  It was dangerously close to a jump the shark moment.  That was infinitely more improbable than Glenn being covered in guts and sliding under a dumpster.

I think if not for the reunion at the end complete with the emotional soundtrack, a lot more would be made of this.

100% right , the bullet thing could be the dumbest thing that ever happened on the show, maybe more improbable than a zombie apocalypse lol

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2 minutes ago, Jolot said:

Lol yea that would seem like the obvious person to leave the note your right , but if Jesus was outside Daryl prison door why not just open it ? Why slide the note ? It was unlocked , I'm thinking an inside job . 

The note leaver...its makes sense!

Good call.  What a coincidence that he left the boat so leave Daryl a note as the same tte Rick and Aaron found his sh*t. 

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Ahahahahahaha was the writing and acting always this horrendous?? Was I just blinded by the cool zombies? The plots now. The facial expressions. The over dramatizing sh*t that was no big deal after S3. "I had a family man. The Kingdom will fall. I can't...we can't." "You have to" I cannnt" "YOU MUST" ***long contemplation facial expression scene***

ahahahah

I'm almost done. Almost. 

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I want to like the show too dudes. I'm not a natural hater either. I like to at least think I'm open minded. But come on man. *sigh

 I netflixed the first 5 seasons in like two weeks so maybe that's it? I dunno. And I LOVE the premise and that it's also a comic. And at least some of the acting is strong. And I can also suspend disbelief. 

But this is getting all a bit too hokey.

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23 hours ago, JiF said:

I've thought about this and I think they've got a couple advantages right now that they could work to their favor.  Jesus knows their routes.  He clearly knows their base.  Darryl now knows their base.  They also know they make their runs in small teams.  I think they have an opportunity to sneak attack them on their runs and make set up some traps to take their weapons and at least start small to grow...I dont know how many bullets they have, but they have 2 guns...it's at least enough to make a strategic attack to take some weapons from them.  We've know they're all a bunch of pussies who dont know how to fight.  The crew was dominating the Saviors before they brought out their entire army for the evening of Lucile. 

You have to figure those amazon women come into play.  They're all trained and they have an enormous arsenal.  I have to imagine that they send home girl back to try and get them to join forces.  

And as you said, I assume the Kingdom has some weapons around as well.  The one guy wanted to attack, I cant imagine he planned on doing it with sticks and stones. 

And then the boot and the boat...they didnt show that for no reason.  

Not really.

They never really stood toe-to-toe with the Saviors.  Sneaking into one of their outposts and killing them while they sleep is hardly dominating.  The other stand-off was not going well until the Saviors were flanked.

I would not waste time with attacking a supply run.  The amount of weapons you are likely to get are minimal.  Plus, unless they go straight to the Sanctuary after the ambush, the attack on the supply run will only raise the Saviors alert level.  Overwhelm the Saviors at the Sanctuary, like they did with the Outpost, in the hopes you can acquire more weapons and maybe run into more people like the woman Michonne came across.

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8 minutes ago, PFSIKH said:

Not really.

They never really stood toe-to-toe with the Saviors.  Sneaking into one of their outposts and killing them while they sleep is hardly dominating.  The other stand-off was not going well until the Saviors were flanked.

I would not waste time with attacking a supply run.  The amount of weapons you are likely to get are minimal.  Plus, unless they go straight to the Sanctuary after the ambush, the attack on the supply run will only raise the Saviors alert level.  Overwhelm the Saviors at the Sanctuary, like they did with the Outpost, in the hopes you can acquire more weapons and maybe run into more people like the woman Michonne came across.

Huh? They absolutely dominated them on every single occasion prior to the Lucile night.  We talked about it numerous times in this thread. 

Darryl RPG'd a group. Cant remember who was captured...was it Carrol and Maggie?, but they broke out of some type of imprisonment and killed all the people that held them captive. Carrol when she goes on her solo trip killed what...3 of them on the road?  And that was all before the outpost attack. They were outright dominating them on every occasion until the night of Lucile. 

They have 2 guns right now and are completely out manned and you think they can just overrun the Sanctuary?  That seems like a suicide mission.  Unless you're saying they need to unite all these other factions and attack..then it makes sense, I guess.  But they would still be out manned and out gunned. .  

Stopping a supply run will gain them more weapons and potentially they could even grab a hostage.  They can go on the run to avoid the Saviors retaliation.  It's not like they havent learned how to survive and settle in place they can protect themselves.  

Start small to get bigger...otherwise, they just need the communities to unit and just stage a war. 

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19 hours ago, Pac said:

The episode was quite slow until the final 10 minutes or so.

I was not a fan at all of Rositas shot miraculously hitting the center of Lucille and not even splintering it.  It was dangerously close to a jump the shark moment.  That was infinitely more improbable than Glenn being covered in guts and sliding under a dumpster.

I think if not for the reunion at the end complete with the emotional soundtrack, a lot more would be made of this.

Not to mention Negan immediately knowing that the bullet was "homemade" and no one having the sense to say, "I don't know.  Like everything else we have, I found it."

17 hours ago, Jolot said:

100% right , the bullet thing could be the dumbest thing that ever happened on the show, maybe more improbable than a zombie apocalypse lol

1) Quiet Toddler

2) Bullet

3) Glenn and the Dumpster

4) Zombie Apocalypse

5) Negan's giant knife hidden in his skinny jeans

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I'm only about an episode behind now... this show is ******* stupid.

I watch, but it's caught in that space between trying to be taken serious - with all the moody music and dialogue - and then perpetrating unrealistic sh*t  you'd expect from something like Shaun of the Dead. Campy almost.

I'm probably in the minority here, but Negan sucks. Doofus smile and swaggy trash talk... dude has left himself open to being killed 100x over, even by the oppressed followers he has... nothing about his character creates a logical threat, or villain. The Governor character was much better constructed. 

Anyway, I'll grind it out like I do every season... but, to me the apparent "changing everything" that the creators touted so much is "finding a way to make it even less interesting than it's been the last 2 seasons".

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2 hours ago, gEYno said:

Not to mention Negan immediately knowing that the bullet was "homemade" and no one having the sense to say, "I don't know.  Like everything else we have, I found it."

1) Quiet Toddler

2) Bullet

3) Glenn and the Dumpster

4) Zombie Apocalypse

5) Negan's giant knife hidden in his skinny jeans

6) Carl shot in face. Only loses eye.

7) Maggie pregnant for months. Only gains weight in her ass.

8) Abraham stops banging Rosita so he can bang Sasha.

9) Tara out-running anyone.

10) Negan has dictatorship over more people and resources than anyone in the history of the show. Chooses to wear the same clothing every day.

11) Diabetes and heart disease is rampant within American population. Not one person struggles to find medication and/or care in post-apocalypic world.

12) Running water and electric.

I can go on, but you get the gist... it's a stupid show. 

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23 hours ago, Jolot said:

Lol yea that would seem like the obvious person to leave the note your right , but if Jesus was outside Daryl prison door why not just open it ? Why slide the note ? It was unlocked , I'm thinking an inside job . 

Dwight?  Could make sense.  We obviously know he goes back and forth on his commitment to Negan.

Did the key to his bike come with the note?  Or was it in the bike? 

Me thinks Dwight.  The boat guy...that's just too far of a stretch.

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5 hours ago, gEYno said:

Not to mention Negan immediately knowing that the bullet was "homemade" and no one having the sense to say, "I don't know.  Like everything else we have, I found it."

1) Quiet Toddler

2) Bullet

3) Glenn and the Dumpster

4) Zombie Apocalypse

5) Negan's giant knife hidden in his skinny jeans

 

2 hours ago, Integrity28 said:

6) Carl shot in face. Only loses eye.

7) Maggie pregnant for months. Only gains weight in her ass.

8) Abraham stops banging Rosita so he can bang Sasha.

9) Tara out-running anyone.

10) Negan has dictatorship over more people and resources than anyone in the history of the show. Chooses to wear the same clothing every day.

11) Diabetes and heart disease is rampant within American population. Not one person struggles to find medication and/or care in post-apocalypic world.

12) Running water and electric.

I can go on, but you get the gist... it's a stupid show. 

I have no problem with this stuff.  It's a show about a Zombie Apocalypse.  Trying to say these things would never happen should be thrown out the window the second you understand that, no?  At least for me, it makes it easy to look past that stuff. 

The issues I have are more with the writing.  Some of the terrible dialogue (though the show has always spent an excessive amount of time talking about feelings) and just stupid pointless scenes, the amount of time focused on boring characters, going episodes without seeing the only interesting characters and the plot holes. 

Those things get frustrating...the other stuff, I can look past it because of the overall premise of the show. 

 

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7 hours ago, JiF said:

Huh? They absolutely dominated them on every single occasion prior to the Lucile night.  We talked about it numerous times in this thread. 

Darryl RPG'd a group. Cant remember who was captured...was it Carrol and Maggie?, but they broke out of some type of imprisonment and killed all the people that held them captive. Carrol when she goes on her solo trip killed what...3 of them on the road?  And that was all before the outpost attack. They were outright dominating them on every occasion until the night of Lucile. 

They have 2 guns right now and are completely out manned and you think they can just overrun the Sanctuary?  That seems like a suicide mission.  Unless you're saying they need to unite all these other factions and attack..then it makes sense, I guess.  But they would still be out manned and out gunned. .  

Stopping a supply run will gain them more weapons and potentially they could even grab a hostage.  They can go on the run to avoid the Saviors retaliation.  It's not like they havent learned how to survive and settle in place they can protect themselves.  

Start small to get bigger...otherwise, they just need the communities to unit and just stage a war. 

We have different definitions of dominate.  Getting the drop on them (Daryl and killing everyone in the outpost) and escaping from a woman dying from cancer, a guy bleeding out, is hardly what I call dominating.  The had a tactical advantage and exploited it.  The Carol/Maggie escape was a tad lame (too easy) IMHO, but I digress.

The Saviors use some tactical sense.  They use LMRs to communicate between groups.  The Saviors had a coordinated effort to deny Rick's group access to the Hilltop and funneled them to a certain point.  Where are you going to ambush them?  They just learned where the sanctuary is.  In order to execute an ambush, you need to know when and where they are going to be.  Otherwise, you are just wasting time.  Plus, you need to overwhelm them with numbers or fire superiority.  They are not going to out gun them so unless they have a bomb maker it is going to be hard to disable/blow up their vehicles with Morgan's staff.  Leaving dead bodies in the road was lame last week.

I am saying they need to unite.  Hilltop, Kingdom and Alexandria at the very least.  If the woman island want to join in or at the very least arm the other groups, even better.  Attack the sanctuary at night/before dawn.  Again, try to get the jump on them.  Jesus was able to get inside the compound.  Use this route to get in as quick and as quietly as possible.  Grab weapons if you can and/or start killing people like they did at the outpost.

In theory, they need to either continue playing along for another week or two so they can get organized or they hit them now when they least expect it.  An ambush, especially after what Rick's group did, will set off alarm bells and have them raise their alert level.  I do not think it is a viable means right now.  Not if that is the only thing they are going to do.

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1 hour ago, JiF said:

 

I have no problem with this stuff.  It's a show about a Zombie Apocalypse.  Trying to say these things would never happen should be thrown out the window the second you understand that, no?  At least for me, it makes it easy to look past that stuff. 

The issues I have are more with the writing.  Some of the terrible dialogue (though the show has always spent an excessive amount of time talking about feelings) and just stupid pointless scenes, the amount of time focused on boring characters, going episodes without seeing the only interesting characters and the plot holes. 

Those things get frustrating...the other stuff, I can look past it because of the overall premise of the show. 

 

To me, those ARE issues with the writing.

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6 hours ago, Integrity28 said:

I'm only about an episode behind now... this show is ******* stupid.

I watch, but it's caught in that space between trying to be taken serious - with all the moody music and dialogue - and then perpetrating unrealistic sh*t  you'd expect from something like Shaun of the Dead. Campy almost.

I'm probably in the minority here, but Negan sucks. Doofus smile and swaggy trash talk... dude has left himself open to being killed 100x over, even by the oppressed followers he has... nothing about his character creates a logical threat, or villain. The Governor character was much better constructed. 

Anyway, I'll grind it out like I do every season... but, to me the apparent "changing everything" that the creators touted so much is "finding a way to make it even less interesting than it's been the last 2 seasons".

Well said. I stopped watching after the second episode this season. Negan is a gigantic doofus. Belongs in a Bugs Bunny cartoon. The governor was a billion times more sinister. Sitting in his fish tank zombie skull collection room brushing the falling out hair of his zombie daughter.  That guy was a quality villain. Negan belongs in a parody of a Zombie movie. You 100% nailed it with Shaun of The Dead.  Yet at least that was funny. It is sad what this amazing show turned into. 

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16 hours ago, JiF said:

 

I have no problem with this stuff.  It's a show about a Zombie Apocalypse.  Trying to say these things would never happen should be thrown out the window the second you understand that, no?  At least for me, it makes it easy to look past that stuff. 

The issues I have are more with the writing.  Some of the terrible dialogue (though the show has always spent an excessive amount of time talking about feelings) and just stupid pointless scenes, the amount of time focused on boring characters, going episodes without seeing the only interesting characters and the plot holes. 

Those things get frustrating...the other stuff, I can look past it because of the overall premise of the show. 

 

Not really, no.  We're asked to suspend our disbelief that the dead are being reanimated by some biological pathogen which we have not been explained.  Then, we place normal, everyday people, on the same earth with the same physics, as you and I live in, and follow then as they struggle with the new reality created by this biological pathogen.  The majority of the time, this is how the show, and literally every other work based on zombies, besides the campy "Zombies in Space," or comedies as I28  points out, works.  What happens when our world comes to an end, by way of biological disaster?  That's what we're faced with.  Explained another way, what if Luke Cage just showed up in an episode?  A guy that was bulletproof?  Would this be a problem?  Based on the extrapolation of 'it's a show about something impossible (Zombie Apocalypse)' logic, it shouldn't be.  We've already accepted Zombies, so why not a bullet proof man?  What if Rick started flying, and shooting heat lazers from his eyes, ala Superman?  I guess I'm saying, you've asked us to accept one unrealistic premise, and we're okay with that... When you start to pile on, well:

14 hours ago, Integrity28 said:

To me, those ARE issues with the writing.

 

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