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Key for 2011 Jets--Getting a Top Talent 3-4 NT


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We can all complain about what happened in the AFCCG for different reasons, but ultimately I believe the loss comes down to this: the lack of a top 3-4 NT in the game.

Look at the 3-4 teams that played in the playoffs. Ravens have Ngata, Steelers have Hampton, Pats have Wilfork, and Packers have Raji.

There is HUGE disparity between those players and Pouha. That, above all, needs to be addressed in the offseason.

The Jets can't count of Jenkins anymore. They've been burned the last 2 seasons. A healthy Jenkins would have been key in the AFCCG, especially with Pouncey being lost in the game. But the Jets simply don't have a healthy Jenkins and need to move on.

Where do they go? Who knows. The wild card is Ngata. He's set to be a UFA, but will he get a longterm deal or be franchised?

If Ngata is franchised with the "non-exclusive" tag (meaning he can negotiate elsewhere), the Jets seriously should consider giving up 2 1st rounders for him and signing him to an offer sheet which the Ravens can't match.

IMO, Ngata is more important than getting Woodley (if he was available via franchise or FA).

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Ngata is not getting away from Baltimore; he is the best defensive lineman in all of football, there is just no way they let him go. I agree it would be nice to have a Ngata or Wilfork, but there's a reason there's only a couple of them in the league. With more and more teams switching to a 34, they are going to be even harder to get.

Pouha has done a great job this year, it's not his fault our LBs and dbacks were missing tackles like it was their job. I agree that we have to get a 34 to groom behind him, but that has more to do with his age than his play.

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Doesnt Ngata play DE?

Pouha is a good player.

Seriously?

Pouha is great and all, but Ngata is worthy of DMVP of the year, yet again. He dominates. NT is a huge need for the Jets. If Jenkins is gone, they need another vet and a NT in the draft. No way Ngata leaves the Ravens IMO, but Pat Williams is a FA too. He is the oldest DT in the league, but he is still a stud. Would be a perfect stop-gap, while they groom an up and comer.

I really like the idea of signing Cullen and Kris Jenkins. Cullen long-term, and Kris for one more year. Scary combo that would certainly feed off of each other. Both have health issues though, obviously.

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Our biggest need is to get more aggressive OLB's. Pace was terrible this season(injury related, I hope) and Bryan Thomas is a complete stiff.

The Steelers have two guys that play with reckless abandon. The Ravens have Suggs. We need a mean SOB on the outside that will make plays behind the LOS.

Edited by Matt39
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Ngata is a NT by trade, but the Ravens play him at DE. In Rex's sceme he's a NT. Contract negotiations are funny things. You never know what happens. We can say that there is no way the Ravens let him go, but it all depends on negotiations and if the franchise tag is necessary.

Visa, Haynesworth is a bona fide cancer, but I do believe he is worth a due diligence look by the Jets.

Ryno, I like the Cullen idea as well. The Jets need the upgrade.

Matt, I want Woodley, but if a top tier NT is in striking distance, that takes priority over OLB IMO. Having that stout NT allows the OLBs to make more plays. Heck, it makes Harris a better player.

Pouha is a solid starter, rotation guy but that's all the Jets have on the DLine. They need better.

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1. I don't think the Jets care about getting big time d linemen. They have had the chance and elected to go back end. I think the bigger guys develop and fill out later. I remember Raji was talking about coming out a year earlier and was projected in the 4th. That's when you try to grab these guys. There is no can't miss at 30 anyway.

2. Franchise tag? Is there one? I think that is probably #1 in things to go in the new CBA.

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We can all complain about what happened in the AFCCG for different reasons, but ultimately I believe the loss comes down to this: the lack of a top 3-4 NT in the game.

Look at the 3-4 teams that played in the playoffs. Ravens have Ngata, Steelers have Hampton, Pats have Wilfork, and Packers have Raji.

There is HUGE disparity between those players and Pouha. That, above all, needs to be addressed in the offseason.

The Jets can't count of Jenkins anymore. They've been burned the last 2 seasons. A healthy Jenkins would have been key in the AFCCG, especially with Pouncey being lost in the game. But the Jets simply don't have a healthy Jenkins and need to move on.

Where do they go? Who knows. The wild card is Ngata. He's set to be a UFA, but will he get a longterm deal or be franchised?

If Ngata is franchised with the "non-exclusive" tag (meaning he can negotiate elsewhere), the Jets seriously should consider giving up 2 1st rounders for him and signing him to an offer sheet which the Ravens can't match.

IMO, Ngata is more important than getting Woodley (if he was available via franchise or FA).

I agree. NT should be our #1 priority. Plus, I think Pouha would look good at DE anyway. I think something like this make Calvin Pace look at a lot better.

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Look no further than Albert Haynesworth. He could be one of those players that a change of scenery resurrects his career. Washington will deal him in a heartbeat.

If Washington is gonna send us Haynesworth, I want a 3rd round pick as well. In return the Jets can send Washington a bill for half of his contract.

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1. I don't think the Jets care about getting big time d linemen. They have had the chance and elected to go back end. I think the bigger guys develop and fill out later. I remember Raji was talking about coming out a year earlier and was projected in the 4th. That's when you try to grab these guys. There is no can't miss at 30 anyway.

2. Franchise tag? Is there one? I think that is probably #1 in things to go in the new CBA.

1. I don't get your point on Raji. He was drafted 9th overall.

2. I definitely think there's a franchise tag in new CBA.

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1. I don't get your point on Raji. He was drafted 9th overall.

2. I definitely think there's a franchise tag in new CBA.

My point on Raji is this - the guy went 9th overall. If he came out early due to his academic ineligibility he was projected to be a 4th rounder. I remember because it was before Jenkins and I wanted the Jets to draft him. There are plenty of guys like him floating around. I think the Jets are in a position to take a bunch of risky guys and hope one pans out (equivalent to Raji in '07 or '08) rather than insist on a topflight guy like Raji in '09 or Ngata. I think they feel they can develop these kinds of guys and aren't worried about the rep or draft position. Also, they aren't getting a big man sure thing at 30 anyway.

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Seriously?

Pouha is great and all, but Ngata is worthy of DMVP of the year, yet again. He dominates. NT is a huge need for the Jets. If Jenkins is gone, they need another vet and a NT in the draft. No way Ngata leaves the Ravens IMO, but Pat Williams is a FA too. He is the oldest DT in the league, but he is still a stud. Would be a perfect stop-gap, while they groom an up and comer.

I really like the idea of signing Cullen and Kris Jenkins. Cullen long-term, and Kris for one more year. Scary combo that would certainly feed off of each other. Both have health issues though, obviously.

You plan to have a vet, an NT in the draft and Pouha? That's a lot of bodies for what was 1 roster spot all season.

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Ngata is a NT by trade, but the Ravens play him at DE. In Rex's sceme he's a NT. Contract negotiations are funny things. You never know what happens. We can say that there is no way the Ravens let him go, but it all depends on negotiations and if the franchise tag is necessary.

Visa, Haynesworth is a bona fide cancer, but I do believe he is worth a due diligence look by the Jets.

Ryno, I like the Cullen idea as well. The Jets need the upgrade.

Matt, I want Woodley, but if a top tier NT is in striking distance, that takes priority over OLB IMO. Having that stout NT allows the OLBs to make more plays. Heck, it makes Harris a better player.

Pouha is a solid starter, rotation guy but that's all the Jets have on the DLine. They need better.

You think so? I don't know. Rex used Ngata at DT and DE in '06 (depending on whether they went 4-across or 3), at DE in '07, and only moved to NT in '08 because Gregg missed the season. Gregg came back in '09 and Ngata moved back to DE where he's been since.

Realistically if Ngata was on this team in 2011 - which is not happening - he would again play DE with Pouha at NT. If Jenkins was here also (doubtful because we could never afford both Jenkins and Ngata with the # of FA's we have) it would shock me if Ryan didn't go Jenkins-Pouha-Ngata. It would also shock me if the Jets gave up 40 rushing yards in any game if they all stayed healthy.

But again, this is not happening. Baltimore has 21 starters more easily replaceable than a 27 year-old Haloti Ngata and I can't believe they'd be that foolish. Their organization is run better than that.

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Look no further than Albert Haynesworth. He could be one of those players that a change of scenery resurrects his career. Washington will deal him in a heartbeat.

Uhh...thought the problem he had in Washington is they asked him to play the nose in the 3-4...square peg, round hole for us.

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3-4 DL in general rather than a NT specifically...coming out of the draft with a Cameron Heyward or Chrisitan Ballard would help this DL out alot despite not being NT prospects. Get younger, bigger, stronger, faster, and all that crap...If there's no FA signings then I hope they draft two front 7 players.

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Ngata does play DE/DT for the Ravens. There's like a .0000000001 change the Ravens let him get away...the guy is the best DL in the league at this point....Also, Wilfork and Raji both played alot of DE on the 3 man line this year.

I'd like to add NT depth behind Pouha...who has turned himself into a pretty decent starter, but getting a starting quality NT is not the issue. It's replacing Ellis as a starter and letting him move to the role Pryce played....

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Wasn't he rated as the #1 DT either last year or the year before? He led in a bunch of statistics. Not tackles or sacks, but more in-depth ones that show the true value to his team.

That's true. Devito graded out excellent this season in those statistics as well.

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While I think it's true that d-line isn't a high priority because Rex thinks he can turn anyone into a decent player, I'm curious as to how the d would look with some top end talent. The Jenkins thing hasn't worked out, which is really a shame because the guy is a freak. I think Woodley is more likely than Ngata to hit free agency. I have no idea if we could afford him but it's an interesting idea at least.

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That's true. Devito graded out excellent this season in those statistics as well.

Devito is awesome. I'm really happy that there is at least some young talent on the d-line. Jenkins, Ellis, Price and Pouha are all either done or nearing the end of their careers. Hopefully one of the practice squad guys can amount to something.

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Cameron Jordan in the first and Phil Taylor in the 3rd if he's there...I would be happy if those were the only two picks we made all draft. I am going to go on record to say Cameron Jordan is going to be the best defensive lineman in this draft. I love Bowers, Dareus, Quin, Fairley etc. Just seeing this kid play during the year and now at the senior bowl, he's going to be an absolute stud (who the jets worked out privately at the senior bowl) and would be a perfect pick for us.

I may be going a bit far with saying best dlineman in the draft, but he has everything you look for; physically impressive at 6'4⅛" 287 lbs with 34½ inch arms, can utilize a variety of pass rush moves besides the bull rush and just has a super high motor.

If we could come away with Cam Jordan and Phil Taylor, our defense would have a solid core for many years.

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Devito is awesome. I'm really happy that there is at least some young talent on the d-line. Jenkins, Ellis, Price and Pouha are all either done or nearing the end of their careers. Hopefully one of the practice squad guys can amount to something.

Devito is a beast man...idk if people really appreciate how good that guy is. He was the biggest reason why this team is so strong against the run. Too bad our LB's played like dogs against the Steelers.

Edited by Matt39
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They need ANY 3-4 top talent, no matter the position.

I agree with that. Pouha is a worthy starter, but he can't be the best player on your DLine and expect to have huge success. He will get exposed and the defense will suffer, like it did against the Steelers.

It's not just about OLB, which is also a big need. If I ranked the defensive needs in order of priority it would be:

1. NT (DE)

2. OLB

3. S

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1. I don't think the Jets care about getting big time d linemen. They have had the chance and elected to go back end. I think the bigger guys develop and fill out later. I remember Raji was talking about coming out a year earlier and was projected in the 4th. That's when you try to grab these guys. There is no can't miss at 30 anyway.

2. Franchise tag? Is there one? I think that is probably #1 in things to go in the new CBA.

Raji would not have went in the 4th round if he came out sooner...his only major issue was that academic problem he had as a junior...otherwise...beast.

Also SMC, on the Ngata being a NT in Rex's D...Rex is the guy who started him at DE. I want a defensive lineman like Ngata...though 6'5 340 with his athleticism is not easy to find...Seymour, at 315 or so, was another guy who was strong enough to play NT but too athletic to waste there...Belichick used him at NT when he was younger as well as DE...It's a talent thing.

Edited by SenorGato
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