I'm rooting for the Jets to lose Monday Night - Part 2

[win4ever]

9 hours ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

Petty hinders the development of the young guys more than Fitz. Aside from one long, underthrown pass he didn't do much of anything and wasn't mostly not good. That hurts the guys playing with him. If you don't think the offense was more limited with Petty, I don't know what to tell you.

To your second point, the way Macc and Bowles treat him are you absolutely sure he isn't coming back?

He played a conservative game against a good defense.  Even after Fitz's very good game this past week, they have a similar rating for the season.  Each week, there is plenty of examples of the offense being limited by Fitzpatrick, guys running wide open, yet ignored.  But you don't think that hinders the offense?  Defenses playing a single safety more often than not, doesn't hinder offense?  If you can't see that Fitz is limiting the offense as well, then there is really no point in having a discussion.   

If they bring back a veteran QB having one of the worst statistical seasons this year, after investing a 4th round pick, and a 2nd round pick on QBs, then Macc should be on the chopping block too.  On the other hand, I don't think there is any way they bring him back.  

[CrazyCarl40]

5 minutes ago, win4ever said:

He played a conservative game against a good defense.  Even after Fitz's very good game this past week, they have a similar rating for the season.  Each week, there is plenty of examples of the offense being limited by Fitzpatrick, guys running wide open, yet ignored.  But you don't think that hinders the offense?  Defenses playing a single safety more often than not, doesn't hinder offense?  If you can't see that Fitz is limiting the offense as well, then there is really no point in having a discussion.   

If they bring back a veteran QB having one of the worst statistical seasons this year, after investing a 4th round pick, and a 2nd round pick on QBs, then Macc should be on the chopping block too.  On the other hand, I don't think there is any way they bring him back.  

I never said Fitz doesn't limit the offense. It's been repeated and repeated and repeated many times that he is a limited player. And yet, the offense is still more limited with Petty there. Defenses didn't change when he took over. You say yourself the offense went conservative, much more so than if Fitz was at QB, against the Rams. How does that help develop young offensive players?

Again, your assertion is that there is zero reason to watch this team with Fitz at QB. That's patently false and dishonest, just like you trying to compare the ratings of one week of Petty vs. a season of Fitz.

[nyjunc]

I root for the Jets to win every week, when the season is lost like it the losses aren't painful but I will never root against them.

[win4ever]

4 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

I never said Fitz doesn't limit the offense. It's been repeated and repeated and repeated many times that he is a limited player. And yet, the offense is still more limited with Petty there. Defenses didn't change when he took over. You say yourself the offense went conservative, much more so than if Fitz was at QB, against the Rams. How does that help develop young offensive players?

Again, your assertion is that there is zero reason to watch this team with Fitz at QB. That's patently false and dishonest, just like you trying to compare the ratings of one week of Petty vs. a season of Fitz.

So you say the offense is admittedly limited with Fitz, but it doesn't hinder the evaluation process with the other guys?  How does that work?  Petty played against a top tier defense, and put up that ranking.  I believe, I did the numbers last week that showed Fitz against top tier defenses this year ranked even worse than his current stats.  If you are dismissive of Petty's numbers for a one game sample, I'm dismissing the "limited offense with Petty" notion over a small sample size as well.   Again, I believe the numbers for Fitz was right around a 60 rating against good defenses, with a lower completion percentage, lower TD%, and higher INT%.   So how does a player who has statistically been worse help develop players, when you yourself admitted that he's a limited player?  

There is zero reason for me to watch these games, because we aren't going anywhere with Fitz.  He played one of his best games last week, and we still lost.  He's not going to carry this team anywhere.  I only watch to write the film breakdowns, but I'd rather do other things on an off day than sitting around to see Fitzpatrick throw bad passes as our punter gets a workout.  If you like seeing that, I'm fine with it, that's your choice.  I'd be much more excited to see Petty/Hack/Anyone with upside play than Fitz at this point.  

[UnitedWhofans]

I would rather they lose but put out an effort, like they did on Sunday.

[CrazyCarl40]

29 minutes ago, win4ever said:

So you say the offense is admittedly limited with Fitz, but it doesn't hinder the evaluation process with the other guys?  How does that work?  Petty played against a top tier defense, and put up that ranking.  I believe, I did the numbers last week that showed Fitz against top tier defenses this year ranked even worse than his current stats.  If you are dismissive of Petty's numbers for a one game sample, I'm dismissing the "limited offense with Petty" notion over a small sample size as well.   Again, I believe the numbers for Fitz was right around a 60 rating against good defenses, with a lower completion percentage, lower TD%, and higher INT%.   So how does a player who has statistically been worse help develop players, when you yourself admitted that he's a limited player?  

There is zero reason for me to watch these games, because we aren't going anywhere with Fitz.  He played one of his best games last week, and we still lost.  He's not going to carry this team anywhere.  I only watch to write the film breakdowns, but I'd rather do other things on an off day than sitting around to see Fitzpatrick throw bad passes as our punter gets a workout.  If you like seeing that, I'm fine with it, that's your choice.  I'd be much more excited to see Petty/Hack/Anyone with upside play than Fitz at this point.

The offense is limited in his arm, not in the play calling. They don't do vanilla with Fitz, they go full bore. With Petty they basically hamstrung him. If that's the type of play calling and management that we'll see as fans when Petty starts, then what's the point? The guy has an arm, let him use it. Q seems to be coming along just fine with Fitz. Anderson and Marshall have shown glimpses with Fitz. He isn't afraid to throw to these guys. Petty is afraid to throw period.

And again, one game versus an entire season is not a metric you can compare two guys with. It just makes zero sense. And you know that.

It's your right to not watch the games. You can do that. I'm sorry you don't think the other 52 players are worth watching because of 1, but that seems pretty small and petty of you.

[win4ever]

8 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

The offense is limited in his arm, not in the play calling. They don't do vanilla with Fitz, they go full bore. With Petty they basically hamstrung him. If that's the type of play calling and management that we'll see as fans when Petty starts, then what's the point? The guy has an arm, let him use it. Q seems to be coming along just fine with Fitz. Anderson and Marshall have shown glimpses with Fitz. He isn't afraid to throw to these guys. Petty is afraid to throw period.

And again, one game versus an entire season is not a metric you can compare two guys with. It just makes zero sense. And you know that.

It's your right to not watch the games. You can do that. I'm sorry you don't think the other 52 players are worth watching because of 1, but that seems pretty small and petty of you.

There are countless examples of Anderson, Peake, Enunwa running wide open while Fitz makes a bad read or throw.  How do you know Enunwa, Peake, Anderson wouldn't be better without Fitz?

You keep side stepping the question.  If you believe one game statistical comparison is a small sample size, then why do you feel like one game is enough to deem the the play calling around Petty is more limited?

You stated that Fitz's arm is the limiting factor for the offense with Fitz.  Can Fitz improve his arm strength now?  Can the offense be opened up for Petty?  I'd venture a guess and say it's far more likely that the offense is opened up for Petty than Fitz taking magic pills and improving his arm.   

I think the other players are being held back by Fitzpatrick.  There is no point in looking at the offense to evaluate, when the QB is so limited.  It forces a change in the entire offense.  So next year, assume a different QB comes in (with a better arm, or legs) then the whole offense changes.  More space for Forte?  More space underneath for Marshall? Less space over the top for Anderson?  These questions can't be answered with Fitz at QB because his arm limits the options, and also limits the options the defense has to worry about.   It can't be evaluated without seeing a change at QB.  

I don't particularly care for Petty himself, I just care for a change at QB for a guy with a semblance of an arm, that can change the offense.  It could be Petty, Hack, (a healthy) Geno, anyone that has more physical talent so the offense can be opened up, at which point we can evaluate the other options on the team.   

 

[RoadFan]

I hear, didn't watch, the Jets played pretty tough against NE.

Time for the other performance.  I sense a flat, going through the motions, potential ass kicking by the Colts on the horizon. 

Fine by me!