Jason Whitlock-Why V.Young is dropping

[serphnx]

Black people can be racist against other blacks. Like that guy that was ripping on Donovan McNabb because he didn't "run enough anymore". If that's not a racist comment, I don't really know what is.

I think the whole article is bunk, and that racism probably is playing a huge part in these articles being written and people's perceptions. I don't think that is the driving factor though, the driving factor is that these people are in the media and they'll write anything. I absolutely despise the media because they usually twist facts and write their opinions, instead of objectively reporting. This thing is an editorial, so it's really even more worthless. I can form my own opinion, as can everyone else. I don't need someone pushing their agenda on me.

[Sperm Edwards]

Black people can be racist against other blacks. Like that guy that was ripping on Donovan McNabb because he didn't "run enough anymore". If that's not a racist comment, I don't really know what is.

I think the whole article is bunk, and that racism probably is playing a huge part in these articles being written and people's perceptions. I don't think that is the driving factor though, the driving factor is that these people are in the media and they'll write anything. I absolutely despise the media because they usually twist facts and write their opinions, instead of objectively reporting. This thing is an editorial, so it's really even more worthless. I can form my own opinion, as can everyone else. I don't need someone pushing their agenda on me.

So if a writer/fan complains that Jeff Garcia runs around too much & needs to stay in the pocket is he also racist?

You guys throw this word around way too frivolously. Saying that a player is immune to this type of criticism or that type BECAUSE of his race is discriminatory no matter what you think.

[Preston Howley III]

.

My points are valid. A top 5 pick doesnt need to beg for a job. He is entitled to have a "posse", thats his personal business.

And if I'm the GM of an NFL team, I'm entitled to not hire him.

What don't you understand?

[Preston Howley III]

despite TO's lack of humility, he always has a big coin job waiting for him and he is still the best WR out there.

You're the GM of an NFL team. Uh-Oh (Tee Oh) and Drew Rosenhaus are across your desk, asking for 9 million a year for 3 years.

You gonna hire him?

[Sperm Edwards]

You're the GM of an NFL team. Uh-Oh (Tee Oh) and Drew Rosenhaus are across your desk, asking for 9 million a year for 3 years.

You gonna hire him?

You're wasting your time. Dickkotite is the biggest biggot here & is the last one who should be chastizing anyone else for perceived ethnic intolerance or criticism. Whether it's Uncle Toms, Crackers, White Douchebags, or Jews, I've read it all from him in the year I've been here. He knows "the truth" about how everyone feels & looks for it so much it's his knee-jerk reaction. He was so sure of it he labelled an African-American of Whitlock's temperment:

- "racist" (against African-Americans)

- "if that isnt a white man writing about his dislike for black culture, I dont know what is"

- "he was late for his KKK meeting"

And if dk thinks something is racist, and you disagree?

"You guys are entitled to your opinion, i still say the article was weak. I say that it speaks to the inherent racism in american society. those who feel differently are either delusionsional, misguided or a bit racist themselves."

Lovely. So you're entitled to your opinion, but if it differs from his you must be retarded or racist. What a friggin' closed-minded, transparently agenda-driven fool. I thought that this stuff was left behind on the JI political forum. I thought we were here to discuss the Jets & football.

[Preston Howley III]

Lectures from sanctimonious white liberals on pathological guilt trips drive me up a fu*cking wall.

Yeah ok, Dickie. Jason Whitlock is in the Klan.

Him and Dave Chapelle, and they are both blind.

[Sharrow]

Lectures from sanctimonious white liberals on pathological guilt trips drive me up a fu*cking wall.

Yeah ok, Dickie. Jason Whitlock is in the Klan.

Him and Dave Chapelle, and they are both blind.

Oh, but you're fine with sanctimonious black liberals on pathalogical guilt trips. RACIST.

[dickkotite]

And if I'm the GM of an NFL team, I'm entitled to not hire him.

What don't you understand?

jetmoses, you can do better than that.

my point is simple: the article suggests that VY has to go to the combine with his tail between his legs, smiling like a fool and say "yes sir, sir" to every team rep that he runs across or he is not worthy of a job in the nfl.

Im saying hogwash. he is a top 5 pick, he will be a wealthy man with a big time job very early on that special day in april. He doesnt have to put on a polo shirt and turn into colin powell to do that.

It has nothing to do with "entitlement" and I never said anything about that

[dickkotite]

Lectures from sanctimonious white liberals on pathological guilt trips drive me up a fu*cking wall.

Yeah ok, Dickie. Jason Whitlock is in the Klan.

Him and Dave Chapelle, and they are both blind.

the chapelle thing went over my head. as for being a white liberal, thats funny since there is a framed picture of Ronald Reagan on the wall in my house. I support giants like reagan, sorry if i view your little man bush as little mean spirited idiot. But you can follow idiots, moses it is indeed a free country

[dickkotite]

that was marcus vick

well isnt that special....

my bad #2.

but you know what? with that cleared up then i REALLY dont understand the root of the VY hatred. You would think the guy raped someone with the amount of scorn he is recieving for god knows what.

[dickkotite]

and 0nce more, just for the record:

I understand that VY has hurt his chances of scoring every penny possible.I understand that he may drop a spot or two as a result. I understand that VY is probably foolish to hire someone who is not experienced in NFL deals. Bugg makes a good point about Bowie being in the business for 30-40 years and having pull and experience.

Im just saying that when you really strip it down, VY didnt do anything that bad. The article was written with such a scornful and judgemental tone that it would be more appropriate for a guy like Terrell Owens who really deserves it.

[dickkotite]

the chapelle thing went over my head. as for being a white liberal, thats funny since there is a framed picture of Ronald Reagan on the wall in my house. I support giants like reagan, sorry if i view your little man bush as little mean spirited idiot. But you can follow idiots, moses it is indeed a free country

oh i think i just got the chapelle thing. chapelle makes fun of whites i.e. reverse discrimination. Its the old white honkey cracker point that says something like "wahhh you cant say anything about a black person or you get labeled a racist but look at what dave chapelle can get away with- why cant i call HIM a racist"

moses, tell us ...why does the subject of race get you so fired up?

also, why is it when i post it is a "lecture" and when others post it is a "post"

[Preston Howley III]

oh i think i just got the chapelle thing. chapelle makes fun of whites i.e. reverse discrimination. Its the old white honkey cracker point that says something like "wahhh you cant say anything about a black person or you get labeled a racist but look at what dave chapelle can get away with- why cant i call HIM a racist"

moses, tell us ...why does the subject of race get you so fired up?

also, why is it when i post it is a "lecture" and when others post it is a "post"

Fired up? Moi?

Dave Chappele did a send-up on the tv sho 48 hrs where he was profiled as a blind klan leader, and nobody had the heart to tell him he was black. It was hysterical.

Anyway, my only point was/is people can judge Vince Young for his crass behavior (that some people generalize as black ghetto behavior), and they are entitled to that discernment. It doesn't make them "racist" it just means they have a different set of value's and standards. Furthermore, judging Vince does not mean you are judging all black people, because all black people DO NOT ACT LIKE THAT.

Kapisch?

PS I could care less if Whitlock was white or black, I agreed with what he said and thats good enough for me.

Reagan was cool.

[dickkotite]

why r u up so early? OOOOH yea, you have that new job where you had to act like a honkey and put a suit on

haha j/k

[dickkotite]

if i were a black guy, i would get my black friends, pile into my old caddy with spinners find whitlock in his gated cracker community and beat him with chicken bones and watermelon rinds.

then we would glue an afro wig onto his fat head

[SouthernJet]

You're wasting your time. Dickkotite is the biggest biggot here & is the last one who should be chastizing anyone else for perceived ethnic intolerance or criticism. Whether it's Uncle Toms, Crackers, White Douchebags, or Jews, I've read it all from him in the year I've been here. He knows "the truth" about how everyone feels & looks for it so much it's his knee-jerk reaction. He was so sure of it he labelled an African-American of Whitlock's temperment:

- "racist" (against African-Americans)

- "if that isnt a white man writing about his dislike for black culture, I dont know what is"

- "he was late for his KKK meeting"

And if dk thinks something is racist, and you disagree?

"You guys are entitled to your opinion, i still say the article was weak. I say that it speaks to the inherent racism in american society. those who feel differently are either delusionsional, misguided or a bit racist themselves."

Lovely. So you're entitled to your opinion, but if it differs from his you must be retarded or racist. What a friggin' closed-minded, transparently agenda-driven fool. I thought that this stuff was left behind on the JI political forum. I thought we were here to discuss the Jets & football.

yup, every culture, country etc is racist. Its inherent in human nature, but we try to grow and learn.

all races within a society are racist also, so its something WE all have in common.

[Sperm Edwards]

yup, every culture, country etc is racist. Its inherent in human nature, but we try to grow and learn.

all races within a society are racist also, so its something WE all have in common.

Dickie doesn't seem to consider an African-American who bashes white people to be racist; black people who aren't enamored with the hip-hop subculture, and have the temerity to not keep it to themselves, are Uncle Toms; white people who make derogatory remarks about white Christians & Jews are enlightened intellectuals who "get it" unlike the rest of us who are just blind imbeciles; white Christians are all backwoods boobs/klansmen & Jews thirst for the blood of Palestinian babies; practicing Islam is acceptable; practicing Christianity is only acceptable in black & Latino churches.

What an open-minded intellectual.

[dickkotite]

Dickie doesn't seem to consider an African-American who bashes white people to be racist; black people who aren't enamored with the hip-hop subculture, and have the temerity to not keep it to themselves, are Uncle Toms; white people who make derogatory remarks about white Christians & Jews are enlightened intellectuals who "get it" unlike the rest of us who are just blind imbeciles; white Christians are all backwoods boobs/klansmen & Jews thirst for the blood of Palestinian babies; practicing Islam is acceptable; practicing Christianity is only acceptable in black & Latino churches.

What an open-minded intellectual.

lol. hey didnt i vote your avatar as being #1? and this is how you repay me?

spermy, look at my body of work and the hypocracy. Dont you get it? Im a ball buster. I say things to piss people off and make people laugh.

How could I be supporting black rights and then say what I said about driving to whitlocks house and beating him with chicken bones and watermelons? Geez....

Im all seriousness there is always some truth to where Im going. I dont hate jews, but I dont think israel is without any fault. I dont think xtians are all crackers, just many. Sure, plenty of blacks are racist towards whites, thats obvious because they are human. as far as uncle toms, well they exist. they are not the worst people in the world though.

And all through out this I am some kind of "enlightened intellectual" , spelling errors and all. When YOU have an opinion, I dont consider you or anyone an "enlightened intellectual". you have your opinion and I have mine. end of story.

You need some confidence to match your good sense of avatar humor and not think that people who have different opinions than you think they are above you. Thats always the way it is, if im arguing one way, then im a close minded elitist, when you or one of your kind argues passionately THEIR way, they are open minded, non-elistist.

well thats a great formula FOR U because in the end you always win.

relax jack

[SouthernJet]

seriously, what defines a uncle tom and who decides?

if a thug who wears hats sideways and 12 lbs of jewelery is decidin its one thing,,

if its a hardworking normal (from societys POV) looking person its another..

i think about this stuff

[Sperm Edwards]

lol. hey didnt i vote your avatar as being #1? and this is how you repay me?

spermy, look at my body of work and the hypocracy. Dont you get it? Im a ball buster. I say things to piss people off and make people laugh.

How could I be supporting black rights and then say what I said about driving to whitlocks house and beating him with chicken bones and watermelons? Geez....

Im all seriousness there is always some truth to where Im going. I dont hate jews, but I dont think israel is without any fault. I dont think xtians are all crackers, just many. Sure, plenty of blacks are racist towards whites, thats obvious because they are human. as far as uncle toms, well they exist. they are not the worst people in the world though.

And all through out this I am some kind of "enlightened intellectual" , spelling errors and all. When YOU have an opinion, I dont consider you or anyone an "enlightened intellectual". you have your opinion and I have mine. end of story.

You need some confidence to match your good sense of avatar humor and not think that people who have different opinions than you think they are above you. Thats always the way it is, if im arguing one way, then im a close minded elitist, when you or one of your kind argues passionately THEIR way, they are open minded, non-elistist.

well thats a great formula FOR U because in the end you always win.

relax jack

The avatar thing is totally different. It is obvious I have the best one.

One of my kind??? You'd be shocked at my voting record.

This whole thing was about actions or inactions that may/will drop VY's stock. When the author enumerated them in his article, you referred or alluded to him as a klansman, a (white) racist, and a (black) Uncle Tom in the span of 10 minutes.

Vince Young may turn out to be a great QB. I doubt it, but he might be everything Michael Vick was supposed to be and more. This wasn't about that. It was about his behavior and apparent lackadasical attitude towards his prospective employers that would make him a very rich man even if he stinks on ice. It could be interpreted (and I think this was the driving point of the article) as a player who takes a my-way-or-the-highway attitude. Someone who is perceived to need much coaching with regards to his mechanics and the nuances of the pro game as they differ from NCAA cannot have that attitude if he wants the big, big bucks on draft day. Not from a quarterback who has so many different responsibilites, both mentally and physically, in order to succeed in a team sport.

It differs from the NBA where acquiring Shaq instead of JAG at center immediately makes your team a force. Or from a position like RB where it's more power-speed-instinct than thinking & breaking down film.

[R44]

yup, every culture, country etc is racist. Its inherent in human nature, but we try to grow and learn.

all races within a society are racist also, so its something WE all have in common.

I hate to get into this matter, but I'll tell you one thing: If Young is facing racism due to being a black quarterback, it's .001% the racisim that Marcus Jacoby and a jewish QB at Grambling (forgot his name) faced in the mid to latter part of the 1990's due to being white QB's -- that was pointed, direct and in their faces

Basically, the traditionally black school in the Louisiana were told (by the courts) to add more white student athletes in the 1990's, or face discrimination lawsuits.

The schools felt by adding quality white QB's to their rosters, they'd increase tolerance and recruit more whites, as the courts demanded -- it backfired bigtime, Jacoby was treated as bad in 1996 as a black player might've been in 1906 by some coaches, fans and fellow players.

I truly believe legendary Grambling coach Eddie Robinson was pushed out of coaching before he wanted to retire in the 1990's, because current Tampa Bay Bucs exec Doug Williams (among others) was upset he kept recruiting White QB's at Grambling...

Williams said: "If we don't give black QB's a chance at Grambling, who will?

Imagine Paterno saying that about white running backs at Penn State these days?

No more blabber from me -- Check the Marcus Jacoby story, next time someone wants to complain Vince Young is a target of severe racisim

Here's the story: http://www.racematters.org/minorityquarterback.htm

P.S: Last fall, we linked a story at DD.com....It was young black female writing that SOME blacks are hypocritical -- they demand equality in sports, but at the predominately black schools like Grambling, Southern, Alcorn State, ect (state funded), only weak, unathletic white kickers and punters are accepted, so they can be ridiculed at laughed at by many players and fans

Point of all this? If there is racism (and there is), it's coming from all angles...

[dickkotite]

The avatar thing is totally different. It is obvious I have the best one.

One of my kind??? You'd be shocked at my voting record.

This whole thing was about actions or inactions that may/will drop VY's stock. When the author enumerated them in his article, you referred or alluded to him as a klansman, a (white) racist, and a (black) Uncle Tom in the span of 10 minutes.

Vince Young may turn out to be a great QB. I doubt it, but he might be everything Michael Vick was supposed to be and more. This wasn't about that. It was about his behavior and apparent lackadasical attitude towards his prospective employers that would make him a very rich man even if he stinks on ice. It could be interpreted (and I think this was the driving point of the article) as a player who takes a my-way-or-the-highway attitude. Someone who is perceived to need much coaching with regards to his mechanics and the nuances of the pro game as they differ from NCAA cannot have that attitude if he wants the big, big bucks on draft day. Not from a quarterback who has so many different responsibilites, both mentally and physically, in order to succeed in a team sport.

It differs from the NBA where acquiring Shaq instead of JAG at center immediately makes your team a force. Or from a position like RB where it's more power-speed-instinct than thinking & breaking down film.

ok sperm

i understand the article. i really didnt know the guy was a black man so i just went with it and had fun. if that guy was....ahhh you know what enough already.

i agree with you that VY is not helping himself and he may be immature. Im only saying that the article seems a little too over the top.

and i didnt mean "YOUR KIND" as if you are something ....i just meant an opposing voice. i really have no clue about what your into because i never remebered anything you have ever said politically.

so there.

[dickkotite]

riggs, thats a great tale.

maybe spermedwards will learn something from it............

That was a joke, sperm hahaheha

[Preston Howley III]

I just don't get this Posse thing. I don't have a posse. I don't know anybody who has a posse. If I had a posse, I wouldn't take them with me to a job interview. Maybe it's just semantics. Maybe posse is just ghetto for friends. Still, I wouldn't bring my friends to a job interview. Number one, I don't think that there presence could help me land the job. I would think that they would have just the opposite effect.

I know if I owned a company, and I scheduled somebody for a job interview, and they showed up with their posse, his resume would go right in the garbage can. First of all, obviously they must all be unemployed. Which tells me right off the bat, that everybody my prospect hangs around with is unemployed. Second of all, they must all really enjoy each other's company that they couldn't possibly think it appropriate otherwise that a a person going for a job interview, should go alone. I mean, if I hire this guy, obviously the posse will want to be with him while he's working, right? They just can't stand to not be with each other. What do they plan to do all day? Hang out in the lobby? The bathroom? The parking lot?

[Sperm Edwards]

I just don't get this Posse thing. I don't have a posse. I don't know anybody who has a posse. If I had a posse, I wouldn't take them with me to a job interview. Maybe it's just semantics. Maybe posse is just ghetto for friends. Still, I wouldn't bring my friends to a job interview. Number one, I don't think that there presence could help me land the job. I would think that they would have just the opposite effect.

I know if I owned a company, and I scheduled somebody for a job interview, and they showed up with their posse, his resume would go right in the garbage can. First of all, obviously they must all be unemployed. Which tells me right off the bat, that everybody my prospect hangs around with is unemployed. Second of all, they must all really enjoy each other's company that they couldn't possibly think it appropriate otherwise that a a person going for a job interview, should go alone. I mean, if I hire this guy, obviously the posse will want to be with him while he's working, right? They just can't stand to not be with each other. What do they plan to do all day? Hang out in the lobby? The bathroom? The parking lot?

too funny

[Bugg]

Some "posse" members might park in my spot or take coffee without paying into the coffee club or start gettng for keys on the sly to the clean washroom. You know-wher you can go to read the paper in peace for a contitutional?

I really don't get the posse thing at all. Look at any number of guys who have a posse like "Starbury". It's somewhere between immaturity, insecurity and plain stupidity. Don't these people have their own jobs, cars, houses, families, etc. or do they expect to hanga round VY all day? Even if you're pals with someone, I don't care where they work, who the hell wants to go to somebody else's job every day? Tickets to game is one thing. Following anybody, even an NFL QB, around like some Mitchell&Ness-dressed camp followers is pathetic.

[Preston Howley III]

Some "posse" members might park in my spot or take coffee without paying into the coffee club or start gettng for keys on the sly to the clean washroom. You know-wher you can go to read the paper in peace for a contitutional?

I really don't get the posse thing at all. Look at any number of guys who have a posse like "Starbury". It's somewhere between immaturity, insecurity and plain stupidity. Don't these people have their own jobs, cars, houses, families, etc. or do they expect to hanga round VY all day? Even if you're pals with someone, I don't care where they work, who the hell wants to go to somebody else's job every day? Tickets to game is one thing. Following anybody, even an NFL QB, around like some Mitchell&Ness-dressed camp followers is pathetic.

I can't wait to clean up the butts and the empties.

Yeah, I want to start every day off with the Posse on my porch.

[Preston Howley III]

Yeah, that's the ticket. I want to become a millionaire, so I can have a dozen unemployed losers hanging out in my driveway 24/7, pissing in the bushes and throwing their butts and empties on my lawn.

[Preston Howley III]

Correction, my neighbor's lawn.

[Bugg]

As much as anyone loves their friends and family, isn't it great when, after a bg day-Easter, Thanksgiving, Christmas- they've all effin' gone and the house is quiet and back in order? Who wants John Belushi and "The Guest Who Would Not LEave" sketch on 24/7?

As much as it cracks me up as a show, "Entourage" is such BS it's not funny.

"Hey, Turtle-get you fat pothead ass out of my house and go get a real job instead of leeching off me, okay?What kind of "business manager" walks around all day dressed like a freaking cabana boy in a Ralph Lauren catalogue?"

[serphnx]

As much as anyone loves their friends and family, isn't it great when, after a bg day-Easter, Thanksgiving, Christmas- they've all effin' gone and the house is quiet and back in order? Who wants John Belushi and "The Guest Who Would Not LEave" sketch on 24/7?

As much as it cracks me up as a show, "Entourage" is such BS it's not funny.

"Hey, Turtle-get you fat pothead ass out of my house and go get a real job instead of leeching off me, okay?What kind of "business manager" walks around all day dressed like a freaking cabana boy in a Ralph Lauren catalogue?"

For Vince Young, it's called a posse, for celebrities, it's called an "entourage". For political figures, it's just, what, security? I don't know. The point is, a lot of people have a group of people around them when they go to do things. It's actually the norm. In school, if you mostly travelled around alone to do things, you were a "loner", and it was a bad thing. But according to you guys, it's not a bad thing, it is the normal thing, and the opposite is "bad".

We should probably take VY with our pick, since everyone is attacking all these unrelated things instead of his football ability. That could mean his football ability is good enough that people can't really criticize it. It's like when politicians resort to mudslinging, you usually know to vote for the guy that isn't bothering with it.

[Bugg]

In school, yes.

As an adult, no.

And many of us don't like his delivery or the fact that whether he can read a defense or a playbook in the NFL is right now pretty doubtful. Pulling the ball down often and running isn't a good long-term plan for an NFL QB.

[Sperm Edwards]

For Vince Young, it's called a posse, for celebrities, it's called an "entourage". For political figures, it's just, what, security? I don't know. The point is, a lot of people have a group of people around them when they go to do things. It's actually the norm. In school, if you mostly travelled around alone to do things, you were a "loner", and it was a bad thing. But according to you guys, it's not a bad thing, it is the normal thing, and the opposite is "bad".

We should probably take VY with our pick, since everyone is attacking all these unrelated things instead of his football ability. That could mean his football ability is good enough that people can't really criticize it. It's like when politicians resort to mudslinging, you usually know to vote for the guy that isn't bothering with it.

Where have you been? Until this article came out yesterday, all criticism was about his wonderlic, his throwing motion, his taking snaps only from shotgun, and his if-the-first-read-is-covered-then-tuck-&-run style. In the pro's, those running lanes will be closed, as will those 15-yard wide passing tunnels he needs with his sidearm delivery.

[Preston Howley III]

The point is, a lot of people have a group of people around them when they go to do things. It's actually the norm.

Uh...no.

I've never gone to see a prospective employer with my posse in tow. That's not normal to bring your friends to a job interview.

[serphnx]

In school, yes.

As an adult, no.

Politicians and celebrities are adults that are also not in school.

It's surprising to me that people are making a big deal out of this. Hell, most people GET jobs in the first place through their friends, so obviously you have atleast one other person go with you.

If I ever become rich, I'd definitely hook up some friends with jobs. I don't see why it's such a big deal. His agent is a former criminal defense attorney I believe, he's not just some random guy off the street. Drew Rosenhaus had to start somewhere, he basically became an agent right out of undergrad. An attorney is a bit further along the chain in agent matters I'd think.