Geno’s Strong Finish: Cause for Optimism, or Fool’s Gold?

[Jetsfan80]

Yep.  The new rules are so advantageous to the QB that if they haven't shown you something in 2 years, you can safely cut bait.  Sanchez is making the same mistakes in Philly that he was in New York.  Geno will continue to make the same mistakes.  There are no Rich Gannon's anymore.  There's no reason to try to find yourself a "reclamation project".   Harbaugh is really the only one who has succeeded in doing that with Alex Smith, and STILL dumped him for another QB.  And Alex Smith is the anti-Geno:  He REFUSES to turn the ball over.  Yet you can tell the kid just never is going to take his team to the next level. 

[Jetsfan80]

Whatever man. I can wait for it to play itself out.  I don't profess to being some all knowing genius. A little humility goes a long way my friend.  Btw I am old enough to remember Terry Bradshaw; you remember him?  His first 3 seasons makes Geno look like Andrew Luck.  That is an exageration of course but he truly sucked. Good thing you weren't the GM for Pittsburgh.  Now before you or anyone else goes apesh*t and say I am comparing Geno to Bradshaw I am simply saying that two years for a young raw qb is not enough time and players CAN improve regardless of what you THINK you know.

 

The NFL is verrrrrry different than it was in the 1970's.  There was no salary cap so the Steelers were able to surround Bradshaw with what, 10 Pro Bowl caliber players?  It's insane how much help he had.  You just can't do that anymore. 

 

You can't get by with a "C" or worse QB anymore.  You need a guy who can elevate the play of his team.  Geno ain't it.  It's wise to move on a year two early rather than a year or 2 too late and thus prevent your window of being a contender close up on you quickly.

[AFJF]

Whatever man. I can wait for it to play itself out.  I don't profess to being some all knowing genius. A little humility goes a long way my friend.  Btw I am old enough to remember Terry Bradshaw; you remember him?  His first 3 seasons makes Geno look like Andrew Luck.  That is an exageration of course but he truly sucked. Good thing you weren't the GM for Pittsburgh.  Now before you or anyone else goes apesh*t and say I am comparing Geno to Bradshaw I am simply saying that two years for a young raw qb is not enough time and players CAN improve regardless of what you THINK you know.

 

Btw I find it truly hilarous that no matter what is presented, if it doesn't fit your argument you just dismiss it.  So the whole article is simply PR?  Why is PR necessary?  I mean who do they feel they have to sway?  Also I think you have it backwards, if Geno and Fitz are close, they may prefer to go with the young player with upside, instead of the journeyman.

 

It's tough to compare Geno to Bradshaw...it's hardly even the same game anymore.  Back then, 50% comp was alright..now if you're under 60% you're in serious trouble.

 

As far as the PR, it's what every team does.  When was the last time a team came out and commented on a player on the roster and said "we don't think this guy is gonna' be any good"?

 

Chip Kelly told the football world how much he loved DeShaun Jackson two years ago and said he wasn't going anywhere...released him less than two weeks later.

[Jetsfan80]

The other thing is, not only does this regime have no ties to Geno, the old one only spent a 2nd rounder on him.  He may have been the highest-rated QB in that class, but 32 teams passed on him in the 1st (including us) for good reason, it would seem.  He's just not good, and it's ok to admit it.  Hoping he'll turn the light switch on puts us in Sanchez territory again.  Luckily we didn't burn a top 5 pick on him and give him a contract extension.  He's basically another Kellen Clemens at this point. Time to move on.

[JetBlue]

The NFL is verrrrrry different than it was in the 1970's.  There was no salary cap so the Steelers were able to surround Bradshaw with what, 10 Pro Bowl caliber players?  It's insane how much help he had.  You just can't do that anymore. 

 

You can't get by with a "C" or worse QB anymore.  You need a guy who can elevate the play of his team.  Geno ain't it.  It's wise to move on a year two early rather than a year or 2 too late and thus prevent your window of being a contender close up on you quickly.

And they may just do exactly that... After they see FOR THEMSELVES and not make decisions based on just how he looked under the previous regime.  

[Jetsfan80]

And they may just do exactly that... After they see FOR THEMSELVES and not make decisions based on just how he looked under the previous regime.  

 

If this regime takes a close look at this guy, on tape and in practice, and determines he deserves to be the Week 1 starter (deserving starter, not a fill-in until Fitzpatrick gets healthy) we're in deep trouble.  It won't be a signal that Geno is ready to turn things around.  I'll be questioning their judgment.

[SouthernJet]

Whatever man. I can wait for it to play itself out.  I don't profess to being some all knowing genius. A little humility goes a long way my friend.  Btw I am old enough to remember Terry Bradshaw; you remember him?  His first 3 seasons makes Geno look like Andrew Luck.  That is an exageration of course but he truly sucked. Good thing you weren't the GM for Pittsburgh.  Now before you or anyone else goes apesh*t and say I am comparing Geno to Bradshaw I am simply saying that two years for a young raw qb is not enough time and players CAN improve regardless of what you THINK you know.

 

Btw I find it truly hilarous that no matter what is presented, if it doesn't fit your argument you just dismiss it.  So the whole article is simply PR?  Why is PR necessary?  I mean who do they feel they have to sway?  Also I think you have it backwards, if Geno and Fitz are close, they may prefer to go with the young player with upside, instead of the journeyman.

Bradshaw NEVER had issues with Progressions. That is what makes QBs good to great. You need to learn geno's issues more. 

Could he start if Fitz hurt/falters? Of course, but he will never be great cause you dont learn Progression reads in Pros, has to be carried over from college, then refined. 

The PR is IF Fitz or drafted QB falters they HAVE to start Geno, so they have to keep up his confidence. Really? You dont get that? I'd be thrilled if Geno was next Montana, just dont see it, Lowlowlow Football IQ of where players are on the field, a killer for QBs.

Agree to disagree.

[JetBlue]

It's tough to compare Geno to Bradshaw...it's hardly even the same game anymore.  Back then, 50% comp was alright..now if you're under 60% you're in serious trouble.

 

As far as the PR, it's what every team does.  When was the last time a team came out and commented on a player on the roster and said "we don't think this guy is gonna' be any good"?

 

Chip Kelly told the football world how much he loved DeShaun Jackson two years ago and said he wasn't going anywhere...released him less than two weeks later.

Of course we are talking about different eras but that doesn't change the fact the most Pittsburgh fans wanted to run Bradshaw out of town.   Just as Jet fans want to do with Geno.  That comparison is valid.

 

And by the way, I am not an idiot; I don't take everything I read at face value, but at the same time to DISMISS everything in the article as PR strikes me as disingenious.   It is in the Jets BEST INTEREST if they can make something out of Geno and they are not going to let the fans opinions determine what they do or don't do with Geno.  He will get a legit chance to compete for the job; why wouldn't he?  That just makes good sense; if sucks like everyone expects him to, then he will be the back up.    The idea that they should just cut there losses in advance and just cut him before seeing with Bowles and Gailey can do with him, is beyond stupid.  Not saying that is your view but it seems to be the view of many on this board.   

[JetBlue]

If this regime takes a close look at this guy, on tape and in practice, and determines he deserves to be the Week 1 starter (deserving starter, not a fill-in until Fitzpatrick gets healthy) we're in deep trouble.  It won't be a signal that Geno is ready to turn things around.  I'll be questioning their judgment.

Well get ready to start questioning..... maybe they will say to themselves; we can coach him up.  Lets see if we can't develop this kid to take full advantage of his tools.   Maybe Gailey, who is known for helping qbs excel can do the same with Geno.   

[AFJF]

Of course we are talking about different eras but that doesn't change the fact the most Pittsburgh fans wanted to run Bradshaw out of town.   Just as Jet fans want to do with Geno.  That comparison is valid.

 

And by the way, I am not an idiot; I don't take everything I read at face value, but at the same time to DISMISS everything in the article as PR strikes me as disingenious.   It is in the Jets BEST INTEREST if they can make something out of Geno and they are not going to let the fans opinions determine what they do or don't do with Geno.  He will get a legit chance to compete for the job; why wouldn't he?  That just makes good sense; if sucks like everyone expects him to, then he will be the back up.    The idea that they should just cut there losses in advance and just cut him before seeing with Bowles and Gailey can do with him, is beyond stupid.  Not saying that is your view but it seems to be the view of many on this board.   

 

Absolutely makes sense to give him a shot...young, still cheap with a rookie deal and what else do they have?  No harm in letting him give it a go..if he's anything close to what he's been through his first two seasons then he'll be replaced as soon as possible.

[SouthernJet]

Well get ready to start questioning..... 

if Geno plays lights out over Fitz AND hits 2nd/3rd WRs he starts. The 2nd option is where I see no chance since he has for 2 years shown he cant find WRs after primary covered. He has other skills for sure, but reading his progressions isnt one of them sadly.

[Jetsfan80]

Well get ready to start questioning.....

 

Fitzpatrick will be the Week 1 starter.  Why should we expect this regime to start Geno?

[JetBlue]

if Geno plays lights out over Fitz AND hits 2nd/3rd WRs he starts. The 2nd option is where I see no chance since he has for 2 years shown he cant find WRs after primary covered. He has other skills for sure, but reading his progressions isnt one of them sadly.

Hey I can't argue with you on this.  Even the article mentions he needs to improve in this area; the question is can he...

[SouthernJet]

Fitzpatrick will be the Week 1 starter.  Why should we expect this regime to start Geno?

IMO only of Fitz leg hasnt healed or if drafted QB pulls a Russ Wilson

[JetBlue]

Fitzpatrick will be the Week 1 starter.  Why should we expect this regime to start Geno?

I expect them the start who ever wins the qb competition and that will be decided on the field.  Why should we expect anything else?

[Jetsfan80]

I expect them the start who ever wins the qb competition and that will be decided on the field.  Why should we expect anything else?

 

Then it will be Fitzpatrick.  As I said, after watching tape and seeing how they practice there's zero doubt in my mind Fitzpatrick will win this competition.  If he does not then I immediately question the judgment of the front office and coaching staff.  Plain and simple.

[SouthernJet]

Hey I can't argue with you on this.  Even the article mentions he needs to improve in this area; the question is can he...

I dont see it, hope I am wrong. I have never seen  a QB learn progression reads as a Pro after Primary. Usually a college QB comes in with this and improves to where he hots 3rd/4th options. geno cant hit 2nd option after 2 years. One can hope

[flgreen]

So he is damned if he does and damned if he doesn't.   Dophins were still in playoff hunt if I remember correctly.   He and Decker had it going that day.   I have no reason to believe he can't repeat that performance especially now that he also has Marshall opposite Decker, along with Kerley plus Amaro and Cumberland  We also now have two smash mouth backs in Ridley and Ivory along with a true blocking TE in Davis.   If the offensive line can come together, I truly believe Geno can lead this team to the playoffs assuming he wins the job over Fitz and whomever else we have in camp.   Chan Gailey may be the most important signing of this off season if he can get Geno to become the quarterback he is capable of being. 

Sorry but you don't remember correctly.

 

The week before the Fish had a very promising season come crashing down.   Going into week 14 the Fish were in a very good position to make the playoffs with the hapless Jets being their week 17 foe.  They got blown out in back to back weeks by the Ravens and the Pats.  Going into week 16 they still had a chance, but needed a little help.  

 

They won a very emotional game in over time by blocking  a punt in the end zone, but were eliminated when the Steelers beat KC.  The elimination was so impactful on the team that some of the players actually took their personal gear home that week.  They came into the Jets game not giving a crap and sleep walked through the game.  Philbin should have been fired for the effort the team put in.   It was the perfect situation for Smith and Decker.  The Fish just didn't care

[JetBlue]

Absolutely makes sense to give him a shot...young, still cheap with a rookie deal and what else do they have?  No harm in letting him give it a go..if he's anything close to what he's been through his first two seasons then he'll be replaced as soon as possible.

Exactly.... 

[SouthernJet]

I expect them the start who ever wins the qb competition and that will be decided on the field.  Why should we expect anything else?

agree

[JetBlue]

Then it will be Fitzpatrick.  As I said, after watching tape and seeing how they practice there's zero doubt in my mind Fitzpatrick will win this competition.  If he does not then I immediately question the judgment of the front office and coaching staff.  Plain and simple.

So why even bother having a competition?  Lets just look at last years practice and watch tape and then pronounce Fitz the starter.  You aren't serious are you??

[Jetsfan80]

Suggesting Geno will "get his shot" over the Summer is not inaccurate, nor does it mean anything.  Who gets named Week 1 starter is all that matters in my eyes.  When it comes down to it, Geno will be on the bench. 

 

No team that put as much money into the roster as we did this offseason can afford to let Geno start meaningful games.  New regimes almost always mean new QB's.  Fitzpatrick has ties to both the GM and our veteran OC.  The incumbent in this situation does not have the upper hand at all.  The newcomer does.

[Jetsfan80]

So why even bother having a competition?  Lets just look at last years practice and watch tape and then pronounce Fitz the starter.  You aren't serious are you??

 

I'm saying this Summer Fitzpatrick, once healthy, will show he deserves the job.  You do realize there's a lot of practice time (plus preseason) between now and September, don't you?  Fitzpatrick will come out of that looking superior.  Read my post above.  Saying Geno will get "his chance" is both true and meaningless to the point I'm making. 

 

They won't let him make it onto the field in meaningful games to "prove himself".  Not a chance.  Fitzpatrick has every advantage in this competition.  Superior in skill, a veteran presence, and all the connections.  Geno has no shot of winning the job.

[SouthernJet]

So why even bother having a competition?  Lets just look at last years practice and watch tape and then pronounce Fitz the starter.  You aren't serious are you??

it will be on field,, only thing I wil l caution to u jetblue is Geno may lose job even if he looks a 'tad' better based on the factors talked about,,progressions, playbook knowledge and a Top5 defense can win without tons of mistakes/turnovers. he will have to REALLY outplay Fitz and QB we 100% will draft somewhere in draft.

[JetBlue]

Sorry but you don't remember correctly.

 

The week before the Fish had a very promising season come crashing down.   Going into week 14 the Fish were in a very good position to make the playoffs with the hapless Jets being their week 17 foe.  They got blown out in back to back weeks by the Ravens and the Pats.  Going into week 16 they still had a chance, but needed a little help.  

 

They won a very emotional game in over time by blocking  a punt in the end zone, but were eliminated when the Steelers beat KC.  The elimination was so impactful on the team that some of the players actually took their personal gear home that week.  They came into the Jets game not giving a crap and slept walked through the game.  Philbin should have been fired for the effort the team put in.   It was the perfect situation for Smith and Decker.  The Fish just didn't care

Sorry my bad. 

[JetBlue]

I'm saying this Summer Fitzpatrick, once healthy, will show he deserves the job.  You do realize there's a lot of practice time (plus preseason) between now and September, don't you?  Fitzpatrick will come out of that looking superior.  Read my post above.  Saying Geno will get "his chance" is both true and meaningless to the point I'm making.

yep that is why I am not declaring who will win until they actually get on the field. 

[JetBlue]

it will be on field,, only thing I wil l caution to u jetblue is Geno may lose job even if he looks a 'tad' better based on the factors talked about,,progressions, playbook knowledge and a Top5 defense can win without tons of mistakes/turnovers. he will have to REALLY outplay Fitz and QB we 100% will draft somewhere in draft.

True.  And by the way, I will have absolutely no problem if Fitz wins the job and will root like hell for him.   I am just interested to see if Geno does take that next step in his development as a qb; he can get better at reading defenses and going through his progressions. If he does so we might, just have something.  I know it's a long shot but what other choice do we have?   So even if Fitz wins the job, Geno could learn alot from watching from the sidelines which is what he should have been doing the last two years anyway.

[AFJF]

it will be on field,, only thing I wil l caution to u jetblue is Geno may lose job even if he looks a 'tad' better based on the factors talked about,,progressions, playbook knowledge and a Top5 defense can win without tons of mistakes/turnovers. he will have to REALLY outplay Fitz and QB we 100% will draft somewhere in draft.

 

Good point..don't forget Geno appeared to be much improved during preseason last year...a lot of folks (me included) thought he made significant strides.  Once bullets started flying he went back to being Genover.

[JetBlue]

I'm saying this Summer Fitzpatrick, once healthy, will show he deserves the job.  You do realize there's a lot of practice time (plus preseason) between now and September, don't you?  Fitzpatrick will come out of that looking superior.  Read my post above.  Saying Geno will get "his chance" is both true and meaningless to the point I'm making. 

 

They won't let him make it onto the field in meaningful games to "prove himself".  Not a chance.  Fitzpatrick has every advantage in this competition.  Superior in skill, a veteran presence, and all the connections.  Geno has no shot of winning the job.

 

If you say so... 

[SouthernJet]

True.  And by the way, I will have absolutely no problem if Fitz wins the job and will root like hell for him.   I am just interested to see if Geno does take that next step in his development as a qb; he can get better at reading defenses and going through his progressions. If he does so we might, just have something.  I know it's a long shot but what other choice do we have?   So even if Fitz wins the job, Geno could learn alot from watching from the sidelines which is what he should have been doing the last two years anyway.

My issues as u know is Progression reading, I just dont see how that improves..maybe Chan is Miracle worker, but progressions are usually a talent u come to Pros with. Even Sanchez knew progressions, his issue (as it 'sometimes, not always ' iis w/Geno) was inability to lead the WR so we get YAC.

jets havent had a 'leading the WR on a riute (or RB out of backfield) in awhile yto capitalize on YAC. damn, most of Jerry Rice's yards came from short routes that Montana/Young led him perfectly on and mucho YAC.

But I 1`00% hope if Geno has lights go on and is great I too will 100% back him. I just have lost confidence ONLY due ot the individual flaws which are hard after 3 years to fix. usually means its part of his game and not fizable. But we can hope and we may have him start if Fitz leg makes him unusable. No one knows if he can even come back. Open switch is why Jets will 100% draft a QB probably in 1st 3-4 rounds.My guess round 2 if the 3 through -5 rated Qbs are around in 2nd round.

[SouthernJet]

Good point..don't forget Geno appeared to be much improved during preseason last year...a lot of folks (me included) thought he made significant strides.  Once bullets started flying he went back to being Genover.

Ya ,thats why I put zero faith in last 4 games. It was like preseaosn for Jets pressure-wise and we faced some team sthat were playing backups and in some cases probably had players more worried about golf tee times and vacations at end of season AND (NEVER forget this when evaluating players at end of year when eliminated) NOT wanting to get hurt

[AFJF]

Ya ,thats why I put zero faith in last 4 games. It was like preseaosn for Jets pressure-wise and we faced some team sthat were playing backups and in some cases probably had players more worried about golf tee times and vacations at end of season AND (NEVER forget this when evaluating players at end of year when eliminated) NOT wanting to get hurt

 

Hard for me to ignore the numbers I posted earlier from Geno's first two seasons combined....

 

15 TD- 30 INT in weeks 1-12

 

10 TD 4 INT in weeks 13-17

[Jetsfan80]

Geno could learn alot from watching from the sidelines which is what he should have been doing the last two years anyway.

 

Too late for that.  You can't play 2 years in the NFL then take a year off to learn the game.  Either he can play or he can't. 

[Jetsfan80]

Hard for me to ignore the numbers I posted earlier from Geno's first two seasons combined....

 

15 TD- 30 INT in weeks 1-12

 

10 TD 4 INT in weeks 13-17

 

Perfect.  Just bench him Weeks 1-12 then unleash the beast the final 4.

[AFJF]

Perfect.  Just bench him Weeks 1-12 then unleash the beast the final 4.

 

LOL