Irish Jet Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 when it comes to weight that's basically the least of anyone's concerns on draft day. if a guy has speed, quick, explosion, aggression, pedigree, heart, motor, and everything else you want, his weight should be the least concerning aspect. don't forget, Amobi Okoye stepped on a scale in Mobile in Jan and it read 287, he showed up to the combine a month later at 312. weight can fluctuate for these players. in general the perfect 3-4 DE is an undersized 4-3 DT. for example Shaun Ellis was the same listed weight as Long. bottom line until Chris Long steps on a scale and it reads 280 he's not 280. Look I dont disagree with you but this is a D that just cannot afford to draft more undersized players. Look at the Pats, they are Huge up front, the steeler, the ravens and all the other great 3-4 D's are HUGE UP FRONT!!!! If we draft another guy who will make 1 big play a game while spending the majority getting pushed around I will kill myself!!! I'm not saying Long will be taht but at 280 pounds we can't afford to take that risk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 I don't see how you can say that. He's a lousy NT. At best, you can argue that some replacement MIGHT be worse. But the flip-side of that is we have another $7-8M to spend on defense elsewhere. Dewayne Robertson at NT is not the keystone that holds a good defense together. taking money out of the equation, almost any replacement that I know of on the market would be worse. He's not worth the cap space. Those dollars would be better spent elsewhere. DT is the hardest position to fill on a defense, it doesn't matter if you have high expectations that aren't being met, until the Jets get a better option they aren't going to just throw away Drob. Last year he was less than mediocre but not the worst thing I've ever seen as far as 3-4 NT's. This year he's much, much worse than that. He doesn't even draw double-teams. Even if he was BAD but still drew double-teams that would be something. He's bad & offenses don't need to commit more than 1 lineman to him. The second lineman he's supposed to occupy is engaging our linebackers. Drob gets doubled all the dang time. And if you don't want to believe me, fine, just watch the game. I see no reason to cut Pouha yet since he makes dick in salary & is under contract for one more year. Drob might be 'only decent' but Pouha is outright terrible. What needs to happen is get a young backup project to replace Pouha and hope he can replace Drob eventually. What shouldn't happen is cutting the good player, keeping the bad player and not replacing the starter. Have you ever watched Raji play (obviously before 2007)? I have not & wanted your opinion on him.. I really like BJ Raji as an NFL NT. He's got everything you are looking for, except he doesn't have a motor to be truly great. The guy has his priorities screwed up, there's no way any star player in any DI program gets academically suspended unless they miss a ton of class. It's not about being smart it's about committment and i'm not sure he has it. Also he's probably not going to be in this draft, because his stock has taken such a huge hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 I'm not saying Long will be taht but at 280 pounds we can't afford to take that risk. like i said until he gets on that scale and it reads 280, he isn't 280. alot of stuff can happen between now and the combine. and as for his arms - yes it is supposedly a weakness (again not measured yet) but if true, not a fatal flaw. the knowledge this guy has about the game cannot be found anywhere, he knows all the tricks his pops knows, it's uncanny how he can embarass pretty good players and make game changing plays all the time. the guy makes everyone on the defense better, heck everyone on his team better. He's a natural leader and an all around badass. put it another way in 05 i focused on Shawne Merriman and told everyone who would listen this guy was a stud. I had him 3rd on my overall rankings, no one else had him in their top 10. After watching UVA I feel the same about Chris Long. the guy is a stud. I don't care if he is a tweener or short arms or whatever. he's going to be a player in the league, the only question is for who... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 like i said until he gets on that scale and it reads 280, he isn't 280. alot of stuff can happen between now and the combine. and as for his arms - yes it is supposedly a weakness (again not measured yet) but if true, not a fatal flaw. the knowledge this guy has about the game cannot be found anywhere, he knows all the tricks his pops knows, it's uncanny how he can embarass pretty good players and make game changing plays all the time. the guy makes everyone on the defense better, heck everyone on his team better. He's a natural leader and an all around badass. put it another way in 05 i focused on Shawne Merriman and told everyone who would listen this guy was a stud. I had him 3rd on my overall rankings, no one else had him in their top 10. After watching UVA I feel the same about Chris Long. the guy is a stud. I don't care if he is a tweener or short arms or whatever. he's going to be a player in the league, the only question is for who... Can I just ask, where would you see him playing on this D, and how would the rest of the front 7 look with him in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceman88 Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 Can I just ask, where would you see him playing on this D, and how would the rest of the front 7 look with him in it. He has the frame to bulk up, him and Coleman would be the starting DEs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 He has the frame to bulk up, him and Coleman would be the starting DEs. IMO he would get manhandled there unless like you say he really bulked up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceman88 Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 IMO he would get manhandled there unless like you say he really bulked up. Also as Bitonti said there is no way he's only 280. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 Also as Bitonti said there is no way he's only 280. Even so, watching him play, he doesnt look like a Richard Seymour type player which is what we really need in that position. We need a player who will dominate the LOS from start to finish. i'm not sure Long ahs the power to do that vs NFL O-lineman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceman88 Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 Even so, watching him play, he doesnt look like a Richard Seymour type player which is what we really need in that position. We need a player who will dominate the LOS from start to finish. i'm not sure Long ahs the power to do that vs NFL O-lineman. I think he does, and I think he will dominate everyone in his way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted November 10, 2007 Share Posted November 10, 2007 I think he does, and I think he will dominate everyone in his way. Thats were our opinions differ and in fairness its almost impossible to judge from watching him. Going up against College OL's and NFL OL's are 2 totally different tasks. I personally think he would be more suited to OLB, he's kind of similar physically to Shawne Merriman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damaged89 Posted November 10, 2007 Share Posted November 10, 2007 I like Long. He has something like 11 sacks as a 3-4 DE which is absurd. However, if it comes out that he can't bulk up to around the 295-300 range I don't think we should take him. I have had it with undersized linemen. We might be able to get Tyson Jackson (6'5 295) in the second. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irish Jet Posted November 10, 2007 Share Posted November 10, 2007 I like Long. He has something like 11 sacks as a 3-4 DE which is absurd. However, if it comes out that he can't bulk up to around the 295-300 range I don't think we should take him. I have had it with undersized linemen. We might be able to get Tyson Jackson (6'5 295) in the second. Thats pretty much exactly how I feel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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