Selig can reverse the Joyce call and make it right

[faba]

MLB Considers Reversing Ump's Imperfect Call

Umpire Jim Joyce Apologizes Profusely After Reviewing Play

NEW YORK (AP) ―

Major League Baseball was still deciding Thursday morning whether to review the umpire's blown call that cost Armando Galarraga a perfect game.

Commissioner Bud Selig has the power to reverse umpire Jim Joyce's missed call that came with two outs in the ninth inning Wednesday night in Detroit. Joyce ruled Cleveland's Jason Donald safe, then admitted he got it wrong.

Selig would likely consult with his top advisers before making such a ruling. St. Louis Cardinals manager Tony La Russa says the call should be overturned.

Tigers manager Jim Leyland said MLB gave Joyce the option to not work Thursday's game between Detroit and Cleveland, but Joyce chose to stick with his job behind the plate. Leyland added that Galarraga would present the lineup card and shake hands with Joyce at home plate before the afternoon game.

In 1991, a panel headed by then-commissioner Fay Vincent took a look at the record book and decided to throw out 50 no-hitters for various reasons.

The instantly infamous play, which had social networking sites all abuzz, will add to the argument that baseball needs to expand its use of replays. As of now, they can be used only for questionable home runs.

Galarraga bitterly sipped a beer minutes after the blown call negated his place in baseball history. An apology and hug changed his attitude.

Joyce, in tears, asked for a chance to apologize after the Tigers beat the Indians 3-0.

"You don't see an umpire after the game come out and say, `Hey, let me tell you I'm sorry,"' Galarraga said "He felt really bad. He didn't even shower."

Galarraga, who was barely known outside of Detroit a day ago, and Joyce, whose career had flourished in relative anonymity, quickly became trending topics on Twitter. At least one anti-Joyce Facebook page was created shortly after the game ended and firejimjoyce.com was launched.

"I worked with Don Denkinger, and I know what he went through, but I've never had a moment like this," Joyce said.

Denkinger didn't have to deal with the wrath of fans on Twitter or Facebook. Denkinger helped tilt the 1985 World Series by blowing a call as a first base umpire, and that followed him throughout his career.

Joyce has been calling balls and strikes and deciding if runners are out or safe as a full-time major league umpire since 1989. He has been respected enough to be on the field for two World Series, 11 other playoff series and a pair of All-Star games.

A split-second decision he made will probably haunt him for the rest of his career.

Joyce emphatically signaled safe when Cleveland's Jason Donald clearly didn't beat a throw to first base for what would've been the last out in Armando Galarraga's perfect game for the Detroit Tigers, setting off a chorus of groans and boos that echoed in Comerica Park.

Chuck Klonke, the official scorer Wednesday night with nearly three decades of experience, said he would not change the disputed play to an error from a hit to give Galarraga a no-hitter.

"I looked at the replay right after it happened, and Miguel Cabrera made a good throw and Galarraga didn't miss the bag so you couldn't do anything but call it a hit," Klonke said Thursday morning. "I watched the replay from the center-field camera, which some people thought showed Galarraga might've bobbled the ball, and I didn't see it that way at all. I have 24 hours to change a call, but I wouldn't consider it.

"End of story."

Not quite.

The story has transcended sports, becoming a topic on NBC's "Today" show Thursday morning and among parents dropping off their kids at the bus stop.

It's rare for an umpire to acknowledge a mistake in one of the few sports that relies heavily on the human eye, but Joyce did to reporters and later to Galarraga.

"It was the biggest call of my career, and I kicked the (stuff) out of it," Joyce said, looking and sounding distraught as he paced in the umpires' locker room. "I just cost that kid a perfect game."

[greenerdaze]

Poor guy simply fuct up at the wrong time.

If correcting the call puts Joyce and the rest of the world at peace, then what's left to debate? Other blown calls of equal magnitude in MLB history?

Let this game be the beginning of a new policy.

[AFJF]

Selig is a complete and total failure. He's said there will be no change to the call. Worst commish in pro sports. By a LOT!

[Thai Jet]

Selig is a complete and total failure. He's said there will be no change to the call. Worst commish in pro sports. By a LOT!

Total failure.

[PFSIKH]

Selig is a complete and total failure. He's said there will be no change to the call. Worst commish in pro sports. By a LOT!

While the latter a part of your statement rings of truth, I have no problem with him leaving the call as is.

He could set a bad precedent. That it happened on the 27th out is a bit of bad luck for MLB. What happens if the call happened on the 10th out? 17th? 25th? While it is a cut and dry solution in this instance, it will not be the next time.

Are you going to replay from that mistake? What happens when the pitcher that threw a one hitter and won, but missed a perfect game due to umpire error loses in the replay?

It sucks for Galaraga, but where do you draw the line? Going to do the same for a mere no-hitter? Why don't they replay the 96 playoffs from the fan interference play? What if a player misses a record due to umpire error?

He did the right thing. The circumstances cloud the issue at hand. Doing that would open a can of worms that will not be easy or possible to close. Hopefully, this ushers in a replay system that can overturn a bad call so it can be over turned in the heat of the moment.

[greenerdaze]

Are you going to replay from that mistake? What happens when the pitcher that threw a one hitter and won, but missed a perfect game due to umpire error loses in the replay?

Huh?

It sucks for Galaraga, but where do you draw the line? Going to do the same for a mere no-hitter? Why don't they replay the 96 playoffs from the fan interference play? What if a player misses a record due to umpire error?

What's wrong with examining each case individually and acting accordingly? Why use video playback for questionable HRs or fair/foul balls in routine games, but not for calls on runners in games with special circumstances such as this one?

It's really not that hard. The circumstances are self-explanatory to anyone familiar with the game.

[PFSIKH]

Huh?

What's wrong with examining each case individually and acting accordingly? Why use video playback for questionable HRs or fair/foul balls in routine games, but not for calls on runners in games with special circumstances such as this one?

It's really not that hard. The circumstances are self-explanatory to anyone familiar with the game.

First, if Selig came out and overturned the call and said this is the only time we are going to do it because it was so cut and dry I would have no problem given the kid his due.

The problem with examining every case is it where do you draw the line? Only perfect games? At what out does it benefit benefit 'in the best interest of baseball"? What about 'normal' no-hitters? What about the run of the mill horrible calls? Or a hitter going for a record?

In the 134 years of calls there have been millions of bad calls. I am all for instant replay and an expanded replay over turning bad calls like that. However, Galaraga still won and when you open pandora's box it is a bitch to close.

Maybe the Cardinals want to replay the 85 World Series? The Orioles the 96 series against the Yanks?

[greenerdaze]

First, if Selig came out and overturned the call and said this is the only time we are going to do it because it was so cut and dry I would have no problem given the kid his due.

The problem with examining every case is it where do you draw the line? Only perfect games? At what out does it benefit benefit 'in the best interest of baseball"? What about 'normal' no-hitters? What about the run of the mill horrible calls? Or a hitter going for a record?

In the 134 years of calls there have been millions of bad calls. I am all for instant replay and an expanded replay over turning bad calls like that. However, Galaraga still won and when you open pandora's box it is a bitch to close.

Maybe the Cardinals want to replay the 85 World Series? The Orioles the 96 series against the Yanks?

What happened in the past stays in the past. There's a first time for every new rule. Let this game be the beginning and the cause of a new video playback policy.

To answer your question about where to draw the line: use replay when the call in question has a clear and immediate (not just potential) impact on the game. Like they already do for uncertain HRs. In Galarraga's case, the call had profound consequences and getting it wrong had devastating results. It was the appropriate time to view replay and get it right. All the umps mucked it up, not just Joyce, so Selig should've fixed it.

Frankly, I'd use replay to overturn all sucky calls. In all sports.

[Mentos]

Maybe the Cardinals want to replay the 85 World Series?

Let's not use that example. The bum call was in Game 6. The Cardinals had a chance to overcome it by winning Game 7. They lost 11-0, fu-- them and their complaint.

[NIGHT STALKER]

What happened in the past stays in the past. There's a first time for every new rule. Let this game be the beginning and the cause of a new video playback policy.

To answer your question about where to draw the line: use replay when the call in question has a clear and immediate (not just potential) impact on the game. Like they already do for uncertain HRs. In Galarraga's case, the call had profound consequences and getting it wrong had devastating results. It was the appropriate time to view replay and get it right. All the umps mucked it up, not just Joyce, so Selig should've fixed it.

Frankly, I'd use replay to overturn all sucky calls. In all sports.

I have to disagree. The game is about winning and losing. The call only impacted whether it would have been a perfect game or not. Tigers still won the game. Now, if the following batter that comes up after the blown call hits a HR, then I would have to agree with replay or perhaps even reversing this particular gaff.

[greenerdaze]

I have to disagree. The game is about winning and losing. The call only impacted whether it would have been a perfect game or not. Tigers still won the game. Now, if the following batter that comes up after the blown call hits a HR, then I would have to agree with replay or perhaps even reversing this particular gaff.

Then you'd be doing injustice to the guy who hit the homer. In reality, the very next batter grounded out and ended the game. It was much less damaging to reverse than erasing a homerun. IMO.

[PFSIKH]

What happened in the past stays in the past. There's a first time for every new rule. Let this game be the beginning and the cause of a new video playback policy.

To answer your question about where to draw the line: use replay when the call in question has a clear and immediate (not just potential) impact on the game. Like they already do for uncertain HRs. In Galarraga's case, the call had profound consequences and getting it wrong had devastating results. It was the appropriate time to view replay and get it right. All the umps mucked it up, not just Joyce, so Selig should've fixed it.

Frankly, I'd use replay to overturn all sucky calls. In all sports.

No it did not.

As NSDQ pointed out, the game was still won by Detroit.

As I said in this thread or the other one about the subject and you mentioned above, hopefully this will usher in a meaningful replay for MLB.

[greenerdaze]

No it did not.

As NSDQ pointed out, the game was still won by Detroit.

As I said in this thread or the other one about the subject and you mentioned above, hopefully this will usher in a meaningful replay for MLB.

You can take a distant perspective and say W's and L's are all that matter.

That's easy for you to say, but the kid may never come close to another perfect game in his career, and that one bad call will prove to be profoundly devastating. Maybe not to you, of course.

[PFSIKH]

You can take a distant perspective and say W's and L's are all that matter.

That's easy for you to say, but the kid may never come close to another perfect game in his career, and that one bad call will prove to be profoundly devastating. Maybe not to you, of course.

There is no crying in baseball.

If this kid is going to become a quivering mass of goo over a bad call, he is not going to amount to a steaming pile of poo in MLB.

He is going to face bad calls, fielding errors, and a litany of things he cannot control. His true mettle will be discovered when he overcomes these plays.

[Mentos]

There is no crying in baseball.

Tell that to Jim Joyce.

[PFSIKH]

Tell that to Jim Joyce.

Well played....I guess there is always an exception. Of course he is a welcome change from the behavior of most umps.

[Mentos]

Well played....I guess there is always an exception. Of course he is a welcome change from the behavior of most umps.

yes, at least there is that

imagine if it was joe west who botched the call?

[NIGHT STALKER]

yes, at least there is that

imagine if it was joe west who botched the call?

Joe West would have recorded a song and made a lot of money from it.

[greenerdaze]

On Armando Galarraga being denied a special place in MLB history:

There is no crying in baseball.

If this kid is going to become a quivering mass of goo over a bad call, he is not going to amount to a steaming pile of poo in MLB.

On umpire Jim Joyce crying after his admittedly blown call:

...there is always an exception. Of course he is a welcome change from the behavior of most umps.

Speaking of a steaming pile of poo, you sure are full of it as you talk from both sides of your mouth.

The umpire cried. WTF? And if the pitcher was Selig's kid, the call would've been reversed by now. You'd do the same.

Just sayin'.

[PFSIKH]

On Armando Galarraga being denied a special place in MLB history:

On umpire Jim Joyce crying after his admittedly blown call:

Speaking of a steaming pile of poo, you sure are full of it as you talk from both sides of your mouth.

The umpire cried. WTF? And if the pitcher was Selig's kid, the call would've been reversed by now. You'd do the same.

Just sayin'.

I was talking about your crying.

I do not care either way.

If Selig decided to turn over the play, I would have been cool with it.

Just as I am cool with them keeping the play as called.

I am only saying I understand his line of thinking. I just do not see getting your panties in a bind over it.

[greenerdaze]

I was talking about your crying.

You should change your moniker to PFSISH, for "Spin Hell."

[PFSIKH]

You should change your moniker to PFSISH, for "Spin Hell."

No, I was not.

You were making him out to be a violated choir boy.