Sperm Edwards Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 The Jets would be in much better shape as a franchise if they had won a few less games, or as many games as they should've considering that they were outscored by 100 points last year. Maybe they could get an elite WR in the draft. The Jets would be in even better shape as a franchise winning 7 games this year than winning 9, no? I mean, we're not winning the SB either way, and your way we will allegedly win a couple more games but still not be good enough. And all we'll have to show for it is a lower draft pick. So this strategy being employed is bad because we're going to be worse this year, even though a superbowl this season is unrealistic no matter what. But if the strategy is abandoned, and we win a few more games but still aren't good enough, then it's also bad. Basically, everything is bad. No matter what we do it'll be bad until the QB fairy farts out an average-or-better passer who can at least be a reliable game-manager with some upside here & there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbanmadmike1 Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 The Jets would be in even better shape as a franchise winning 7 games this year than winning 9, no? I mean, we're not winning the SB either way, and your way we will allegedly win a couple more games but still not be good enough. And all we'll have to show for it is a lower draft pick. So this strategy being employed is bad because we're going to be worse this year, even though a superbowl this season is unrealistic no matter what. But if the strategy is abandoned, and we win a few more games but still aren't good enough, then it's also bad. Basically, everything is bad. No matter what we do it'll be bad until the QB fairy farts out an average-or-better passer who can at least be a reliable game-manager with some upside here & there. There is a difference between being a super bowl team and a 10 win competitive team that doesn't embarrass itself like it did last season about 7 times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 Do you really think that Kyle Wilson is a league average starting outside CB or are you just arguing for the sake of it? i'm sure it's the latter. He probably isn't far off. He improved as a slot corner over the prior year. It's not unfathomable that he would have improved outside as well if that's where he lined up. I think it would be better, if we know he's a decent slot corner, to keep him where we know he's a positive. I think the team thinks this as well. I also think the league average corner is worse than you think. And I have my doubts that we'd be talking about Verner Island if that's who we brought in to start outside opposite Milliner. And I know you're arguing for the sake of it, going back to your inconsistent complaints regarding both Wilson and Howard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 There is a difference between being a super bowl team and a 10 win competitive team that doesn't embarrass itself like it did last season about 7 times. Oh for **** sake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbanmadmike1 Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 He probably isn't far off. He improved as a slot corner over the prior year. It's not unfathomable that he would have improved outside as well if that's where he lined up. I think it would be better, if we know he's a decent slot corner, to keep him where we know he's a positive. I think the team thinks this as well. I also think the league average corner is worse than you think. And I have my doubts that we'd be talking about Verner Island if that's who we brought in to start outside opposite Milliner. And I know you're arguing for the sake of it, going back to your inconsistent complaints regarding both Wilson and Howard. Verner is 25 years old and getting better every season there is not one person on this board who would've had one bad word to say about that signing. The same goes for Jerius Byrd who was a no brainier for the Jets to sign. Instead we're getting Dimitri Patterson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 Did you see them get blown off the field in half the games last season? If you want to view everything with green glasses and think that they didn't get gifted 2 games with penalties and get 3 wins in meaningless games vs bad teams in dec, good for you. That isn't reality. Just going to say this outright, anyone who uses the bold thinking it's actually a legitimate argument for their little agendas is completely clueless and understands nothing about football. If you'd like to debate this further, you can start off by sharing all of the reasons why you're making these claims, while not (1) specifically supporting how this is allegedly the case within the overall scope of the entire game, (2) citing any instances where significant calls went against the Jets, or (3) coming up with a similar evaluation for all 256 games in the NFL season for the other 31 teams in the NFL to show why the Jets were allegedly the lone exception. When you're done with that, I can feel free to let you know why you're still wrong. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbanmadmike1 Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 Oh for **** sake. I guess you slept though those games... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbanmadmike1 Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 Just going to say this outright, anyone who uses the bold thinking it's actually a legitimate argument for their little agendas is completely clueless and understands nothing about football. If you'd like to debate this further, you can start off by sharing all of the reasons why you're making these claims, while not (1) specifically supporting how this is allegedly the case within the overall scope of the entire game, (2) citing any instances where significant calls went against the Jets, or (3) coming up with a similar evaluation for all 256 games in the NFL season for the other 31 teams in the NFL to show why the Jets were allegedly the lone exception. When you're done with that, I can feel free to let you know why you're still wrong. Thanks. You've already agreed with me that 8-8 isn't a true representation of how good the roster was last season. You know there IS such a thing as over or underpreforming your roster quality right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 There is a difference between being a super bowl team and a 10 win competitive team that doesn't embarrass itself like it did last season about 7 times. You get embarrassed personally when a rebuilding team - one that had only barely begun rebuilding - gets beaten? You should grow a pair of balls. Get your shoulders fixed so you can learn to shrug them when a gutted team struggles the year they were gutted. Losing is losing, and your point was that after the season ended, for the draft the following season it ended the same whether we won 6 or 8 or 10 games. The only difference is with the latter we'd have a worse draft pick, and that makes it that much harder to improve further. Also I didn't count 7 times the team embarrassed itself. As lacking as the team was in multiple areas, if Geno Smith wasn't inserted well before he was ready, and was merely ok all season long, that number would have been pretty low. But that's what happens when you put an unready QB on the field for 16 starts, and while it would have been better if he had decent receivers, he still probably would have sucked on balance anyway. He'll either improve as a QB or he won't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 There is a difference between being a super bowl team and a 10 win competitive team that doesn't embarrass itself like it did last season about 7 times. This is true. But equally unfortunate is the fact that there's no evidence to support the idea that signing high priced free agents turn you into the kind of team you're aiming for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 Verner is 25 years old and getting better every season there is not one person on this board who would've had one bad word to say about that signing. The same goes for Jerius Byrd who was a no brainier for the Jets to sign. Instead we're getting Dimitri Patterson. Oh, I can think of one or two that might have had something to say about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbanmadmike1 Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 This is true. But equally unfortunate is the fact that there's no evidence to support the idea that signing high priced free agents turn you into the kind of team you're aiming for. There is no evidence to support that adding good players makes your team better? You get embarrassed personally when a rebuilding team - one that had only barely begun rebuilding - gets beaten? You should grow a pair of balls. Get your shoulders fixed so you can learn to shrug them when a gutted team struggles the year they were gutted. Losing is losing, and your point was that after the season ended, for the draft the following season it ended the same whether we won 6 or 8 or 10 games. The only difference is with the latter we'd have a worse draft pick, and that makes it that much harder to improve further. Also I didn't count 7 times the team embarrassed itself. As lacking as the team was in multiple areas, if Geno Smith wasn't inserted well before he was ready, and was merely ok all season long, that number would have been pretty low. But that's what happens when you put an unready QB on the field for 16 starts, and while it would have been better if he had decent receivers, he still probably would have sucked on balance anyway. He'll either improve as a QB or he won't. It was much more than just Smith. You know that. The Skill players were clearly the worst group in the NFL, The OL was mediocre. The secondary was probably bottom 5 in the NFL and the LBs were mediocre at best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 Oh, I can think of one or two that might have had something to say about it. I like that 9M a year for a safety is a "no-brainer." It is, just not in the way he thinks it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 This is true. But equally unfortunate is the fact that there's no evidence to support the idea that signing high priced free agents turn you into the kind of team you're aiming for. Just ask the Buffalo Bills. They've been offseason champs like 8 times in the last 12 years and haven't made the playoffs once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 There is no evidence to support that adding good players makes your team better? There is no evidence that adding multiple big name free agents to a team that isn't "8-8 quality" leads to super bowl contention. Nice effort on the myopic spin though. How many wins did adding Revis give the Bucs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 Just ask the Buffalo Bills. They've been offseason champs like 8 times in the last 12 years and haven't made the playoffs once. But dat Super Mario... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbanmadmike1 Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 I like that 9M a year for a safety is a "no-brainer." It is, just not in the way he thinks it is. *For the at worst the best safety in the AFC at a position the jets have literally no one to play right now and 40 million in cap room. BTW Ian Rapoport ✔ @RapSheet Follow Wondered how #Saints could fit Jairus Byrd into their cap. With an $11M signing bonus over 5 years, cap hit should be around $4M in year 1 1:16 AM - 12 Mar 2014 For the best safety this side of Earl Thomas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 *For the at worst the best safety in the AFC at a position the jets have literally no one to play right now and 40 million in cap room. How many Super Bowls did he win in Buffalo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 Verner is 25 years old and getting better every season there is not one person on this board who would've had one bad word to say about that signing. The same goes for Jerius Byrd who was a no brainier for the Jets to sign. Instead we're getting Dimitri Patterson. So Verner is getting better every season but anyone we have is hopeless. Unless we didn't re-sign them, then they're also going to get better. You realize this is exactly what you sound like, right? This is me doing a madmike impersonation, upon the Jets outbidding Tampa for Verner, to the tune of $7.5M/year (what it would take for Verner to exceed the take-home money he'll make with Tampa): What the hell is THIS crap??? There is ZERO reason. ZERO, to believe that Verner could man up on a team's #1 WR every game. We NEEDED a #1 CORNER. Idzik is a F*CKING JOKE!!1!. He FINALLY spends money and he does it by overpaying for a player who doesn't even fit?!?!?!? Watch, now we're going to pass up on a STUD in this year's draft or next year's draft. Or BOTH. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 You've already agreed with me that 8-8 isn't a true representation of how good the roster was last season. You know there IS such a thing as over or underpreforming your roster quality right? I don't think that was me, but regardless, that's not my point. If you don't like the current state of the team that's fine, if you don't like the moves that's your prerogative, but your arguments have been beyond the points of extreme. In one breath your admonishing the team for not re-signing their "impact player" of a RT and then in the next criticizing the team for replacing him, for significantly less money, with what you concede to be a lateral move. Then you're talking about the clear regression of a unit that last a grand total of one starter, who was awful last year, while dismissing the potential improvement of 6 starters who have 3 years or less experience. Now you're trying to make excuses why wins they did get last year don't count. For crying out loud, the Jets/Pats game would've been a Jets' win in regulation if not for the officiating (see: Hill's game-winning TD which was called back due to non-existent offensive PI). You're really going to trying to sell that as a win being "gifted" to the Jets, because later that game the Pats were called for a penalty they actually committed for the second time, which they were not called on the first time and warned by the officials about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbanmadmike1 Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 So Verner is getting better every season but anyone we have is hopeless. Unless we didn't re-sign them, then they're also going to get better. You realize this is exactly what you sound like, right? This is me doing madmike impersonation, upon the Jets outbidding Tampa for Verner, to the tune of $7.5M/year (what it would take for Verner to exceed the take-home money he'll make with Tampa): What the hell is THIS crap??? There is ZERO reason. ZERO, to believe that Verner could man up on a team's #1 WR every game. We NEEDED a #1 CORNER. Idzik is a F*CKING JOKE!!1!. He FINALLY spends money and he does it by overpaying for a player who doesn't even fit?!?!?!? Watch, now we're going to pass up on a STUD in this year's draft or next year's draft. Or BOTH. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!! Why would you waste your time with a foolish post like this? Seriously. If the jets had been adding building blocks like Verner this offseason I would have an entirely different tone and you know it. instead you're using me as a straw man to defend this GM who has done literally nothing to improve the team since he's been here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 Why would you waste your time with a foolish post like this? Seriously. If the jets had been adding building blocks like Verner this offseason I would have an entirely different tone and you know it. instead you're using me as a straw man to defend this GM who has done literally nothing to improve the team since he's been here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 How many Super Bowls did he win in Buffalo? Must be thousands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbanmadmike1 Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 How many Super Bowls did he win in Buffalo? What exactly is your argument here? That Byrd isn't a great player? If so LMAO., That if you haven't won a super bowl you can't be a great player? if so LMAO. What the hell are you talking about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 I don't think that was me, but regardless, that's not my point. If you don't like the current state of the team that's fine, if you don't like the moves that's your prerogative, but your arguments have been beyond the points of extreme. In one breath your admonishing the team for not re-signing their "impact player" of a RT and then in the next criticizing the team for replacing him, for significantly less money, with what you concede to be a lateral move. Then you're talking about the clear regression of a unit that last a grand total of one starter, who was awful last year, while dismissing the potential improvement of 6 starters who have 3 years or less experience. Now you're trying to make excuses why wins they did get last year don't count. For crying out loud, the Jets/Pats game would've been a Jets' win in regulation if not for the officiating (see: Hill's game-winning TD which was called back due to non-existent offensive PI). You're really going to trying to sell that as a win being "gifted" to the Jets, because later that game the Pats were called for a penalty they actually committed for the second time, which they were not called on the first time and warned by the officials about? Oh, and I almost forgot. You also tried to blame the failure of the entire 2011 season solely on Kyle Wilson due to one play that saw two other defenders whiff on tackles (including the guy Wilson allegedly cannot replace). This in a game that the Jets lost by 15 points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 Why would you waste your time with a foolish post like this? Seriously. If the jets had been adding building blocks like Verner this offseason I would have an entirely different tone and you know it. instead you're using me as a straw man to defend this GM who has done literally nothing to improve the team since he's been here. Bullsh*t. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 What exactly is your argument here? That Byrd isn't a great player? If so LMAO., That if you haven't won a super bowl you can't be a great player? if so LMAO. What the hell are you talking about? 1) That a great safety isn't worth 9M a year. Guess you missed that one. 2) That a great safety doesn't take a team you described as "not 8-8 quality" to the super bowl. Guess you missed that one too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 There is no evidence that adding multiple big name free agents to a team that isn't "8-8 quality" leads to super bowl contention. Nice effort on the myopic spin though. How many wins did adding Revis give the Bucs? I read on here that Revis is single-handedly responsible for a minimum of two wins per season, so it must be true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbanmadmike1 Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 1) That a great safety isn't worth 9M a year. Guess you missed that one. 2) That a great safety doesn't take a team you described as "not 8-8 quality" to the super bowl. Guess you missed that one too. Show me one post where I said the jets are one or two players away from the super bowl? This is about improving the roster. Also he counts 4M on the cap this year for the siants. 4 MILLION. not 9. 4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 *For the at worst the best safety in the AFC at a position the jets have literally no one to play right now and 40 million in cap room. BTW Ian Rapoport ✔ @RapSheet Follow Wondered how #Saints could fit Jairus Byrd into their cap. With an $11M signing bonus over 5 years, cap hit should be around $4M in year 1 1:16 AM - 12 Mar 2014 For the best safety this side of Earl Thomas. I guess you skipped year 2 when his cap number balloons to 10.5M Or year 3 when it plummets down to 9.7M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 Show me one post where I said the jets are one or two players away from the super bowl? This is about improving the roster. Also he counts 4M on the cap this year for the siants. 4 MILLION. not 9. 4. See above. If we're not a contender this year, than the 4M cap number isn't nearly as important as the 10.5M the year after. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 I guess you skipped year 2 when his cap number balloons to 10.5M Or year 3 when it plummets down to 9.7M. The cap limit is going up $30M a year, you fewl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 See above. If we're not a contender this year, than the 4M cap number isn't nearly as important as the 10.5M the year after. NO ALL THAT MATTERS IS 2014. I LACK THE CAPACITY TO UNDERSTAND THE LONG TERM IMPLICATIONS OF SPENDING TOO MUCH MONEY NOW TO SATISFY A FICKLE FANBASE AND MORONIC PRESS CORPS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 The cap limit is going up $30M a year, you fewl. Impact players for everyone!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted March 31, 2014 Share Posted March 31, 2014 Outside of signing drew brees, who plays QB, which makes for a totally different argument, when has this strategy EVER worked? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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