Jets offer Holmes contract

[Klecko73isGod]

500 yards per year ? Really ? Santonio had 1 very good year the rest was pure Jag. Even in his best stat year he only produced 5 TD's and was not even the best reciever on his team Hines Ward was and has his share of huge plays for the steelers

They've both played 5 seasons, Holmes has 4581 yards, Moore has 2156 yards.

4581-2156=2425

2425/5=485

This is simple math.

He also averages nearly five more yards per catch. Holmes is on an entirely different level than Lance Moore and you know who would probably be the first person to tell you this? Lance Moore.

[Smashmouth]

They've both played 5 seasons, Holmes has 4581 yards, Moore has 2156 yards.

4581-2156=2425

2425/5=485

This is simple math.

He also averages nearly five more yards per catch. Holmes is on an entirely different level than Lance Moore and you know who would probably be the first person to tell you this? Lance Moore.

Moore did not break out until season 3 and season 4 he got hurt so its not simple math compare the two best seasons by both players .

[Klecko73isGod]

Moore did not break out until season 3 and season 4 he got hurt so its not simple math compare the two best seasons by both players .

That's an extraordinarily arbitrary way to compare players, especially considering how you were going on and on yesterday about how Moore was the better all-around and more consistent receiver.

A simple look at their career stats refutes that so now you are basing your entire assessment on their best single year?

OK, I'll play along.

Moore: 2008: 79 catches for 978 yards, 11.7 YPC, 10 TD.

Holmes: 2009: 79 catches for 1248 yards, 15.8 YPC, 5 TD.

So they had the same number of catches, while Holmes averaged an 4.1 more yards per catch, which is huge, and Moore had twice as many TDs.

Still looks like Holmes is the better player to me. Moore may have caught more TDs, but Holmes moved his team significantly closer to a score with every single catch he made.

Lets give these numbers some perspective now, shall we?

Moore played on an 8-8 team in '08 and was the #3 WR on his team. So while Colston and Meacham got significantly more attention in the red zone, Moore likely drew single coverage 95% of the time.

Santonio played on the 10-6 defending Super Bowl Champion and was his team's number 2 WR and the guy who won them the SB the year before on a spectacular red zone catch. What kind of coverage do you think Holmes saw in the red zone on every possession in '09?

Holmes >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Moore.

Look, I can understand you thinking Holmes is overrated. I can understand you not wanting him back. Hell, if had my druthers and the Jets could only sign one of last years WRs it would be Braylon, specifically because I like his size and heart. But using Lance Moore as your preferred replacement was an enormous mistake. He's just not on Santonio's level.

[FloridaJetsFan]

Moore did not break out until season 3 and season 4 he got hurt so its not simple math compare the two best seasons by both players .

Glad to see we're not digressing ... How 'bout that Holmes guy? Did we sign him yet?

[SoFlaJets]

Glad to see we're not digressing ... How 'bout that Holmes guy? Did we sign him yet?

forget it FJF-this is like a fight that goes from room to room and there's no stopping it knocking over lamps and furniture and anyone in their way

[FloridaJetsFan]

forget it FJF-this is like a fight that goes from room to room and there's no stopping it knocking over lamps and furniture and anyone in their way

Anyone listening to Peter King on M&M this morning would make a fairly good assumption that Tanny ain't letting Holmes go, so the point is probably moot - at least I hope it WILL be!!

[SoFlaJets]

Anyone listening to Peter King on M&M this morning would make a fairly good assumption that Tanny ain't letting Holmes go, so the point is probably moot - at least I hope it WILL be!!

and that there aren't any other teams going after him and Washington resigning Santana and now Donte Stallworth-they don't need him

[FloridaJetsFan]

and that there aren't any other teams going after him and Washington resigning Santana and now Donte Stallworth-they don't need him

Correct-a-mundo!!!

[JiFtheOracle]

That's an extraordinarily arbitrary way to compare players, especially considering how you were going on and on yesterday about how Moore was the better all-around and more consistent receiver.

A simple look at their career stats refutes that so now you are basing your entire assessment on their best single year?

OK, I'll play along.

Moore: 2008: 79 catches for 978 yards, 11.7 YPC, 10 TD.

Holmes: 2009: 79 catches for 1248 yards, 15.8 YPC, 5 TD.

So they had the same number of catches, while Holmes averaged an 4.1 more yards per catch, which is huge, and Moore had twice as many TDs.

Still looks like Holmes is the better player to me. Moore may have caught more TDs, but Holmes moved his team significantly closer to a score with every single catch he made.

Lets give these numbers some perspective now, shall we?

Moore played on an 8-8 team in '08 and was the #3 WR on his team. So while Colston and Meacham got significantly more attention in the red zone, Moore likely drew single coverage 95% of the time.

Santonio played on the 10-6 defending Super Bowl Champion and was his team's number 2 WR and the guy who won them the SB the year before on a spectacular red zone catch. What kind of coverage do you think Holmes saw in the red zone on every possession in '09?

Holmes >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Moore.

Look, I can understand you thinking Holmes is overrated. I can understand you not wanting him back. Hell, if had my druthers and the Jets could only sign one of last years WRs it would be Braylon, specifically because I like his size and heart. But using Lance Moore as your preferred replacement was an enormous mistake. He's just not on Santonio's level.

Thats not even taking into account that Holmes has played on run first teams, who were in the top 5 in the league in run vs. pass. When the Jets and Steelers get to the endzone, they look to run first. When the Saints get to the endzone, they look to pass first.

I cant believe I'm letting myself get into this but that thick **** smash wants to throw stats around as if they tell the story in Holmes vs. Moore (the dumbest argument in the history of a Jets message board, I feel so dumb getting involved and you said it best, ask Lance Moore who is better).

On average, Brees, throw 100 attempts than Roth. And go figure, Holmes one year the Smash keeps referring to, is the year that Roth attempted the most amount of passes in his career. You know what else is ironic, Moore's one good year, fell on the same year Brees attempted the most passes of his career. Weird, I know.

[jgb]

That's an extraordinarily arbitrary way to compare players, especially considering how you were going on and on yesterday about how Moore was the better all-around and more consistent receiver.

A simple look at their career stats refutes that so now you are basing your entire assessment on their best single year?

OK, I'll play along.

Moore: 2008: 79 catches for 978 yards, 11.7 YPC, 10 TD.

Holmes: 2009: 79 catches for 1248 yards, 15.8 YPC, 5 TD.

So they had the same number of catches, while Holmes averaged an 4.1 more yards per catch, which is huge, and Moore had twice as many TDs.

Still looks like Holmes is the better player to me. Moore may have caught more TDs, but Holmes moved his team significantly closer to a score with every single catch he made.

Lets give these numbers some perspective now, shall we?

Moore played on an 8-8 team in '08 and was the #3 WR on his team. So while Colston and Meacham got significantly more attention in the red zone, Moore likely drew single coverage 95% of the time.

Santonio played on the 10-6 defending Super Bowl Champion and was his team's number 2 WR and the guy who won them the SB the year before on a spectacular red zone catch. What kind of coverage do you think Holmes saw in the red zone on every possession in '09?

Holmes >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Moore.

Look, I can understand you thinking Holmes is overrated. I can understand you not wanting him back. Hell, if had my druthers and the Jets could only sign one of last years WRs it would be Braylon, specifically because I like his size and heart. But using Lance Moore as your preferred replacement was an enormous mistake. He's just not on Santonio's level.

and maybe the biggest point: moore had a top 3 QB throwing to him

[Smashmouth]

and that there aren't any other teams going after him and Washington resigning Santana and now Donte Stallworth-they don't need him

This means we can have him cheaper and its also a statement about the player as well. I hope we didnt offer him too much. If we offered him 6-7 mil per I think I can live with that but we better sign Braylon or we will once again have a very small WR corps.

[Smashmouth]

Klecko you and JIF have convinced yourselves that I compared the stats of Lance Moore to Snatonio Holmes when in fact I compared Santonios stats to Braylon Edwards a while back. No matter what you say I think Moore is a better and more consistent WR its funny when you did compare thier best 2 years you made mention of how Santonios 4.1 YPC avg was such a monumental stat but just brushed off the fact Moore had 10 TD's to Santonios 5 (mr Big play ) and chalked it up to other players on his team making it easier for him. Bad arguement ! You have convinced yourself what I was thinking and put words in my mouth from the start. STATS alone do not tell the story of an all around WR which is what Im claiming Moore is. You saw Santonio play last year and he does not block, he runs inncorrect routes, makes bone headed plays, and his drop rate is going up rather than down, and hes afraid to go over the middle consistently. While he is very capable of the big play hes also capable of stalling drives. I do not see any of these bad qualities in Moore and thats why I like him but you are all wrapped up in stats, while I continue to talk consistency. But neither of us run the Jets personell Dept. So lets see what happens. All I have to say is if we Sign Santonio we better damn well sign Braylon or you will see our offensive numbers drop to really bad levels with no big target to throw too.

[Klecko73isGod]

Klecko you and JIF have convinced yourselves that I compared the stats of Lance Moore to Snatonio Holmes when in fact I compared Santonios stats to Braylon Edwards a while back. No matter what you say I think Moore is a better and more consistent WR its funny when you did compare thier best 2 years you made mention of how Santonios 4.1 YPC avg was such a monumental stat but just brushed off the fact Moore had 10 TD's to Santonios 5 (mr Big play ) and chalked it up to other players on his team making it easier for him. Bad arguement ! You have convinced yourself what I was thinking and put words in my mouth from the start. STATS alone do not tell the story of an all around WR which is what Im claiming Moore is. You saw Santonio play last year and he does not block, he runs inncorrect routes, makes bone headed plays, and his drop rate is going up rather than down, and hes afraid to go over the middle consistently. While he is very capable of the big play hes also capable of stalling drives. I do not see any of these bad qualities in Moore and thats why I like him but you are all wrapped up in stats, while I continue to talk consistency. But neither of us run the Jets personell Dept. So lets see what happens. All I have to say is if we Sign Santonio we better damn well sign Braylon or you will see our offensive numbers drop to really bad levels with no big target to throw too.

Take away that one season for both of them: Moore has 12 TDs in his other four years, Holmes has 21 in the same span, how the hell is Moore more consistent? Moore's 2008 was an abberration, not the norm.

There is no spin you can use that will make you right.

[JiFtheOracle]

Klecko you and JIF have convinced yourselves that I compared the stats of Lance Moore to Snatonio Holmes when in fact I compared Santonios stats to Braylon Edwards a while back. No matter what you say I think Moore is a better and more consistent WR its funny when you did compare thier best 2 years you made mention of how Santonios 4.1 YPC avg was such a monumental stat but just brushed off the fact Moore had 10 TD's to Santonios 5 (mr Big play ) and chalked it up to other players on his team making it easier for him. Bad arguement ! You have convinced yourself what I was thinking and put words in my mouth from the start. STATS alone do not tell the story of an all around WR which is what Im claiming Moore is. You saw Santonio play last year and he does not block, he runs inncorrect routes, makes bone headed plays, and his drop rate is going up rather than down, and hes afraid to go over the middle consistently. While he is very capable of the big play hes also capable of stalling drives. I do not see any of these bad qualities in Moore and thats why I like him but you are all wrapped up in stats, while I continue to talk consistency. But neither of us run the Jets personell Dept. So lets see what happens. All I have to say is if we Sign Santonio we better damn well sign Braylon or you will see our offensive numbers drop to really bad levels with no big target to throw too.

Nothing you've stated above is even remotely true. You just keep making yourself look like the moronic thick headed **** you are...its enjoyable to watch.

[Lupz27]

This is 2 separate Holmes threads hijacked by these arguments we couldn't just keep it separate in the other thread, fight on, that's fine but leave one thread to the actual real news.

[JiFtheOracle]

Take away that one season for both of them: Moore has 12 TDs in his other four years, Holmes has 21 in the same span, how the hell is Moore more consistent? Moore's 2008 was an abberration, not the norm.

There is no spin you can use that will make you right.

LMFAO - HES THE BETTER ALL AROUND MORE CONSISTENT WR!!!! SMASHMOUTH SAYS SO!!! HE'S THE ONLY PERSON ON EARTH STUPID ENOUGH TO BELIEVE THIS!!! I DONT KNOW WHY I'M TYPING IN ALL CAPS!!!

AHHHHHH!!!!!

[Irish Jet]

Why is this thread about Lance Moore?

[Klecko73isGod]

Why is this thread about Lance Moore?

Ask Smashmouth.