SMC Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Um, let's see. What could my point be in a thread about how Sanchez's completion percentage makes him elite? Yawn... Do better. Mr. Yellin: "Eric, you suck in Algebra, you have to do better!" Little Eric: "I know, Dad, but I now got an A in Algebra, so I got better." Mr. Yellin: "Well, so what? Little Timmy got an A too. You also suck in English." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 No one's saying that but you. If anything the only argument I'm seeing is praising the "pace" he's on for 4000 yards and 32 TD's while ignoring that he's also on pace for 40 interceptions + fumbles. And that's with playing against two garbage secondaries. Before we get goosebumps over stats against Rob Ryan's Dallas defense, that pussy Alexa Smith had just as good of a game statistically-speaking. I like that we won. I like that we usually do win with him at the helm. And I still think Sanchez has a long way to go in 3 major areas: 1. staring down his receivers (and in doing so not seeing who else is open) 2. consistency with accurate passing (clearly he threads the needle sometimes but too often he's throwing behind receivers or too high or too low when said receiver is open enough to allow a pass in stride right where he wants it). 3. being more careful with the ball in general. I also think all 3 of these things are items that can and will improve with time and experience, as it did with many QBs. Why this is treated as a controversy is beyond me. Maybe you haven't been saying that, but if you really think this board hasn't been filled with people throwing a fit over every single negative play that has occurred, you may have missed some threads. Reading around here you'd think Sanchez is the only player in the league who's dare commit a turnover. There's certainly never been this repeated reference to how his stats project positively, as I've thought of it myself when reading the endless whining about how many picks he's destined to throw this year, but SMC's post is the very first time I've seen it mentioned. I agree with you there's plenty of room for improvement and as I said previously, there's a difference between those with legitimate concerns and those just whining, but if you think there isn't an excessive amount of the latter with Sanchez than you just haven't been paying attention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Yes, but you criticized Sanchez for his poor completion percentage in the pats and now that he has improved on that, you dismiss it with the Chad analogy. Great job in moving the Goal Posts. What is this world coming to when you and I are defending a Jets QB? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 What is this world coming to when you and I are defending a Jets QB? It's fascinating what has happened to the ACM. It's cinematic, actually. We won the war and didn't know what to do with ourselves in the aftermath. Now, it's you & I versus EY with CTM on the fence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 That's an awesome stat. Cam Newton is only at 62.7%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 That's an awesome stat. Cam Newton is only at 62.7%. So I take that to mean you missed the 12,384 threads this offseason whining about Sanchez's completion %? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 It's fascinating what has happened to the ACM. It's cinematic, actually. We won the war and didn't know what to do with ourselves in the aftermath. Now, it's you & I versus EY with CTM on the fence. Veterans without a war must find a new enemy, and now... it's each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 I'm sick of you latching on to a pedestrian point-of-view argument, and beating it like a dead horse to veil a complete lack of football knowledge. Agreed. Caring about interceptions is so mundane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 So I take that to mean you missed the 12,384 threads this offseason whining about Sanchez's completion %? Not at all. In relation to Sanchez, that jump in completion percentage is a big deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Agreed. Caring about interceptions is so mundane. It's not. But caring about interceptions while completely discounting the positives is. And Sperm, you're guilty of that. You've stated that "Sanchez hasn't improved" and point out the locking on receivers, but completely ignore the other aspects of Sanchez's game he has gotten better at. Overall, Sanchez has tangibly improved from year to year, although he has not improved in all aspects of his game as we would like. Does Sanchez need to improve in that ASPECT of his game concerning locking on? Certainly. But just because he might get poor marks in that department doesn't wipe out his other improvements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 maybe mark sanchez is sick of lesbians but he doesn't say mean things Yes, this post should definitely help change everyone's perception of you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 My take on the thread was that Sanchez has shown improvement in an area most fans wanted to see it. To be honest I think you and some of the other broken records around here need to do better - bringing up Pennington at the drop of a hat still? Let it go. The thread basically says, "suck it haters". Spare me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackout Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Yes, this post should definitely help change everyone's perception of you. that I'm the coolest poster on this forum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Yes, but you criticized Sanchez for his poor completion percentage in the past and now that he has improved on that, you dismiss it with the Chad analogy. Great job in moving the Goal Posts. Haha. I was waiting for this... When you say, "you", I assume you're talking about the "you familiar", because I never killed Sanchez for his completion percentage, I killed him for 3 things: 1) Lack of vision 2) Awful decision making 3) Inconsistency that led to complete ineffectiveness over large portions of games Nicely fabricated argument though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Mr. Yellin: "Eric, you suck in Algebra, you have to do better!" Little Eric: "I know, Dad, but I now got an A in Algebra, so I got better." Mr. Yellin: "Well, so what? Little Timmy got an A too. You also suck in English." Another failure based on a false premise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 You should be banned for this. If I see anything like this again - you will be gone. Hey, so, what is grounds for banishment again, because there's a lot of things I haven't said that I've wanted to on these forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Haha. I was waiting for this... When you say, "you", I assume you're talking about the "you familiar", because I never killed Sanchez for his completion percentage, I killed him for 3 things: 1) Lack of vision 2) Awful decision making 3) Inconsistency that led to complete ineffectiveness over large portions of games Nicely fabricated argument though. Not a fabrication at all. You criticized him for those 3 aspects of his game without question, but also criticized him for his accuracy. This. Sanchez's issues aren't really the mistakes anymore. They seem to be at about par. Sanchez's issue is that he'll go long periods of games being completely ineffective. He DOES still stare down WRs and he DOES still miss open WRs. He just doesn't have a great field of vision at this point. Or was that last part about open WRs misinterpreted or do you see them as two different things? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicious89x Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Agreed. Caring about interceptions is so mundane. IT'S LIKE A LONG PUNT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Also I offer my counter-point: Sample Size. The end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latinlawyer Posted September 20, 2011 Author Share Posted September 20, 2011 Haha. I was waiting for this... When you say, "you", I assume you're talking about the "you familiar", because I never killed Sanchez for his completion percentage, I killed him for 3 things: 1) Lack of vision 2) Awful decision making 3) Inconsistency that led to complete ineffectiveness over large portions of games Nicely fabricated argument though. Ok so why don't we take each one separately. 1) Lack of Vision - Three picks in two games. Two of those picks were due to poor vision...an underlying LB or DB took advantage of his snap throws. The other pick was a product of a gambling DB who slipped off his assignment to jump in front of Holmes for the pick. I would argue that given his higher completion rate and his 4 tds he has better vision than before. So improvement here. 2) Awful Decision Making: Again, are we looking at the interceptions as barometers or his passing in general? So if Sanchez has two Ints that were the product of bad decisions and the rest of the passes or pass attempts were good decisions...then we are really picking at nits here. If we are looking at his incompletions as bad decisons and you include his completions then his good decisions occur 63.2% of the time. Still, almost a 10% improvement thus far. 3) Inconsistency: He is a streaky QB. However, if anyone saw Matt Ryan against the Eagles or Peyton Manning last year against the Cowboys or Brady against the Jets in the playoffs...there is no perfect passer. By nature we are consistently inconsistent. We all have to keep in mind that Sanchez has been a starting qb 4 years if you include college. This is his 3rd year as a pro and therefore he is maturing. He will put up better numbers to become consistent...however, we have to be patient. Not everyone is great at first (see Elway's first year, see Manning's first year, see Namath's first year...QB's sometimes need some seasoning...). SO really what is left to argue about? He doesn't own a cannon? Look at Jeff George...great arm..soft head. Not a leader? His team looks to him in tough spots and the amount of come from behind wins points to leadership. Can't win big games? 4 PLAYOFF WINS in his FIRST TWO SEASONS and they were on the ROAD!. They guy can win. He throws too many picks....scan the NFL site and see who else has thrown 3 or more picks thus far. Next look at completion percentage and see who is above 60%. Then look at TD's. Metrically speaking, Sanchez is progressing. LL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Anyone see Ryan Fitzpatrick's stats this year? Nuts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Haha. I was waiting for this... When you say, "you", I assume you're talking about the "you familiar", because I never killed Sanchez for his completion percentage, I killed him for 3 things: 1) Lack of vision 2) Awful decision making 3) Inconsistency that led to complete ineffectiveness over large portions of games Nicely fabricated argument though. Yeah, I'm not so sure I agree with the assumption that the relationship between success or improvement and completion percentage is linear. Sanchez still looks discernibly bad; he's still throwing almost an equal amount of picks to TD's and he still goes braindead when his primary option isn't available; he still has the same single moments of brilliance sandwiched in between 5-6 retarded ones. Regardless, I don't think 2 games is a big enough sample to determine whether or not he's noticeably improved from last season. Guys have bad games and metrics will always even out over time if the improvement is there, but through 2 games I personally have not been impressed at all, and once tomorrow's FO numbers come out he's probably going to have some pretty bad totals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latinlawyer Posted September 20, 2011 Author Share Posted September 20, 2011 Yeah, Fitz is definately shining right now. I am hoping the Bills can put a dent in the Pats. LL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyHector Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Anyone see Ryan Fitzpatrick's stats this year? Nuts. Meh. Small sample space and it has come against non-AFCE opponents who have suspect and/or banged-up secondaries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Not a fabrication at all. You criticized him for those 3 aspects of his game without question, but also criticized him for his accuracy. Or was that last part about open WRs misinterpreted or do you see them as two different things? The last part is about "not seeing open WRs", not accuracy. Though, I'll also say that completion percentage isn't a pure accuracy measure IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Meh. Small sample space and it has come against non-AFCE opponents who have suspect and/or banged-up secondaries. Know who's also faced some suspect and/or banged-up secondaries through 2 games? Mark Sanchez. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 I'll also say that completion percentage isn't a pure accuracy measure IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyHector Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Know who's also faced some suspect and/or banged-up secondaries through 2 games? Mark Sanchez. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 SO really what is left to argue about? Well, everything, because I basically think your dismissals are absurd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 IT'S LIKE A LONG PUNT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Also I offer my counter-point: Sample Size. The end. The problem with sample size is that all of the numbers regress. Unless you think he's going to throw 24 interceptions, I don't see how you can declare that 63.2% is sustainable over 16 games. Remember the first five games of last season, when everyone said that completing 55% of his passes was fine, as long as he wasn't turning the ball over? How'd that end up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Unless you think he's going to throw 24 interceptions, I don't see how you can declare that 63.2% is sustainable over 16 games. Maybe he will stay at 63.2% actually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vudu Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 I'm sick of you latching on to a pedestrian point-of-view argument, and beating it like a dead horse to veil a complete lack of football knowledge. Sanchez is the best QB in the entire NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyHector Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Maybe he will stay at 63.2% actually. And maybe he will consume the defense with fireballs from his eyes and bolts of lightning from arse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicious89x Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 The problem with sample size is that all of the numbers regress. Unless you think he's going to throw 24 interceptions, I don't see how you can declare that 63.2% is sustainable over 16 games. Remember the first five games of last season, when everyone said that completing 55% of his passes was fine, as long as he wasn't turning the ball over? How'd that end up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicious89x Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 And maybe he will consume the defense with fireballs from his eyes and bolts of lightning from arse. 60% of the time, it works every time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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