TomShane Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 But he CAN teach someone to pass block, read zone packages and how to bump and run. No he can't. Otherwise he wouldn't have had to fire his two coordinators. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BwanaZulia Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 I was being conservative. :wink: Besides your under-the-bridge-like-tendinancies, for every game you can name that you say, in your professional board posting opinion, that Herm lost the game, I bet I can name three other reasons why we lost the game. Coaches don't win or lose games. QBs don't win or lose games. OC/DC don't win or lose games. Teams, win or lose games and as a Pats fanatic (if you even remember where there fanbase and websites are) you should know that one of the reasons that the Pats are so succesfull is because BB gets them to play as a team. This is actually something he has in common with Herm as they both have that type of ability. BZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garb Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 No he can't. Otherwise he wouldn't have had to fire his two coordinators. He did in Tampa, right? I 'dunno.....you would know better than me. I just think that Hermie is overwhelmed by all the DETAILS. The man clearly has multi-tasking issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomShane Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 Coaches don't win or lose games. Shouldn't you be reserving that line for AFTER he gets fired? That's usually when that quote makes its appearance in all sports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BwanaZulia Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 1) Bill Bellicheck is a horrible excuse for a human being, but he has 3 super bowl rings in 4 seasons. I don't care if Herm is the antichrist, I'd take championships over friendliness Well, that is you. Personally I love that we have not only a good leader but an incredible person leading the Jets. I don't want to have an ass for a HC (but I wouldn't mind the SBs) 2) You mean like when Herm "motivated" his buddy John Lynch AWAY from the Jets? Or when he "motivated" Chester McGlockton to lay around on his fat a$$ in front of the rest of the team? Or like when he "motivated" John Abraham to not get on the field to play hurt? Or like when Herm "motivated" Paul Hackett and Ted Cottrell not to change their ways for the benefit of the team? Or when Herm "motivated" leaders Curtis Martin, Chad Pennington and co. to play terribly in the big games ever since Oakland in 2002? Or like when Herm "motivated" his team to backing into the playoffs last season? Do you have proof of him "motivating" the God father of his own KID and substitute guardian away from the Jets? In fact, do you have proof of any of that? Anywhere besides a bunch of fan sites and discussion boards? 3) Herm costs teams games himself with poor decision-making abilities in the clutch. Good coaches don't shoot their teams in the foot. Not to mention, good coaches KNOW HOW TO CALL A FRIGGIN' PLAY WHEN NECESARRY. So, you want it both ways? You want him to be a leader and undermine his OC and DC? 4) You mean like when Herm "admitted his mistakes" by tossing everyone from Paul Hackett to Quincy Carter to the towel boy under the bus for the Ravens debacle? I saw the game. I saw the conferences and nowhere does he do (or TomShane has been claiming he has done) that. Show me the transcript where he tosses them under the bus? BZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomShane Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 He did in Tampa, right? I 'dunno.....you would know better than me. I just think that Hermie is overwhelmed by all the DETAILS. The man clearly has multi-tasking issues. Herm was the secondary coach in Tampa. Monte Kiffin was the legendary DC. So Herm got Monte's coffee and stuff. Go Herm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vanDoug Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 1) Belichick 2) Reid 3) Parcells 4) Fox 5) Billick 6) Gruden 7) Fisher 8) Holgren 9) Mora Jr. 10) Shanahan 11) Vermeil 12) Cowher 13) Green 14) Lewis 15) Martz 16) Dungy 17) Schottenheimer 18) Edwards 19) Mariucci 20) Capers 21) Smith 22) Sherman 23) Tice 24) Coughlin 25) Mularkey 26) DelRio 27) Turner 28) Haslett 29) Turner INC) Crennel, Nolan, Saban Uh-uh TS. No deal on Holmgren at 8. Living where I do we get saturated with Seahawks/Holmgren stuff. Guy hasn't done anything since he got here. He's in the 20's somewhere d Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BwanaZulia Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 Shouldn't you be reserving that line for AFTER he gets fired? That's usually when that quote makes its appearance in all sports. Grass is always greener Tom. How many years did Parcells get us to the post season? BZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 Well, that is you. Personally I love that we have not only a good leader but an incredible person leading the Jets. I don't want to have an a$$ for a HC (but I wouldn't mind the SBs) Do you have proof of him "motivating" the God father of his own KID and substitute guardian away from the Jets? In fact, do you have proof of any of that? Anywhere besides a bunch of fan sites and discussion boards? So, you want it both ways? You want him to be a leader and undermine his OC and DC? I saw the game. I saw the conferences and nowhere does he do (or TomShane has been claiming he has done) that. Show me the transcript where he tosses them under the bus? BZ 1) I like Herm as a person. I hate him as a coach. Simple. 2) Proof? The proof is that Lynch basically said "**** you" to the Jets despite being close with Herm. If I couldnt prove Herm and Lynch were friends, that would be another story, but their relationship is well documented. If Herm is such a good motivator and friend with Lynch, he would have signed with the Jets. But don't get me wrong, I never wanted Lynch in the first place, so good riddance. 3) I don't want him to UNDERMINE his staff, I want him to LEAD them. Leading means you have to give the people under you a swift kick in the ass at times, am I right? Herm never did that because he doesn't know a damn thing about running an offensive or defensive unit. He wouldn't have known how to go about telling Hackett and Cottrell how to make the necesarry adjustments. As I said before, HEAD COACHES NEED TO KNOW HOW TO CALL PLAYS, because their job is to have an intimate knowledge of the game and know how to run an ENTIRE TEAM. 4) You didn't need to see it in the press conferences, just listen to the sideline chatter during the game, which has been played several times, including at least once on NFL Network. Herm didn't have a friggin' clue what he was doing, and never took responsibility for his mistake during or after the game until he realized the press was going to attack him for it, like it or not. He has blamed Hackett several times to the press, saying the offense needed to get more aggressive, but it never happened. Why? See # 3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 Grass is always greener Tom. How many years did Parcells get us to the post season? BZ Parcells took over from Rich Kottite. Herm took over from Parcells. Parcells got us closer to a Super Bowl title than has Herm. End of argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BwanaZulia Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 1) I like Herm as a person. I hate him as a coach. Simple. Why (with facts not conjecture). 2) Proof? The proof is that Lynch basically said "F#ck you" to the Jets despite being close with Herm. If I couldnt prove Herm and Lynch were friends, that would be another story, but their relationship is well documented. If Herm is such a good motivator and friend with Lynch, he would have signed with the Jets. But don't get me wrong, I never wanted Lynch in the first place, so good riddance. Show me the quote from Lynch saying that. You seem not to comprehend that everything is not black and white. There were probably a 100 different points to Lynch's decision and being friends with Herm was one. There were also reports that his Wife wanted to be on the West coast. Are you going to blame Herm for not motivating his wife now? 3) I don't want him to UNDERMINE his staff, I want him to LEAD them. Leading means you have to give the people under you a swift kick in the a$$ at times, am I right? Herm never did that because he doesn't know a damn thing about running an offensive or defensive unit. He wouldn't have known how to go about telling Hackett and Cottrell how to make the necesarry adjustments. As I said before, HEAD COACHES NEED TO KNOW HOW TO CALL PLAYS, because their job is to have an intimate knowledge of the game and know how to run an ENTIRE TEAM. You saw it last year when him the RB coach when head to head. Herm does come down on his coaches, but you have a limited view into what really goes on (no, I don't have a bigger view, but I am not saying he is a wuss). 4) You didn't need to see it in the press conferences, just listen to the sideline chatter during the game, which has been played several times, including at least once on NFL Network. Herm didn't have a friggin' clue what he was doing, and never took responsibility for his mistake during or after the game until he realized the press was going to attack him for it, like it or not. He has blamed Hackett several times to the press, saying the offense needed to get more aggressive, but it never happened. Why? See # 3. That was his throwing him under the bus? Everyone in the world and probably a few in space knows the offense needed to get more aggressive. Where is that throwing Hackett to the wind? And the Herm-Bashing-Nation always want it both ways. They want him to be tougher and kick ass, but when he says something even as limited as that, you guys say he is throwing them under the bus. Which do you want? I tell you what I want. I want the Jets to play tough (they do), be competitive (they are) make as little mistakes as possible (they do), learn from their mistakes (they do) and put themselves in a position every season to make it to the post season (they have). Yes, winning the Super Bowl is going to be great but you have to make it there first and Herm gets us there, with his system with guys that fight as hard any any other players on the planet (look at the Chargers game for that). That is what I want from a HC and we have it in Herm. BZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasonJet Posted July 18, 2005 Share Posted July 18, 2005 Herm may be ranked somewhat highly on that list, the only people on that list that he should probably be behind, at least that I'm thinking of right now, are Jeff Fisher and Marvin Lewis. And Mike Martz should be lower than 21. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxman Posted July 19, 2005 Share Posted July 19, 2005 Parcells took over from Rich Kottite. Herm took over from Parcells. Parcells got us closer to a Super Bowl title than has Herm. End of argument. Wrong. Herm took over from Groh who took over from Belichek. The franchise wasn't exactly at the top of Forbes list at that point. Nobody wanted to be here. 2 coaches quitting in a row? Cmon. Parcells and Herm have both failed. Because neither won the SuperBowl here. So who cares who got closer. Wow Parcells had a lead at the half in the Championship game. You know what? All I ever heard was that Parcells teams don't lose when they are winning by 10 at the half. The lost that day. Parcells failed. Herm has failed. Herm hasn't walked out on this franchise yet so he still has a shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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