Kellen Wins First Practice(According To Cimini)

[CTM]

http://videos.nj.com/star-ledger/2009/04/clemens_takes_very_early_lead.html

It really is amazing how Kellen sounds like Chad did last year, and Ratlif sounds like Kellen did.

Imo, there's no question whose going take an early lead here. Last year Chad played defense and let Kellen screw up trying to look better then him. Kellen seems to be taking the CPF approach this year and Ratliff seems to be the one screwing up. It a product of knowing whose 1A and 1B, Ratliff needs to significantly outplay Kellen to get the job

[DMaynard]

Translation: I was such a Ratlff supporter that i have to still back him, even though Clemens has owned him in minicamp. My heart is telling me TNJet and 124 have been right all along and he will start for years making good money,therefore me and many other Ratliffeers will eat crow for many moons.

"Owned"? That is funny. Averaging 5 yards a pass? Funny how the Clementines have ignored the report that Ratliff looked better the last day and Clemens threw a couple of picks.

[slats]

"Owned"? That is funny. Averaging 5 yards a pass? Funny how the Clementines have ignored the report that Ratliff looked better the last day and Clemens threw a couple of picks.

Well, that "report" came from a single Ratliff backer on the board, and not from the press. I think it's fair to take that one with a grain of salt.

Now the focus has to be on the draft. This Clemens-Ratliff competition will really heat up if the Jets don't take a QB in the first round. As of right now, you figure both guys have to be wondering if they're playing for the #1 spot, or to just keep it warm for the next heir apparent.

[124]

Well, that "report" came from a single Ratliff backer on the board, and not from the press. I think it's fair to take that one with a grain of salt.

Now the focus has to be on the draft. This Clemens-Ratliff competition will really heat up if the Jets don't take a QB in the first round. As of right now, you figure both guys have to be wondering if they're playing for the #1 spot, or to just keep it warm for the next heir apparent.

Exactly.

The two days the media was there, Clemens was the one winning the battle and Rex Ryan called Clemens "outstanding", not Brett Ratliff.

[Irish Jet]

"Owned"? That is funny. Averaging 5 yards a pass? Funny how the Clementines have ignored the report that Ratliff looked better the last day and Clemens threw a couple of picks.

I have nothing against JK94 but seriously? You know he's a Ratliff fanboy. I'm not accusing him of lying but I'd just find it a little easier to trust a more credible source.

To be fair, with regards to these mini camps in general I doubt they mean too much. Yeah Kellen may have the early lead, but we need to see how he does in the legit TC, in pre-season, when he has defenders chasing after him. His pocket presence was after all considered to be his main weakness. Ratliff? As far as I'm concerned we still don't have a clue about him.

My point is I wouldn't read too much into these reports just yet, for either QB. It wil all kick off again in Training Camp and THEN we'll get a real idea who's going to step up. Now I still think it will be Clemens but nothing is for sure yet.

[DMaynard]

Well, that "report" came from a single Ratliff backer on the board, and not from the press. I think it's fair to take that one with a grain of salt.

Now the focus has to be on the draft. This Clemens-Ratliff competition will really heat up if the Jets don't take a QB in the first round. As of right now, you figure both guys have to be wondering if they're playing for the #1 spot, or to just keep it warm for the next heir apparent.

I trust the kid more than the media, because he said what I want to hear.

But your are right, the big question now is will they get a QB in the draft?

[SMC]

This is from Boland's blog last Friday (repost):

Clemens has clearly out-performed Ratliff over the first two days and it

[SMC]

Translation: I was such a Ratlff supporter that i have to still back him, even though Clemens has owned him in minicamp. My heart is telling me TNJet and 124 have been right all along and he will start for years making good money,therefore me and many other Ratliffeers will eat crow for many moons.

Uhm, no.

I don't believe in Zero Sum Gain like you, 124 and the Ratliff supports. Only a simple minded person believes that in order to support one player it is necessary to denegrate another.

I rooted for Ratliff, but never said I did so because Clemens sucked. Those who have are misguided. Same for the Pro-Clemens crowd.

As CTM noted, the Jets need to have the winner win on merit not because the other guy sucks. In other words, Clemens winning by default does the Jets no good. So "owning" Ratliff in minicamp is irrelevant. QB play can't be judged on a grading curve.

I find waaaaaayyyyy more encouraging Rex saying that Clemens looks outstanding than any claim that he outperformed Ratliff.

[DMaynard]

Uhm, no.

I don't believe in Zero Sum Gain like you, 124 and the Ratliff supports. Only a simple minded person believes that in order to support one player it is necessary to denegrate another.

I rooted for Ratliff, but never said I did so because Clemens sucked. Those who have are misguided. Same for the Pro-Clemens crowd.

As CTM noted, the Jets need to have the winner win on merit not because the other guy sucks. In other words, Clemens winning by default does the Jets no good. So "owning" Ratliff in minicamp is irrelevant. QB play can't be judged on a grading curve.

I find waaaaaayyyyy more encouraging Rex saying that Clemens looks outstanding than any claim that he outperformed Ratliff.

To be fair, I believe every single Ratliff supporter has said repeatedly that they will have no problem with Clemens shining and winning the job. And I believe most people who want Clemens to win or believe he will win would have no problem with ratliff stepping up and winning. It is just a couple of Clemens fans who have a strange hatred of Ratliff.

[124]

To be fair, I believe every single Ratliff supporter has said repeatedly that they will have no problem with Clemens shining and winning the job. And I believe most people who want Clemens to win or believe he will win would have no problem with ratliff stepping up and winning. It is just a couple of Clemens fans who have a strange hatred of Ratliff.

You would be wrong.

Almost all of the Ratliff supporters spend more time bashing Clemens than the Clemens supporters bash Ratliff. If Ratliff is the Quarterback, fine, so be it. I'd rather have two good Quarterbacks instead of one in case of injury. I defend Clemens because I do not understand the love for Ratliff when he has shown nothing except for one game against guys working for UPS or on NFL Practice Squads.

The majority of Ratliff supporters feels that that is enough evidence that he is a better Quarterback than Clemens, and thats just stupid talk. I support Clemens, I don't think Ratliff will be good, but if he is, I have no problem with it because no matter what in my mind, Clemens is a good QB. I hope Ratliff gives him some competition, but so far, he hasn't. Clemens badly out performed Ratliff both days the media was there and Rex Ryan came out and said Kellen's performance was outstanding.

Thus we have not heard much from the Ratliff backers the last few days.

There are more Ratliff fans who feel Clemens is garbage no matter what than there are Clemens fans who feel Ratliff is garbage no matter what. Those are the idiots who fail to look over the 2007 Offensive Line/Roster.

[DMaynard]

You would be wrong.

Almost all of the Ratliff supporters spend more time bashing Clemens than the Clemens supporters bash Ratliff. If Ratliff is the Quarterback, fine, so be it. I'd rather have two good Quarterbacks instead of one in case of injury. I defend Clemens because I do not understand the love for Ratliff when he has shown nothing except for one game against guys working for UPS or on NFL Practice Squads.

The majority of Ratliff supporters feels that that is enough evidence that he is a better Quarterback than Clemens, and thats just stupid talk. I support Clemens, I don't think Ratliff will be good, but if he is, I have no problem with it because no matter what in my mind, Clemens is a good QB. I hope Ratliff gives him some competition, but so far, he hasn't. Clemens badly out performed Ratliff both days the media was there and Rex Ryan came out and said Kellen's performance was outstanding.

Thus we have not heard much from the Ratliff backers the last few days.

There are more Ratliff fans who feel Clemens is garbage no matter what than there are Clemens fans who feel Ratliff is garbage no matter what. Those are the idiots who fail to look over the 2007 Offensive Line/Roster.

Once again, I can not recall any Ratliff fans here bashing Clemens. I know I have not. I was rooting for Clemens every year to beat out Chad. I just liked what I saw in Ratliff last year. I think they both have potential to be starting QBs in this league. And they could both flop. Just because Clemens had lots of excuses for not playing great in 2007, does not mean he will be good if those excuses are gone. But he does have a much better pedigree than Ratliff and has actual NFL experience. I think the only fair criticism of Ratliff fans is being overly optimistic given the little we have seen of Ratliff. That is OK. We are not "idiots". We are fans. This is a fan message board.