If you had $25,000 to invest....

[THE ILK]

Hahaha, I saw it before though.

[villain_the_foe]

Hahaha, I saw it before though.

My boy just put me on to it. I was in stitches!

[JetsFanInDenver]

The bill was already passed and will be implemented Jan. 1st 2012. Any purchase/sell of items $600 or more has to be reported to the IRS. Im not going to get into details because I dont want to get too political, however, if you search the net you'll find the info. If gold is selling for $1300 then thats more than $600. I guess they beat you to it lol.

Also, The "futures" contracts are up come this december for people who have long holdings on Gold ETF's. The problem with gold is that people generally own "Shadow" gold...meaning that they dont own the physical, but they own the paper version.

Point being, Once these futures contracts are up this december people are going to come to a crossroad. Either enter a new contract and pay new premiums on their gold if they believe that Gold will continue to rise in price, or simply take the profit that they made during the time locked in and sell their contract.

I believe most of the people are going to sell their longs to reap that $300-$500 profit per coin that the held control on and the price of Gold is going to drop. Thats going to hurt the new physical buyers DEARLY who just now jumped into the game and bought at $1300+.

Gold is simply too easy to manipulate because whoever holds the gold makes the rules...and right now no one wants to own the physical just yet. The gold market is still a "paper" market. I still think gold will hit highs, but the manipulation is still there domestically. I think once China population is in a position to really purchase gold in the physical, thats when you'll begin to see the true potential. There's just too much phantom gold out there for me to really invest $1300 per coin.

I'd stick to Silver because I know for a fact that for the past 18 years demand has outweighed supply, and since supply has to always equal demand all of the stockpiles of silver from 1990-2005 is pretty much dried up to help meet that demand.

The only person holding a great portion of Silver is Warren Buffet with 130 million oz that he bought back in I believe 97. He said that he sold it but there's speculation that he actualy leased it to the LBMA in London to cover their short position on the market.

The way i read it that could be the first step reporting purchases to the IRS. Did not see anywhere saying purchases will be taxed. But the framework is being laid. Gold sales (apart from Gold Eagles) for profit are taxable right now.

Paper gold vehicles like GLD are relatively new.

And i think the demand for physical gold has picked up substantially. That is evidenced by the US Mint running out of the Gold Buffalo's for the year already.

On top of that the word out of China is that is in fact encouraging its citizens to procure PM's.

At the end of the day the problem with investing in physical PM's the overheads like storage that add to cost of investing. But as more and more people realize the ponzi scheme that our currency has really become we will see a flight to even more physical PM's. I understand the ride up will not be in straight line. There will be inflection points. But those would be good opportunities to get long.

For silver specifically the long long term scenario is much more rosy for the reasons you mention. But in the medium term i think gold continues to outperform silver. That's because the new money pouring in to PM's is looking for preservation of capital and wealth and a currency that will not evaporate. And historically gold always has been the standard and not silver.

I remember Buffett cornering of the silver market. How can i forget ? I made some coin of his actions. It would be interesting to see where he is in those positions.

[JetsFanInDenver]

The sad this is that the zimbabwe dollar is slowly catching up to ours lmao!

This is the perfect reason why you need not just a dollar that's backed by real assets, but you also need "true" free markets. Free markets allows competition...which in turn keeps everything honest. For example, We have the US Dollar index. We hear everyday how the US dollar went up or down against other "fiat" currencies. Given the lack of a free market people dont get to see that ALL of the fiats are losing value against real money like Gold/Silver or Commodities like Soybeans and Wheat. Then people wonder why food is so expensive. Its because they're not getting the entire picture.

The economy has cancer, but instead of cutting the cancer we print more of it.

That's a very valid point.

We have focused on the symptoms (the pain) and how to reduce the impact of those symptoms.

But we have not treated the disease.

And the longer it goes untreated the worse it becomes.

[villain_the_foe]

That's a very valid point.

We have focused on the symptoms (the pain) and how to reduce the impact of those symptoms.

But we have not treated the disease.

And the longer it goes untreated the worse it becomes.

Maybe me and you should fly to washington and help out lol.

[villain_the_foe]

The way i read it that could be the first step reporting purchases to the IRS. Did not see anywhere saying purchases will be taxed. But the framework is being laid. Gold sales (apart from Gold Eagles) for profit are taxable right now.

Paper gold vehicles like GLD are relatively new.

And i think the demand for physical gold has picked up substantially. That is evidenced by the US Mint running out of the Gold Buffalo's for the year already.

On top of that the word out of China is that is in fact encouraging its citizens to procure PM's.

At the end of the day the problem with investing in physical PM's the overheads like storage that add to cost of investing. But as more and more people realize the ponzi scheme that our currency has really become we will see a flight to even more physical PM's. I understand the ride up will not be in straight line. There will be inflection points. But those would be good opportunities to get long.

For silver specifically the long long term scenario is much more rosy for the reasons you mention. But in the medium term i think gold continues to outperform silver. That's because the new money pouring in to PM's is looking for preservation of capital and wealth and a currency that will not evaporate. And historically gold always has been the standard and not silver.

I remember Buffett cornering of the silver market. How can i forget ? I made some coin of his actions. It would be interesting to see where he is in those positions.

I was just taking in an article this morning and there's 9 billionaires (no names were given) that have been pushing the COMEX/LBMA to provide them with the physical metal that they purchased. There's a good chance that the 4 top bullion banks are wont be able to cover their shorts (naked shorts). Thats what happens when you "lease" gold/silver. lol. The next few months are going to tell alot.

[JetsFanInDenver]

I was just taking in an article this morning and there's 9 billionaires (no names were given) that have been pushing the COMEX/LBMA to provide them with the physical metal that they purchased. There's a good chance that the 4 top bullion banks are wont be able to cover their shorts (naked shorts). Thats what happens when you "lease" gold/silver. lol. The next few months are going to tell alot.

That is going to be interesting.

I had read somewhere that all the gold ever mined in the world could only fill a Olympic sized swimming pool. Whether that's true or not the point still stands. It a metal in limited supply.

[JetsFanInDenver]

Maybe me and you should fly to washington and help out lol.

LOL. We will be shunned out of that place in a hurry!

[villain_the_foe]

That is going to be interesting.

I had read somewhere that all the gold ever mined in the world could only fill a Olympic sized swimming pool. Whether that's true or not the point still stands. It a metal in limited supply.

I actually heard a youtube vid saying something like that. Could be true, only controllers of govt secure this gold and given its price you really dont need that much. Whats crazy though is allegedly there's 5 to 6x's more gold than silver. Mining wise, silver is found more toward the surface of the earth while Gold is much deeper. There's a good chance given Silver's easy accessiblity we're running out of it. You cant do alchemical processes to mimic silver either because its natrual construct is monatomic...down to the atom.

Think about this. Silver is possibly running out, industry has depleted all of the stock holds of it (Even Buffett's 130 million oz is small on a world scale), you cant replicate it alchemically and its practical use makes it the most important metal in the world.

I say Silver ONE DAY will surpass Gold in price, and I think we're going to be alive to see it. This is why im so excited about silver.

[villain_the_foe]

LOL. We will be shunned out of that place in a hurry!

You may have a point. They never liked smart people

[JetsFanInDenver]

I actually heard a youtube vid saying something like that. Could be true, only controllers of govt secure this gold and given its price you really dont need that much. Whats crazy though is allegedly there's 5 to 6x's more gold than silver. Mining wise, silver is found more toward the surface of the earth while Gold is much deeper. There's a good chance given Silver's easy accessiblity we're running out of it. You cant do alchemical processes to mimic silver either because its natrual construct is monatomic...down to the atom.

Think about this. Silver is possibly running out, industry has depleted all of the stock holds of it (Even Buffett's 130 million oz is small on a world scale), you cant replicate it alchemically and its practical use makes it the most important metal in the world.

I say Silver ONE DAY will surpass Gold in price, and I think we're going to be alive to see it. This is why im so excited about silver.

Those are some great points.

I agree silver can never be replicated.

But historically whenever a metal has become difficult to use in industrial processes most industries go for substitutes to have a handle on the economics on what they are producing. Now the substitutes might not be as good as silver and downgrade the product life or utility but if its scarce all industry players would go away from the metal.

Now i am not well versed with all the industrial processes that use this metal and how critically dependent they are on silver. I am sure you have a better handle on those.

But i think that creates a natural ceiling for price of silver. Also because of it price now its a lot more bulkier to store silver compared to gold.

Gold does not have as much industrial use as silver. But historically it has been the standard of currency and by extension wealth. We had a gold standard till Nixon (not being political here) stripped it down because France called his bluff. And gold has been that standard for ages. I expect that to continue as the international currency war heats up ( for all practical purposes it has started already).

I would not be against investing in silver. But i would rather be in gold for a majority of PM's assets.

[JetsFanInDenver]

I actually heard a youtube vid saying something like that. Could be true, only controllers of govt secure this gold and given its price you really dont need that much. Whats crazy though is allegedly there's 5 to 6x's more gold than silver. Mining wise, silver is found more toward the surface of the earth while Gold is much deeper. There's a good chance given Silver's easy accessiblity we're running out of it. You cant do alchemical processes to mimic silver either because its natrual construct is monatomic...down to the atom.

Think about this. Silver is possibly running out, industry has depleted all of the stock holds of it (Even Buffett's 130 million oz is small on a world scale), you cant replicate it alchemically and its practical use makes it the most important metal in the world.

I say Silver ONE DAY will surpass Gold in price, and I think we're going to be alive to see it. This is why im so excited about silver.

Those are some great points.

I agree silver can never be replicated.

But historically whenever a metal has become difficult to use in industrial processes most industries go for substitutes to have a handle on the economics on what they are producing. Now the substitutes might not be as good as silver and downgrade the product life or utility but if its scarce all industry players would go away from the metal.

Now i am not well versed with all the industrial processes that use this metal and how critically dependent they are on silver. I am sure you have a better handle on those.

But i think that creates a natural ceiling for price of silver. Also because of it price now its a lot more bulkier to store silver compared to gold.

Gold does not have as much industrial use as silver. But historically it has been the standard of currency and by extension wealth. We had a gold standard till Nixon (not being political here) stripped it down because France called his bluff. And gold has been that standard for ages. I expect that to continue as the international currency war heats up ( for all practical purposes it has started already).

I would not be against investing in silver. But i would rather be in gold for a majority of PM's assets.

[JetsFanInDenver]

You may have a point. They never liked smart people

They have smart people. But those people use their smarts for the benefit of special interest groups or lobbyists.

What we are talking about impacts Main Street. And who cares about them.

The problem is Main Street can be swayed by negative ads bought by the money supplied by various lobbyists whose essential function is to screw Main Street. Gotta love the irony!

[villain_the_foe]

Those are some great points.

I agree silver can never be replicated.

But historically whenever a metal has become difficult to use in industrial processes most industries go for substitutes to have a handle on the economics on what they are producing. Now the substitutes might not be as good as silver and downgrade the product life or utility but if its scarce all industry players would go away from the metal.

Now i am not well versed with all the industrial processes that use this metal and how critically dependent they are on silver. I am sure you have a better handle on those.

But i think that creates a natural ceiling for price of silver. Also because of it price now its a lot more bulkier to store silver compared to gold.

Gold does not have as much industrial use as silver. But historically it has been the standard of currency and by extension wealth. We had a gold standard till Nixon (not being political here) stripped it down because France called his bluff. And gold has been that standard for ages. I expect that to continue as the international currency war heats up ( for all practical purposes it has started already).

I would not be against investing in silver. But i would rather be in gold for a majority of PM's assets.

Silver could very likely have a ceiling...and it will be introduced IMO by government in the form of national security and for military usage. There's many robotics and weapons created by military that "cannot" work without Silver. Medical industry as well given that silver is naturally a antibiotic, antimicrobal and antiviral. Thats actually why Colloidal Silver is so great...though some would call you a kook if you told them you use it and not chemical asprin tablets lol.

Silver historically has been money basically as long as Gold. The US changed to the one metal Gold Standard in 1873 for "banking" reasons, however they still coined 90% silver coins until 1964 and 40% silver coins until 1971. Silver literally means "Money" in romance languages (latin). Look at France for example. Money in France is Argento, and Silver in france is also called Argento. There's many countries where you can find that correlation as well as in the bible. Banks try to hide that fact...but people such as yourself that knows whats going on will always flow back to real money once paper becomes just that.

Outside the past 100-150 years Silver for the previous several thousand years has always been money. I think that the more we print ourselves into the ground the more people will begin to gravitate to silver coins/rounds given is undervalued price.

[villain_the_foe]

They have smart people. But those people use their smarts for the benefit of special interest groups or lobbyists.

What we are talking about impacts Main Street. And who cares about them.

The problem is Main Street can be swayed by negative ads bought by the money supplied by various lobbyists whose essential function is to screw Main Street. Gotta love the irony!

I feel you, though we have to keep it on Gold/silver. Cant get too political here. Good point though.

[bitonti]

Your point would be valid, if we were an industrial nation. Remember, dollars (no matter the nation that its from) is simply an IOU. Question, if we're a consumer nation, and we're not making anything then where is the backing of those IOU's floating all around the world?

we don't make anything? who invented the Iphone? Who invented the stealth bomber? who invented NFL football? Hello?!

This country is still top dog, despite the fears (Hopes) to the contrary.

you gold bugs are really bumming me out. Read your posts, forget buying silver, i want to curl into the fetal position and cry myself to Monday Night Football.

also I'd invite you to look up the definition of a service-based economy. When the government of Lichtenstein needs a new computer system, they pay IBM millions of dollars to set it up. It's services that's the thing. And it's legitimate way to make money.

here's the news gentlemen: there is nothing to replace the US dollar in the short term. not gold. not the Chinese Yuan, not the Euro. Nothing. If you come up with a valid way for wide-spread paper currency to exist without the US dollar, in the next few years or so... I'm all ears. Please let me know. We will not go back to the gold standard... that's hog-wash.

it seems to me that many people are imposing their political alarmism on an economic situation. I don't see how we get from a housing bubble to Zimbabwe style hyper-inflation. We are not greece, there is growth and there is upside.

[villain_the_foe]

we don't make anything? who invented the Iphone? Who invented the stealth bomber? who invented NFL football? Hello?!

This country is still top dog, despite the fears (Hopes) to the contrary.

you gold bugs are really bumming me out. Read your posts, forget buying silver, i want to curl into the fetal position and cry myself to Monday Night Football.

also I'd invite you to look up the definition of a service-based economy. When the government of Lichtenstein needs a new computer system, they pay IBM millions of dollars to set it up. It's services that's the thing. And it's legitimate way to make money.

here's the news gentlemen: there is nothing to replace the US dollar in the short term. not gold. not the Chinese Yuan, not the Euro. Nothing. If you come up with a valid way for wide-spread paper currency to exist without the US dollar, in the next few years or so... I'm all ears. Please let me know. We will not go back to the gold standard... that's hog-wash.

it seems to me that many people are imposing their political alarmism on an economic situation. I don't see how we get from a housing bubble to Zimbabwe style hyper-inflation. We are not greece, there is growth and there is upside.

Im not a silverbug or goldbug, i simply taught myself to understand cycles within the market for the purpose of taking responsibility for my own finances. The moment Silver/Gold is overbought then you'll be calling me a Landbug or stocks bug. There's a new bull market emerging and its obvious that its commodities, however many will sit there and play ostrich with their head in the sand and their money on the Dow/S&P. We'll see soon enough. I understand that Silver and Gold (especially silver) are manipulated and suppressed by the market that you think is a "free" one, yet assets traded on the market are controlled through fraudulent paper derivatives on metals that were "leased"...lol Believe it or not, but you're not conversating with a moron here. Money, by its very definition isnt a liability but an asset, yet the US dollar has debt attached to it. Its created out of nothing through debt is it not? How do bullion banks lease silver and gold anyway? Does that even make sense? Better question...do you even know how? You have alot of information to look up and learn if you want to get a legit opinion across on this topic.

Ipods/Ipads/Mac computers were "designed" in California but mostly "made" in China. My question is what do we make here? We dont make Ipods here. Designing something and producing something are not the same, Just like Currency and Money isnt the same, Just like Manipulated markets and Free markets arent the same, Just like assets and liability isnt the same.

Just seeing how you responded to this and how you "feel" about silver/goldbugs and how you're "hopeful" about the bounce back only re-confirms to me that 95% of the stuff you type is based on emotion. Its not based on rational thinking and a knowledge of history because if it was you would know the dangers of fiat and what to expect. You'd also recognize the signs and plan accordingly instead of holding on to false hope with quantitative easing. And we all know that QE is always introduced "after" the original monetary set-up failed. Whats more important is that through the history of QE we've never in human history seen it work and turn around an economy...yet you criticize silverbugs for grabbing for real assets???? lmao. Also, with this being the first time in history that every currency on the planet is fiat. Like I said, we'll see whos right...you or history.

P.S. Since you introduced me to the definition of service based economy, let me service you to the reality of things with a smile The Government needs computers, they'll call IBMs service office in the US and put in an order. That order is then transfered from the service rep (US) to the manufacture (China). China produces the products for sale (which adds to China's GDP) and then it is exported from China (Which Adds to Chinas GDP) to the US to be handed over to the governmetn who orderd it. Question, where's the money made by the US for this transaction to support GDP? lol. If you're going to give me definitions and tell me what has been invented here then I suggest that you dig deeper in this conversation. Think "outside" the box, gather real information and come up with your own conclusions. Granted, doing that will make some say that you're a moron (like when I say vaccines are bad for you) but you'll know the truth...while others play catch up. Enjoy the Jet game tonight.

[serphnx]

Gold is great, but probably too late now. There was a really good fund that mostly just invested in 3 major mining stocks and a gold ETF but I forgot its name. If you had dropped $50k in that 3 years ago you're probably just about in retirement mode now, or at least, you're in a good spot.

Of course other people like to hold onto things physically and aren't sold on a piece of paper. Gold and silver is manipulated and the major players are trying to keep the price down. JP Morgan has something like 100 million oz. shorted, and since it's just going up they are going to crash really hard soon. I think I read that is due at the end of this week.

So if you hear about a JP Morgan bailout coming up within the next couple of weeks that's your reason. Pure unadulterated greed.

Buffet no longer has silver though villain, he sold it at around $6/oz way back in London. It pretty much became the SLV ETF.

Physical is good to have but you should have been collecting it for awhile. I have a tiny stash, mostly because I just like the coins, but nothing major. If silver continues to go up I'll sell some of it probably just to cover the costs. Eventually I'll probably retire off this, after 30 years or so of collecting especially if there's another spike like right now.

Gold and silver will go back down to their historic lows in about 10-20 years. Then you have about 30 more years to collect it again.

@villain: It sounds like you have a physical stash. Do you have any silver Kookaburras? I'm a pretty big fan of those, maybe we can work out a trade. I have a few of the 2011 Canadian silver wolfs that I want to unload. I don't have any physical gold but eventually I'm going to start grabbing some gold eagles and then a bunch of random coins off of the Perth mint. PM me when you get the chance if you're interested.

[villain_the_foe]

Gold is great, but probably too late now. There was a really good fund that mostly just invested in 3 major mining stocks and a gold ETF but I forgot its name. If you had dropped $50k in that 3 years ago you're probably just about in retirement mode now, or at least, you're in a good spot.

Of course other people like to hold onto things physically and aren't sold on a piece of paper. Gold and silver is manipulated and the major players are trying to keep the price down. JP Morgan has something like 100 million oz. shorted, and since it's just going up they are going to crash really hard soon. I think I read that is due at the end of this week.

So if you hear about a JP Morgan bailout coming up within the next couple of weeks that's your reason. Pure unadulterated greed.

Buffet no longer has silver though villain, he sold it at around $6/oz way back in London. It pretty much became the SLV ETF.

Physical is good to have but you should have been collecting it for awhile. I have a tiny stash, mostly because I just like the coins, but nothing major. If silver continues to go up I'll sell some of it probably just to cover the costs. Eventually I'll probably retire off this, after 30 years or so of collecting especially if there's another spike like right now.

Gold and silver will go back down to their historic lows in about 10-20 years. Then you have about 30 more years to collect it again.

@villain: It sounds like you have a physical stash. Do you have any silver Kookaburras? I'm a pretty big fan of those, maybe we can work out a trade. I have a few of the 2011 Canadian silver wolfs that I want to unload. I don't have any physical gold but eventually I'm going to start grabbing some gold eagles and then a bunch of random coins off of the Perth mint. PM me when you get the chance if you're interested.

Yeah, I heard that Buffett sold, however, there was speculation that he leased out the silver for the purpose of funding the "un-audited" reserves for the iSilver SLV ETF and the LBMA in London. Thats actually the main reason why I would never purchase an SLV ETF. If you cant audit whats there then whats the point? I'd rather jump into a mining stock and take my chances there. You're right though, he did state a few years back that he sold.

I think we have about a 20 year run with Silver. Gold/Silver was in a bear market for 30 years leading up to 2001 for Gold and I say 2006 for Silver.

As for a stash, I have one. I used to buy government issued coins (favs being the maple leaf) but outside of junk silver I stopped some time back and just dealt with private minted silver given that I want to be as unregulated as possible in the future...and also to keep premiums on the metals I buy as low to spot price as possible.

Unfortunately I have no Kooks. I've actually seen these coins in person and LOVE their designs, very detailed with extreme gloss (seen a 1 kilo)...but the premiums per ounce are just ridiculous. Its a waste of money when at the end of the day when Silver becomes "the" commodity its all going into the same melting pot.

I used to deal with Gold, but seeing that the gold/silver ratio is closing favoring silver in I've stopped buying gold to deal with silver. Also, Gold has become a household name. And we all know that the "boom" always precedes the "bust"...and Gold is booming right now all over TV. Its lets me know to stay away from it because its been commercialized.

[Jetlag]

SILVER!!!!!!!

A few tidbits.

-Central Banks globally are in a race to print the ever living sh*t out of their currency. Inflation will occur big time.

-Metal commodities are the best way to hedge paper money because you cannot create more gold/silver/platinum...from thin air. Labor must get involved.

-Silver historically has held a 16-1 ratio to the price of gold, right now it's at about 58-1.

-Gold has reached is all time high (although it will certainly blow past 2,000 in the next year and the few economists whom I trust because they foresaw all of this, are predicting anywhere from 4000-5000). That said SILVER is still 50% below it's all-time high of $50/oz.

Silver is one of the absolute certainties going forward. But don't take my word for it, here's an article from well respected global investor Jim Rogers. http://www.bi-me.com/main.php?id=48835&t=1&c=62&cg=4&mset=

[Jetlag]

I didn't read the thread before my last post but now I'm seeing that my view is shared by some other bright posters.

End the Fed!

[villain_the_foe]

SILVER!!!!!!!

A few tidbits.

-Central Banks globally are in a race to print the ever living sh*t out of their currency. Inflation will occur big time.

-Metal commodities are the best way to hedge paper money because you cannot create more gold/silver/platinum...from thin air. Labor must get involved.

-Silver historically has held a 16-1 ratio to the price of gold, right now it's at about 58-1.

-Gold has reached is all time high (although it will certainly blow past 2,000 in the next year and the few economists whom I trust because they foresaw all of this, are predicting anywhere from 4000-5000). That said SILVER is still 50% below it's all-time high of $50/oz.

Silver is one of the absolute certainties going forward. But don't take my word for it, here's an article from well respected global investor Jim Rogers. http://www.bi-me.com/main.php?id=48835&t=1&c=62&cg=4&mset=

Jim Rogers is one of the pioneers on the subject of Silver as well as agriculture.

I highlighted the $50 all time high because I think thats a good point that you bring up, and yet another reason why I stay away from Gold. Gold passed its all-time high of $800+ dollars some time ago, and everyday that gold goes up is setting a new high. What I like about Silver is that technically its 80% under its all-time high if you apply the inflation rate of today. With that Said Silver's "inflation adjusted" all-time high is about $132 an oz, which means silver is 82% under its all-time high.

Silver has no choice but to explode. Not only does the ratio have to re-adjust, but it will also have to account for inflation which is happening all over the world with this global currency debasement. Silver is absolutely affordable right now so there's no reason for people to stay in the Ponzi scheme...I mean the Dollar.

[villain_the_foe]

I didn't read the thread before my last post but now I'm seeing that my view is shared by some other bright posters.

End the Fed!

+1

[Jetlag]

Jim Rogers is one of the pioneers on the subject of Silver as well as agriculture.

I highlighted the $50 all time high because I think thats a good point that you bring up, and yet another reason why I stay away from Gold. Gold passed its all-time high of $800+ dollars some time ago, and everyday that gold goes up is setting a new high. What I like about Silver is that technically its 80% under its all-time high if you apply the inflation rate of today. With that Said Silver's "inflation adjusted" all-time high is about $132 an oz, which means silver is 82% under its all-time high.

Silver has no choice but to explode. Not only does the ratio have to re-adjust, but it will also have to account for inflation which is happening all over the world with this global currency debasement. Silver is absolutely affordable right now so there's no reason for people to stay in the Ponzi scheme...I mean the Dollar.

I started buying junk silver when it was at 14.50 and accumulated most of my small stash at about 16-18. I haven't gone in a few months to pick up more but I think it's about time. Although I'm trying to wait for a sell-off. I'm hoping it'll dip back to 21-22 so I can reload.

[villain_the_foe]

I started buying junk silver when it was at 14.50 and accumulated most of my small stash at about 16-18. I haven't gone in a few months to pick up more but I think it's about time. Although I'm trying to wait for a sell-off. I'm hoping it'll dip back to 21-22 so I can reload.

The sell-off is coming. There's ALOT of speculators that are still in it for quick cash and not for wealth preservation. Silvers rise has been on a 45 degree angle since August. A retracement has to come sometime...and when that tree is shaken all the speculators are going to sell, and we should be right there to pick it up!

I've always been interested in the metals, learning about it for like a year, and I jumped in when it was 18 dollars. I wished I would have jumped in when it was 9 dollars but I wasnt knowledgeable of the market then.

Anyway, I attached a book to this quote from David Morgan. One of my favorites on the subject. Hope it gives you some info.

[Jetlag]

The sell-off is coming. There's ALOT of speculators that are still in it for quick cash and not for wealth preservation. Silvers rise has been on a 45 degree angle since August. A retracement has to come sometime...and when that tree is shaken all the speculators are going to sell, and we should be right there to pick it up!

I've always been interested in the metals, learning about it for like a year, and I jumped in when it was 18 dollars. I wished I would have jumped in when it was 9 dollars but I wasnt knowledgeable of the market then.

Anyway, I attached a book to this quote from David Morgan. One of my favorites on the subject. Hope it gives you some info.

BTW, not sure if you're a gun owner but I'd advise a few shotguns to go along with your silver stash. I will be getting one soon enough. Ammo will be a hot commodity.

[villain_the_foe]

BTW, not sure if you're a gun owner but I'd advise a few shotguns to go along with your silver stash. I will be getting one soon enough. Ammo will be a hot commodity.

A gun owner...in NYC??? lmao. You seen what Bloomberg did to Plaxico....AND HE SHOT HIMSELF???? lol.

Seriously though, good looks for the info. I thought about it but I personally stay away from guns. Yeah I protect my wealth, but if it came down to me having to threaten or take a life then I'd rather not and just give it up.

Gold & Silver is very important right about now, but I know that this is all just a big azz game that we're playing and I'd rather keep my spirituality in tact and not forget whats most important.

EDIT: Not sure if you heard, but Japan has been buying silver like there's no tomorrow! What else are you gonna do with 0% interest rates and the debasement of currency (sound familiar)? lol. That should also show the importants of Silver, because the profit margins will be how Japan stimulates their economy. I mean, if they're going to go to 0% then thats a smart move IMO. I hope the rest of us here get on the ball with it, because we've been at 0% or a 1/2% for years now...its been only like a week for Japan.

[serphnx]

The premiums usually aren't a big deal because you get it back on sales too. I guess it depends on if you look at the numismatic value or not, Kooks generally sell for above spot/more than generics. Since I'm generally buying as a hedge/with disposable money I'm not too worried about the premiums now. If I'm paying a buck more or whatever it is, I'll get it back on the sales end anyway when I eventually sell.

I have a few bars, I do like the bars. They are the closest to spot you can usually get. The bars I get more for the investment, the coins I get because I like how they look, they are recognizable, and they have numismatic value usually too. In 30 years, a 2011 Kook will have value above spot because silver isn't just silver, there is definitely a market for collectors. Unless you think a total collapse will happen not only of currency but numismatic value. Still, diversifying never hurt anybody and isn't bad for silver either. You can do worse things than having bars, generics and government issue. A positive to government issue is it wouldn't need a testing kit and is generally accepted on visual appraisal, which isn't the case for most others.

Gold adjusted for inflation should be at $2500 actually from what I've read, so it does have a ways to go. That is if you take those inflation numbers seriously. I take it with a grain of salt myself, they are usually overestimated. Still too late to get into gold probably. I expect a correction for both gold and silver soon, but after that, neither will face much resistance up to the historic highs adjusted for inflation.

[villain_the_foe]

The premiums usually aren't a big deal because you get it back on sales too. I guess it depends on if you look at the numismatic value or not, Kooks generally sell for above spot/more than generics. Since I'm generally buying as a hedge/with disposable money I'm not too worried about the premiums now. If I'm paying a buck more or whatever it is, I'll get it back on the sales end anyway when I eventually sell.

I have a few bars, I do like the bars. They are the closest to spot you can usually get. The bars I get more for the investment, the coins I get because I like how they look, they are recognizable, and they have numismatic value usually too. In 30 years, a 2011 Kook will have value above spot because silver isn't just silver, there is definitely a market for collectors. Unless you think a total collapse will happen not only of currency but numismatic value. Still, diversifying never hurt anybody and isn't bad for silver either. You can do worse things than having bars, generics and government issue. A positive to government issue is it wouldn't need a testing kit and is generally accepted on visual appraisal, which isn't the case for most others.

Gold adjusted for inflation should be at $2500 actually from what I've read, so it does have a ways to go. That is if you take those inflation numbers seriously. I take it with a grain of salt myself, they are usually overestimated. Still too late to get into gold probably. I expect a correction for both gold and silver soon, but after that, neither will face much resistance up to the historic highs adjusted for inflation.

I'd have to disagree with silver just not being silver. In the next couple years then yes you have a point with the premiums. However, with the looks of things regarding global inflation and rise of silver its going to get to a point where if you can get the same oz of silver for less money then whats that going to do for the premiums that you initially paid for? You'll loose it in the long run. Im in it for the long run. With that said, I'll get any type of silver, whether its junk, shoot, bars etc because if it gets to a point where inflation is a global issue people are not going to pay a premium because its a Kook on a coin...or it says Johnson Matthey or Englehard on the bars. That goes for numismatics as well, because if you're an investor and not a collector then the numismatic value means nothing...its the intrinsic value that you're interested in. A knowledeable investor is not going to pay a numismatic price for a coin that has the same metal content as another coin $100 less. The rarity of a coin when trying to preserve wealth through intrinsic value is erroneous.

What they're going to care about is if its .999 or not. I'd rather put that premium money into metals, because in the future its all going to the melting pot for industry support for these new developing 3rd worlds.

the US just raised the premium on American Silver Eagles by 33% a few weeks ago (50 cents extra per coin totalling $2 per coin in premiums). Now if you're buying a roll of 20 Silver Eagles for example, you just lost a half ounce worth of money on premiums. At the end of the day the silver will be worth more than the premium even if you were able to charge a premium...which IMO wont matter once silver passes its $132 All time inflated adjusted high.

I personally think that Silver has a realistic chance of one day surpassing gold in value. I think Silver is going to massively overshoot. Its a long shot...but im certain that Silver will atleast see a 10/1 ratio, most likely 5/1. IMO people are not going to pay extra in premiums for basically a coin design in an overly inflated economy and Gold to the moon.

[serphnx]

Yeah I don't really care too much about maximizing my profits. I figure I'll make a big gain regardless and I don't need to sweat a $1/oz premium here or there, or whatever it is. And if I don't, I also don't care, this is the very definition of high reward low risk for me. It's not like I'm going to quit my day job.

Silver passed $24 today. There should be no resistance until $25, after $25 is crossed $50 is the next milestone.

The feds are apparently investigating JP Morgan for trying to manipulate silver prices. Criminal charges might be filed. When that goes down, watch out, who knows how artificially low they kept the price.

[villain_the_foe]

Yeah I don't really care too much about maximizing my profits. I figure I'll make a big gain regardless and I don't need to sweat a $1/oz premium here or there, or whatever it is. And if I don't, I also don't care, this is the very definition of high reward low risk for me. It's not like I'm going to quit my day job.

Silver passed $24 today. There should be no resistance until $25, after $25 is crossed $50 is the next milestone.

The feds are apparently investigating JP Morgan for trying to manipulate silver prices. Criminal charges might be filed. When that goes down, watch out, who knows how artificially low they kept the price.

Yeah, Silver is up 3% in a day and it closed in on the gold/silver ratio from 58/1 to 57/1. There has to be some type of consolidation in the Silver market coming soon, but no major retracement IMO and once that consolidation comes in to support the next leg up I think we'll see $30 easily before the new year.

As for JP Morgan, They'll just get hit with some million dollar fines which they can pay off with the money tissue that they wipe their behinds with. However, this will certainly open the market even further for an already bullish, though undervalued Silver market.

Dude, did you see the market today in general??? EVERYTHING went up today,...except the dollar of course which went down a quarter%.

[bitonti]

BTW, not sure if you're a gun owner but I'd advise a few shotguns to go along with your silver stash. I will be getting one soon enough. Ammo will be a hot commodity.

this is the mindset of a commodities investor. don't pretend that people are gonna buy silver and eventually sell it for US dollars.

It's going in a panic room with the shotguns, canned beans, gas masks and water filters.

if you buy something and never sell it, that's not an investment strategy.

The markets have been recovering alot better than main street. End the Fed? ok let's the end con edison and public schools while we are at it. Not gonna happen.

[MasonJet]

I don't know about silver and gold but graphene is the material of the future.

Theoretical physicist Michio Kaku on graphene:

http://bigthink.com/ideas/24381

Since then, in the past 6 years, scientists have discovered that the substance retains some amazing properties. Some say that it will be heralded as one of the materials that will literally change our lives in the 21st century. Not only is graphene the thinnest possible material that is feasible, but it's also about 200 times stronger than steel and conducts electricity better than any material known to man—at room temperature. Researchers at Columbia University's Fu Foundation School of Engineering who proved that graphene is the strongest material ever measured said that "It would take an elephant, balanced on a pencil, to break through a sheet of graphene the thickness of Saran Wrap."

If you follow my work, you have surely heard me speak about Moore's Law and the race to find a suitable replacement for silicon semi-conductors. Graphene may in fact be the answer to these problems. The fastest growing problem facing chip engineers around the world is that everyone wants to increase power, make chips smaller and achieve both of these without significantly rising the temperature. The development of graphene transistors would in theory be able to run at much faster speeds and be able to ultimately battle the heat at a microscopic scale.

http://www.popsci.com/technology/gallery/2010-10/graphenes-greatest-hits

This material is a strong candidate to replace silicon in computer processors, among many other amazing things. I think the words I'm looking for are..cha-ching.

[bitonti]

here's what I want you guys to do:

Go to your favorite watering hole. Order a nice frosty beer (or two). Try to pay using Silver.

[villain_the_foe]

this is the mindset of a commodities investor. don't pretend that people are gonna buy silver and eventually sell it for US dollars.

It's going in a panic room with the shotguns, canned beans, gas masks and water filters.

if you buy something and never sell it, that's not an investment strategy.

The markets have been recovering alot better than main street. End the Fed? ok let's the end con edison and public schools while we are at it. Not gonna happen.

lol.