WWWWombat Posted August 7, 2011 Share Posted August 7, 2011 In the 11 games after Moss was traded welker had 60 Catches 5.5 a game and 631 Yards. That prorates over a season to 917 yards. Thats just OK. Nothing amazing at all. He wouldn't be in the top 23 of WR's in yards and he was the no 1 target. There is no real number one target in New England without Moss. Belichick era New England receivers didn't put up gaudy numbers before Moss came (Troy Brown only topped 1,000 yards once). Welker definitely benefited from Moss, but I still think he is a very good WR without him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted August 7, 2011 Share Posted August 7, 2011 Pats TEs are better than Keller, by a lot. Welker is better than Mason, especially with Ocho taking attention away from him. I know Jets fans diminish Welker, but he's basically the super-charged Chrebet. Ocho=Plaxico: two older dudes who may or may not suck at this point. Holmes is better than Branch, by a lot. The Pats TEs by a mile? Maybe because they have two. But Keller=Hernandez=Gronkowski. They are all pretty even in performance. If Keller ever lived up to expectations he'd blow them both away. Holmes is by far the best receiver on either team. If Plax is 85% of what he was his last year for the Giants, the Jets have the better receivers by a wide margin. The Jets also have two backs who can make plays out of the backfield now in LT and Powell. Of course Brady is better and he better continue to be significantly so if he wants to win the division. If Sanchez improves by the same percentage he did from his rookie to his second year, the Pats are going to be hard pressed to win the division because we should sweep their worthless asses. Brady's 34 and trending downward. Sanchez is 25 and trending upward. I like the position our team is in. Unless Sanchez sh*ts the bed, we're gonna be one hell of a team this year. Oh, and Mr. Shane, make sure you work the balls when you suck off Brady this year. I think the only Jets fan who loves Brady more than you is 124. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doggin94it Posted August 7, 2011 Share Posted August 7, 2011 Running the football is going to be a lot harder vs the pats this season. My guess is we're going to see a lot of 4 man fronts in running situation with Ellis, Haynesworth, Wilfork, and Warren. Thats just horrifying. I'll bet you $100 you never see that 4some on the Pats DL at the same time this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangreenman Posted August 7, 2011 Share Posted August 7, 2011 I'll bet you $100 you never see that 4some on the Pats DL at the same time this season. Hell no. I'd like it very much if you;re right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted August 7, 2011 Share Posted August 7, 2011 I'll bet you $100 you never see that 4some on the Pats DL at the same time this season. Hell, I'll bet him ten million dollars you won't see Shaun Ellis, Vince Wilfork, Albert Haynesworth and Ty Warren on the Pats DL at the same time this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmikeisback Posted August 7, 2011 Share Posted August 7, 2011 There is no real number one target in New England without Moss. Belichick era New England receivers didn't put up gaudy numbers before Moss came (Troy Brown only topped 1,000 yards once). Welker definitely benefited from Moss, but I still think he is a very good WR without him. Maybe because they are awful at drafting WR's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doggin94it Posted August 7, 2011 Share Posted August 7, 2011 Hell no. I'd like it very much if you;re right. I'll give you odds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doggin94it Posted August 7, 2011 Share Posted August 7, 2011 (the pats cut ty warren, he's now a bronco) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JiFtheOracle Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Oh, and Mr. Shane, make sure you work the balls when you suck off Brady this year. I think the only Jets fan who loves Brady more than you is 124. Dont mess w/ Captain Klacko. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatriotReign37 Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Ridiculous. He kind up in the slot, but he's your best receiver, not your number 3 1 Ocho 2 Branch 3 West The slot WR is a safety valve when the other 2 guys are covered. Moss was the #1 when he was there. Wouldnt you agree? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatriotReign37 Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 The Pats TEs by a mile? Maybe because they have two. But Keller=Hernandez=Gronkowski. They are all pretty even in performance. If Keller ever lived up to expectations he'd blow them both away. Holmes is by far the best receiver on either team. If Plax is 85% of what he was his last year for the Giants, the Jets have the better receivers by a wide margin. The Jets also have two backs who can make plays out of the backfield now in LT and Powell. Of course Brady is better and he better continue to be significantly so if he wants to win the division. If Sanchez improves by the same percentage he did from his rookie to his second year, the Pats are going to be hard pressed to win the division because we should sweep their worthless asses. Brady's 34 and trending downward. Sanchez is 25 and trending upward. I like the position our team is in. Unless Sanchez sh*ts the bed, we're gonna be one hell of a team this year. Oh, and Mr. Shane, make sure you work the balls when you suck off Brady this year. I think the only Jets fan who loves Brady more than you is 124. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatriotReign37 Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 What unnerves me would be an un-bracketed Welker and an improved pair of TE's that we didn't match up well against in the first place. If Ocho+Branch do nothing else against us, they at least require some safety attention. Add in the return of Kevin Faulk and the drafting of future-pain-in-the-a$$ Shane Vereen and it looks like Belichick plans on giving up on throwing it outside the hashes altogether. Vereen is injured, but Ridley has been surprisingly good FWIW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Wow! Thank you for the in-depth, insightful analysis as always. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 I know Jets fans diminish Welker, but he's basically the super-charged Chrebet. Pfff. I can assure you that Chrebet's lunch pail is way sexier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
villain_the_foe Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Really depends on plaxico... Our #1 is obviously better, they have less question marks. They are also a ton better at TE... But as others have said, there's no way to judge this arguement cause the Pats have a ton more at QB Hey CTM. I tried to respond to your PM but for some reason it says that you cannot recieve messages. Hit me when you get a chance. I wanted to respond to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangreenman Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 (the pats cut ty warren, he's now a bronco) Well, glad I didn't take the bet then! Lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetsFanInDenver Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 This is absolutely absurd. Cotch didn't want to be the Jets #3, what the hell makes you think he'd have any interest in being the #4? Not only that, if the Jets signed Braylon, they don't sign Plax. Oh, and your second WR lineup also needs to decide what other signed players are not going to be on this teams roster, since you're talking about a whooole lot more money for the WR corps. You know what, I think the Jets WR Corps would've been better if the traded for Calvin Johnson, Andre Johnson and Larry Fitzgerald. Why didn't they do that? What whole lot of money are we talking about ? Braylon signed for 1 mill with steep performance clause that only go upto 3.5 mill. Ahhh..sarcasm. Great job! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetsFanInDenver Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Honestly, the first option is better because you've got two guys there who can be effective inside. Really don't even have one with the second option. We have the inside covered. Now who is going to stretch the field ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 What whole lot of money are we talking about ? Braylon signed for 1 mill with steep performance clause that only go upto 3.5 mill. Ahhh..sarcasm. Great job! Oh, so you're one of those people who just pretends that Edwards would have signed for that with the Jets, despite the fact that all published reports state the contrary, and that he actually rejected bigger offers than that from the Jets? When he was negotiating with the Jets, he was looking for far more than that, and only really dropped his number so much once the Jets were out of the picture and he realized nobody else was willing to pay him what he wanted either. Not to mention your scenario also saw the Jets still signing Plax in addition to Braylon AND keeping Cotchery (ignoring that he didn't want to be here), which is why it would be far more money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetsFanInDenver Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Oh, so you're one of those people who just pretends that Edwards would have signed for that with the Jets, despite the fact that all published reports state the contrary, and that he actually rejected bigger offers than that from the Jets? When he was negotiating with the Jets, he was looking for far more than that, and only really dropped his number so much once the Jets were out of the picture and he realized nobody else was willing to pay him what he wanted either. Not to mention your scenario also saw the Jets still signing Plax in addition to Braylon AND keeping Cotchery (ignoring that he didn't want to be here), which is why it would be far more money. I am not sure of the what really happened behind closed doors. But one thing for sure isn't that the job of the FO to get it done at decent price. Once we drop out does not mean its a line in sand. As a FO on this one we defintiely dropped the ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NFL Fan Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 As an unbias fan of the nfl, the patriots wr are better. And Gronk is better than any TE the jets could ever dream of having. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JiFtheOracle Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 As an unbias fan of the nfl, the patriots wr are better. And Gronk is better than any TE the jets could ever dream of having. Come'on, are you saying the Jets cant dream of having a Gates or Tony G.??? I mean, its just a dream. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Oh, so you're one of those people who just pretends that Edwards would have signed for that with the Jets, despite the fact that all published reports state the contrary, and that he actually rejected bigger offers than that from the Jets? When he was negotiating with the Jets, he was looking for far more than that, and only really dropped his number so much once the Jets were out of the picture and he realized nobody else was willing to pay him what he wanted either. Not to mention your scenario also saw the Jets still signing Plax in addition to Braylon AND keeping Cotchery (ignoring that he didn't want to be here), which is why it would be far more money. All anyone needs to know about Braylon is this: when he signed with the 49ers he tweeted that he wanted to be the second coming of T.O. I guess that means he intends to be a locker room cancer who argues with the OC on the sidelines and calls their QB a "faggot" in interviews. If Braylon wanted to endear himself to 49ers fans, there is a WR who played for that organization who is worthy of emulation whose name is not Terrell Owens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Come'on, are you saying the Jets cant dream of having a Gates or Tony G.??? I mean, its just a dream. Yeah, I think I can dream of much better TEs than one that a Patsy troll disguising himself as a general "NFL fan" faps to when he goes to bed every night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JiFtheOracle Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Yeah, I think I can dream of much better TEs than one that a Patsy troll disguising himself as a general "NFL fan" faps to when he goes to bed every night. Maybe the Jets cant dream big. You know, maybe they have very realistic dreams or maybe they dream of worse players than Keller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Maybe the Jets cant dream big. You know, maybe they have very realistic dreams or maybe they dream of worse players than Keller. Can you dream of Keller ever living up to his ability? I can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JiFtheOracle Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 Can you dream of Keller ever living up to his ability? I can. Depends...if living up to his ability means he's better than Gronk, then no. Because I cant dream of ever having a TE better than Gronk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doggin94it Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 1 Ocho 2 Branch 3 West The slot WR is a safety valve when the other 2 guys are covered. Moss was the #1 when he was there. Wouldnt you agree? you are being ridiculous. Will Welker be on the field in 2WR sets? Then he's not your third receiver. He's your best receiver. Moss was your number 1 not because he played outside, but because he was better than Welker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jared Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 I think WRs 1 to 3 are a wash. Too many question marks between Plaxico and Ocho. Both have the capability to be 1000+ receivers, but one is on the decline and the other has been out of football for two years. Mason and Branch are both dependable veterans (though one is much more "veteran" than the other) and Santonio and Wes are both very good at what they do. For the Patriots 2 TE set, I'll take Gronk and Hernandez over Keller, just because I know they can perform. Keller is very good in his own right, but hasn't had the opportunity to prove it on a consistent basis. For now I give the slight edge to the Patriots. As for receiving RBs, LT is good, but Woodhead and Faulk are also right up there (Faulk with more experience and vision, Woodhead with pure speed). LT is probably between Faulk and Woodhead in terms of athleticism at this point in his career, so I'm inclined to call this a wash as well. Of course when you factor in QB and OC, passing game goes to the Pats in a landslide, but I suppose that is why we're not supposed to take those into account. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 I think WRs 1 to 3 are a wash. Too many question marks between Plaxico and Ocho. Both have the capability to be 1000+ receivers, but one is on the decline and the other has been out of football for two years. Mason and Branch are both dependable veterans (though one is much more "veteran" than the other) and Santonio and Wes are both very good at what they do. For the Patriots 2 TE set, I'll take Gronk and Hernandez over Keller, just because I know they can perform. Keller is very good in his own right, but hasn't had the opportunity to prove it on a consistent basis. For now I give the slight edge to the Patriots. As for receiving RBs, LT is good, but Woodhead and Faulk are also right up there (Faulk with more experience and vision, Woodhead with pure speed). LT is probably between Faulk and Woodhead in terms of athleticism at this point in his career, so I'm inclined to call this a wash as well. Of course when you factor in QB and OC, passing game goes to the Pats in a landslide, but I suppose that is why we're not supposed to take those into account. You've clearly never seen Bilal Powell play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jared Posted August 8, 2011 Share Posted August 8, 2011 As I mentioned in another offseason thread, I don't like to take into account possible rookie performances. So neither Powell nor Vareen for the Patriots are part of my consideration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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