44 replies to this topic

[JetsFanInDenver]

It would be nice if Santonio and Marks agents got inducted into the Hall of Fame in the same year

 

Meh....

 

They only outsmarted Tanny!

[slats]

How the **** does it put the team's interests before his own? He gets his money NOW. Money now is better than money paid in 16 installments, no matter how you term it. It might make him easier to trade if he wants that and IT DOES NOT IN ANY WAY HARM HIM OR MAKE HIM EARN (or not earn) A PENNY LESS. He'd have to be a complete douche not to take that deal and his agent would risk being blackballed for douchebaggery.

I tried explaining this a month ago. Bit doesn't get it. Knowing that Bit likes to really dig in with his opinions, I've given up.

[bitonti]

I tried explaining this a month ago. Bit doesn't get it. Knowing that Bit likes to really dig in with his opinions, I've given up.

 

 

I put myself in the players shoes. If my job pays me 12,000 a year. And instead of give me 12 monthly payments of a 1000, they give it all up front. How is that any better? The time value of money is basically nothing because the interest rates are zero. 

[Sperm Edwards]

it's not really better. it's the same. If my job offered me my salary up front i'd feel like i was working for free by December. 

 

and with interest rates at a historic low it really doesn't matter. what he's gonna earn < 1% in a savings account? 

 

the difference between now and later isn't worth the time to go into the office to sign the contract. It's meh. 

 

Your job doesn't have NFL salary cap rules.  Money paid to you in 2013 is fully on the books for 2013 whether you take it in advance as a bonus or weekly/bi-weekly as paychecks.  There is no similarity.

 

I'm sure Mark sees himself as a team leader (this team or another team in the future).  Let's see him explain to the team how he wouldn't take some millions in advance of the season instead of later on over the course of the season, and how the team ended up with millions less in cap room this year for another player because it wasn't worth his time to go into the office to sign a contract.

 

Bit, it would never ever happen like that.

 

And for the record, I'm against it anyway.  I'm still for cutting him this year and being 100% free and clear of him after the season's over.  There is a 0% chance of the Jets winning a superbowl this year with so many actual or relative holes on the team and so little cap space to do anything about it.

[bitonti]

Your job doesn't have NFL salary cap rules.  Money paid to you in 2013 is fully on the books for 2013 whether you take it in advance as a bonus or weekly/bi-weekly as paychecks.  There is no similarity.

 

I'm sure Mark sees himself as a team leader (this team or another team in the future).  Let's see him explain to the team how he wouldn't take some millions in advance of the season instead of later on over the course of the season, and how the team ended up with millions less in cap room this year for another player because it wasn't worth his time to go into the office to sign a contract.

 

Bit, it would never ever happen like that.

 

And for the record, I'm against it anyway.  I'm still for cutting him this year and being 100% free and clear of him after the season's over.  There is a 0% chance of the Jets winning a superbowl this year with so many actual or relative holes on the team and so little cap space to do anything about it.

 

yes mark needs to be a team leader by making himself easier to cut or trade. Can anyone find a situation where this has happened before? where a player converted guarunteed salary to bonus without getting a raise? Im not talking about what's possible i'm talking about what will happen. Any agent worth their licence would want something out of the deal. Players don't make deals for no reason. Neither do teams. Everyone acts in their own economic interest. There is no advantage to the player to get his money up front. It's just a different delivery method.

 

The only reason Mark would make this deal is if he wanted to leave NY. In which case his "team leadership" is not relevant. 

Edited by bitonti, 21 February 2013 - 09:00 AM.

[Sperm Edwards]

yes mark needs to be a team leader by making himself easier to cut or trade. Can anyone find a situation where this has happened before? where a player converted guarunteed salary to bonus without getting a raise? Im not talking about what's possible i'm talking about what will happen. Any agent worth their licence would want something out of the deal. Players don't make deals for no reason. Neither do teams. Everyone acts in their own economic interest. There is no advantage to the player to get his money up front. It's just a different delivery method.

 

The only reason Mark would make this deal is if he wanted to leave NY. In which case his "team leadership" is not relevant. 

 

Don't agree with any of this.  In no small part because doing this doesn't even mean he gets traded.  If you can find an instance of a player refusing to take money in advance to help the team clear cap room - with no pay cut - then I'll stand corrected.  But the onus is on you, since you're the one saying he wouldn't do that.  Not to mention your analogy to your own finances is kind of silly and irrelevant.

[flgreen]

I put myself in the players shoes. If my job pays me 12,000 a year. And instead of give me 12 monthly payments of a 1000, they give it all up front. How is that any better? The time value of money is basically nothing because the interest rates are zero. 

Your correct.  Getting $12,000 a year up front, when you have to live on it, isn’t much money in interest.

 

$12,000,000 up front is a different situation.  Even if you live like a Duke, and spend $2,000,000, you still have $10,000,000 to invest.  Your not putting that money in a savings account, if you are smart, your investing it.

 

If you have good advisors the investment return on $10,000,000 is significant.  Always take the money up front

[#27TheDominator]

yes mark needs to be a team leader by making himself easier to cut or trade. Can anyone find a situation where this has happened before? where a player converted guarunteed salary to bonus without getting a raise? Im not talking about what's possible i'm talking about what will happen. Any agent worth their licence would want something out of the deal. Players don't make deals for no reason. Neither do teams. Everyone acts in their own economic interest. There is no advantage to the player to get his money up front. It's just a different delivery method.

 

The only reason Mark would make this deal is if he wanted to leave NY. In which case his "team leadership" is not relevant. 

 

It happens so ******* often they don't even report on it now.  IIRC, off the top of my head, Scott did it before he even played a game with the team.  Jonathan Stewart did it recently. Julius Peppers did it barely into that big deal with the Bears, I remember reading about it when we were interviewing Angelo for the GM job.  It is routine.

 

PS:  The interest rates are not 0 and getting money now is always better, unless you are a crackhead. 

[jack48]

ok but why would he do this? Cause he feels bad?  Gholston actually gave money back towards the end but it's pretty rare for a player to put the team's interest before his own. 

 

 

by the way the original thread title talks about Revis and March 15. Even the trade Revis crowd should be able to realize this is selling him at a low to move him now. No one's seen him run or cut. He can't really pass a physical right now. The 1 mil bonus means the jets are up against a clock and everyne knows it. They would get fleeced in any deal.

 

If you want to move Revis the time to do it is in the season, when everyone sees he's back, teams are aware that they are SB contenders (or not) and even the Jets can decide whether 2013 is really a lost year. Trading him now is like selling your stock the day after a crash. 

Well, if he had a conscience he might.  But these players think nothing of taking the money.  He has essentially been grossly overpaid for his contributions the last two years.  But why am I even bothering to mention things like conscience in relation to a football team?

[jack48]

1.  Why wouldn't he?

2.  Even assuming 1%, 1% of $8.5M is still actual money.

3.  He has every reason to want the team to succeed NOW by having more money to spend while he is still here and not later when he is cut. 

4.  What is he, a dick?  Players do this constantly.  

I doubt these guys put their money in savings accounts.  More likely corporate bonds and the market.  Having the money now could be a good deal, if the dollar continues to tank in the coming years---which it probably will.

[bitonti]

It happens so ******* often they don't even report on it now.  IIRC, off the top of my head, Scott did it before he even played a game with the team.  Jonathan Stewart did it recently. Julius Peppers did it barely into that big deal with the Bears,

 

so these players took money that they already had coming to them up front and didn't take any raise at all? Not even a little raise in the bonus? Why? 

 

we talk in the Revis thread about what a player will or will not do... and it's assumed that revis will eventually hold out again... there's nothing in Mark Sanchez' history that leads us to believe he will do anything for the team for free. 

[bitonti]

Your correct.  Getting $12,000 a year up front, when you have to live on it, isn’t much money in interest.

 

$12,000,000 up front is a different situation.  Even if you live like a Duke, and spend $2,000,000, you still have $10,000,000 to invest.  Your not putting that money in a savings account, if you are smart, your investing it.

 

If you have good advisors the investment return on $10,000,000 is significant.  Always take the money up front

 

like a Duke eh... 

 

[#27TheDominator]

so these players took money that they already had coming to them up front and didn't take any raise at all? Not even a little raise in the bonus? Why? 

 

we talk in the Revis thread about what a player will or will not do... and it's assumed that revis will eventually hold out again... there's nothing in Mark Sanchez' history that leads us to believe he will do anything for the team for free. 

 

We have told you why about 90 times in this thread alone.  You are unable to provide one valid reason why they wouldn't.  As Jack said, these guys are not putting their money into interest bearing checking accounts - properly invested a few million dollars can bring back some serious change. 

[bitonti]

We have told you why about 90 times in this thread alone.  You are unable to provide one valid reason why they wouldn't.  As Jack said, these guys are not putting their money into interest bearing checking accounts - properly invested a few million dollars can bring back some serious change. 

 

or you can lose it all. Financial advisors charge a fee for management, commissions, fees, taxes, it's possible that the investment gains don't exceed the cost of doing business. Yes if it's smartly invested you can beat the market if it's dumbly invested you end up with nothing. It's all theoretically.

 

BL I can't say why they wouldn't you can't say why they would. it seems like a wash at best. and I think we all agree it's not gonna happen. We can argue about it all day in theory but in practice when has Mark done anything for the jets for free?

Edited by bitonti, 21 February 2013 - 09:48 AM.

[Maxman]

I can't believe David Harris and Holmes make 13M. That is just absolutely ridiculous.

 

It is criminal.

[Maxman]

The good thing about a new GM is he can be pretty ruthless when it comes to redoing these deals.  I don't know the particulars of the Holmes and Harris contracts.  But he didn't give them out.  So he can play hardball.  He would be able to cut them (cap ramifications aside) because it wasn't his idea to sign them to those deals.

[slats]

I put myself in the players shoes. If my job pays me 12,000 a year. And instead of give me 12 monthly payments of a 1000, they give it all up front. How is that any better? The time value of money is basically nothing because the interest rates are zero. 

 

You're probably the only person who doesn't understand that $8M today beats the hell out of $8M spread out over September thru January. I'm sure Mark and his advisors understand the benefits,

[IrishJets39]

Would love to have Revis back it won't be easy to replace him. But if the Jets can get some picks and a quality player that can come in and start right away then I'm for it.  I'm hoping Jets can get a 1st Rd for Revis if not a least a 2nd and a 3rd or 4th Rd's and a 2nd for the 2014 drafts. Can't wait till the 12th and the 15 to see what going to happened.

[faba]

As someone I think Bleedin Green said 1 million bonus is chump change- that is not a hard decision deadline

[bitonti]

You're probably the only person who doesn't understand that $8M today beats the hell out of $8M spread out over September thru January. I'm sure Mark and his advisors understand the benefits,

 

Because of the implied investment gains? there's implied investment losses too.

 

with interest rates so low it's a marginal benefit at best.