Richardson vs. Revis

[Klecko73isGod]

I understand why the Bucs traded for Revis, they had the #1 rush D with the worst passing D.

 

And an enormous amount of cap space and the salary floor went into effect this year. 

[Klecko73isGod]

possible Pro Bowl DT is not equal value to a 4x All Pro CB.  

 

 John Idzik has made 1 really good move, 5 decent moves and 25 terrible moves. We shall see. I have more faith in Rex than in Idzik. 

 

It's one game.

 

What if five years from now Richardson is widely considered the best DT in the NFL and has been to five ProBowls?

[JiFtheOracle]

 

The Bucs don't understand ANYTHING about value.  You really don't think giving Revis QB money and overpaying Vincent Jackson won't come back to bite them later?  How are they going to pay Doug Martin down the line?  Or a real QB whenever they find one?  The Bucs were thinking short-term and it's going to backfire.

 

The Bucs entire short-term win now philosophy is so bizarre.  They suck.  Sucked last year too.  Lost their what, last 7 of 8 games?  And then they go out and spend spend spend some more again.  These contracts, will absolutely kill them.  The value they placed in their secondary is laughable. Gholston is great, if this was the 70's, now?  He's a walking personal foul.  So Revis shuts down 1 WR a game.  Big deal.  We've all see first hand that you can throw to other receivers and they aint rolling out anyone near Cro's caliber on the other side.

 

 

Yes and that's all well and nice. But he's one guy who can only cover one guy. Face a team with more than one good wideout and then what?

 

Exactly.  Just look at what the Jets did!!!

 

If Revis is on the Jets yesterday with Richardson we probably shut the Bucs out.

 

Possibly, but VJax is a very physical receiver and he was getting his on the skinny post that historically has been the one route to beat Revis.  A lot different than going against Holmes, who's not manhandling anyone at the LOS, the way VJax was pushing skinny little Cro out the way.

[Matt39]

The Bucs entire short-term win now philosophy is so bizarre.  They suck.  Sucked last year too.  Lost their what, last 7 of 8 games?  And then they go out and spend spend spend some more again.  These contracts, will absolutely kill them.  The value they placed in their secondary is laughable. Gholston is great, if this was the 70's, now?  He's a walking personal foul.  So Revis shuts down 1 WR a game.  Big deal.  We've all see first hand that you can throw to other receivers and they aint rolling out anyone near Cro's caliber on the other side.

 

 

 

Exactly.  Just look at what the Jets did!!!

 

 

Possibly, but VJax is a very physical receiver and he was getting his on the skinny post that historically has been the one route to beat Revis.  A lot different than going against Holmes, who's not manhandling anyone at the LOS, the way VJax was pushing skinny little Cro out the way.

 

Jackson is a really good player. We need a player like him.

 

As far as the Bucs go- Schiano is a jerkoff. But if Revis gets back to being Revis in that division and they can feed Martin the ball...they'll be ok.

[JiFtheOracle]

possible Pro Bowl DT is not equal value to a 4x All Pro CB.  

 

 John Idzik has made 1 really good move, 5 decent moves and 25 terrible moves. We shall see. I have more faith in Rex than in Idzik. 

 

Please list. 

[Jetsfan80]

possible Pro Bowl DT is not equal value to a 4x All Pro CB. 

 

Again, NO ONE is suggesting this to be the case, but do you really feel that $16 million a year is an accurate reflection of his value?  Would you really rather have Revis at $16 million per or Richardson at the amount we're paying him?

 

And don't you dare give me the "Bucs had money to spend" line again.  There's a salary cap in the NFL, and eventually the Bucs are going to feel the hurt of devoting 1/6 of their cap space to a 28-year old CORNERBACK coming off an ACL tear.  Answer me truthfully, is he worth that kind of coin?

[ZachEY]

If Revis is on the Jets yesterday with Richardson we probably shut the Bucs out.

 

If we could have added Richardson, kept Revis, and had a healthy Coples, that would have been scary.  Unfortunately, we'll have to hope Milliner isn't teh suck.

[flgreen]

If Revis is on the Jets yesterday with Richardson we probably shut the Bucs out.

 

Revis isn't going to prevent Smith from fumbling at the 5.  Nor is he stopping the TD run following it

[TNJet]

Richardson may honestly be the most NFL ready rookie DL the jets have drafted the last 20 years, including Wilkerson. He's more ready than Wilk was 2 years ago. The only guy that comes close is 2000 Shaun Ellis.

[JiFtheOracle]

Jackson is a really good player. We need a player like him.

 

As far as the Bucs go- Schiano is a jerkoff. But if Revis gets back to being Revis in that division and they can feed Martin the ball...they'll be ok.

 

Every team needs a player like VJax.  Dudes a monster.  Physical freak who can catch everything.  Revis typically did well vs. him, but first game back going against a guy like him compared to Holmes (who was also coming back from injury)...its a completely different ball game.  Like, other world type sh*t.

 

The Bucs will be the worst team in that division.  

[Jetscode1]

Revis was Revis yesterday. He was a blanket and he took away HOlmes. on our offense that's no big deal but if we had him taking away Vincent Jackson that would have been huge. Im not taking away anything from Sheldon, who had a great debut and was a great pick. But Revis is an all time great. Just cause he isn't a Jet anymore doesn't mean he sucks.

 

 

Who said he sucks? The real question is: is one corner worth 16 million dollars, which is nearly 15% of your total cap space, in a league where teams are routinely running 4 and 5 wide receiver sets? I say no. 

 

I personally think Richardson had a bigger overall impact on the game. Plus, when you consider how much less of the cap he eats up, it makes the move look like a no-brainer. 

 

Revis sucks!

[bitonti]

What if five years from now Richardson is widely considered the best DT in the NFL and has been to five ProBowls?

 

that would be awesome. Since we are talking about a conversation I had in March, i didn't think Revis would really only want 16 mil a year every year. I thought they could work something reasonable out. That was my mistake. thought Revis could take 13-14 or thereabouts.

 

Trading Revis and watching him sign that particular deal, it was the right move to trade him, regardless of what the pick turns out to be. I've said this on the board before...  in fact the day after they traded him and that deal came out I said Revis on the Jets was not possible. Maybe that was dumb to expect Revis to sign a reasonable deal. I didn't think it was correct to keep him at all costs.

 

Please list. 

 

[Jetscode1]

Barnes played for Rex in Baltimore, and Kellen Winslow played against him. I have a feeling Rex had a lot of input into those two pick-ups. He likes his guys, and guys who beat him (see: Holmes, Sporano).

 

This is a good point as well.  Major reason I think we still the Jets in Wildcat cause it caused ole Rex so much grief.  Wish they'd just put this to bed like the horse-collar tackle.

[Sperm Edwards]

Lost in all this is that what the future holds for Revis is not better than what the future holds for Richardson.  It's not a comparison of the first 4 years of Revis vs the first 4 years of Richardson.  That timeframe for Revis is in the past.  

 

Revis looked good, but I'm sure lots of CBs could look good sticking with Holmes in his first game back from serious injury, who clearly isn't 100% and may never be again, after not working with the team all summer long & only returning maybe a week ago, with a rookie QB he's spent almost no time with, etc.

 

In other words, while he looked good doing it, the task at hand for Revis was not an especially difficult one.  Therefore it is in no way indicative that Revis will be anywhere near as good as he once was, or even as good as Richardson will be.

 

Keeping Revis would have been stupid.  It is not, in any way, one player or another player.  The assertion that "most" pro-bowlers & all-pros were really good right away is among the more ridiculous that I've read here, and based on absolutely no evidence; nothing at all, other than someone's attempt to BS his way through an argument with made-up "facts" to substantiate a lame argument he was so wrong on for so long.

[ZachEY]

Lost in all this is that what the future holds for Revis is not better than what the future holds for Richardson.  It's not a comparison of the first 4 years of Revis vs the first 4 years of Richardson.  That timeframe for Revis is in the past.  

 

Revis looked good, but I'm sure lots of CBs could look good sticking with Holmes in his first game back from serious injury, who clearly isn't 100% and may never be again, after not working with the team all summer long & only returning maybe a week ago, with a rookie QB he's spent almost no time with, etc.

 

In other words, while he looked good doing it, the task at hand for Revis was not an especially difficult one.  Therefore it is in no way indicative that Revis will be anywhere near as good as he once was, or even as good as Richardson will be.

 

Keeping Revis would have been stupid.  It is not, in any way, one player or another player.  The assertion that "most" pro-bowlers & all-pros were really good right away is among the more ridiculous that I've read here, and based on absolutely no evidence; nothing at all, other than someone's attempt to BS his way through an argument with made-up "facts" to substantiate a lame argument he was so wrong on for so long.

 

Especially when that someone is one of the most vocal about preaching patience.  (READ: GHOLSTON, VLAD, B.THOMAS, FARRIOR)

[Sperm Edwards]

Especially when that someone is one of the most vocal about preaching patience.  (READ: GHOLSTON, VLAD, B.THOMAS, FARRIOR)

 

You're missing someone.  Someone who also played DT, and who we traded away two 1sts and a 4th to get into position #4 overall to draft (as well as a gargantuan contract).  I believe the term to describe him was "stud" if I recall correctly.

[bitonti]

Lost in all this is that what the future holds for Revis is not better than what the future holds for Richardson.  It's not a comparison of the first 4 years of Revis vs the first 4 years of Richardson.  That timeframe for Revis is in the past.  

 

Revis looked good, but I'm sure lots of CBs could look good sticking with Holmes in his first game back from serious injury, who clearly isn't 100% and may never be again, after not working with the team all summer long & only returning maybe a week ago, with a rookie QB he's spent almost no time with, etc.

 

In other words, while he looked good doing it, the task at hand for Revis was not an especially difficult one.  Therefore it is in no way indicative that Revis will be anywhere near as good as he once was, or even as good as Richardson will be.

 

Keeping Revis would have been stupid.  It is not, in any way, one player or another player.  The assertion that "most" pro-bowlers & all-pros were really good right away is among the more ridiculous that I've read here, and based on absolutely no evidence; nothing at all, other than someone's attempt to BS his way through an argument with made-up "facts" to substantiate a lame argument he was so wrong on for so long.

 

 what makes you say Holmes clearly wasn't 100%? He looked like Holmes out there. What is your proof that he isn't 100%? the media who got lied to all summer? 

 

as for the other stuff don't be a hater if you don't think Pro Bowlers show flashes right away you aren't watching. The exceptions are guys like Farrior who suck for their first 3 years. It's rare Most dominant NFL players are dominant the first time they put on pads in the league.

[bitonti]

You're missing someone.  Someone who also played DT, and who we traded away two 1sts and a 4th to get into position #4 overall to draft (as well as a gargantuan contract).  I believe the term to describe him was "stud" if I recall correctly.

 

I thought DBrick was an awesome pick and had him as my avatar for years why don't you stalkers bring that up?  The difference between me and you is I make statements and you critique them later. Whens the last original contribution you made? Probably your username which is a 15 year old joke. Way to stay fresh buddy.

[bitonti]

Especially when that someone is one of the most vocal about preaching patience.  (READ: GHOLSTON, VLAD, B.THOMAS, FARRIOR)

 

dude your username was tEYbow last year. maybe we should bring that up every time you make a post.

[Jetsfan80]

dude your username was tEYbow last year. maybe we should bring that up every time you make a post.

 

EY does that stuff as a joke.  You're deadly serious in all of your many flawed arguments, which is simply amazing.  I don't know that I've EVER seen you say, flat out, that you were dead wrong. 

 

EY is really good at therapy.  Just saying.

[JiFtheOracle]

that would be awesome. Since we are talking about a conversation I had in March, i didn't think Revis would really only want 16 mil a year every year. I thought they could work something reasonable out. That was my mistake. thought Revis could take 13-14 or thereabouts.

 

Trading Revis and watching him sign that particular deal, it was the right move to trade him, regardless of what the pick turns out to be. I've said this on the board before...  in fact the day after they traded him and that deal came out I said Revis on the Jets was not possible. Maybe that was dumb to expect Revis to sign a reasonable deal. I didn't think it was correct to keep him at all costs.

 

 

 

Lmfao.  Every team in the league has a similar list.  You're reaching.  I like it.  But you're reaching.  

[bitonti]

EY does that stuff as a joke.  You're deadly serious in all of your many flawed arguments, which is simply amazing.  I don't know that I've EVER seen you say, flat out, that you were dead wrong. 

 

EY is really good at therapy.  Just saying.

 

ok so he's joking about Geno now?

 

how do you know Im not joking all the time?

 

BTW did you get your 50 dollars labrum money? 

[ZachEY]

dude your username was tEYbow last year. maybe we should bring that up every time you make a post.

 

If only that wasn't an April Fools joke that stuck.  If only.

[Jetsfan80]

how do you know Im not joking? BTW did you get your 50 dollars labrum money? 

 

I did.  And while I never root for injuries, and I'm classless for doing so even in this instance, when I saw Sanchez on the ground writing in pain I was going "YEEEEEAHHHHH!!!!  STAY DOWN SANCHEZ, STAY DOWN, WOOOOOOOO!!!!!!"

[bitonti]

Lmfao.  Every team in the league has a similar list.  You're reaching.  I like it.  But you're reaching.  

 

 agree but some of those signings like Garrard and Goodson are indefensible. Like i said he's made 1 really good move Sheldon. Alot of these other moves were awful. 

[ZachEY]

EY does that stuff as a joke.  You're deadly serious in all of your many flawed arguments, which is simply amazing.  I don't know that I've EVER seen you say, flat out, that you were dead wrong. 

 

EY is really good at therapy.  Just saying.

 

JN sessions would be hilarious.  I could sit in with a few posters each week and convince them that ultimately they want to have sex with their mothers or that they're secretly gay.  No doubt this would be a bigger draw than Dennis Agaptiatao or Courtney.

[bitonti]

If only that wasn't an April Fools joke that stuck.  If only.

 

isn't it fun when someone you don't know asks you questions about things you posted on a message board years ago?  

 

It's not creepy at all that I remember these details right? like what your username used to be. Im gonna start remembering all you fools' foolish statements.

 

And then we can talk about Drob. 

[Sperm Edwards]

 what makes you say Holmes clearly wasn't 100%? He looked like Holmes out there. What is your proof that he isn't 100%? the media who got lied to all summer? 

 

as for the other stuff don't be a hater if you don't think Pro Bowlers show flashes right away you aren't watching. The exceptions are guys like Farrior who suck for their first 3 years. It's rare Most dominant NFL players are dominant the first time they put on pads in the league.

 

Oh so now it's "flashes" once someone challenges you on your absurd assertions?  You said, quite clearly, that most pro bowlers and all pros were instant-good.  This is beyond untrue; it's patently ridiculous.

 

My recollection is that Holmes has said himself that he isn't 100% and that was only 50/50 to play (let alone start).  Players who are 100% are not listed as questionable and are not 50/50 to not play in the game.  If you have other information to the contrary, then show it to us.

 

You bring all this stuff on yourself.

[bitonti]

I did.  And while I never root for injuries, and I'm classless for doing so even in this instance, when I saw Sanchez on the ground writing in pain I was going "YEEEEEAHHHHH!!!!  STAY DOWN SANCHEZ, STAY DOWN, WOOOOOOOO!!!!!!"

 

ok I admit. that's funny. i LOL'ed.

[ZachEY]

isn't it fun when someone you don't know asks you questions about things you posted on a message board years ago?  

 

It's not creepy at all that I remember these details right? like what your username used to be. Im gonna start remembering all you fools' foolish statements.

 

And then we can talk about Drob. 

 

Hard to forget when someone that is one of the most prominent posters on the board, who promotes himself as an expert on the material (a fact, not a judgement), makes repeated and unambiguous claims that are extremely contrarian and are so often proven incorrect.

[JiFtheOracle]

 agree but some of those signings like Garrard and Goodson are indefensible. Like i said he's made 1 really good move Sheldon. Alot of these other moves were awful. 

 

Awful is a poor choice of words.  Killing a GM for having a bunch of camp fodder not make the roster is a little juvenile, if you ask me.  His pickups, made plays, thats all you can ask for.

 

Garrard retiring was a blessing in disguise.  Goodson and Ivory are the only signings that I see as being "awful", as of now.  Lots of season left and you never know how things shake out.

[bitonti]

Oh so now it's "flashes" once someone challenges you on your absurd assertions?  You said, quite clearly, that most pro bowlers and all pros were instant-good.  This is beyond untrue; it's patently ridiculous.

 

My recollection is that Holmes has said himself that he isn't 100% and that was only 50/50 to play (let alone start).  Players who are 100% are not listed as questionable and are not 50/50 to not play in the game.  If you have other information to the contrary, then show it to us.

 

You bring all this stuff on yourself.

 

it depends on how we define Instant good. 

 

Holmes has been lying to the press all year. I was at the game and he looked fine to me. Take it fwiw but he didn't seem limited in anyway. and he played a ton of snaps. They said they would manage his snaps and they gave him as many as he could handle. This is good news for the Jets btw cause they won't face Revis again. Revis was doing his thing where he'd follow Holmes out of the huddle and eventually they stopped throwing his way.

[Matt39]

Tommy Bohanon made a big play yesterday. Was that pick awful?

[Sperm Edwards]

I thought DBrick was an awesome pick and had him as my avatar for years why don't you stalkers bring that up?  The difference between me and you is I make statements and you critique them later. Whens the last original contribution you made? Probably your username which is a 15 year old joke. Way to stay fresh buddy.

 

I make original contributions all the time.  Made a bunch last night and this morning.  If all I did was wait for you to post and then respond to it, I'd have been called out on it by someone other than just you by now.

 

As for my username, it is a classic.  But as long as you bring it up, I recall you being a big fan of coach Herm's as well.

[bitonti]

Hard to forget when someone that is one of the most prominent posters on the board, who promotes himself as an expert on the material (a fact, not a judgement), makes repeated and unambiguous claims that are extremely contrarian and are so often proven incorrect.

 

I have never promoted myself as an expert. I've always called myself a fan of the game.  in fact I call myself a bathroom attendant in my forum title.