Jetsfan80 Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Even if this is true (and there's no proof that it is), it doesn't matter if John Idzik is a capable GM. He only needs Rex to cook the meal, not buy the groceries. Well he hasn't cooked the meal well enough this year. Idzik won't be firing himself, so Rex is gone. Oh well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Well he hasn't cooked the meal well enough this year. Idzik won't be firing himself, so Rex is gone. Oh well. Six wins is close to miraculous with this roster. If Idzik wasn't purposely trying to undermine him, he should be able to see that. If he was purposely trying to undermine him, he did a nice job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 I'd love to have a beer with you, and I know we share some similar politics, but I wouldn't cast a vote for you in the local dog catcher election. Haha, then why the neg rep, dude? That's what I get for trying to positive rep on phone .. Sorry! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Year one, they trade up to draft Sanchez, the team makes it to the AFCCG. Year two, they make it to the AFCCG again, and again, Sanchez plays better in the playoffs than he did in the regular season. Year three, they miss the playoffs, and Sanchez is looking worse. It was at that point that the team should've started seriously looking for an alternative, and they were rumored to be interested in Manning. Instead, they wind up extending Sanchez and trading for Tebow. That was where the screwup at the position took place. In the fourth year, Rex sat Sanchez for McElroy, because there was no one else to turn to. Tannenbaum is fired. In year five, his new GM provides him with Geno and Garrard. Hot dog. 30+ starts into the kid's career, he had four road playoff wins under his belt. It's revisionist to suggest Rex was supposed to make a change at QB any sooner than his fourth season. Year one, they trade up to draft Sanchez, the team makes it to the AFCCG. Year two, they make it to the AFCCG again, and again, Sanchez plays better in the playoffs than he did in the regular season. Year three, they miss the playoffs, and Sanchez is looking worse. It was at that point that the team should've started seriously looking for an alternative, and they were rumored to be interested in Manning. Instead, they wind up extending Sanchez and trading for Tebow. That was where the screwup at the position took place. In the fourth year, Rex sat Sanchez for McElroy, because there was no one else to turn to. Tannenbaum is fired. In year five, his new GM provides him with Geno and Garrard. Hot dog. 30+ starts into the kid's career, he had four road playoff wins under his belt. It's revisionist to suggest Rex was supposed to make a change at QB any sooner than his fourth season. You can have the best quarterback in the world and still need a viable backup, much more so if you have an emotionally fragile nancy-boy who just put up 32 starts looking like a career backup. His two playoff runs gave us hope, though, which is nice, but they earned him a spot under Rex's Umbrella of Eternal Protection, which likely cost both men in the long run. You'll recall the Plaxico-Holmes-Mason insurgency vs Sanchez in training camp that was apparently so ugly that Rex had to cut Derrick "he's gonna catch 80 passes" Mason. It's safe to say that the team wasn't as enamored with Sanchez as Rex was at that point. They never sought a legitimate backup for Sanchez because Rex was protecting his tat-model buddy. He had no choice but to start McElroy after Buttfumble because fans would have set the seats on fire if #6 walked out onto that field to start the game. Recently you bemoaned the fact that Rex never had the luxury of having a Josh McCown on the roster, as if those guys are impossible to get every year. Why do you think that is? Because the ink was dry on the tattoo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 That's what I get for trying to positive rep on phone .. Sorry! Moron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 That's what I get for trying to positive rep on phone .. Sorry! Ha! Just asking, I'll get by. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewillie78 Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Six wins is close to miraculous with this roster. If Idzik wasn't purposely trying to undermine him, he should be able to see that. If he was purposely trying to undermine him, he did a nice job. Was it close to miraculous in 2011 when he was 8-8?Was it close to miraculous in 2012 when he was 6-10? Now its close to miraculous in 2013 that he won 6 games (so far) If he goes 8-8 next year, will that be close to miraculous? Who is going to be the person that decides that REX has a stacked roster and he UNDERachieved or are we always going to be able to use the "his roster sucks" to defend him? Again, If I am REX, for job security based on attitudes on this forum, I always want a CRUMMY roster, because then I always have a built in excuse when I fail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 You can have the best quarterback in the world and still need a viable backup, much more so if you have an emotionally fragile nancy-boy who just put up 32 starts looking like a career backup. His two playoff runs gave us hope, though, which is nice, but they earned him a spot under Rex's Umbrella of Eternal Protection, which likely cost both men in the long run. You'll recall the Plaxico-Holmes-Mason insurgency vs Sanchez in training camp that was apparently so ugly that Rex had to cut Derrick "he's gonna catch 80 passes" Mason. It's safe to say that the team wasn't as enamored with Sanchez as Rex was at that point. They never sought a legitimate backup for Sanchez because Rex was protecting his tat-model buddy. He had no choice but to start McElroy after Buttfumble because fans would have set the seats on fire if #6 walked out onto that field to start the game. Recently you bemoaned the fact that Rex never had the luxury of having a Josh McCown on the roster, as if those guys are impossible to get every year. Why do you think that is? Because the ink was dry on the tattoo. Lord God Bill Parcells backed up Vinny Testaverde with last minute acquisition Rick Mirer. And he was the buyer of groceries. And I don't think I've ever said anything ever about Josh McCown. Did suggest Idzik spend a couple picks on QB this year, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Was it close to miraculous in 2011 when he was 8-8?Was it close to miraculous in 2012 when he was 6-10?Now its close to miraculous in 2013 that he won 6 games (so far)If he goes 8-8 next year, will that be close to miraculous?Who is going to be the person that decides that REX has a stacked roster and he UNDERachieved or are we always going to be able to use the "his roster sucks" to defend him?Again, If I am REX, for job security based on attitudes on this forum, I always want a CRUMMY roster, because then I always have a built in excuse when I fail. Rex has done more with less for his entire career. He took over a team one year -and one Brett Favre- removed from 4-12, and his GMs have either failed or purposely done nothing over that span. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Lord God Bill Parcells backed up Vinny Testaverde with last minute acquisition Rick Mirer. And he was the buyer of groceries. And I don't think I've ever said anything ever about Josh McCown. Did suggest Idzik spend a couple picks on QB this year, though. LGBP ate dirt on Mirer, but he wouldn't let that situation continue for three years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 LGBP ate dirt on Mirer, but he wouldn't let that situation continue for three years. No, he quit before it became an issue. But he held the GM title here, Rex never has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewillie78 Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Rex has done more with less for his entire career. He took over a team one year -and one Brett Favre- removed from 4-12, and his GMs have either failed or purposely done nothing over that span.Ok, It appears that no matter what type of roster Rex has, he certainly has you convinced that he will always overachieve. Your welcome to your opinion, and we are welcome to disagree. By the way, I agree on using some picks to get a REAL QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 No, he quit before it became an issue. But he held the GM title here, Rex never has. Mike Tannenbaum himself, this week, said that Rex had oodles of input into the roster. He shares the blame for its decline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Mike Tannenbaum himself, this week, said that Rex had oodles of input into the roster. He shares the blame for its decline. Not sure what percentage of blame "oodles" represents, but -again- Rex's GM'ing skills are completely inconsequential if Idzik has any talent in that regard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Six wins is close to miraculous with this roster. If Idzik wasn't purposely trying to undermine him, he should be able to see that. If he was purposely trying to undermine him, he did a nice job. It's especially miraculous when you consider we've been outscored by 121 points overall this season. No matter how bad a roster is you have to be more competitive than that. Lucking into a couple wins we shouldn't have gotten doesn't save Rex. No one is giving 2-time Super Bowl winner Mike Shannahan a free pass for having a bum-legged QB and basically no surrounding talent whatsoever. They've been outscored by 129 points, so he's gone after the season, whether he fully deserves it or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Not sure what percentage of blame "oodles" represents, but -again- Rex's GM'ing skills are completely inconsequential if Idzik has any talent in that regard. Which is fine, because he's not that good at coaching, either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Not sure what percentage of blame "oodles" represents, but -again- Rex's GM'ing skills are completely inconsequential if Idzik has any talent in that regard. Yet Rex's coaching skills are inconsequential because he wasn't given enough talent. Weird. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugg Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 You can have the best quarterback in the world and still need a viable backup, much more so if you have an emotionally fragile nancy-boy who just put up 32 starts looking like a career backup. His two playoff runs gave us hope, though, which is nice, but they earned him a spot under Rex's Umbrella of Eternal Protection, which likely cost both men in the long run. You'll recall the Plaxico-Holmes-Mason insurgency vs Sanchez in training camp that was apparently so ugly that Rex had to cut Derrick "he's gonna catch 80 passes" Mason. It's safe to say that the team wasn't as enamored with Sanchez as Rex was at that point. They never sought a legitimate backup for Sanchez because Rex was protecting his tat-model buddy. He had no choice but to start McElroy after Buttfumble because fans would have set the seats on fire if #6 walked out onto that field to start the game. Recently you bemoaned the fact that Rex never had the luxury of having a Josh McCown on the roster, as if those guys are impossible to get every year. Why do you think that is? Because the ink was dry on the tattoo.The Dawidoff book makes clear Pettine and Westoff were not happy with Schitty's nonsense playbook nor Sanchez flitting about like a happy schoolgirl on junior prom night as he craps the season away with awful play.A real head coach sees that and intervenes. Wrecks being a nonconfrontational hands off delegator did nothing really substantive. And it culminated in 2 disasters - the Christmas Eve loss to the Jints and Holmes' total insubordination in Miami. In the Jints' game the defense did in fact dominate, as it had against the Broncos. In both of those games the total lack of an offense KILLED a playoff spot. And that has to be on the HC. Watch those games, get sick to your stomach over Sanchez throwing 50+ passes vs. the Jints and failing to mount any semblance of an offense against Tebow, and then get back to us what a great head coach this fat dumb f__ is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Even if its true that Rex is a good coach who's been hamstrung by lack of talent, we can still do better. Why settle for mediocrity? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 The Dawidoff book makes clear Pettine and Westoff were not happy with Schitty's nonsense playbook nor Sanchez flitting about like a happy schoolgirl on junior prom night as he craps the season away with awful play.A real head coach sees that and intervenes. Wrecks being a nonconfrontational hands off delegator did nothing really substantive. And it culminated in 2 disasters - the Christmas Eve loss to the Jints and Holmes' total insubordination in Miami. In the Jints' game the defense did in fact dominate, as it had against the Broncos. In both of those games the total lack of an offense KILLED a playoff spot. And that has to be on the HC. Watch those games, get sick to your stomach over Sanchez throwing 50+ passes vs. the Jints and failing to mount any semblance of an offense against Tebow, and then get back to us what a great head coach this fat dumb f__ is. I've just never seen a head coach more afraid of upsetting his players than Rex Ryan. Even Herm was tougher on them than Rex was/is. Why is he afraid of Santonio Holmes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Even if its true that Rex is a good coach who's been hamstrung by lack of talent, we can still do better. Why settle for mediocrity? No guarantees there. Rex is the best coach this team has had since Parcells, and if not for Parcells he's the best coach this team has had since Walt Michaels. In the team's history, the two best coaches they've had were coaches who won championships before they got here. This idea of our novice GM hiring a novice head coach to "develop" a rookie QB turns my stomach in new and exciting ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 I've just never seen a head coach more afraid of upsetting his players than Rex Ryan. Even Herm was tougher on them than Rex was/is. Why is he afraid of Santonio Holmes? Rex would really like to be softer on his players, but Idzik failed so badly that Rex actually had to bench two of his draft picks a couple times this year. It hurt him, on the inside. Would've been nice if the front office could've found a receiver better than Holmes, too. I imagine they'll give another shot next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 No guarantees there. Rex is the best coach this team has had since Parcells, and if not for Parcells he's the best coach this team has had since Walt Michaels. In the team's history, the two best coaches they've had were coaches who won championships before they got here. This idea of our novice GM hiring a novice head coach to "develop" a rookie QB turns my stomach in new and exciting ways. Saying that he's the best since Parcells, who also failed to win a title here, doesn't really help Rex's cause. Rex has also failed with 2 young QB's. Say what you will about Geno, but the 1st half of the season he at least looked like a competent QB. Do we really want to entrust him with a 3rd rookie QB out of this year's crop? Not I. Like it or not, but it's this novice GM that we'll need to put our trust in. He helped build a helluva roster in Seattle. Perhaps he can do the same here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Rex would really like to be softer on his players, but Idzik failed so badly that Rex actually had to bench two of his draft picks a couple times this year. It hurt him, on the inside. Would've been nice if the front office could've found a receiver better than Holmes, too. I imagine they'll give another shot next year. Yeah, Santonio Holmes is a GM problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Yeah, Santonio Holmes is a GM problem. I guess it wasn't Idzik's. He didn't seem to think it was an issue this year at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 I guess it wasn't Idzik's. He didn't seem to think it was an issue this year at all. When Idzik cut his salary or when Idzik cuts him in three weeks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 When Idzik cut his salary or when Idzik cuts him in three weeks? When Idzik finds a better receiver, so that benching a healthy Holmes is actually a viable option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 When Idzik finds a better receiver, so that benching a healthy Holmes is actually a viable option. Benching an insubordinate player is always a viable option. If a player is openly flouting your program, you sit him down. Otherwise, your team lacks discipline and you lose the locker room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slats Posted December 22, 2013 Share Posted December 22, 2013 DISCIPLINARIANISM! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted December 22, 2013 Share Posted December 22, 2013 DISCIPLINARIANISM! You'd vote for me for dog catcher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugg Posted December 22, 2013 Share Posted December 22, 2013 When Idzik finds a better receiver, so that benching a healthy Holmes is actually a viable option.Again, Sunday we had Kerley, Holmes and Winslow all in the lineup. 2 very decent pros and one diva dickhead, but again, that's not a bad corps. Every team has injured guys, so that is while no means a great bunch, it should have helped.It didn't, and there were no real adjustments nor direction from the HC when it could've mattered. Between them those decent pros caught 4 balls. Where is the HC when that happens?That game was still in play well into the late 3rd quarter. And Rivera didn't even respect this offense enough to kick a FG at 16-3. That was total disrespect for this offense and CS.May be put in the QB who can wing it as a change of pace, get a spark, crazy idea, yanking a nonperformer. DO SOMETHING OTHER THAN STAND THERE WITH THAT DUMBASS LOOK ON YOUR FACE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SayNoToDMC Posted December 22, 2013 Share Posted December 22, 2013 They also base their vote for President on the crucial question of which candidate they'd rather have a beer with. That's how most people vote, if I had thought of it I would have wrote Rex in instead of waisting my vote last election Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SayNoToDMC Posted December 22, 2013 Share Posted December 22, 2013 Benching an insubordinate player is always a viable option. If a player is openly flouting your program, you sit him down. Otherwise, your team lacks discipline and you lose the locker room. Rex NEVER lost the locker room. Look how many guys are having the best year of their careers in what could have been a year they all packed it in being it was a lost year with Tanny and Idziks incompetent handling of Rex's prime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted December 22, 2013 Share Posted December 22, 2013 Saying that he's the best since Parcells, who also failed to win a title here, doesn't really help Rex's cause. Rex has also failed with 2 young QB's. Say what you will about Geno, but the 1st half of the season he at least looked like a competent QB. Do we really want to entrust him with a 3rd rookie QB out of this year's crop? Not I.. ehhh, this line of argument is kinda silly. Most rookie QB's fail.. what nobody wants to acknowlede is that Sanchez was almost pre ordained to fail. Lewin isn't perfect but it is directionally correct and Sanchez was basically Akili Smith in its projection Geno was clearly not ready to play, you could clearly see a tough year coming from the first preseason game. Further, Marty is a very competent OC, any irrational belief of Rex ruining QB's has to be diminished by Marty's presence in even the most foaming at the mouth Rex haters Rex has his negatives; over loyalty to players, poor game time decisions, discipline, etc.. it's best to stick to that IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewillie78 Posted December 22, 2013 Share Posted December 22, 2013 Rex NEVER lost the locker room. Look how many guys are having the best year of their careers in what could have been a year they all packed it in being it was a lost year with Tanny and Idziks incompetent handling of Rex's prime. Wait, guys are having the "best year of their careers" and we are 6-8? Arent you supposed to win when guys are "having the best years of their careers"? Just out of curiosity, being they are 6-8 with guys performing their "best". if they were say, just average, would we be like 4-10 or 2-12? How can we improve on 6-8 when they are "having their best year of their career"? Arent we maxed out? Hmmmm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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