the longer this goes on the less i want Fitz

[nyjunc]

Just now, ylekram said:

i like how 10 wins are fantasy #'s

10 wins w/ no playoffs might as well be 3 wins.  it is completely meaningless.

[cant wait]

1 minute ago, ylekram said:

you seem to want to give  most of the credit to marshal for the improved offense.he is known to make circus catches, but is also know to drop easy passes. lots of easy passes.we plays well MOST of the time. then you go on to downplay fitzpatricks play as circumstance. both players play well MOST of the time, but only 1 gets credit and the other gets sh*t on

Kind of like how you give Fitzpatrick all the credit for the jets successes this season, and none of the blame for their failures?

[ylekram]

2 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

10 wins w/ no playoffs might as well be 3 wins.  it is completely meaningless.

yea, 11 wins and no playoffs might as well be 0-16, right?

[whodeawhodat]

I have no answer as to why I stopped by in this thread.

[ylekram]

3 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

he dropped a few but saved far more bad passes than he dropped.

Fitz played well, I want him back at the right price BUT his "great" season was more a product of knowing this offense and the incredible talent around him.

by reading this, you would think that fitz lobbed passes 15 yards from him, and the superman that he is, came up with balls nowhere near him. nice. marshal did not "save far more bad paases" than drop easy ones. quite an exaggeratioin

[Beerfish]

1 minute ago, whodeawhodat said:

I have no answer as to why I stopped by in this thread.

Perhaps to show us your nice wolf howling t-shirt?

[nyjunc]

4 minutes ago, ylekram said:

yea, 11 wins and no playoffs might as well be 0-16, right?

had we won 11 at least he would have done all he could but in a win and in game a week after Pitt gave us a golden opportunity Fitz and his teammates blew it and Fitz was one of the main culprits.  

 

1 minute ago, ylekram said:

by reading this, you would think that fitz lobbed passes 15 yards from him, and the superman that he is, came up with balls nowhere near him. nice. marshal did not "save far more bad paases" than drop easy ones. quite an exaggeratioin

He saved a million bad Fitz throws and has a huge target.  Fitz would often throw it up for grabs and Marshall(and decker) would come down w/ it. 

[cant wait]

31 minutes ago, ylekram said:

by reading this, you would think that fitz lobbed passes 15 yards from him, and the superman that he is, came up with balls nowhere near him. nice. marshal did not "save far more bad paases" than drop easy ones. quite an exaggeratioin

Another example of Marshall turning a weakly thrown Fitzpatrick duck into a TD for the "$18M man"

[whodeawhodat]

5 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

Perhaps to show us your nice wolf howling t-shirt?

http://www.amazon.com/The-Mountain-Three-Short-Sleeve/dp/B002HJ377A

 

read the reviews my friend

[ylekram]

1 minute ago, nyjunc said:

had we won 11 at least he would have done all he could but in a win and in game a week after Pitt gave us a golden opportunity Fitz and his teammates blew it and Fitz was one of the main culprits.  

 

He saved a million bad Fitz throws and has a huge target.  Fitz would often throw it up for grabs and Marshall(and decker) would come down w/ it. 

i am starting to think that A.  you didnt watch the games closely, or B. you just like to make stuff up. throw it up for grabs? lol. thats what all qb's do, good or bad, when they have large wide recievers that can box the defender out

i consider bowles to be the main culprit, considering the entire jets team(sans marshal) sucked

[nyjunc]

16 minutes ago, ylekram said:

i am starting to think that A.  you didnt watch the games closely, or B. you just like to make stuff up. throw it up for grabs? lol. thats what all qb's do, good or bad, when they have large wide recievers that can box the defender out

i consider bowles to be the main culprit, considering the entire jets team(sans marshal) sucked

I watched every play and I understand what I am watching unlike many fans.  Brandon Marshall was the biggest difference in our offense last year, that isn't really debatable.  Fitz played well and did a great job rallying his teammates but he had the most talent on a Jets O around the QB since the 80s.

Bowles didn't have his team ready but in a game like that why aren't the players held accountable too?  biggest game of Fitz's career and he was awful.

[ylekram]

13 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

I watched every play and I understand what I am watching unlike many fans.  Brandon Marshall was the biggest difference in our offense last year, that isn't really debatable.  Fitz played well and did a great job rallying his teammates but he had the most talent on a Jets O around the QB since the 80s.

Bowles didn't have his team ready but in a game like that why aren't the players held accountable too?  biggest game of Fitz's career and he was awful.

not only is it debatable, but its wrong, imo. it just fits the narrative of fitz playing well due to circumstance, rather than his talent level. competant, although unspectacular qb play was the biggest difference in the offense. i get the fact that some posters believe any bum qb could have thrown for 4000 yds and 31 td's, while winning 10 games throwing to brandon marshal. only problem is is that history hasnt shown that. marshal himself has never been to the playoffs and, correct me if i am wrong here, had the his best season with fitz throwing to him.. the 2 players are a team. you cant give all the credit to 1 and discredit the other. both players play the game "mostly well". neither are perfect

people tend to bring up fitzpatricks past. on how he sucked and all. well, if you look close enough, you will see his progression over the past few years. he has gotten better over the past 3 years. thats what important. not what he did his first 6 years, in which some posters thrive off of

[ylekram]

23 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

I watched every play and I understand what I am watching unlike many fans.  Brandon Marshall was the biggest difference in our offense last year, that isn't really debatable.  Fitz played well and did a great job rallying his teammates but he had the most talent on a Jets O around the QB since the 80s.

Bowles didn't have his team ready but in a game like that why aren't the players held accountable too?  biggest game of Fitz's career and he was awful.

biggest game of alot of players careers and they were awful. lets hold them to the same standard, right? or do we just forget about them and blame the qb, well because thats what we do?

[cant wait]

Just now, ylekram said:

biggest game of alot of players careers and they were awful. lets hold them to the same standard, right? or do we just forget about them and blame the qb, well because thats what we do?

when your QB is demanding the team pay him $18M and make him the leader of the team, then yes you damn well better hold him accountable for his shortcomings 

[Mainejet]

Listen, I still want Fitz to come back, but I will readily admit after this long, it's rather obvious to me that both sides should be giving serious thought to moving on permanently. The Jets and Fitz need time to get things in place, to set up for the season, make contingency plans depending the unexpected, etc...

I do not believe this goes on much longer before the Jets actually sign a QB and come to the conclusion at that point, that even if Fitz opts to accept their previous offer, the Jets will say it no longer stands. They will inform Fitz agent that they already signed a QB and no longer need his services as their roster is not full and they plan on going into battle with those QB's.

In other words, this could be getting into the neighborhood of a permanently fractured relationship.

I truly hope that doesn't happen, but from all outward appearances and not speaking with each other, this fight could result in grudges.

[ylekram]

4 minutes ago, Mainejet said:

Listen, I still want Fitz to come back, but I will readily admit after this long, it's rather obvious to me that both sides should be giving serious thought to moving on permanently. The Jets and Fitz need time to get things in place, to set up for the season, make contingency plans depending the unexpected, etc...

I do not believe this goes on much longer before the Jets actually sign a QB and come to the conclusion at that point, that even if Fitz opts to accept their previous offer, the Jets will say it no longer stands. They will inform Fitz agent that they already signed a QB and no longer need his services as their roster is not full and they plan on going into battle with those QB's.

In other words, this could be getting into the neighborhood of a permanently fractured relationship.

I truly hope that doesn't happen, but from all outward appearances and not speaking with each other, this fight could result in grudges.

i dont believe it is a fight at all.

"fitz here is the offer"

"that seems low. i want this amount"

" thats too much. we want you back,tho. you know you fit in well here. go test the market. if you are offered more, we are open to negotiation"

"ok. will do. i will be back in touch either way"

"look forward to hearing from you"

[nyjbuddy]

I believe Fitzpatrick is a starter in this league, maybe not in the top half of the league, but still useful as a starter.  With that being said I do not understand the argument that Fitzpatrick is a back-up talent QB and the Jets should pay him back-up QB money.  I don't disagree with differing talent evaluation, as everyone has their own opinion, but I don't see who the starter would be if the Jets are just trying to sign Fitzpatrick as a back-up QB.

Secondly, what is preventing Fitzpatrick from signing and then just playing in the backup role and collecting a pay check?  He is near the end of his career, according to the market, he has little respect in the league, nobody believes he is a starter in this league.  He may very well feel disrespected and want to stick it to the Jets.  Having a player under contract that doesn't feel they are being compensate properly is dangerous, especially at the QB position.  To paraphrase Elway, building a team with players who want to be here.  Maybe he goes into the year not preparing as well, not working as hard, skipping workouts.  By the time the season starts, the Jets would be forced to find a starter that is on their roster (Smith, Petty, drafted QB, etc) or scrabbling to sign a free agent to come in and learn the offense in limited time while also cutting others to free up cap space.  If they cut Fitzpatrick, he walks away with whatever guaranteed money he signed for and he would have not done anything.  The same result if he doesn't sign at all.   

 

[cant wait]

55 minutes ago, ylekram said:

i dont believe it is a fight at all.

"fitz here is the offer"

"that seems low. i want this amount"

" thats too much. we want you back,tho. you know you fit in well here. go test the market. if you are offered more, we are open to negotiation"

"ok. will do. i will be back in touch either way"

"look forward to hearing from you"

"Hey mike is that offer still on the table?"

".....we'll get back to you"

[ChuckkieB]

Many say that Geno Smith stunk because there was no talent around him. Many also say that Fitzpatrick had a really good year because of the talent around him.  My question is - when does the QB ever get any actual credit (or blame)?   

Yes, Smith wasn't done any favors by having a putrid supporting offensive cast, but a stiff is as stiff is a stiff!  He never elevated anyone around him, and that's the mark of a good QB.  Geno is not a good QB.  As for Fitzpatrick, yes, he was surrounded by some very good receivers, but he still had to execute the plays and make the throws.  He has to get some credit for that.  He's not Joe Montana, but he isn't Ryan Leaf either.

I'd be fine with Fitz back in the fold for 2016 while the Jets continue to search for their franchise QB, but if the price isn't right, then it's time to move on.

[nyjunc]

4 hours ago, ylekram said:

 

[Beerfish]

1 hour ago, ChuckkieB said:

Many say that Geno Smith stunk because there was no talent around him. Many also say that Fitzpatrick had a really good year because of the talent around him.  My question is - when does the QB ever get any actual credit (or blame)?   

Yes, Smith wasn't done any favors by having a putrid supporting offensive cast, but a stiff is as stiff is a stiff!  He never elevated anyone around him, and that's the mark of a good QB.  Geno is not a good QB.  As for Fitzpatrick, yes, he was surrounded by some very good receivers, but he still had to execute the plays and make the throws.  He has to get some credit for that.  He's not Joe Montana, but he isn't Ryan Leaf either.

I'd be fine with Fitz back in the fold for 2016 while the Jets continue to search for their franchise QB, but if the price isn't right, then it's time to move on.

Only when it fits the posters agenda and or bias.

For the Jets it is all about weaponz, playoffs and strength of schedule, nothing else is relevant in the least.  Qb's are just some card board cut out along for the ride.

[nyjunc]

3 hours ago, ylekram said:

not only is it debatable, but its wrong, imo. it just fits the narrative of fitz playing well due to circumstance, rather than his talent level. competant, although unspectacular qb play was the biggest difference in the offense. i get the fact that some posters believe any bum qb could have thrown for 4000 yds and 31 td's, while winning 10 games throwing to brandon marshal. only problem is is that history hasnt shown that. marshal himself has never been to the playoffs and, correct me if i am wrong here, had the his best season with fitz throwing to him.. the 2 players are a team. you cant give all the credit to 1 and discredit the other. both players play the game "mostly well". neither are perfect

people tend to bring up fitzpatricks past. on how he sucked and all. well, if you look close enough, you will see his progression over the past few years. he has gotten better over the past 3 years. thats what important. not what he did his first 6 years, in which some posters thrive off of

it's not debatable, marshall was the biggest difference.  His teammates saw it too giving him the team MVP award.

Many of those 10 games he made mistakes and we overcame.  he had never won more than 6 in any year prior to last year.

2 years ago he was 6-6 as a starter, his backups were 3-1.  what progression?

3 hours ago, ylekram said:

biggest game of alot of players careers and they were awful. lets hold them to the same standard, right? or do we just forget about them and blame the qb, well because thats what we do?

biggest game for Fitz and Marshall, Marshall showed up and almost carried us to win.  Fitz was awful and sent us home.

[nyjunc]

2 hours ago, ChuckkieB said:

Many say that Geno Smith stunk because there was no talent around him. Many also say that Fitzpatrick had a really good year because of the talent around him.  My question is - when does the QB ever get any actual credit (or blame)?   

Yes, Smith wasn't done any favors by having a putrid supporting offensive cast, but a stiff is as stiff is a stiff!  He never elevated anyone around him, and that's the mark of a good QB.  Geno is not a good QB.  As for Fitzpatrick, yes, he was surrounded by some very good receivers, but he still had to execute the plays and make the throws.  He has to get some credit for that.  He's not Joe Montana, but he isn't Ryan Leaf either.

I'd be fine with Fitz back in the fold for 2016 while the Jets continue to search for their franchise QB, but if the price isn't right, then it's time to move on.

you are talking about 2 mediocre talents that need talent around them to succeed.  Geno has never had it, Fitz had the most talent a Jets O has had since the 80s.

[Larz]

I wonder if fitz basic position is "**** it, I'm either getting a starting gig at starters money or I'm retiring"

he must so many dudes from harvard he can get a cushy banking job or whatever

 

[PatsFanTX]

the first 10 win season in five years. respect from his team mates. competency at the position

And no playoffs because he came up small in the Jets biggest game in 5 years.

[ylekram]

30 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

it's not debatable, marshall was the biggest difference.  His teammates saw it too giving him the team MVP award.

Many of those 10 games he made mistakes and we overcame.  he had never won more than 6 in any year prior to last year.

2 years ago he was 6-6 as a starter, his backups were 3-1.  what progression?

biggest game for Fitz and Marshall, Marshall showed up and almost carried us to win.  Fitz was awful and sent us home.

ok. i am wrong. you are right. you win. its not debatable

[ylekram]

21 minutes ago, PatsFanTX said:

And no playoffs because he came up small in the Jets biggest game in 5 years.

yes, i know. it was very frustrating watching the rest of the jets team play thier hearts out and ol' fitz cost them the playoffs. bowles with a genius game plan clearly out coached rex and fitz hands them a victory on a golden platter. the jets really need to start geno or petty and forget this horrible fitz idea.

[Beerfish]

25 minutes ago, PatsFanTX said:

And no playoffs because he came up small in the Jets biggest game in 5 years.

Much like how the pats came up small vs the jets and the phins in late season games to toss away home field and most likely another trip to the big show.

[nyjunc]

4 minutes ago, ylekram said:

ok. i am wrong. you are right. you win. its not debatable

I don't care about being right or wrong but it;s not debatable.  Marshall was far and away the most important player on offense.

[ylekram]

Just now, nyjunc said:

I don't care about being right or wrong but it;s not debatable.  Marshall was far and away the most important player on offense.

if its not debatable,than its not debatable. why are you still trying to debate? i told you already, you win. marshal is far and away the best player on offense. the man carries weak offenses and weak qb's on his back to the playoffs, year in and year out. yea, he dropped 10 easy passes, one being a td in new england, but he he catches thousand of errant throws,sometimes with 3 or 4 defenders on his back. i get it. jeremy kerley could throw for 4000 yards and 31 td's with this guy. who needs fitz. the jets should just line up marshal in the wildcat and let him throw to himself. problem fixed. no more errant passes

[PatsFanTX]

Much like how the pats came up small vs the jets and the phins in late season games to toss away home field and most likely another trip to the big show.

What does that have to do with Fitz laying an egg in the Jets biggest game in 5 years?

[nyjunc]

4 minutes ago, ylekram said:

if its not debatable,than its not debatable. why are you still trying to debate? i told you already, you win. marshal is far and away the best player on offense. the man carries weak offenses and weak qb's on his back to the playoffs, year in and year out. yea, he dropped 10 easy passes, one being a td in new england, but he he catches thousand of errant throws,sometimes with 3 or 4 defenders on his back. i get it. jeremy kerley could throw for 4000 yards and 31 td's with this guy. who needs fitz. the jets should just line up marshal in the wildcat and let him throw to himself. problem fixed. no more errant passes

the only time Cutler threw for 4,000 yds was w/ Marshall, Chad henne had his best season w/ Marshall and Fitz had his best season.  It's not a coincidence.

marshall had a drop in NE, so what? we still had chances to win.  how many bad passes did he save? 

[Beerfish]

2 minutes ago, PatsFanTX said:

What does that have to do with Fitz laying an egg in the Jets biggest game in 5 years?

It has the same thing to do with 98.346% of the things you interject into conversations on this forum.

[ylekram]

8 minutes ago, PatsFanTX said:

What does that have to do with Fitz laying an egg in the Jets biggest game in 5 years?

simple. forget what fitz did for the first 15 games and find another qb. this is the answer you are looking for right?

[ylekram]

1 minute ago, nyjunc said:

the only time Cutler threw for 4,000 yds was w/ Marshall, Chad henne had his best season w/ Marshall and Fitz had his best season.  It's not a coincidence.

marshall had a drop in NE, so what? we still had chances to win.  how many bad passes did he save? 

1,000's